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Shoplifters are only part of the problem. Employee theft is nearly as rampant in retail sales.

Gamble wrote: If OTOH the owner were to follow through and press charges, he risks alienating those people who, and they do exist, would say charges were too much. Shoplifter's been dealt with, but now he might lose additional sales because his buddies are going elsewhere to play/ shop. I'm not saying this is what happens, but a possibility of what could happen.

Anyone who acts that way is more likely to shoplift themselves. If I was still running a shop, I'd rather lose those "customers" and prosecute the offender and hopefully get some deterrence going in m favor.


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Breotan wrote:Shoplifters are only part of the problem. Employee theft is nearly as rampant in retail sales.

I had something like this happen at a comic store I used to manage. I had one employee, who worked Saturdays, and one of his friends ordered a lot of White Wolf books. When they came in I would put them in his subscription bin and like clockwork they would be gone the following Monday. I don't remember what got me suspicious, but one day I checked the Saturday receipts and there were not game sales rung up. I had the owner go through previous Saturday receipts, same story.

When confronted, the employee in question put on a big show about how "it wasn't his fault" and he "couldn't watch the guy all the time" and then walked out and never came back. Neither did his friend.

That store closed less than a year later, which was very sad since it was really the only comic shop in a lower income section of Philly, but I don't begrudge the owner one bit. When product is walking out the door like that you can't justify staying open.

Shoplifting is the cause of higher prices for everything.

Breotan wrote:Shoplifters are only part of the problem. Employee theft is nearly as rampant in retail sales.

When I was a retail wage-slave, I recall two different supermarkets/bigbox stores had quite a campaign in place to make the workers aware that employee theft accounted for the majority of all stealing in the store. I always wondered if that discouraged or encouraged it. I know that when I was working out at the gas station of one of the stores, one of the employees was lifting *cartons* of cigarettes a week while doing inventory. I hear they eventually caught him, but I guess he'd been doing it for years. They finally got him when they installed a camera in the break room.

Working in a restaurant back in the stone-ages of being a teenager and I remember it was pretty much an all-you-can-eat buffet. According to company line, we were allowed to purchase food for 1/2 price. Not even the managers were hip to that. Heck, there was actually a hearty trade of food for movies/cigarettes/beer that went through the back door. It was a phenomenal situation to be in as a teenager.

The thing is, all three of the places treated its employees like disposable crap. Even as an adult I look back and am conflicted on if whether what was going on was right or wrong. Questionable wages, incorrect paychecks (ALWAYS on the short side, never extra if there was a mistake), horrendous scheduling. Did the stores treat the employees like crap because of their despicable behavior, or did the employees act despicabley because of the store's callous indifference?

Breotan wrote:Shoplifters are only part of the problem. Employee theft is nearly as rampant in retail sales.

This is true, I suggest people take the time to have a good look to see where security cameras are pointed in shops, sometimes they are pointed at the till because they are more concerned about watching the staff then they are the customers. My wife has worked in such places and knew that was the reason for the cameras, you couldn't even see the customers, only the staff and the tills.

I hate thieves.

If I were a store owner (I hope to be someday) I'd probably implement a camera system along with some dummy-cams as a deterrent. I'd also look into those anti-theft tags you can put on product. If it's cheap enough to implement or cheaper than what you have walking out the door than I don't see why one wouldn't put such things into place.

Gamble wrote:

Redbeard wrote:If they're stealing from you, they're not exactly customers, now are they.

You misunderstood. Customer X gets caught stealing and is banned from the store. Not many people, his best friends included, would disagree. If OTOH the owner were to follow through and press charges, he risks alienating those people who, and they do exist, would say charges were too much. Shoplifter's been dealt with, but now he might lose additional sales because his buddies are going elsewhere to play/ shop. I'm not saying this is what happens, but a possibility of what could happen.

Not where I'm at. I've called the police and pressed charges on dozens of shoplifters. In every single case, they slapped their wrist and gave them some community service, or just dropped the cases. I was only ever consulted one time, because the theif was over 18 and had over 100.00 in merchandise. I was told he would get public service, and I had no options about it. All other cases I wasn't even notified.

One of the hard things about preventing theft in a game store (im assuming) is the simple fact that people are bringing in bags and backpacks and the likes. It's easy to slip something into them when no ones looking.

Mike, I think you may have nailed two birds with one stone (not saying the problem can ever truly be solved 100%) by having the majority of tabletop game play being done in a separate store front that doesn't have any merchandise in it. No large bags around the merch = less stock shrinkage.

This thread implies shoplifting is like regular shopping. I love the internet.. Just take it they wont prosecute blah blah.

But on topic the malls in oz who have cameras and security ban shoplifters from entering the mall, using trespass to involve police. Someone on this very forum got banned from his local flgs for life (was a thief).. these are pretty good measures, not so heavy handed.

I like the Nicaraguan method, give the mall guard a shotgun.. you steal you and everyone around you gets shot. haha.

Just to let you all know you can actually get insurance for stock theft. It would come under the class of general liability and unless the wording or was a exception stock theft would be covered under that insurance class. The reason why they don't claim stock theft is because it never goes over the minimum deductible i.e. £12 blister pack isnt going to break a £1000 deductible, hence the insurer doesn't pay out. But if a truck worth of stock got stolen they would probably pay out. (if claimed)

It seems it is a harsh cost of doing business.

On the one hand, you dont want to make the customers feel like thieves by following them around or having everything behind glass cases, but on the other you dont want to be too lax about the security of your product either. There is a fine line.

Between employee theft and and regular shrinkage, its amazing how some places even remain open for very long.

The small guys get poorer because they cannot afford cameras or more employees to prevent theft, while the big guys get bigger because they can separate retail space from their game areas. Very rarely do you see a game shop set up that has an atmosphere of deterrence. Deterrence is the best way to avoid this as reasons given already numerous times in this thread.

Its sad, but I imagine the best and only way you can be sure shrinkage is a non issue is by creating an online store since they cannot pocket what they cannot touch without first paying for.

I really doubt shrinkage has major impact on GW sales and if they tell you that then its just an excuse to raise prices.

GW already get their cut from retail and distribution areas. The only shrinkage they may feel is their own employees or retail stores not paying for what they got.

The cost of producing their product is so small (if their investor release and other sources of production info are to be believed) that any hints they may give for theft as a reason prices increase is just another way of soaking the consumer and retail base. Pure and simple.

If I were a shop owner, I'd hire some guys from a local dojo and dress one up like a store employee. The other one would come in dressed in street clothes and start swiping stuff in view of the other customers. Then as he headed for the door, the employee would catch him and beat the living h*ll out of him. It would be really REALLY bad, but it would, you know, all be staged. The one being beaten up would be all like, "I'll sue!" and the employee would be all like, "Try it!" Then the cops would come drag him off.

I'd have this show repeated during busy times and after a while word would get around re: how my gamestore doesn't tolerate thieves. I bet shoplifting would drop off fast.

Stealing food to live I understand. Hate it, but I understand. Stealing toys is a sickness called greed. And these people should be prosecuted to the extent the law allows, because if nothing is done, they're just going to keep doing it.

Good luck finding a guy who wants to get beaten up. And arrested..

Shaman wrote:Good luck finding a guy who wants to get beaten up. And arrested..

That's why you get martial arts guys. They know how to make it look good and minimize the injuries.

I guess the cops would have to be in on it, too.

Solorg wrote:

Shaman wrote:Good luck finding a guy who wants to get beaten up. And arrested..

That's why you get martial arts guys. They know how to make it look good and minimize the injuries.

I guess the cops would have to be in on it, too.

Sounds like fun! (when do i get my pay check?)

I don't think GW up their prices to cover for thief's.

They need to make monies!!!

Just my view,

Alexgm101.

Shaman wrote:
I like the Nicaraguan method, give the mall guard a shotgun.. you steal you and everyone around you gets shot. haha.

I dislike this method.

Who's going to buy product peppered with shot?

I'm hopefully a future store owner too and though of people stealing from me is really, really, really scarey. I'm gonna be investing my life savings into my store, and it's gonna be tough enough to stay alive just getting people to buy army men. It also really has me worried about hiring people, like what if I want a saturday off and hire someone to work, how do I know he's not robbing me blind when I'm not there? Even the nicest most helpful employee could be a dirty rotten thief when no one's looking.

I hope to have my place laid out in such a way that my eyes can almost always be on the shop. Possibly with the cash register area up a step higher than the rest. Also considering having the gaming area in a separate room (if I can afford to build walls) or sectioned off somehow. I would probably want to invest in a camera system too, I've seen some that come with like 8 indoor/outdoor cameras and you can even log in and watch em when you're not there and spy on your store, for around $1000 or at least the one I saw anyway...

Theft is one of the main reasons I don't really plan to focus on selling blisters at first anyway (that and they don't sell as well), CCGs will be behind or at least on the counter, spray paints behind the counter, basically anything small will be where I can easily see it.

I think to help prevent it you really just need to be aware of what's going on in your shop at all times, and having a core group of loyal gamers who can watch your back sometimes would be cool too

Redbeard wrote:I read this here article: about shoplifting policies across the US. It basically states that most stores won't prosecute shoplifters because it's not profitable to do so, and so instead, they just boost prices to account for these losses.

I know that most of the GW stores near me have had shoplifting incidents. Sometimes, the parents of the kid caught red-handed will even threaten to sue the GW employees for defaming their precious snowflake's reputation. Sometimes the employees laugh it off (like the idiots who ran in and snatched a couple of cans of matte varnish, thinking they could go tagging), but I'm sure that the bottom-line effect is that it comes out of the pockets of the honest consumers.


Mikhaila, if you see this, what's your take on shoplifting in your store(s)? How much do you have to factor in for losses (if you're comfortable sharing that info)?

EVERYTHING comes out of the pockets of honest customers.

When I worked at Selfridges, they told us 80% of shoplifting losses came from staff. That was a long time ago so maybe things have changed.

Have any of you ever noticed at larger stores like Targets and Walmarts- the largest concentration of cameras is over the cash registers? Some silly idealistic people would say thats for when they get robbed lol But armed robberies of depratments stores is pretty much unheard of. Those cams are there to monitor the employees.

Loyal customers that want your store to succeed are the best security you can get(for the price!). When you run a league or tournament, make sure you're rewarding the organizers(if they arent employees), and with leagues, throw them an extra 5% discount. Little perks that make people love your store will make them want to protect it if they feel like its 'their store too'.

Do you want people to think 'well, this store is closer so I guess I'll play there...' or, 'My stores an extra 20 miles but its awesome!' ?

In the cases where you get a kid that did something stupid, but seems like a good kid- give him a chance to earn trust back. Think of it as a chance for some free community service- I have yet to find a game store that has bathrooms that girls are actually comfortable using- alot of gamers seem to urinate using templates or bad scatter dice- so put the lil miscreant to work cleaning bathrooms for a few weekends til you think he's learned the lesson. This only works for the ones that want to come back and admit they were dumb.

Mistress of minis wrote:alot of gamers seem to urinate using templates or bad scatter dice

I haven't quoted a poster for use as a sig in years, but this simply must be yoinked.

Yep, thats right. I stole that right in the middle of a shoplifting thread.

Hellfury wrote:

Mistress of minis wrote:alot of gamers seem to urinate using templates or bad scatter dice

I haven't quoted a poster for use as a sig in years, but this simply must be yoinked.

Yep, thats right. I stole that right in the middle of a shoplifting thread.

I just hope templates never get bigger than the Apocalypse ones

Redbeard wrote:It basically states that most stores won't prosecute shoplifters because it's not profitable to do so, and so instead, they just boost prices to account for these losses.

That depends on the store, and whether they think they have the margin for it.

Wally World, home of low prices, prosecutes to the fullest extent of the law. The other day, I even saw some cops marching a couple women out in cuffs to a waiting cruiser...

A lot of other stores do the same, as a deterrent.

Unfortunately, looking at Mikhaila's responses, it appears that the "fullest extent of the law" is a slap on the wrist. Possibly why many companies don't see this as worth their time.

He doesn't employ 100 people, tho...

Breotan wrote:Shoplifters are only part of the problem. Employee theft is nearly as rampant in retail sales.

The retail stores I worked at were more concerned about Employee theft than shoplifting as employee theft usually costs way more than some person looking for a 5 fingered discount. That and the fear of being sued by the thief.

Stealing food to live I understand. Hate it, but I understand

That sounds good. But in Western industrialized countries it does not occur. Theft in these areas is a criminal act based upon greed and corrupt morals.


TR

As working for a big HOME improvement DEPOT store. When a customer steals merchandise or if we have damaged merchandise it goes against our daily profit. When the item is taken we have to mark it down in our system as being stolen, how much the retail is we subtract that from our "daily profit."

Unfortunately when this actually happens associates are not allowed to do anything to the bandit. But our LP (lost prevention) team can basically manhandle these thief's. If its under like 50 we kick them out, and if its under 20 we kinda laugh at them. But we only really press charges if its 200 up, or in a recent case the thief sprayed one of my cashiers in the face with pepper spray.


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But as for raising prices on stolen goods no. But sometimes we have sales on items that are usually high theft to deter them from stealing and just buy it.

Mistress of minis wrote:

Hellfury wrote:

Mistress of minis wrote:alot of gamers seem to urinate using templates or bad scatter dice

I haven't quoted a poster for use as a sig in years, but this simply must be yoinked.

Yep, thats right. I stole that right in the middle of a shoplifting thread.

I just hope templates never get bigger than the Apocalypse ones

This just in, GWS is coming out with 50' templates, for Real-Scale Epic. You can even get a fortress monastery as a unit!!!
That would be the day, eh?

(And yes i mean 50 foot)

Most business deduct it as a cost of business, and it accounts for roughly 5% of the costs. As such, these costs should of been around since forever! It isn't like stealing is a new trend.

I was thinking of reasons why I wouldn't shoplift from my FLGS and the number one probably is (there's a laundry list but this seemed the most potent) that I feel like the store owner/employees are kind like friends? mostly because they are like almost all of the nerds that walk through the door and you can just chat about the game with them. So if I stole from them it would seem like I was stealing from a friend which is just wrong on the deepest level.

I guess the point is the best deterrent befriend the people who walk through your store's door?