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Hey Hod, long time long time no talk.

Thanks, that's exactly why I'm leaning torwards him. I figure the list should have enough anti infantry to be okay without doom, except maybe not against orks or tervigon spam.

SW and guard are my biggest concerns, followed closely by other bugs and loota spam/horde orks.

In most of my playtest games against guard I usually come out on top, unless its got plasma in its vet squads. I haven't gotten the chance to pla wolves yet, but I don't see it ending well for me at all. Orks also gave me a run the one time we played, but I also made a few tacical mistakes in that game since I was new to the army. But, I do have to say reserve style nids as a whole performs phenominally when everything works as it's supposed to, which occurs maybe a third of the time, and when it dosn't it's a pretty even fight.

Oh, just looked at the INAT ruling and Doom does affect units in transports.

+1 vote for Doom.

I have the unique experience of playing with nids and against nids. For guard, their best weapon against the new nids is auto-cannons. The high torrent of wounds brings down tyrants and tervigons alike.

I am glad you are enjoying the army Nick. Please tell me how your experiences at the GT are and post a battle report on the WC forums.

Lukus83- In all honesty I don't think I could bring myself to go through a bunch of FAQ's to IMO abuse the rules to make an already good unit absolutely broken. Regardless of how the rulling is for Doom, until I see it spelled out in the tyranid FAQ itself that it does effect units units in transports I refuse to play it that way.

Hod- The few times I've had to do nids vs nids I've always lost due to my opponent having around the same skill level as me, but having the more expierience with nids vs nids battles. I'm the only regular bug player at my local store. As far as auto cannons go they do mess us up quite a bit, but I find that if we are deep striking plasma is much more effective since it AP's us also, and since we got all close and personal range isn't an issue.

Thanks, I;ll be sure to put the reports up there aswell.

Well my point was that if the tournament uses the INAT ruling then it will work, regardless of how you want to use it. I would just check with the TO.

I'm not trying to be stubborn, just pointing out a perk if you do choose the Doom, though as mentioned beforehand Deathleaper makes the list much more well-rounded.

Either way good luck with your list.

Oh I didn't mean to sound offensive if I did, I was just making a point of how I feel about Doom. Anyway thanks!

Non-taken. And good luck once again.

DeathLeaper is win against any psker character that's going to be a problem for your army. Doom can combo very nicley with Leaper.

I've played a few games and more often than not I was getting shutdown by enemy Pyskers, In most cases now I would make my first objective to kill the psker, any good player will be attempting to shut you down or screw you up with Hood or Jaws or the like.

I'm really surprised there are no hive guard. IMO they are one of the best units in that codex. Maybe its just my fear because I play Eldar, but Zoeys are a joke against Serpents and Runes of Warding.

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to say this so I'll be as careful as possible. Has anyone seen the Hitler video on the well known internet video site for Doom of Malan'Tai . I couldnt stop laughing, Especially when he says for all SM varient players to leave the room.

pointzero wrote:I'm really surprised there are no hive guard. IMO they are one of the best units in that codex. Maybe its just my fear because I play Eldar, but Zoeys are a joke against Serpents and Runes of Warding.

Why are zoanthropes a joke for against serpents? Warp blast is S8 against a serpent and is AP1, hive guard are S8 AP4. So a warp blast gets +1 on the damage chart. Far from a joke...

LOL,nice list


Automatically Appended Next Post:
mercer, they aren't really that good against wave serpents,for more information you can ask Luke over there,but I m just telling you that with a 4+ cover save from flying,wave serpents can save thier own butts pretty well,and if there is a farseer fortuning the wave serpent,you've just wasted a turn with you zoey

They only get a 4+ cover save if turbo boosted, they are not going to move 24" every turn are they? And if thats the case then that rule applies to hive guard and only makes them better on volume of fire.

I do know how serpents and eldar work

Hive Guard are too short ranged to be good in games like DOW and sometimes spearhead. The zoans are podding in which for the most part eliminates the range issue. And zoanthropes can pop a land raider just as eassily as a chimera.

I never assumed you didn't know how Serpents worked. The comment was regarding the fact that with Runes of Warding, the Serpents energy shield, and the Serpents speed the effectiveness of a Zoanthrope is far less than that of the Hive guard.

I'm not really sure how how zoans are better in DOW. They are in reserve which means they don't come out until turn 2 or 3, by that time Hive guard could have been shooting for 2-3 turns and can now hit pretty much anything on the board, even better if you give Tervigons onslaught.

I know zoans are better at taking out Raiders in theory, but that's about it and with librarians, Inquisitors, and Runes it makes them very iffy.

Zoans have shadow of the warp so it will probably cancel each other out. My point is zoans have ap1 which is +1 on the damage chart and even if serpent turbo boost zoans still possibly be within range, and guard will still have a cover save against them.

Zoans are better than taking raiders out, thats a fact. raiders are something a hive guard cannot deal with.

Well my point was that if the tournament uses the INAT ruling then it will work, regardless of how you want to use it. I would just check with the TO.

I'm not trying to be stubborn, just pointing out a perk if you do choose the Doom, though as mentioned beforehand Deathleaper makes the list much more well-rounded.

If they are using the INAT FAQ your army won't work at all so don't even bother unpacking it if they are following INAT. INAT have decided that the reserve Tyranid army is too powerful so they've knobbled it, throwing out both RAW and RAI on Hive Commander to make it not work until after your Hive Tyrant has Dsed in... Oh and neither of it's bonuses stack. Essentially making Tyranids pointless and neuturing the entire codex because they hate Tyranids.

I wouldn't play at a tournament that follow INAT's rulings if they intend to continue rulings like this which intentionally ignore RAW and RAI just to stop a new army from being useable.

Omg, why, dear lord of Nurgle, why, why, why.

Can't we just have a useable army. I watched a game last night, Nids versus Tau, They got obliterated before they even got close enough to assault, The Deepstriking Ninja list overcomes that perfectly. This still doesn't make the list over powered though getting a +1 to DS rolls with him off the board so why the have gone against that, god only knows. The dice gods can still screw you over leaving you with one outflanking unit of Gaunts on turn 2. Come on GW, lets see an FAQ so we can put these arguments to bed.

mercer wrote:Zoans have shadow of the warp so it will probably cancel each other out.

Shadow of the warp will not help zoans vs runes of warding. They have to make ld10 on 3d6, which will happen 50% of the time.

Then they have to hit, which they will do 67% of the time, leaving you at 34%.

You will glance or pen 50% of the time. That puts you at 17%.

Assuming the serpent moved enough to get a 4+, that puts you down to 9%.

You are going to be in the low to middle single digits to kill the serpent per zoan. If all 4 manage to fire at one serpent, if they even come in at the same time, I doubt you would have a 1 in 4 chance of killing one.

As with the two lists I have seen from yermom, not enough anti-tank.

You will glance or pen 50% of the time. That puts you at 17%.

Given that you glance on a 2 and penetrate on a 3+ why only 50% for glance or pen? I make it 83%.

So, the tournament organizer has decided to play hivee commander like this. (I know it's not RAW I'm not questioning it, I'm not arguing it, I'm just accepting it)

2 hive commanders reserve bonus do NOT stack. However, you may ouflank 2 units. The reserve bonus does stack with other reserve bonus giving units, such as a lictor oor swarm lord. Hive commander DOES work regardless of whether the tyrant is on the table.

With that I submit to you my list.

HQ
Tyrant- 2 twin linked devourers wings hive commander old adversary paroxysm leech life 250

Elites
2 zoanthropes 120
spore pod 40

2 zoanthropes- 120
spore pod 40

deathleaper 140

Troops
10 gaunts 50

10 gaunts 50

tervigon- catalyst adrenal glands toxin sacs 195

tervigon- catalyst adrenal glands toxin sacs 195

Heavy
trygon 200

trygon 200

mawloc 170

Good luck with your games

Thanks!

FlingitNow wrote:

You will glance or pen 50% of the time. That puts you at 17%.

Given that you glance on a 2 and penetrate on a 3+ why only 50% for glance or pen? I make it 83%.

Str 10 goes to str 8 vs wave serpents, unless you manage to get rear.

Str 10 goes to str 8 vs wave serpents, unless you manage to get rear.

Cheers being dumb...

2 hive commanders reserve bonus do NOT stack. However, you may ouflank 2 units. The reserve bonus does stack with other reserve bonus giving units, such as a lictor oor swarm lord. Hive commander DOES work regardless of whether the tyrant is on the table.

This is how I'd play in most instances seems the RAI of it (though by RAW the oposite things stack). At least they haven't follow the INAT FAQ which just makes the nwe Nid Codex a total waste of time and effort...

yermom wrote:

HQ
Tyrant- 2 twin linked devourers wings hive commander old adversary paroxysm leech life 250

Did i miss something, or why is your tyrant that cheap?
Mine costs about 310 points with that equipment.

hive2003- no your right, when i counted up the points he was 310 but for some reason i was being slowed and put 250 thanks.

Looks pretty good. You added Deathleaper to help deal with hoods

Can you find some points to bump up your gaunts to 15? 10 just seems like to few. Maybe make the Trygons Alphas and drop the Mawloc to get more gaunts?

Big question to ask the TO about the Mawloc is can it deepstrike on top of enemy stuff? If not the Mawloc isn't worth it.

Big question to ask the TO about the Mawloc is can it deepstrike on top of enemy stuff?

I can't see any TO ruling any other way it is the RAW and clear RAI so there is no argument against it other than from people scared of the new creature and desperately trying to rules lawyer it away. You'd have to be TFG to even consider ruling it the other way and if the TO is that then don't enter...