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Was just thinking that at some point I will need a Dwarf Codex + O&G and then if the Woodies get an update a new one of those.

If my maths is correct, £17.50 x 3 =£52.50!
Guess I can spread the cost over a period of time so it doesn't hurt so much

A trio of thin bendy books that will fall apart for the same dosh as the Big 'un makes the latter seem better all of a sudden!

TBH would probably get it if I could for the background.
Good to hear that not all the illustrations are those red and yellow ones.
They would be fine imho if part of an article describing the concept/design process. That would be interesting.

Trouble is the other hobby stuff is leaching funds, and if I get any nice tomes it will have to be some arty farty ones that am currently lusting after!

Personally, I'm tempted to buy it, but I can see how it's unnecessary. And I probably won't, TBH. $75 for just the book is a bit much, especially when I could get 2 armies and some terrain for only $15 more.

As a guy strongly considering getting into Fantasy, you'd better believe I'm waiting for the small book. Of course that's what the starter set is for I guess.

The big book is for sitting at home. Fluff and painting ideas don't need to be lugged around to the game store every time. I just with the starter kit was coming out sooner, but in the grand scheme, 2 months isn't bad... for GW that is.

Mattlov wrote:I agree with that, but not the heavy part. I don't want to pay $75 for a 500+ page book that I only need what, 80 pages of?

Bad deal.

Yeah, this. I feel the same way about The BBB. I don't really care about most of it, I'll just use the starter set rule book. For the price of the BBB I could get a land raider, which is more fun to me.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:I love the smell of condescension in the evening.

I was so uncertain what I was going to do but have been saved by the blinding insight and wisdom. Now I know what the options are. I'm sure there are many more who are similarly grateful for the advice.

I got the 6th edition BRB and 7th edition starter set rulebook. Needless to say the 6th edition rulebook art and photos of models are very dated so I missed that aspect in the LRB. I'll probably get the BRB for all the extra non-rule content then get the start set when it comes out as it'll probably be a good deal and the LRB can travel while the BRB stays home.

Another factor to add into the equation is how much will you actually play.
Sadly for me it will not be a lot. So not a lot of justfication for the expenditure. If there is a change in these circumstances I might have to rethink my position.

Karon wrote:Just buy it. I honestly don't know why people get into warhammer if they don't give two gaks about fluff and the background.

W/o it, its like playing w/ static action figures.

----------------

Bottom line is that you can buy it now, I mean, even get it on ebay for probably $10 off, and have the fluff grow on you.

Or, you wait 'till september for the mini rulebook, and don't play 'till then.

First point of yours.

You totally disregard that MOST players will already know all of the significant fluff completely. Only completely utterly new people don't know Sigmar united men into the Empire.

Also, you can find out all of the fluff for free online.

They really should have released it as two separate books. One rulebook and one fluffbook. Why should I carry a book of fluff and model pictures to every single game? I don't need to open up the back-story of the Tomb Kings when I'm playing a Watchtower battle against Dwarfs.

As to your second point, not buying the fat-tome doesn't mean you can't play until September at all. Non-GW stores you can look through the PDF on a laptop or just use the rulebook of the person you are playing against. And in GW stores, the store copy or the rulebook of the person you're playing against. That's hardly "Pay $80 or zero games until September." Exaggerating makes a weak point.

TheBloodGod wrote:

Karon wrote:Just buy it. I honestly don't know why people get into warhammer if they don't give two gaks about fluff and the background.

W/o it, its like playing w/ static action figures.

----------------

Bottom line is that you can buy it now, I mean, even get it on ebay for probably $10 off, and have the fluff grow on you.

Or, you wait 'till september for the mini rulebook, and don't play 'till then.

First point of yours.

You totally disregard that MOST players will already know all of the significant fluff completely. Only completely utterly new people don't know Sigmar united men into the Empire.

Also, you can find out all of the fluff for free online.

They really should have released it as two separate books. One rulebook and one fluffbook. Why should I carry a book of fluff and model pictures to every single game? I don't need to open up the back-story of the Tomb Kings when I'm playing a Watchtower battle against Dwarfs.

As to your second point, not buying the fat-tome doesn't mean you can't play until September at all. Non-GW stores you can look through the PDF on a laptop or just use the rulebook of the person you are playing against. And in GW stores, the store copy or the rulebook of the person you're playing against. That's hardly "Pay $80 or zero games until September." Exaggerating makes a weak point.

Well said , i feel the same way :3 ( but yes its personal preference )

Except that the fluff was actually advanced in this book.

I like my rulebook. I can manually input data into people who just want to argue with me continually after I've proved them wrong.

Zhetsuken wrote:Phish Skills: I have no problem with that at all and in fact I expect that to an extent. However, what they released imho is extreme. The least they could have done is offered a "Collectors edition" (the monstrous one) and "Standard version" just like they did with 40K.

But all in all what this topic was supposed to be about was if other found this effecting their decision and it seems like there are a few but they constitute a minority so perhaps GW did the right thing and catered to their main audience and refused to take the hit for a slimmer version that wouldn't sell as well.

Also, do you intend for them to make a bigger book and sell it for more? No.

I think this new book is a blessing. The fluff is interesting, even if you never want to read it, it may get some friends into the hobby etc. etc. It can give you inspiration for your models, or facts to apply to your army construction.

Wouldn't have been logical from a business stand point to make a smaller one that sells for less, they should honestly make the starter set come with a good deal, and sell it for 100~150 cash moonies.

Todosi wrote:

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:

Read it before you speak.

There are ALOT of new additions in it.

Though the fluff has been re-amped. The pictures are amazing.

You'll all be sad when the starter set doesn't come with a mini-rulebook.

The new starter set does come with the mini rulebook. I looked at it yesterday. Held it in my hands even.

Where are the salt pictures when you need them...?

Seriously, you can understand why I don't believe you.

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:

Where are the salt pictures when you need them...?

Seriously, you can understand why I don't believe you.

Whats so hard to believe the starter set does come with the mini rule book o_o

LunaHound wrote:

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:

Where are the salt pictures when you need them...?

Seriously, you can understand why I don't believe you.

Whats so hard to believe the starter set does come with the mini rule book o_o

Yes, assuming GW follows the business model of the very successful Assault on Black Reach set, a mini rulebook which covers everything up until the modelling, background and narrative battle sections will be included.

This will be very easy to pick up on ebay as many people will buy the set and sell the miniatures and rulebook separately for a profit.

I have also seen the mini rulebook, held it in my hands, and looked through it. They have it at both of the local GWs, in addition to the larger one (not for sale yet, obviously).

I think it's extremely likely that it will come in the starter set. There's been no indication otherwise, and that's how they usually do it- probably also to keep people from buying it alone to get the rules. Even though you're getting a ton of great models in the starter set, by combining the mini-rulebook with it, they guarantee you'll have to spend at least $75 to get the rules (to pay for the hardcover version, or to get the starter set).

That is, unless you go through something like The Warstore, where you can get it by itself

Since the OP was asking for opinions, here are the reasons I don't purchase the bloated main rulebooks that GW produces.

1) I'm a casual gamer that enjoys relaxing with a paintbrush from time to time. This means that I don't want/need the entire extra.

2) GW "fluff" can't really be called a story, a history, or anything literary in nature. Many of the fluff sections of the rulebooks/codices seem to be written by half-literate 8 year olds and there are blatant inconsistencies from one book to the next or even within the same book (see the ongoing drama over Tau fluff in another thread). There's no real story or even a background, just a collection of cobbled together, fractured information blurbs. Be honest, we all know that GW is a miniature seller first and a game manufacturer second (or even third after being a lawsuit factory).

No, I'll just wait until I can buy the mini-rulebook.

My 2 cents.

Flashman wrote:

LunaHound wrote:

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:

Where are the salt pictures when you need them...?

Seriously, you can understand why I don't believe you.

Whats so hard to believe the starter set does come with the mini rule book o_o

Yes, assuming GW follows the business model of the very successful Assault on Black Reach set, a mini rulebook which covers everything up until the modelling, background and narrative battle sections will be included.

This will be very easy to pick up on ebay as many people will buy the set and sell the miniatures and rulebook separately for a profit.

I knew it would come with a mini-rulebook! I simply thought that it was still miles away, I was expecting a september release from some earlier rumors.

1.) Big rulebook in July.
2.) Starter box with mini-rulebook in September.
3.) Mini rulebook not sold separately by GW, browse ebay instead or ask people with 2 starter boxes.
4.) Big rulebook has 90 pages of extra rules including 30 pages extra scenarios and 60 pages on how to make your own scenarios/legendary battles/campaigns. I really recommend to get the big book, it is fantastic!

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:
A trio of thin bendy books that will fall apart for the same dosh as the Big 'un makes the latter seem better all of a sudden!

I always find this statement amusing. I have no clue what the hell people are doing to their books to make them fall apart. The only miniatures related book I've had "fall apart" is my copy of "Hell's Highway" for Flames of War. And I can't even explain that one, since I barely had it for a month and then pages began falling out.

I took my BRB to work, copied the rules section, and used the binder to put a spiral ring on it. took 10 minutes of my lunch break.

Now i have the BRB for the fluff and imo great extra stuff, and my easy to flip through floppy book.

Kanluwen wrote:I always find this statement amusing. I have no clue what the hell people are doing to their books to make them fall apart. The only miniatures related book I've had "fall apart" is my copy of "Hell's Highway" for Flames of War. And I can't even explain that one, since I barely had it for a month and then pages began falling out.

What amuses me the most is , how one person's possession of GW book which doesnt fall apart ,
leads him to make statements of him finding amusing of tons of others in possession of GW books that does fall apart.

All i can say to you is , lucky you?

I see that you always defend GW product based on your lone personal experience and make interesting statements when someone owns defective GW products.

Why?

I ordered the Collector's Edition and I have to say it's one of the best purchases I've made. The rules sections are so well laid out, as well as having huge amounts of interesting lore. The Lore of Magic section is also stellar, and the reference sheets are amazing. I highly suggest picking it up.

Vinditater wrote:I ordered the Collector's Edition and I have to say it's one of the best purchases I've made. The rules sections are so well laid out, as well as having huge amounts of interesting lore. The Lore of Magic section is also stellar, and the reference sheets are amazing. I highly suggest picking it up.

Are reference sheet detachable by any chance?

Unfortunately not, but should be easy to photocopy nonetheless. Maybe so in the normal edition, I would feel like I was ripping pages out of the bible though with the Collectors =).

I just saw a picture of the new rulebook next to a table going on...The Thing's massive!

Honestly, I'm starting to think of buying it, so I can use it a step-stool to reach some of the higher shelves in my kitchen

I honestly want to wear it around a chain and swing it about like a Warrior Priest during games. It's the biggest book I think I've ever owned lol.

I passed on the BRB because there just isn't enough in it to convince me to buy it. I don't need a modeling / hobby section, I don't need more-of-the-same fluff (even if it advanced a little its still not PP fluff I'm sure), and the rest will be in the mini rule book.

Since I really won't be playing much Fantasy until after Gen Con, its really only a month to wait or so until the mini rule book is available.

Oh, even if its not advanced, its not PP fluff...hurr...durr.

(Not directed at you specifically) People say that they don't want the same old fluff, I tell them it is advanced and they're wrong. Then they tell me they don't care because its not the same as the fluff PP writes.

Give me a break, that's just whining for the sake of whining.

Its a shame really, since this is by far the best book GW has ever produced for one of their games, and it looks as if nobody actually gives a gak about background story because its "GW quality"

I wouldn't be surprised if for the next edition of Fantasy, they sell just the rules for $50, hardcover, and don't put a softcover rulebook in the box set.

Karon wrote:Oh, even if its not advanced, its not PP fluff...hurr...durr.

(Not directed at you specifically) People say that they don't want the same old fluff, I tell them it is advanced and they're wrong. Then they tell me they don't care because its not the same as the fluff PP writes.

Give me a break, that's just whining for the sake of whining.

Its a shame really, since this is by far the best book GW has ever produced for one of their games, and it looks as if nobody actually gives a gak about background story because its "GW quality"

I wouldn't be surprised if for the next edition of Fantasy, they sell just the rules for $50, hardcover, and don't put a softcover rulebook in the box set.

I get where you're coming from I just have a different opinion. When I want a story, I buy a novel. When I want a game, I buy a game. Unless GW suddenly starts designing the game around a "choose your own adventure" style book, there's really no point for me, personally, in purchasing a huge tome for a game. It's not like in the middle of a game, I stop my opponent and ask them the history of the character they are fielding. I roll some dice and kill it. Having fluff is all well and good but it's hardly worth it for me to buy a 500+ page book when all I want are the game rules.

Karon wrote:Oh, even if its not advanced, its not PP fluff...hurr...durr.

(Not directed at you specifically) People say that they don't want the same old fluff, I tell them it is advanced and they're wrong. Then they tell me they don't care because its not the same as the fluff PP writes.

Give me a break, that's just whining for the sake of whining.

Maybe I didn't clarify myself enough?

If GW had taken the results of the Storm of Chaos (forces of order stomping forces of chaos) there would be a lot of potential there and I would be interested in the fluff. Each army section could have fluff on how that empire has changed since the storm of chaos.

For example, have a nice 20 page story about the storm of Chaos and Valtens role in it. As a result of the Storm, Archeron loses the favor of the gods and is now just a warlord and is trying to regain the favor of the gods. The empire has reclaimed all of its land and pushed into chaos territory to setup out posts. The forces of order have changed the worlds state to a razor edge of balance from what seemed like eternal darkeness. Etc, etc.

That would be freaking awesome and the best part? The fluff would have been determined by a player driven event.

However, GW won't make that drastic of a change, so I'm just not that interested in more of the same.