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Made in ca
Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential






Victoria, B.C. Canada

Melissia wrote:Only way that could happen is if they removed Marines entirely and focused on Daemons.


Oh wait they already did that...


Just because your army doesn't get possessed suits of armour with awesome Egyptian hats...

But yeah the Chaos Codex went too far in the direction of simplifying everything, even if the old codex did have to be pruned a little.



Change and change until Change is our master, for nothing neither God nor mortal can hold that which has no form. Change is the constant that cannot be changed.

No game of chess can be won without pawns, and this may prove to be a very long game.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLnIFn-iROE 
   
Made in us
Veteran ORC







Nitros14 wrote:
Melissia wrote:Only way that could happen is if they removed Marines entirely and focused on Daemons.


Oh wait they already did that...


Just because your army doesn't get possessed suits of armour with awesome Egyptian hats...

But yeah the Chaos Codex went too far in the direction of simplifying everything, even if the old codex did have to be pruned a little.


Or men who let themselves be possessed by daemons to become killing machines.

Some of our stuff would be alot better if it where more reliable. Possessed should be able to purchase different upgrades instead of rolling for it, Dreadnaughts should be able to be drop podded or teleported into enemy lines if your going to make it crazy/pron to attacking your own guys. We are Chaos Space Marines, NOT Orks, for crying out loud....

I've never feared Death or Dying. I've only feared never Trying. 
   
Made in ca
Calm Celestian




Windsor Ontario Canada

mikeyboyj wrote:I dont like the fact that you get close combats where it is impossible for one side to hurt the other. I realise that things like wraithlords are very tough to wound but I find it hard to believe that if 30 orks all ganged up on it at the same time for 5 turns, they wouldn't be able to damage it in any way. Even if they needed 6, then a further 6 on another roll to wound that would be preferable imo. There should at least be a chance, even if its remote.


I agree, sort of like in War of the Rings. When your fighting something tough you have to roll a 6+ followed by a 4+ or sometimes a 5+ or even 6+. There should always be a chance.
   
Made in us
Combat Jumping Ragik






two things:

Drones from Tau vehicles NOT counting as extra kill points, seriously I have to take a 20 point upgrade because if they kill my transport all they have to do is shoot down 2 drones & get an extra KP.

Reduce FW cost to 8 points. Only a small reduction but it would be very worth it.

Trade rules: lower rep trades ships 1st. - I ship within 2 business days, if it will be longer I will contact you & explain. - I will NOT lie on customs forms, it's a felony, do not ask me to mark sales as "gifts". Free shipping applies to contiguous US states. 
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Murfreesboro, TN

I only want to change one letter, heres the before (KP) and heres what I wish it would go back to (VP).

I had thought I was past this but 'Ard Boyz round 2 REALLY made me miss vps.....

"I'm not much for prejudice, I prefer to judge people by whats inside, and how much fun it is to get to those insides." - Unknown Haemonculi 
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

For Guard, I'd say reduce power weapon cost to five points...

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in gb
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot




Scotland

One thing?

Tau Battlesuits have standard BS4 not 3. It is hard to belief a veteran in a armoured suit with enhanced systems isnt any better at firing then a new recruit, in a FW unit.

~You can sleep when you're dead.~
 
   
Made in gb
Lord of the Fleet






London

I'd like to see Terminators gain either +1 BS, WS or W.

Valk
   
Made in gb
Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator





In blood angels give termies a jump pack option or atleast let a librarian use wings of sanguinious for the whole squad.



Daemons 3000pts
2000pts
Marines 2000pts 
   
Made in au
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





I’d move attack resolution from needing three die rolls to hit, wound and beat armour, to just two. You could easily turn ‘to hit’ and ‘to wound’ into a single roll, representing the ability to put a lethal wound on target. This would be a chart like the current to wound chart, and would ultimately make it so that instead of a guardsman rolling a 4+ to hit then a 5+ to wound a marine, he’d just roll once needing a 6. An ork wouldn’t roll a 5+ then a 4+ to wound a marine, he’d roll once needing a 6. A marine wouldn’t need a 3+ then a 4+ to wound an ork, he’d just need a 5+.

After that you’d roll armour, where I’d add a bit more complexity. Instead of the binary system we’ve got at present where you have a save or you have absolutely no save at all, I’d give each model three armour stats, one vs small arms, one vs harder hitting weapons, and one vs armour destroying weapons. A marine would be 3/5/-, meaning against regular weapons like bolters and lasguns he’d save on a 3+, against more deadly weapons like heavy bolters he’d save on a 5, and he’d get no save at all against armour destroying weapons like plasma guns.

I’d get rid of the silliness where combat resolution needs four unique stats that aren’t used anywhere else in the game. The same system can be managed with two stats, attacks and melee. The first is the number of dice you roll when attacking, the second is a combination of strength and weapon skill – merged in the same way as BS and weapon strength above. All units on both sides would be considered as attacking at the same time, units designed around built around going first in melee such as ‘stealers getting a special rule stating they always attacks first. Units that always go last, such as powerfists, would keep the rule saying they always go last.

I’d drop wounds entirely. A monstrous creature can be taken out by a well placed shot just like a walker or a tank can. Regular troops with two wounds can have FNP instead. Everything else would get a wound table, similar to the vehicle/walker table. I would think about building separate tables for characters, monstrous creatures, walkers, skimmers, and light vehicles and tanks.

I’d make fleet and running part of the movement phase. Having to move troops in two separate phases of the one turn is silly.

“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Washington DC

Sorry, just felt the need to address some things...

sebster wrote:I’d move attack resolution from needing three die rolls to hit, wound and beat armour, to just two. You could easily turn ‘to hit’ and ‘to wound’ into a single roll, representing the ability to put a lethal wound on target. This would be a chart like the current to wound chart, and would ultimately make it so that instead of a guardsman rolling a 4+ to hit then a 5+ to wound a marine, he’d just roll once needing a 6. An ork wouldn’t roll a 5+ then a 4+ to wound a marine, he’d roll once needing a 6. A marine wouldn’t need a 3+ then a 4+ to wound an ork, he’d just need a 5+.


So guardsmen and orks would go from having a 16.5% chance of wounding a space marine, to a 16.6666% chance where in a space marine would see no change, but see significantly better odds to wound T3... This also kinda assumes that all shots hit, but only some (very few) actually wound. Instead I think the current system allows for a model to get his chance to hit (BS) and the weapons chance to wound (Weapon str) without this, you would probably get caught up in weapon complexity quite quickly...

sebster wrote:
After that you’d roll armour, where I’d add a bit more complexity. Instead of the binary system we’ve got at present where you have a save or you have absolutely no save at all, I’d give each model three armour stats, one vs small arms, one vs harder hitting weapons, and one vs armour destroying weapons. A marine would be 3/5/-, meaning against regular weapons like bolters and lasguns he’d save on a 3+, against more deadly weapons like heavy bolters he’d save on a 5, and he’d get no save at all against armour destroying weapons like plasma guns.


This would dramatically underbalance MEQ armies or leave GEQ armies with less saves then they actually get, as the easiest way to balance this system would be to remove the AP system in general and instead base it on weapon str (for instance, weapons of str 1-4 = Normal 5-7 Heavy 8+ Devestating ((no armor))) which leaves questions for things like Nid weaponry that normally does allow army saves would have to have special rules regarding this system.

sebster wrote:
I’d get rid of the silliness where combat resolution needs four unique stats that aren’t used anywhere else in the game. The same system can be managed with two stats, attacks and melee. The first is the number of dice you roll when attacking, the second is a combination of strength and weapon skill – merged in the same way as BS and weapon strength above. All units on both sides would be considered as attacking at the same time, units designed around built around going first in melee such as ‘stealers getting a special rule stating they always attacks first. Units that always go last, such as powerfists, would keep the rule saying they always go last.


Again, the initiative system is meant to balance things like IGs ability to quite literally take 50 models for every ~20 tac marines. If the mass armies automatically struck simul with the bulky guys, the bulky guys will lose out much more frequently then the mass. Weapon skill/Strength is the same as BS/Strength in regards to having a model hit, then try to wound, but I do agree the system is currently very flawed. The fact that almost everyone has a 4+ to hit, when Parrying(etc) is supposed to be considered in the rolls to hit with WS is a bit far-fetched. Maybe giving more uses to those stats would be helpful, incorperating Initiative into Weaponskill / Coversaves /movement might be one idea. Letting WS/Power weapons be used to assist in Difficult terrain tests (hacking away at a jungle/building wall for instance) Strength could be used for Armorsaves or more likely, to determine how far a model can move and fire a heavy weapon (if it is not already relentless). I'm wondering what four stats you are referring to (I assume Attacks/Init/WS/Str) and if correct, the attacks attribute is one of the most important attributes in w40k. It lets you know what NOT to let get in melee with you (as a unit of 5 guys with 4 attack each is scarier then 10 guys with 1 each) and without it, you kinda lose out on melee as a whole.

sebster wrote:
I’d drop wounds entirely. A monstrous creature can be taken out by a well placed shot just like a walker or a tank can. Regular troops with two wounds can have FNP instead. Everything else would get a wound table, similar to the vehicle/walker table. I would think about building separate tables for characters, monstrous creatures, walkers, skimmers, and light vehicles and tanks.


To assume realism (for instance, something big has an equal chance of dying in one shot as something small) is not always the best course of action. Again, while not all MCs are Eternal warrior (and thus, can be IKed) keep in mind that an MC can be VERY different then a walker of a tank. For instance, if you cause an engine in a tank to explode, it explodes, if you shoot a Daemon (who actually has the special rule "Invurnerable") with a lascannon, theoretically, you will not hurt it, the fact that you still can with mundane, mortal weaponry, is already an incredible feat in itself. Wounds allow non-mass armies to (exist for one) field big guys without the worry that one lucky autocannon shot (from a ~45 point model) will take out their 200+ point MC. While tanks in some way have this worry, a way to balance MCs to be able to be one-shotted by common fire would be to associate "Toughness Values (like armor)" where they would have equivlent FA 14 (immune to anything <str8 non rending) etc. Str 3 can wound all but 2 MCs(Talos and Wraith lord) out there right now, str 3 can not effect ANY armor(vehicle) in the game (without some sort of special rule like rending). This balance change would be needed if you were going to have a 16% chance to one shot a MC with common-fire.

sebster wrote:
I’d make fleet and running part of the movement phase. Having to move troops in two separate phases of the one turn is silly.


I don't think its silly to incorperate the fact that people may decide to run instead of shoot while their comrades are firing at an opponent, quite contrary I believe it is moreso silly to assume that the entire army does all its moving as one (even if parts of the army will be moving further then others of the same speed of them) and then all just stand still while some of the units are opening fire.

Again, I understand it is your opinion and you are entitled to it, by no means am I trying to completely dismiss your ideas, I just wanted to post my own opinions and address some concerns that I personally noticed arise.

-DAR>

In Reference to me:
Emperors Faithful wrote: I'm certainly not going to attract the ire of the crazy-giant-child-eating-chicken-poster

Monster Rain wrote:
DAR just laid down the law so hard I think it broke.

 
   
Made in au
The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





Daemon-Archon Ren wrote:So guardsmen and orks would go from having a 16.5% chance of wounding a space marine, to a 16.6666% chance where in a space marine would see no change, but see significantly better odds to wound T3... This also kinda assumes that all shots hit, but only some (very few) actually wound. Instead I think the current system allows for a model to get his chance to hit (BS) and the weapons chance to wound (Weapon str) without this, you would probably get caught up in weapon complexity quite quickly...


Umm, the odds go from 16.6666% to wound to 16.6666%. It'd be the same. Don't know where you got 16.5% from, rounding error maybe?

And yeah, a marine would probably go from the current 3+ to hit, 3+ to wound (44%) to probably a straight 4+ to inflict a wounding hit (50%). This is a marginal shift in probabilities.

And no, it doesn’t assume all shots hit, but only some wound. The current system doesn’t state marines shoot once, with a 2/3 chance of hitting. Instead the system is abstracted, with a large number of shots reduced to a single roll to hit on a 3+. My proposed change wouldn’t bother tracking the number of hits at all, just the number of effective hits that need to be saved by armour.

This would dramatically underbalance MEQ armies or leave GEQ armies with less saves then they actually get, as the easiest way to balance this system would be to remove the AP system in general and instead base it on weapon str (for instance, weapons of str 1-4 = Normal 5-7 Heavy 8+ Devestating ((no armor))) which leaves questions for things like Nid weaponry that normally does allow army saves would have to have special rules regarding this system.


First up, a change like this, given in isolation cannot be measured in terms of game balance. Especially when armour saves for other troop types haven’t even been given. That just makes no sense.

Second up, your suggestion is the same as mine, it just ties AP to the weapon’s strength. This would be a poor change as it removes the ability to distinguish weapons by strength and AP. 40K has a lot of high strength, low AP weapons and vice versa. Your suggestion would lose the ability to represent the autocannon and venom cannon at one end, and inferno rounds and hellguns at the other.
Again, the initiative system is meant to balance things like IGs ability to quite literally take 50 models for every ~20 tac marines. If the mass armies automatically struck simul with the bulky guys, the bulky guys will lose out much more frequently then the mass.


You don’t need four seperate stats to build a combat system where numerous guys are balanced against elite guys.
Weapon skill/Strength is the same as BS/Strength in regards to having a model hit, then try to wound, but I do agree the system is currently very flawed. The fact that almost everyone has a 4+ to hit, when Parrying(etc) is supposed to be considered in the rolls to hit with WS is a bit far-fetched.


Like BS, WS is a stat that the game’s basic design has moved past, but remains for historic reasons. So we all keep rolling three dice whenever anyone attacks anyone. Like BS, GW has basically turned WS into a simple randomiser, a 4+ roll (occasionally a 3+) before getting to the stats that actually distinguish melee combatants – str vs toughness and armour saves.

Maybe giving more uses to those stats would be helpful, incorperating Initiative into Weaponskill / Coversaves /movement might be one idea. Letting WS/Power weapons be used to assist in Difficult terrain tests (hacking away at a jungle/building wall for instance) Strength could be used for Armorsaves or more likely, to determine how far a model can move and fire a heavy weapon (if it is not already relentless).


If 40K was to go down a path of minute simulation, then maybe. It hasn’t though, it’s built around being a company level game. It started as a squad level game though with a strong focus on simulation, and still hasn’t managed to remove all of that baggage.

I'm wondering what four stats you are referring to (I assume Attacks/Init/WS/Str) and if correct, the attacks attribute is one of the most important attributes in w40k. It lets you know what NOT to let get in melee with you (as a unit of 5 guys with 4 attack each is scarier then 10 guys with 1 each) and without it, you kinda lose out on melee as a whole.


Yeah, attacks is one of those stats, and yeah, it is important. If you read my change, you’ll note that the attacks stat is kept, along with a WS/Str combination stat.

To assume realism (for instance, something big has an equal chance of dying in one shot as something small) is not always the best course of action. Again, while not all MCs are Eternal warrior (and thus, can be IKed) keep in mind that an MC can be VERY different then a walker of a tank. For instance, if you cause an engine in a tank to explode, it explodes, if you shoot a Daemon (who actually has the special rule "Invurnerable") with a lascannon, theoretically, you will not hurt it, the fact that you still can with mundane, mortal weaponry, is already an incredible feat in itself. Wounds allow non-mass armies to (exist for one) field big guys without the worry that one lucky autocannon shot (from a ~45 point model) will take out their 200+ point MC. While tanks in some way have this worry, a way to balance MCs to be able to be one-shotted by common fire would be to associate "Toughness Values (like armor)" where they would have equivlent FA 14 (immune to anything <str8 non rending) etc. Str 3 can wound all but 2 MCs(Talos and Wraith lord) out there right now, str 3 can not effect ANY armor(vehicle) in the game (without some sort of special rule like rending). This balance change would be needed if you were going to have a 16% chance to one shot a MC with common-fire.


Yes, there is presently a (theoretical) balance between MCs and vehicles, as the former can be wounded by small arms, and the latter can go boom in one hit. But I think maintaining a balancing mechanism that makes no sense is bad design. If you look at a walker, there are exposed elements everywhere – small arms should be able to damage it. Similarly, I have no idea how a creature would be simultaneously be vulnerable to small arms fire and able to survive four times as many AT hits as a land raider.

It’s a nonsense balance, where balance could be much easier represented with more direct methods.

I don't think its silly to incorperate the fact that people may decide to run instead of shoot while their comrades are firing at an opponent, quite contrary I believe it is moreso silly to assume that the entire army does all its moving as one (even if parts of the army will be moving further then others of the same speed of them) and then all just stand still while some of the units are opening fire.


You have a game where one side moves and shoots, then the other side does the same. We accept this for simplicity and ease of play. Accepting that, but then thinking it is important to simulate all units in the army moving as one, then some units moving again while other units fire is a completely bizarre design decision. It’s even sillier when you consider 40K is almost unique in gaming in making units move twice. 40K wasn’t like that originally, WHFB never has been, and I can’t think of any other game that does it.

Again, I understand it is your opinion and you are entitled to it, by no means am I trying to completely dismiss your ideas, I just wanted to post my own opinions and address some concerns that I personally noticed arise.


Sure, and you’re welcome to your opinion.

“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
Made in ca
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine





Did you guys know Canada has a friggin desert?

make the imperial guard troops choices NORMAL!

You're not playing the game like I play it...why aren't you playing the game like I play it?! O_O 
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

... define normal? That isn't exactly very clear.

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





One change? I'd convert the entire rule set to Toymallet $0.40.
   
Made in se
Wicked Warp Spider






Ios

One change... move the focus away from Space Marines. That is; kill off the extra books and leave all the Space Marine chapters the way the Imperial Guards have their worlds and Eldar craftworlds are described. Change the focus towards a more balanced set of armies (shooty-movey-choppa - i.e. IG, Eldar, Orks which are all cooler than SM). I honestly see less reason for SM chapters to have their own books than for, f.ex., IG to have them.

Speaking of realism... with games the rule is "you don't have to make it realistic, but it must be believable". For instance, a bolter is a ridiculous weapon, to think it would be remotely efficient is silly, but it is believably efficient and believably powerful.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/25 23:45:27


I really need to stay away from the 40K forums. 
   
Made in hk
Shas'la with Pulse Carbine





Hong Kong

Lower prices






 
   
Made in us
Drop Trooper with Demo Charge




Pennsylvannia

Add some Forge World stuff to the regular codexes! The FW books are sooo expensive to ship to the US.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, that or give guard a better armor save. Everything and their mother busts through A5+

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/26 02:47:47


Good to be back!

2500pts of Imperial's ready to fight

750-1000pts of Nids WIP 
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

Mahtamori wrote:One change... move the focus away from Space Marines. That is; kill off the extra books and leave all the Space Marine chapters the way the Imperial Guards have their worlds and Eldar craftworlds are described. Change the focus towards a more balanced set of armies (shooty-movey-choppa - i.e. IG, Eldar, Orks which are all cooler than SM). I honestly see less reason for SM chapters to have their own books than for, f.ex., IG to have them.

Speaking of realism... with games the rule is "you don't have to make it realistic, but it must be believable". For instance, a bolter is a ridiculous weapon, to think it would be remotely efficient is silly, but it is believably efficient and believably powerful.

Not really... it's not exactly believed to be efficient.

The LASGUN is efficient.

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Drop Trooper with Demo Charge




Pennsylvannia

Not really... it's not exactly believed to be efficient.

The LASGUN is efficient.


Yes efficient, but woefully underpowered. Flashlights are deadlier than lasguns.

Good to be back!

2500pts of Imperial's ready to fight

750-1000pts of Nids WIP 
   
Made in ca
Pulsating Possessed Chaos Marine





Did you guys know Canada has a friggin desert?

Melissia wrote:... define normal? That isn't exactly very clear.



apparently in one troops choice you have to get 2 mandatory inf squads,0-5 heavy weapons teams, 0-2 special weapons teams and 0-1 conscript squads. all in one troops choice. thats kind of unnecesarry imo.

You're not playing the game like I play it...why aren't you playing the game like I play it?! O_O 
   
Made in ca
Calm Celestian




Windsor Ontario Canada

Blitza da warboy wrote:
Melissia wrote:... define normal? That isn't exactly very clear.



apparently in one troops choice you have to get 2 mandatory inf squads,0-5 heavy weapons teams, 0-2 special weapons teams and 0-1 conscript squads. all in one troops choice. thats kind of unnecesarry imo.

True but that's why you also get veterans which is a normal troop choice.
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

The Odessey wrote:
Not really... it's not exactly believed to be efficient.

The LASGUN is efficient.


Yes efficient, but woefully underpowered. Flashlights are deadlier than lasguns.

And yet, lasguns can kill a Marine in one shot, both in fluff and in tabletop.

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Apprehensive Inquisitorial Apprentice






Mahtamori wrote:One change... move the focus away from Space Marines. That is; kill off the extra books and leave all the Space Marine chapters the way the Imperial Guards have their worlds and Eldar craftworlds are described. Change the focus towards a more balanced set of armies (shooty-movey-choppa - i.e. IG, Eldar, Orks which are all cooler than SM). I honestly see less reason for SM chapters to have their own books than for, f.ex., IG to have them.

Speaking of realism... with games the rule is "you don't have to make it realistic, but it must be believable". For instance, a bolter is a ridiculous weapon, to think it would be remotely efficient is silly, but it is believably efficient and believably powerful.


bolter ridiculous?? check this out... its called the AA-12 shotgun. about 1min into it it says this full auto shotgun has granade rounds that blow up 1/2 second after impact. just like a boltgun.Hell it even looks like a boltgun !!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syog9ETZ96g

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2010/05/26 07:48:18


Silence is golden but Duct tape is silver
 
   
Made in au
Death-Dealing Devastator






AA-12... it's... beautiful.

Blood Ravens W: 5 D: 3 L: 5
Argent Castellans: Ideating on a new non-codex chapter.
"It is only fitting that we ride into battle!"
Imperial Guard soon.  
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

It doesn't relaly look like a boltgun...

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle





Bellingham, WA

It kinda looks like a storm bolter from the side.

Heralds of Rot CSM 4000 pts


"In short there is no Order only Chaos eternal so lament and be quelled with fear if you serve the False Emperor or accept the gifts bestowed by the pantheon of the four gods and rejoice as the galaxy burns." - Unknown Wordbearer  
   
Made in us
Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

Only it doesn't. Unless you're drunk or something...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/26 15:58:37


The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Hmmm...If I could change one thing...MOAR DAKKA!!!







There's just an acre of you fellas, isn't there? 
   
Made in us
Drop Trooper with Demo Charge




Pennsylvannia

They actually designed a bolter-esque weapon that explodes after entering a building, XM-18 I think....


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and in Gaunt's Ghosts it took 2 squads of lasgunners to fry 1 CSM, so I guess it sort of fits.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/05/27 03:07:08


Good to be back!

2500pts of Imperial's ready to fight

750-1000pts of Nids WIP 
   
 
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