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2009/10/09 20:26:31
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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Ahh excellent, I've seen these before in passing...wondered about the armour placements....like the idea for modern versions of pavises. One thing...no matter how much some people bitch about the squats; a well made army, decently painted simply screams 40K to me and seems to be well respected by most decent gamers (Mannahnin etc). Read a brilliant post recently about how old farts (that's us jinshiryuu / mellon - although as i'm guessing you are a lady thus your age is no matter for polite conversation but rather for a duelling field  ) always complain that GW stopped supporting a "useless and obsolete" race (squats) yet still waste their money on their products. The chap who wrote this collected Dark Eldar. Didn't have the heart to slate him/point out that without our early involvement and expenditure he wouldn't even have a hobby. Thought I'd leave it ten years and see how he felt then  All this positivity is great as I've had mixed reactions from GW staff in the past concerning my force. Some really love it and some just plain blanked me/attempted to be sarcastic from that point on. I'm going to have to organise a few practice games with the couple of friends that play 5th and see which force I like the most. (although the IG were my first force in the eighties/nineties and I think I'm smitten).
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2009/10/09 20:30:57
lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/09 21:38:31
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Dances with Squats wrote:Stunty marines are brilliant but the simple level of converting I'm doing now is almost making me cry. Just the sheer numbers.....hehehehehe
I'm trying to decide if it's worth just sculpting my own originals and resin casting. More work upfront, but easier to reproduce. I'll have to wait and see how hard it is to do the conversions. I'm going to try and cast a few SM body parts this weekend so I can do some test chopping before I go after the expensive stuff with a razor saw.
Dances with Squats wrote:jinshiryuu do you have a points limit target for this project or is it going to just keep expanding as you go along?
Probably just keep expanding as time goes on. If nothing else, I eventually have to work on those APOC superheavies
Dances with Squats wrote:One question...where do you guys stand on the squat colour scheme?
I can tell you I was never too fond of the original "inhouse" GW Squat color scheme. Always made me think someone had looted a stockpile of Lithuanian flags to make their uniforms. You probably don't want to get too "bright" with the helmets, or they'll grab the eye so quick the rest of the mini will kind of fade into the background. Maybe do some "scuffing" or chipping and darken them down a bit (assuming you want that well-used look). My first Squat army (many moons ago) was done in dark brass and a deep "maroon" color (of course those are irrefutably Khornate colors now). Other than that, I'd say cruise through the gallery here or over at CMoN and look for inspiration. You might also want to consider tracking some of the old b&w Squat art and using a graphics prog or a printer and colored pencils, just start trying out different schemes and see what they look like first ( aka fashion plates).
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 The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
 =  “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
 +  +  =  [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/10 01:35:19
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend
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On the matter of my age. First, thank you for this weeks best wording Dances. I seldom laugh while reading these forums :-) And I will give the subtle hint that I regularly get beaten in games of 40k by players who are younger than the models I play with. If only this wargaming thing could work as it does in 80's kung fu films, where the old and smiling ones are always the most skilled and dangerous.
On the matter of competitive vs friendly: In my experience the internet crowd have a much much higher ratio of "competitive" players than any random group of gamers. It's the fanatics and the idiots that thends to spend their time voicing their convictions over the net. Maybe I should have achieved some degree of self-insight by writing that sentence. But I choose not to :-)
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2009/10/10 02:39:40
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Mellon wrote:Maybe I should have achieved some degree of self-insight by writing that sentence. But I choose not to :-)
Until you make it into the "top posters" list, you should be in the clear
Question for you folks, I'm trying to figure out a "theme" for my Squats when I start converting and narrowed it down to a few choices (all of which I like) and wondered what you guys thought:
Pre-Heresy look with a lot of "heavy, ponderous metal"Steampunkish (iron, brass and pseudo-Goldberg)Saxon-influenced "genre blend"High-tech (not "sleek", just obviously "advanced")
(And before anyone brings it up, I am not doing the vertically-challenged Hells Angels look. What the  was GW thinking?)
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/10 09:02:53
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend
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Steampunk! Everything gets better with brass, cogs, vents, pipes, valves and polished dark wood.
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2009/10/10 18:49:52
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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Mellon's right about steam punk (especially if you use some select WHFB bits like faceplates etc) but i also like high-tech or at least advanced tech. Harder to do though as the ground between SM's and Tau doesn't leave alot to work with. If you're doing resin/casting then this would make it easier and you could achieve some nice plate/carapace armour for them. My epic chaps are green and red and this works nicely at that scale, may have to be brave and paint up a 40K one just to try it out. Don't want to go mad with colour but have seen some nice versions using bits of the traditional style, see below for my favourite by the amazing fleshtuxedo
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2134/2180412547_044a9bdfff.jpg%3Fv%3D0&imgrefurl=http://flickr.com/photos/66936279%40N00/2180412547/&usg=__mUDsC-m2H1RmGtxJgxdEh27UcMA=&h=375&w=500&sz=118&hl=en&start=7&um=1&tbnid=OZyq9UbZf2qryM:&tbnh=98&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3D40K%2Bsquats%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1
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lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/11 06:03:47
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops)
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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I'm beginning to lean towards a heavy blend of Steampunk and "preHeresy/Heresy era" (big riveted pauldrons and shinpads, fairly plain facemasks. Heavy, obviously tough, with pretty blatant "mechanization".
Of course, now that I've gotten this far, my gf is not so sure she wants to play Eldar now, and is hinting at WHFB Elves. Shouldn't complain though, I've got a gf who games 
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/11 16:06:32
The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/11 18:34:00
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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That's fair enough the "shame" of playing vanilla style eldar outweighs the "shame" of wargaming on the whole (my regular opponent is a namby pamby space elf lover!) if she likes the more archaic look try steering her towards eldar exodites (or just be plain grateful she loves you and your little men). weekend has gotten away from me and no progress. Time to sit down for the evening with a tray and work whilst my wife commands the remote like a over zealous commissar!
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lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/11 19:26:21
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Dances with Squats wrote:...or just be plain grateful she loves you and your little men
Oh, I am, I assure you. As much as I miss my Squats, they don't mean enough to me to alienate a life-partner who is also a gaming-buddy. My comment wasn't so much annoyance as it was an acknowledgement of the existence of Murphy's Laws. It would be nice to be able to afford both, but that's not in our budget right now. Maybe down the road, but for now, if she decides she prefers WHFB, I'm up for that. Heck, as long as it's not any of the "clix" games I'm easy
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/11 20:09:20
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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Fear not wasn't suggesting that you aren't grateful! (I know my place and am grateful my wife lets me occupy it ) I have recently (1989) taken up a small interest in WHFB and use 10mm (warmaster size-ish) instead of 28mm. Works well especially if you cheat and base them on individual magnets (available in sheets) and use metal movement trays. Lacks some of the beauty of heroic scale but is cheaper, looks grander and more sweeping and takes up less space. plus side to elves in 28mm is she could still use them in RT versus the squats, simply give them power/refractor field and run at the enemy waving swords and screaming!  like the British did for hundreds of years (although admittedly we didn't have the fields and most of enemies idea of high tech weaponry was sharpened fruit!).
On the Original thread I like the pre-heresy idea as it gives you a perfect get out clause for any killjoys that say squats don't exist anymore and would fit in with the lost in the warp theme. Need WIP pictures (even if just scribbles)....no pressure
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lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/11 20:25:05
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Dances with Squats wrote:... use 10mm (warmaster size-ish) instead of 28mm.
"Back in the day" my friends and I used Epic scale minis (based on small metal washers) for 40k games because we all had shoeboxes for living space. We just changed all the measurements from inches to cm (12" became 12cm) and played on this fold-up 3'x3' card table with green felt glued onto it. You could transport your entire army in a mint tin. Much cheaper too.
Dances with Squats wrote: Need WIP pictures (even if just scribbles)....no pressure
I'll probably start posting stuff as soon as the gf settles on what she wants. I'm sort of idling in neutral for the moment. Not sure if I want to just run it through this thread, or go ahead and start up a WIP page.
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/11 22:25:33
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Boosting Space Marine Biker
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Somewhere in the army list section a list of squats was built using SW rules and it seemed to work pretty well. This is the way I would go too. Special characters may be a problem and would require a lot of explaining to fit with the special rules (stasis bomb for a second heart, etc.) but I still think that marines are a better representation of squats. Even the regular SM codex wouldn't be bad.
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2009/10/12 07:38:43
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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@Gridge: I'll see if I can dig it up, thanks for the heads up.
Was cruising CMoN for some ideas and saw these. Almost makes me wanna do a chaos army (still probably use the SW codex ). Spending too much time over there looking at the top-rated minis can lead to feelings of inadequacy 
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/12 10:48:20
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Fully-charged Electropriest
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2009/10/12 23:11:18
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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I love the "mad inventor Grot" with the robot "nurglings". That's good stuff
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/13 08:26:54
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Angry Chaos Agitator
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jinshiryu, i will release a n-o squat codex in afew days, right here on dakka...it'll have all the fluff imaginable(over 12 pages)and a huge army list/wargear list to keep up with the armys of 5th ed. It's in true ig/squat style and you will be able to play games and actually WIN!
4 days to go...
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...nothing else matters...
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2009/10/13 12:20:25
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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Jon Garrett wrote:Speaking of Chaos Squats, I spotted this a while back. Might be useful to you.
These are lovely and show squats can work in a variety of formats. I have a feeling however that this chap MATT BIRDOFF- THOUSAND SQUATS having won was not mentioned in White Dwarf and after the Tourney they ( GW) tried to deny/ignore his army choice/his existence. There was definitely something about it in another thread. Naughty naughty GW 
Those chaos chaps are lovely and if you intend to cast your own would be excellent.
I'm thoroughly confused now, I had originally wanted to do SM list but didn't think I could justify it as I'm using the original plastics primarily (have loads of metals but not sure I like them enough!) and they aren't fantastic (flak armour), more IG looking than anything. And I actually bought the IG codex grumblegrumblegrumble. And now the_emperors_renegade turns up like some avenging angel and promises an actual codex. Oh god I'm soooo confused/distracted/unsure.
Arrrrrgggggggghhhhhh!
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2009/10/13 21:23:11
lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/15 02:13:50
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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I'm definitely interested in seeing the codex he's put together, but I'll still have a "backup" for when I can't use it since it's not GW (though to be honest, I've seen "fan" creations that are more thought-out and balanced than anything GW comes up with). At one point, I considered doing a "revision" of the rules to basically bring everything currently in existence under the same "banner" and eliminate all the rules confusion, then make it a freely available download. Possibly even do some "updating" for the out of date codices. But between the lack of a dedicated playtest group and having to navigate the GW legal gauntlet I never did anything with it.
For my own part, I tossed around a ton of codex "counts as" ideas before I really settled on SM, even with the advice here helping. I thought about IG with some "non-faith" SoB units "refluffed" (psychic save = "geller fields", etc). Heck, Eldar wouldn't be a bad choice if it weren't for all the "fleet" units (polar opposite). If the CSM codex was still 3rd ed, I'd have based them on Iron Warriors and using a lot of the vehicle upgrades with rewritten "fluff". But we have to work with what GW gives us. Automatically Appended Next Post: And when it's time to go APOC: http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2009/10/40k-showcase-tim-klines-leviathan.html
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/15 03:14:36
The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/16 07:02:51
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Angry Chaos Agitator
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Alright, Jin...
the codex is going to be about 40 pages long, with some artwork/miniature photos. It will have a lot of history(not 100% made up )and a competitive army list as well as converting tipps(can i please use your conversion photos? i will give you credit for that!!!!  )...now here is my question...
actually im gonna start a poll for this in general discussion, so vote for your favorite play style!
3 days Squat bros...
ps im playing traitor ig, but i like my own creation so much, that im actually gonna start a squat army a/w...damn me!
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...nothing else matters...
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2009/10/16 11:39:06
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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the_emperors_renegade wrote:(can i please use your conversion photos? i will give you credit for that!!!! ...
Most of the pics on here right now are either those of Dances with Squats or some "inspirational" stuff I found. I've been down with the flu and haven't gotten much of anything done. I don't see any issues with using the pics once I get some up. At the moment, I have some terminator armor tweaks I did in Photoshop to show some idea of scale and theme. I included a "regular" terminator to give some indication of size. What's everyone think of the first "rough draft"?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/16 11:39:57
The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/16 16:33:22
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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I like the mocked up mini termies. Especially because you've used the chaos launchers on one (much better than the imperial ones.) And studs are good. sometimes on the inside 
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/16 16:34:04
lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/17 04:27:38
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Another PS mockup, this time showing them as an IG conversion (with a touch of steampunk). I don't really like the detail on the gun, it's not one of GW's best attempts, so I'd probably scratchbuild something like it.
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/17 07:19:46
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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And another, this time as "space marines". (Black Reach SM for scale)
Automatically Appended Next Post: Maybe it's just my distorted sense of aesthetics, but this is screaming "squat" styling to me:
http://www.quantumgothic.co.uk/content/view/28/83/
http://www.quantumgothic.co.uk/content/view/15/83/
I think I just found my theme. Maybe.
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This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2009/10/17 08:23:07
The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/17 11:04:28
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Sister Vastly Superior
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Now, you're making progress, but can I throw a suggestion in the mix...
So theres the whole "Squats in the warp" fluff thing... why not chaos-ify them a bit, add a few spikes, some khornate colours, etc, and then use codex:chaos marines?
(now win me the lottery so I can do it :|
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I collect:
Guard - 2k of mostly infantry
DA - 2k of deathwing, 2k of other bits (no vehicles)
Sisters - mostly converted/proxy because I'm waiting for therange to go plastic.
Tau - 2k with no riptides because I can. |
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2009/10/17 11:38:04
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Nobody_Holme wrote:Now, you're making progress, but can I throw a suggestion in the mix...
So theres the whole "Squats in the warp" fluff thing... why not chaos-ify them a bit, add a few spikes, some khornate colours, etc, and then use codex:chaos marines?
I actually gave that a lot of consideration. If the C: CSM were still in it's 3rd edition incarnation, or if GW had done anything at all for Iron Warriors in the 4e, I would have done it, either as straight up chaos (there were Squats who went over to "the other side") or as a "independent/loyalist" just "re-fluffed". The vehicle upgrades that were available in the 3e codex would have suited Squats extremely well, and the IW + other vet abilities could fluff them out about perfectly. Then GW went and generified the CSM's for the whole "13th Black Crusade" crap so the codex matched the spew fiction their house authors are generating. The only (non- APOC) way to get the appropriate armor on the field would have to be with IG or SM at the moment. Troop-wise, the new space pups work, but they don't have the TF cannon IIRC (don't own the codex no not sure).
If I could pull landspeeders (gyrocopters), TF cannons (mole mortars), Whirwinds (thudd guns) drop pods (Termites) and Vindicators (closest thing to field arty outside of IG) out of the SM codex and plunk them into the C: CSM s Iron Warriors, sure. I think they'd make an excellent Chaos army, but you'd have to give their whole "technological superiority" the axe (no pun intended).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to see what it looks like, a "chaos" exo-suit (termie conversion w/ Black Reach termie for scale):
And with a bit of color (yeah, I know it's crappy, but it's a quick photoshop mockup)
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2009/10/18 01:17:35
The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/17 19:15:14
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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That's fantastic, there's nothing wrong with the CSM idea either (bar the codex issues ). IMO Squats aren't supposed to be staunch imperialists; as they were originally abandoned during the warp storms that cut off the home worlds. They have a serious axe to grind with a number of races (eldar, orks - both of which used to be trading partners) and I see them as fiercely independent, mercenary warriors. That's why my chaps are the military wing of a Rogue Traders force, he no longer sees eye-to-eye with the imperium and their attitude towards the expendability of their populace. Also gives you good background fluff to find a reason to shoot at anyone you feel like.
I like the mini-marines but I feel if you could just change the helmets to be less SM then they'd almost instantly feel like a distinct, individual force. I like the idea of using some of the new bare headed SW heads (although not some of the more stupid styles...that's going too far even for mohicaned, smoking mini hells-angels in space!) IMO the look you've gone for really suits the high-tech feel squats would have personified if they'd made any headway past RT and been developed properly as a codexed race. Unfortunately I feel the Tau filled this gap and appealed to the manga generation, hammering the last nail into the squat coffin.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/17 21:21:49
lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/17 23:52:29
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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I'll look around and see what I can find. Maybe some non-GW stuff. I',m trying to avoid falling into the same trap that GW did of slapping tech on the fantasy dwarves. If you ever get a good look at the RT era Squat army list, it pretty much reads like WHFB dwarves (even unit names) in flak armor and carrying lasguns. Except where they stuffed them in Humpty-Dumpty looking termie armor, or made them into a cross between the Hell's Angels and the Desert Rats.
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/19 15:36:45
Subject: Re:Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Hardened Veteran Guardsman
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A sad but beautifully succinct summary of the stunted ones. I'm looking forward to the inevitable WIP blog to see these guys as actual minis. If you're anything like me finding the time/money and avoiding the procrastination (work) tends to slow things up somewhat.....The egginators need serious work...have 10 but want to arm them differently and will probably use Terminator arms cut down so I can have thunder hammers and storm shields. More I read the SM codex the more I believe it will work nicely for your squats.
Pig Iron makes nice heads but I'm not sure if any would suit.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2009/10/19 15:37:39
lord marcus wrote:I resent that sir. Orks most certainly do have ding dongs.
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2009/10/20 06:55:30
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Drop Trooper with Demo Charge
Knoxville, TN, USA
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Right now I'm still shaking this flu. Been sleeping mostly. Starting to feel somewhat human again, so hopefully I'll be able to start some actual work soon. I've been giving a lot of thought to vehicle build/conversion during my more lucid moments. That and pondering working up a mini-dex (maybe two, one "legal count-as" and one "n.o. but proper"). I'd been thinking about if for awhile, but I want to wait and see what the_emperors_renegade 'dex looks like first. One thing I'd really like to do is actually work up a fully fluffed-out and tested 'dex eventually, although it would be a nightmare to work around GW's IP ©,® & ™'s. Even if you're giving something away, copyright law is an ugly swamp. Just ask the guys who did the Damnatus movie.
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The above post is the express opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the opinion of any rational sentient being. Any resemblance to credible cogitation is purely coincidental. Also, he likes using the little pictures.
= “Have you noticed that any time Games Workshop wants to get rid of a bit of the background, they have the Tyranid eat it and poop it out as a chitinous thing with exciting mandibles? The Squats… the Zoats. They’re less an alien race, more the office paper-shredder.” - Kieron Gillen
+ + = [ aka: League of Confusing Counts As Army Players: "Counts as, its not a term, its a way of life!" - jfrazell ]
"There is no finer sig on this forum than ArbitorIan's..." -MeanGreenStompa |
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2009/10/20 23:50:36
Subject: Advice and input from old-timers (or at least on old-timey troops (Squats "counts as"))
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Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend
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I shouldn't worry too much. GW likes there to be a bit of fan work around their products. Take a look at BOLS mini-dexes. They are well spread and have never given their creators any legal worries afaik.
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