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Just a note on the eldar mind war power. Since its a psychic shooting attack, you cant have the same character do it twice in one turn, not even Eldrad.

As a separate note, for high toughness targets its hard to beat snipers (or pathfinders if you are running eldar)


Sliggoth

I'm not sure it is a physcic shooting attack. And anyway, eldrads profile specifically says he can use 3 phycic power per turn. One of those powers may be made twice.

Nurgleboy77 wrote:Three words: Nemesis Force Weapon!

::waits for GBF to show up::

You know where I stand and my position has not changed. In fact a lot of people agreed with me. I don't see a need to turn this thread into another quagmire of circular arguments so I'll just close it by saying:

When Andy Hoare wrote the DH codex which came out at years before the 5th edition ruleset neither nor anyone had any conception of the Eternal Warrior rule. The whole argument that the NFW bypasses the EW rule is based out on two words... Kills outright which is used to describe how force weapons work in the DH and WH codices. To me that is a loophole at best. RAW is a good tool but it is not always right. Just look at all the clarifications in the INAT FAQ of which there are far more of than RAW rulings. In the original discussion there was some misinformation presented such that a NFW is not a force weapon but it is indeed listed as a force weapon in the table at the back of the DH codex. The INAT FAQ says that the NFW does indeed kill outright an Eternal Warrior but this same document uses clarifications more often than RAW. There was a lot of discussion at the time when the INAT FAQ was being drafted that Grey Knights needed a break because they have a weak and old codex... that in my opinion is how this clarification came about. Like I said it hinges on two words. Look at older versions of other codices that have rules for a force weapon such as the 4th edition SM codex to compare how the rules for a force weapon are presented.

I'm not going to discuss this anymore. People should discuss this in their own local gaming groups or with the TOs at local tournies if this comes up. That is how I would handle it.

G

Best way to deal with those uber-creatures:

Massed fire from almost anything (S5 and above), in CC:

SS/TH Termies
GK terminators
Grandmaster with NFW )and stormshield, sacred incense, grimoire), gives 6 attacks on charge, with chaos at -1I, and deamons at half WS. whether you'll be using the forceweapon in any way, it will definately hurt some of those guys. (Still 6S6 powerweapons attacks after all).

@GBF: Dont want top open up this discussion, but GM is good anyways .

Grt. Pim

Hmmm, hurt it will PRoeske, hurt it will...

If your an ork just get old Zogwort and use his curse to turn it into a Squig

I think it depends on what armie you play on how to deal with these guys, I mostly play space marines, and oddly enough I faced the nightbringer just the other day, I told my opponent his night bringer was going to die in the first turn and he laughed at me, I therefore drop podded a 10 man unit of sternguard in front of it and killed it in one round of shooting with enfernal bolts, (the ones that always wound on a 2+) that is how I deal with any of the big nasties, and it has not let me down yet.

If your feeling cocky tank shock em (i do not recomend this against the Night Bringer but against a marien character go for it!) if they stand and fail they will die...
Vindicare Assasin *sp is great against the night bringer as i learned the hard way

Hmmm, interesting subject. What I'm going to say is not something I based on experience in battles, but just something I brainstorming on right now. I think it's depending a bit on who the special character is. For example, if you got a special cahracter on foot, marneus calgar or something alike. Maybe it's not the best thing to actually try & hunt him down. Instead you could try and lock him in CC with a big unit. As long as he's in close combat, he won't be able to run away and kill other stuff, giving you an opportunity to focus on other things, hopefully having the result to crush them without taking too many casualties yourself. After that you can own him.

If you really want to nuke down a special character, I suppose just use a lot of hard hits. Some rolls must be bad enough to wound...

Overall I don't think you should focus too much on special characters. It are the normal soldiers that do the most anyway, special characters mainly scare you, distract you or mop up a few troops. Quite often players don't send their special characters on a suicide run anyway, or is that just something I see in my battles? That also may depend on the army you play, if you got an army with low Leaderships, or troops which tend to flee at the sight of a naked ork, it's good to keep you general close to your army so they can benefit from his LD...

Guess the best thing to do is either ignore the cahracter, or atleast don't focus on him/her too much (unless it's an objective to kill him/her), or try to find the rock-paper-scissors-system (aka, it's very weakness, melee or ranged?)

Snipers are good against special character, i think (I haven't read the rulebook in a while) they always wound on a 4+? and some have rending? If this is true then they can completely ignore the toughness value of the target and they ignore armour on a 6+ to wound... correct me if i'm wrong

Snipers are good against special character, i think (I haven't read the rulebook in a while) they always wound on a 4+? and some have rending? If this is true then they can completely ignore the toughness value of the target and they ignore armour on a 6+ to wound... correct me if i'm wrong

I suppose that could work. But I'm not sure: if the character joined a squad, most snipers can't target him specificly right? The hits/wounds will get divived all over the squad. Not 100% sure but I thought it was something like that. If the character walks alone it's np ofc.

i think some special characters can't join units (E.g. the nightbringer. Also i think certain snipers can target characters in units regardless of that rule.

Yeah, but only the vindicare. But against monsters like a carnie it will take all game for snipers to kill it off.

Daon wrote:If your an ork just get old Zogwort and use his curse to turn it into a Squig

Surprised me that this didn't turn up until page 2. Zogwort's Curse + uber enemy character = hilarious. That's why I snagged a blister of squigs last year, you can't beat the look on your opponent's face.

"Marneus who...? Oh, you mean the squig!" *replace*

Waited for my opponent to march Abaddon the entire way across the board before squigging him. He never made an attack. The look on his face was priceless.

OLD ZOGWORT!!! (If it is an independent character!)

Basically a roll off...even for a C'tan.

Too get rid of most tough things get a Chaos Sorcerer:

Chaos Sorcerer + Gift of Chaos = Marneus Calgar turned in to Chaos Spawn!!

(its basically a T test,if you roll equal to or over someones toughness they turn into a spawn!!!
even if ur toughness 8,nightbringer or Wraithlord,it dosent matter, if you roll a 6,regardless of ur T ur a spawn!! lol

All problems can be solved by 2 things grey knight grand masters and thunder hammers

HATE that spawn thing. My friend uses it on me all the time and I have only T3.