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Pipboy101 wrote:Stormtroopers are just good to draw forces away, hunt vehicles and do damage to DP and MC. Quick throw away soldiers which saves your Vet in Valks for the more diffcult nuts to crack. The AT value of a Stormtrooper/Vet/Valk list will make any Mech player stop and think.

How the hell do they do damage to MC?

Melta or Plasma. The AP3 shots you need 5's or 6's on most MC or SC models but if it takes a wound or two off then they did their job.

Another trick I've seen with storm troopers that hasn't been mentioned...

Take 'behind enemy lines' and buy them and a chimera.

Bam! Scouting chimera. In a list where fast attack slots are already full of vendetta/valkyrie combos. This trick gives you even more scouting vehicles.

If going first, move 12" to midfield with scout move, next turn move another 12", spin, debark 3", shoot 12" at either marines or vehicles.

If going second, outflank.

Do Storms have rules that specifically confer Scouting onto their Transports?

If not, then how does the Chimera gain Scouting?

All units that have scout confer it to 'dedicated' transports purchased for them. In the BGB.

Don't you remember all of the tau players jumping for joy when 5th ed came out?

There ok in small hunting groups of DSers and such. Large groups are overpriced unless you plan on assaulting with them and have creed. Cuz now they all have 3 attacks on the charge S4 and a PW sgt with 4PW attacks so they can hold there own in CC and other things also with creed there fearless and +1 I

Thanks, tho, there are Tau players?

Thing is, that's roughly 250 pts spent for 10 non-Scoring T3 models in a non-Scoring AV12/10/10 Transport. I don't know if that's such a good idea. I mean, if I had 250 spare points, sure...

Tho why not take 250 pts as a couple Bassies? AP3 pike plates in the backfield that can double-duty against hard targets.

It rly depends what the rest of your army looks like because if you have a mixed army or a infantry heavy army they can take up some spots extremely well. If your doing vets they have no place unless your gonna DS a 5 man Squad.

Storm Troopers are one hit wonders.
They usually die from return fire.

Tri wrote:

Witzkatz wrote:As far as I know, you can only take one doctrine.

Reads, "you can take any doctrine" ... its missing the key word 'one'. So if you're mad you could take all of them.

QFT. You can take any or all of them.

JohnHwangDD wrote:Thanks, tho, there are Tau players?

Thing is, that's roughly 250 pts spent for 10 non-Scoring T3 models in a non-Scoring AV12/10/10 Transport. I don't know if that's such a good idea. I mean, if I had 250 spare points, sure...

Tho why not take 250 pts as a couple Bassies? AP3 pike plates in the backfield that can double-duty against hard targets.

I'm not advocating taking 10. In fact, I don't think there is ever a reason to take 10.

160 for 5x storms 2x meltas and chimera with hull heavy flamer

I guess, the way I see it, if I'm going to suicide in the backfield, triple-DC SWS is the way to go.

The point is, that stormtroopers are NOT useless. you can debate their effectiveness, sure, but nobody will flat out agree that they are a worthless unit.

Taking a squad of them doesn't automatically make you an idiot, they just aren't a no brainer choice. If you like them, you can take them, and normally do well with them. 250 points for a specialist squad isn't that big a deal, if your using them to deal with threats that large. a 10 man squad in a chimera with flamers outflanking is totally worth it if your fighting a loota heavy ork army...

I think vets and storm troopers are comparable but the lynch pin is the vets score and work just as well as STs. So tie goes to the scoring unit...

I'm still not seeing how they are worthless as a smallish anti MEQ fire support for the line. Not really too interested in a suicide troop. They come with the nicer armor and with scouting can show up with Al Rahem. There isn't really a way to get vets to pop up next to Al.

They are DEFINITELY worthless when you forget that your list has a squad of them in reserve . That's what happened last night at a game! I remembered Marbo (its rare that I remember a single model in reserve) but ironically I forgot the entire 10 man squad of stormtroopers.

Well, next time, don't put your reserves in the same place as your "dead" pile...

One thing about the pinning on first round of fire tactic to keep in mind is that for every gun that wounds your opponant needs to take a pinning check. Depending on the target you might not even need a PBS to make that worth while. You are nearly guaranteed wounds from the melta/plasma they are packing, as well as from a few lasguns (though keeping track is a pain.)

JohnHwangDD wrote:Well, next time, don't put your reserves in the same place as your "dead" pile...

Well that's where they will likely end up anyway! Saves time.

Seriously though, I left them packed in the miniature case and failed to read through my list before the battle... I would only glance at it to see what options I paid for in my regular line units like my Russes and my CCS, but failed to notice I paid for a full storm trooper squad.

I like to lay my entire army out before I play, so it's easy to see what's in Reserves, and what's not.

OTOH, with the "model molester" thread, keeping in box isn't a bad idea if you're at a store.