Vanilla Marines @ 1,500 points (all comers)

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**Kolath**

See this thread for a discussion of how to do it and some great example pics: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/270318.page#1195644

**Sgt.Sunshine**

Ah, awesome. Out of curiosity is my list solid?

**Corennus**

On the sternguard i'd lose the powerfist and invest in 5 more combi-bolters.

say 2 more combi-meltas and 3 combi-plasmas

Other than that......yeah it's pretty solid. I like your typhoon squadron, get those firing frag on infantry and could cause a lot of casualties.
Especially with the plasma cannons adding to it.

i think the only area you're weak in now is high power (lascannon and blast) long range firepower.

Nothing you're taking will really hurt AV 13 tanks at range. But I guess if you hunker down and wait it out they'll close on you far enough to melta them.
Or use the Dreadnought.

**Toban**

The last edited list sound quite better right now.

I just still have a problem about the Sternguard unit.
Try to complete it at 10 models to combat sq. them by droppin' in with a pod.
Remember that you can charge in the entire sq before the combat-squaddin' suddivision.
This way you'll can land close to sensibles targets dividing fire on 2 of them.

In a Rhino you'll can fire 2 weapons vs just one target.
You'll be limited in 12" range (talking about -meltas) and you'll move slowly.

Unfortunately, to really take advantage of them, the Sternguard's units should be suicided more or less..
They'll have 1/2 turns of life when, in the more efficient position, they'll should try the best.

For the rest if you'll can't double the Pred take instead a second Sniper Dread.

**Corennus**

You either take sternguard to be a suicide unit, or keep them at max range to take advantage of using Kraken rounds on infantry.

**Sgt.Sunshine**

The problem of maxing the sternguard is that the Libby won't have a spot on the ride. If I exclude him from that unit I feel that his nullzone won't be as effective.

I'll consider the powerfist for more goodies. I just kind of wanted the ability to take on stuff in CC with the fist and scare people? I always figured it'd be a good investment.

**Corennus**

You don't really want your Librarian with your sternguard anyway Sunshine. What's he going to do? Cast Force Dome to give them an INV SAVE of 5+?

And Nullzone with Sternguard?? Nullzone is really effective as a close combat power when power weapons are in play. Shooting will use the normal armour save.

And sternguard can only take power weapons on the sergeant.

If you REALLY want to splash out and take an elite unit that will benefit from Null Zone take Assault Terminators or even Vanguard.

**tedurur**

Corennus wrote:You don't really want your Librarian with your sternguard anyway Sunshine. What's he going to do? Cast Force Dome to give them an INV SAVE of 5+?

And Nullzone with Sternguard?? Nullzone is really effective as a close combat power when power weapons are in play. Shooting will use the normal armour save.

And sternguard can only take power weapons on the sergeant.

If you REALLY want to splash out and take an elite unit that will benefit from Null Zone take Assault Terminators or even Vanguard.

Becuse you would have the Libby ride with a 5 man tactical squad instead? Sternguard with combi meltas and plasmas will greatly benefit from Null Zone and vs quite a few enemies they will they will benefit from it even if they havent got any combi weapons at all (seer council, deamons ect.)

**Corennus**

Null Zone would be better put with an assault squad.

How often are you going to use the melta/plasma part of the combi-bolters over the special ammo? Not often IMO.
Not enough to make Null Zone really worth it.

**tedurur**

Corennus wrote:Null Zone would be better put with an assault squad.

How often are you going to use the melta/plasma part of the combi-bolters over the special ammo? Not often IMO.
Not enough to make Null Zone really worth it.

Yeah, thats a great idea, stick him in the invisible assault squad

also unless you mean assault terminator squad

x100

**mercer**

Sgt.Sunshine wrote:HQ
Librarian
- Nullzone and something else
100 points

Elites
Sternguard
- 9 man w/ Powerfist, Combi-Meltas(x5), Combi-Flamer(x2) and Rhino w/ EA
335 points

Dreadnought
- TL Autocannons (x2)
125 poins

Troops
Tactical Squad
10 man w/ Powerfist, Flamer, Plasma Cannon and Razorback
240 poitns

Tactical Squad
10 man w/ Powerfist, Meltagun, Plasma Cannon and Razorback
245 points

Scout Squad
5 man w/ Sniper Rifles, Camo Cloaks and Missile Launcher
100 points

Fast Attack
Land Speeder
Typhoon Missile Launcher
90 points

Land Speeder
Typhoon Missile Launcher
90 points

Land Speeder
Typhoon Missile Launcher
90 points

Heavy Support
Predator
Autocannon and Heavy Bolter Sponsons
85 points

Total
1,500 points

So is this list competitive, not competitive? I'm looking for input before I buy more models. I already have the troops and want to make sure before I invest in more.

Edit 2: Toyed around with the list a bit more. I know predators work best in two so I'm curious if I should swap it out for something.

HQ is sound

Sternguard don't need a power fist; they shouldn't be in combat or else they're not shooting those expensive special ammo rounds. You also don't need extra armour as you're not in a rush to get any where, all ammo at least has 24" range.

Drop the power fist from tacticals; 5 man Space Marines do not win combat all that often. Switch the Razorback for a Rhino too, you want to stay in the vehicle at all times not get out to shoot putting yourself a risk. Razorbacks at good for taking a min tactical squad without a special weap so they do not need to get out.

Meh on Scouts. I'd rather take Tacticals TBH or give them bolters, I know they still hit 4+ and wound 4+ but you've got the AP there. TBH I wouldn't take them.

Auto/las Pred works well for anti tank; I've used it in that config for anti troop and it's meh TBH. I'd rather take a Thunderfire Cannon and sit back from a-far and blast templates.