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LunaHound wrote: lets not forget to mention 80% of the GW paint pot owners have their paints dry out within 2 years.

As an interesting aside from the impending verbal knife fight, I have some GW paints that are probably twenty years old (although I never bought any from the dark age of GW paints - late nineties ) and still going strong (I have a large range of late eighties/v.early nineties GW - modern GW and Vallejo) . 80's had exciting colours like the metallics of glistening green and polished blue (shiny). They all still work nicely and are much loved (although I don't have any left of high use colours like black etc) and when they run out I go here:

http://www.gladiator.clara.net/coatd.htm

and replace them. Its hard to argue against the usefulness of the foundations paints and the washes. They make even less experienced painters work come in in leaps and bounds. IMO the main case for GW paints is ease of purchase. Not many other brands can be easily and locally purchased on a sunday if I run out.

Kanluwen wrote:It all comes from tone, Luna.

Being a smartass, and posting in a thread where the first post is "why do people hate on GW's tools and paints" with a reply of:

"This is for you: <mega GW paint set that is intended for beginners>" rather than making an actual, valid response.

Talk about bias.

See i told you before . This thread is fine with us just discuss the pros and cons of GW.
It doesnt require such examples ^^.

Now , should we discuss about GW ,
or should we continue to discuss whether Kanluwen think luna 's view on GW products are not trust worthy?

Dances with Squats wrote: I have some GW paints that are probably twenty years old (although I never bought any from the dark age of GW paints - late nineties ) and still going strong (I have a large range of late eighties/v.early nineties GW - modern GW and Vallejo) . 80's had exciting colours like the metallics of glistening green and polished blue (shiny). They all still work nicely and are much loved (although I don't have any left of high use colours like black etc) and when they run out I go here:

Actually that i do agree with you . The old old paints GW make are very good ( atleast the paint pots are good )
But , its the previous screw caps and the current flip tops ( not foundation ones )

They all dry out really fast.

If GW replaces the rest of the paint line to have same quality paint + paint pot ( like foundation paints ), i agree , they would decent .

Ohh I love how this thread on GW hate degenerated to a fight involving more paint than sense.

Ack! My heart has been stung by the arrows of Luna's barb!

Mayhaps I should report her!

oh wait no, I'm not a thin skinned debutant who claims bias on the other side of a conversation when I get called on my shenanigans.


Sidenote: MGS, where is that from? It looks familiar but I can't place it...

warboss spinetwizta wrote:why do most people on this fourm hate gw tools paints etc when if they never excisted you would have noting to do all day and most likely kill yourself out of lonelyness

I would never kill myself out of loneliness, I would come round to your house in the wee small hours and make you learn how to fething write and spell, using a car battery and some crocodile clips as a handy incentive...

Nofasse 'Eadhunta wrote:Ohh I love how this thread on GW hate degenerated to a fight involving more paint than sense.

Ya right ^^?

*Awaits for the other 4

Kanluwen wrote:Ack! My heart has been stung by the arrows of Luna's barb!

Mayhaps I should report her!

oh wait no, I'm not a thin skinned debutant who claims bias on the other side of a conversation when I get called on my shenanigans.


Sidenote: MGS, where is that from? It looks familiar but I can't place it...

Thats just so funny , if you arnt so biased on me , you would have spotted the first shenaningans is from OP post .

Like i keep saying , you 6 guys have very effective ATR on me . So effective its painfully obvious.

I agree fully the old paints are really good and mine are still going strong after years and years of being in storage,and have not dried out at all, Foundation paints I am having a hard time using, if I water them down the colour separates and I constantly have to keep mixing them, I'm really having a battle painting my space wolves with foundation at the minute.

George Spiggott wrote:All of those early models are pre '92 with the exception of the Greater Deamons, pity they're 28mm Epic sculpts. Nice try but FAIL!

That would make sense, were it not for the fact that most of those models lasted a hell of a long time. The bike didn't get a resculpt until the dark angels, Ghazgull didn't get a resculpt until armageddon, the Mekboy didn't get a resculpt until the most recent ork codex, we're STILL using the old wartraks from gorkamorka, and the greater daemons at the time in the regular range were far from spectacular. It was a picture I found online anyway. The 1992-1995 era was pretty poor. I started this game in the third edition rulebook, and I can't remember a single model at the time that I would want to go back too, let alone ones that predate even then.



Either way I think I pretty much summed up the following page and a half of flames in my first post.

It's a way to get new players hooked in, and help them then and there. Not everyone starts by using forums or 4chan and finding out there's a whole, wide world of stuff out there.

Whats 4chan? Is it a 40k forum? I've never heard of it before.

Kanluwen wrote:Ack! My heart has been stung by the arrows of Luna's barb!

Mayhaps I should report her!

oh wait no, I'm not a thin skinned debutant who claims bias on the other side of a conversation when I get called on my shenanigans..

Thank you for proving my point

Nofasse 'Eadhunta wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Ack! My heart has been stung by the arrows of Luna's barb!

Mayhaps I should report her!

oh wait no, I'm not a thin skinned debutant who claims bias on the other side of a conversation when I get called on my shenanigans..

Thank you for proving my point

Ya , your ATR is so effective that you went right around OP's shenanigans and right onto my attempt to counter OP's troll post right?

And thanks you 2 , for proving my points exactly since first page.
I asked Kanluwen what he was implying , and after bunch of BS excuses , the truth comes out:

Kanluwen wrote:It all comes from tone, Luna.
Being a smartass, and posting in a thread where the first post is "why do people hate on GW's tools and paints" with a reply of:
"This is for you: <mega GW paint set that is intended for beginners>" rather than making an actual, valid response.

Now see , if he was honest and replied that right away , it would save so much trouble wouldnt it ^^

Oh no Luna, I spotted the OP's shenanigans. An implication that without painting people would be killing themselves left and right.

So what? He has a point in that so many people come on here crying that suchandsuch model doesn't fit their view of a 40k unit or that GW ruined THEIR models by not having a better range available!

But then when places like Rackham come out with poorly designed prepaints, people fawn over them left and right like the models are salt licks and they're the deer. Or that suchandsuch is so much better than the GW model versions, I'm going to use it as a counts as!

Do you really think many of these companies would even have a place if it weren't for GW and the other early miniatures companies?

Kanluwen wrote:Oh no Luna, I spotted the OP's shenanigans. An implication that without painting people would be killing themselves left and right.

So what? He has a point in that so many people come on here crying that suchandsuch model doesn't fit their view of a 40k unit or that GW ruined THEIR models by not having a better range available!

But then when places like Rackham come out with poorly designed prepaints, people fawn over them left and right like the models are salt licks and they're the deer. Or that suchandsuch is so much better than the GW model versions, I'm going to use it as a counts as!

Do you really think many of these companies would even have a place if it weren't for GW and the other early miniatures companies?

Yes i think they do , and PP is a solid proof of it.

Do you really think many of these companies would even have a place if it weren't for GW and the other early miniatures companies?

The argument that an economic niche wouldn't exist if it were not for previous entries into the field are typically patently false and ignorant. It doesn't take particularly much to start a miniatures company, nor does it take much to aquire/trend into/develop products similar. There is very little logistical infrastructure, and there is nothing inherently unique or irreplaceable that existed during the halcyon days of games workshops early forays into modeling.


So yes, miniatures gaming would likely exist, even if it developed later, perhaps separately from the DND counterculture that flourished in the 70's and 80's.


It also has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

Picture is from the Scarlet PIMPernel.

Also anyone who doubts that GW is The Great Satan please explain to me why it is justified in:

Raising the price of all metal miniatures a couple of years ago due to a 'tin shortage crisis...'

And then openly stating in the financial report that they 'see no reason why the plastic product cannot be brought into line with the metal product pricing'.

So they put up the metal figure prices and now believe they can bring the plastics up to that same price. In the middle of a worldwide economic crisis, GW would like to don eye-patches and parrots and come raid your booty some more.

So, your stance Shuma is that there would be a large amount of miniature wargaming companies despite the fact that GW during its early days was the prime supplier of models for other companies?

Yeah, the rules were there. But the actual miniatures weren't.

But you're right, I'm sure there would have been SOMETHING along the way but it would have taken quite awhile or stuck with the same vein as historical wargaming was at the time.

Ral Partha and Grenadier were both serious contenders back in the day. They supplied far more figures for DnD and other roleplay games IIRC.

So, your stance Shuma is that there would be a large amount of miniature wargaming companies despite the fact that GW during its early days was the prime supplier of models for other companies?

There may have even been more. It's much more difficult as a startup to contest a monolithic standard then it is to enter into an open and empty field. Economic niches fill quickly to capacity once they are deemed viable, and the moment one success story was half written another three would be starting. If games workshop (and competitors at the time) didn't exist someone else would have simply filled the void. Miniatures (read: toys you don't play with) have existed for hundreds of years. The thought that games workshop simply happened along and invented the concept is ridiculous. They were not the first, they will not be the last.

Oh, I wasn't meaning that GW invented the field of miniatures. I was meaning that miniature wargaming, as we currently know it, seems to be more a product of the influence that GW had during that time.

Kanluwen wrote:Oh, I wasn't meaning that GW invented the field of miniatures. I was meaning that miniature wargaming, as we currently know it, seems to be more a product of the influence that GW had during that time.

Of course it is. Just as computing as we know it is influenced by apple and microsoft, and cars as we know them is influenced by ford. Your point that the past influences the future is a powerful though thoroughly obvious one.

Wow , the thread died down now that we are on topic , what a surprise.

GW is not the "god send" answer to miniature gaming.
They just happen to be the first , with such an early lead in the industry , they pretty much *grabbed and most importantly *spread their fan base.

If GW didnt exist , thats not saying another company wouldnt have done the same thing , and make the same mistakes.

There will always be a company there as long as the niche exists.

...way to summarize what was established like 3 hours ago?

That's why the thread died down. There was nothing more to say...

Kanluwen wrote:...way to summarize what was established like 3 hours ago?

That's why the thread died down. There was nothing more to say...

No, you just can't troll me as easily. I'm a rock. Look at those faces in my signature, they aren't to be messed with.

Definitely Shuma. Those faces are just terrifying.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Whoa. Talented, I beat the autoattach! I'm not even sure how, I only hit submit once...

Definitely Shuma. That Kirby face terrifies me and haunts my nightmares.


Or it could be that you pretty much summarized my last train of thoughts on it.

Kanluwen wrote:Definitely Shuma. That Kirby face terrifies me and haunts my nightmares.

Not to be a nit-picker, but that's actually a Jigglypuff with a mean face

I was never into Pokemon, sorry It looked like Kirby, dangnabbit!

Should we take an office pool, of sorts, to guess the time in which this topic gets brought back up after this one dies?

I...can't...summon...the...interest...

Kanluwen wrote:Oh, I wasn't meaning that GW invented the field of miniatures. I was meaning that miniature wargaming, as we currently know it, seems to be more a product of the influence that GW had during that time.

You are aware that the field of miniature war gaming is huge right, and that GW makes up but a fraction of that field right. Historicals have gone on and on from long before GW's appearance and they continue to go onwards.