Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

On the topic of picking up dice, I really hate it when people pick up the "successful" dice, because you can never tell if they are fudging 1 or 2 low rolls. We always make sure you pick up the Misses and the Failed wounds and leave the successful ones on the table for the opponent to see.

That must be a real pain with Ork shooting! Do you really not trust each other enough?

The deal is that if you only pick up failed rolls, it's just as quick as the other way, but there's no potential for "accidentally" picking up a couple extra "successes."

willydstyle wrote:The deal is that if you only pick up failed rolls, it's just as quick as the other way, but there's no potential for "accidentally" picking up a couple extra "successes."

Which is exactly why we do it.

The way I roll it's faster to pick up hits (if there even are any)

I pick up failed rolls, and reroll anything I find questionable or that my opponent requests.

Picking up "successful" rolls is shady, and to be avoided.

kirsanth wrote:I pick up failed rolls, and reroll anything I find questionable or that my opponent requests.

Picking up "successful" rolls is shady, and to be avoided.

Agreed. Then you can't, as Gwar! and Willydstyle have said, 'accidentally' grab too many dice. Plus you can do it super-fast, then double-check with your opponent to see if you missed any. Also makes any kinds of rerolls easier (TL guns, poison, etc. etc.) by simply rolling the dice now in your hand.

MasterSlowPoke wrote:That must be a real pain with Ork shooting! Do you really not trust each other enough?

It's not entirely a question of trust; if somone's trying to pluck out 20 of 60 dice with their undoubtedly meaty digits, misses may come too. It's just a show of good faith to be as open about your rolling as possible. I'm ok with something like shoota boyz if the opponent wants to set aside hits, I just hate when people pluck out all their hits into their fist and go 'K I'M ROLLING WOUND NOW". Besides, who doesn't enjoy watching the probabilities of dice play out? How am I going to notice if my opponent or myself hits with all 20 bolter shots, then wounds 2 guardsmen with them?

I file picking out fails under the same category as not smelling like road kill and proper infantry movement measurement: 40k Etiquette. Which would actually make for a pretty good article....

whys no one mentioned page 19? cocked dice & dice on the floor? Cocked = call it or re-roll in doubt; Floor = auto miss

the floor=auto miss is defined as a house rule, not a binding rule

MasterSlowPoke wrote:the floor=auto miss is defined as a house rule, not a binding rule

But it is in t3h roolbookz!2!!"12!"oneoneoneone!!!1

I'll rephrase that why has no one mentioned page 19 ... I play it that if a die misses the 4'by6' table then its an auto fail ... I've never missed the table I can't see how you can manage it without manic throwing.

Just remember that "Dropping dice as you are picking them up" is not the same as missing the table.

Thanks y'all. Personally I re-roll anything that looks questionable. I'd rather give my opponent (and the fates) the benefit of the doubt.

Interesting too are the comments about picking out misses instead of hits. I like my opponent to see everything going on with the dice and just feel it's not fair to them if I don't let them see what hit and what didn't. I'll typically try to get my opponent to help me as I'm picking out misses and ask them "do you see any I missed" when I'm tossing lots of dice. This engages them and requests tacit agreement that yes, they accept the dice results.

Agreed. Once in a while I get the "you grabbed the 3s and those were hits" so I re-roll all of the dice. All of them.

Grabbing "successful" rolls means anyone questioning is, at best, questionable. And asserting which dice were "successful" is simply personal, and this causes more problems than it solves

Tri wrote:I'll rephrase that why has no one mentioned page 19 ... I play it that if a die misses the 4'by6' table then its an auto fail ... I've never missed the table I can't see how you can manage it without manic throwing.

I don't "miss" the table when my dice end up on the floor. I always roll towards myself so as to avoid dice ending up banging into my/opponent's models and/or scenery which I find to be quite annoying. However, some of our local tables have a raised edge (think Vegas craps table) and some do not. On the ones that do not my rolling method tends to have dice end up on the floor.

Thor665 wrote:I don't "miss" the table when my dice end up on the floor. I always roll towards myself so as to avoid dice ending up banging into my/opponent's models and/or scenery which I find to be quite annoying. However, some of our local tables have a raised edge (think Vegas craps table) and some do not. On the ones that do not my rolling method tends to have dice end up on the floor.

Not to mention the fact that if you've got a couple of large armies with some complex terrain, I frequently find that the clearest areas of table are near the edges...

If I faced someone who insisted that all drops were auto-misses, I'd grab the pop die from the middle of a 'Trouble' board and roll everything one die at a time

unistoo wrote:

Thor665 wrote:I don't "miss" the table when my dice end up on the floor. I always roll towards myself so as to avoid dice ending up banging into my/opponent's models and/or scenery which I find to be quite annoying. However, some of our local tables have a raised edge (think Vegas craps table) and some do not. On the ones that do not my rolling method tends to have dice end up on the floor.

Not to mention the fact that if you've got a couple of large armies with some complex terrain, I frequently find that the clearest areas of table are near the edges...

If I faced someone who insisted that all drops were auto-misses, I'd grab the pop die from the middle of a 'Trouble' board and roll everything one die at a time

The tables never that full .... if you are worried about hitting the model and/or scenery then roll in a tray (or box lid). As for you're "roll everything one die at a time" unistoo, I wouldn't want to play some one that continually managed to drop dice off the board.

Tri wrote:

unistoo wrote:

Thor665 wrote:I don't "miss" the table when my dice end up on the floor. I always roll towards myself so as to avoid dice ending up banging into my/opponent's models and/or scenery which I find to be quite annoying. However, some of our local tables have a raised edge (think Vegas craps table) and some do not. On the ones that do not my rolling method tends to have dice end up on the floor.

Not to mention the fact that if you've got a couple of large armies with some complex terrain, I frequently find that the clearest areas of table are near the edges...

If I faced someone who insisted that all drops were auto-misses, I'd grab the pop die from the middle of a 'Trouble' board and roll everything one die at a time

The tables never that full ....

I disagree. The table doesn't have to be packed for a large handful of dice to be forced close enough to the edge to have a couple/few roll off the edge.

Tri wrote:The tables never that full .... if you are worried about hitting the model and/or scenery then roll in a tray (or box lid). As for you're "roll everything one die at a time" unistoo, I wouldn't want to play some one that continually managed to drop dice off the board.

But I don't think anyone is claiming that we drop dice "continually." I probably, over the course of a game where I'm playing on a table that will allow my dice to fall over the edge, have about five or six dice end up on the floor.

To be frank, if I was playing someone who insisted upon a "dice on floor=auto-fail" I would roll my dice into the center of the board every time just to be sure and I'd probably have no dice hit the floor. I only took exception to the way you implied anyone who had dice end up on the floor was a bit of an unreasonable manic roller who misses the table because of some inherent flaw and thus need to be punished. Locally we have one gamer who due to some physical ailments has difficulty with his dice, and even though he uses a cup to roll still has dice end up on the floor that, because of his situation, I pick up for him.

Would I prefer not to have to pause the game while I pick up his dice? Sure.
Do I believe I need to start playing by a rule that will punish him for it? No.
Do I feel I need to play by a rule that will punish me for my method of rolling dice? Not really.

But, at the same time I don't begrudge you choosing to play that way - I just find that I'm feeling as though you're implying that somehow because I roll and "miss" the table that I'm being inconsiderate to others and need an in game punishment because my die rolling skills are clearly improper and less then that of those able to roll upon the table. Which is the read I'm getting off your posts, perhaps incorrectly, but it's why I feel an urge to explain why us "table missers" are not to be vilified.

ha of course i wouldn't begrudge some one with an aliment that gives them reduced mobility. Still missing the table is not something that happens very often for me or those i play with. Its rare for anything to fall off the table and I've always played it as a miss because of that.

Voted A

Re-rolling anything that looks iffy is fine by me. Potential for abuse is there, but I haven't seen anyone do it too much.

Also never had trouble with people scattering dice across the floor (yet) but I suppose that would be annoying. Repeat offenders would probably be cautioned with the "auto-fail" treatment but accidents happen.

I just use an upturned vehicle box (my old Cadian Battleforce box) and avoid both cocked dice and dropping them on the floor 99% of the time.

Of course you can't really do it with scatter dice (although I suppose you could still roll the 2D6 in the box) but you're probably rolling those extra carefully because you're near models anyway.

I always pick up the misses, it's just as easy as picking up hits and people don't get suspicious.

DoW

Our group has a 3 stage solution to on the table cocked dice (off the table dice are just re rolled).

1) hit the table next to the dice, if this leads to it being un cocked then hurrah, if not...
2) try and balance a die on top, if this fails...
3) just re-roll the damn thing.

Sgt.Sunshine wrote:Oh in terms of it falling off the table I just reroll those as well.

As you should. Why should be penalized for something bouncing oddly or rolling around more than might be normally expected?

Dice off the table = Auto Fail is a complete fail. Completely ridiculous. Apply it like you would a board game at home. If a die goes off the table in Monopoly, do you discount it and say it was never rolled?

With my Orks it depends on how I rolled. If there are a ton of hits, I'll pick up the misses, if a bunch of misses I pick up the hits but make sure my opponent is watching.

As far as cocked die, I usually re-roll anything that even looks cocked. I've never been a fan of "can I set another die on top of it without it rolling off. I've seen a few folk jam one on top of a cocked die literally moving it with the pressure he applies.

I reroll cocked dice. Simple. In addition, if one die lands flat on top of another, they both stand as they are.

Where I'm from, people do these funny things called 'looking' and 'counting'. If I needed 6's or 5+ to wound and I'm rolling 24 dice, I'm not going to pick up the fails. I don't care how loud and American you are. They're called eyes. You see with them. I hate it when people are picky about this. If it's about even I habitually pick up the fails to get them out of the way, not to placate paranoid opponents.

I'm not suerstitious about dice at all, but one thing I really hate is when your opponent tries to 'help' pick up hits or misses. That's just damned annoying, and never makes things faster because they get in the way.

Arctik_Firangi wrote:They're called eyes. You see with them.

And what about people with Green Dice that have Green pips? Or yellow dice with Gold Pips? or just Small Dice? What if your opponent is Colour Blind so cannot see the numbers well? What about if you are on the other end of the table? It is just common courtesy to pick up the fails (because no-one will pick up successes as fails) and letting both players see before roiling again.

Yes, generally always. It avoids problems that way.

I use computer generated random numbers these days. No worries about cocked dice.

Tri wrote:ha of course i wouldn't begrudge some one with an aliment that gives them reduced mobility. Still missing the table is not something that happens very often for me or those i play with. Its rare for anything to fall off the table and I've always played it as a miss because of that.

Good for you. If you tried to force your issue on me I'd laugh and ignore you.

Frazzled wrote:

Tri wrote:ha of course i wouldn't begrudge some one with an aliment that gives them reduced mobility. Still missing the table is not something that happens very often for me or those i play with. Its rare for anything to fall off the table and I've always played it as a miss because of that.

Good for you. If you tried to force your issue on me I'd laugh and ignore you.

but then it won't come up unless you continually miss the table? As I said if you're able of body and mind you can roll dice with out dropping them off the board.