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Sir Pseudonymous wrote:

Thaylen wrote:Also take not that a lot of DE builds rely on vehicle mounted darklances for AT fire. Once you kill their skimmers, most foot mounted DE can't really do anything to a vehicle on close combat. If they don't have hand carried blasters, you can pretty much count the game as a win if you kill all of their dark lances before they demech you.

Unless their wyches are carrying haywires, or their troops have gotten a couple of pain tokens and so can glance AV10 on a 6... Or they have an incubi klaivex with demiklaives... Or an Archon Court with Sslyth and Ur-ghuls... Or Grotesques with a Haemonculus... Or Hellions (with or without pain tokens, though even more so with)... Or beastmasters with clawed fiends or razorwings... Or a Talos or Cronos... Or reavers with heat lances... Or scourges with haywire blasters...

Yep, not really any foot mounted anti-tank but blaster warriors...

Sorry I'm not superfamiliar w/ their codex. The two guys I played had none of the elements you mentioned.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sir Pseudonymous wrote:That makes it sound as though you could feasibly get your walkers in close if they didn't want you to. They are faster than your walkers. They have a plethora of good ranged anti-tank. How then do you plan on tarpitting them with walkers, or avoiding wyches with haywire grenades? They have a possible 26" charge range, more if you consider that raiders can turn, so what's more than 26" away from the side, becomes less when they're facing you. You're not going to get the drop on them, or escape the units that can hurt you.

And wyches with haywire grenades have a very good chance of bringing down a dreadnought in two rounds of melee, and it's unlikely to explode because it's all in glancing hits. If they have shardnets too, then it has about a 20% chance of actually inflicting a single wound.

The trick is to use them as counter assault. You don't run down DE. You have the dreadnought chill next to your squad of tacticals in a rhino. if they assault the tacticals, they will get killed by the dreadnought. They would have to spat the dread first (admittedly not to hard given the abundance of darklances availiable to them).

DE are weak to walkers.

DE are vulnerable to MSU since it counters their MSU somewhat.

and the Missile launcher is the best weapon to take. Imperial version or Eldar.

Take a bunch of razorback units with twin hvy bolter and the squad inside has flamer/bolters or bolters/missile launcher. Take some dreads.

Honestly the strength of dark eldar is dealing with expensive low model count units. Like your super death character, dark eldar players want you to take him.

Like everyone has been saying, if you can deny their long range assault movements, and get them in the Shooting phase, they're likely to fall relatively easy. However, if you do get caught up in CC, it's better that you bring the fight to them, instead of letting them get to you.

Sternguard Veterans are a good unit for shooting with. Hellfire Rounds will work wonders against them, as well as any weapon that has a high quantity of shot volume. Heavy Bolters and flamers of any sort help a lot in this case.

Librarians with the Null Zone power are one of the best defenses you can bring when facing them in CC. Having them reroll their successful Invul saves is huge.

Good luck!

Brother-Thunder wrote:consider a 10 man squad firing at a raider outside of rapid fire range. Assuming one brought the free flamer and ML, we have 8 shots. 5-6 will hit, 1-2 will actually glance, and if the DE player is smart, he turbo-boosted forward, having a 50% chance to ignore it. Even then, one only has a 1/6th chance to actually wreck the raider.

It can still happen, and it does more than once in a blue moon, but it is not exactly something to be relied on. I think bolters are better used on the guys who have to get out after seeing their tin can blown out of the sky by an autocannon dread or typhoon speeder. That's this Marine and DE player's two cents, though.

Brother-Thunder speaks the truth. Each bolter shot has just under a 2% chance to destroy a AV10. While immobilized does count as destroyed when they move fast, a total of 1/2 the cover granted lowers to overall destruction chance to ~1.86%, or just under the normal chances. Now, if you have 2 squads rapid-firiing, you have 20 chances to make that 1.92%, which starts to change the odds considerably....

As Brother-Thunder mentioned, using an AC is a completely different story. The second value provided is from a TL-AC fired from a dread. If your dread is the rifleman config, you have two chances, each with just under a 25% of destroying the AV 10 target at 48". Those are odds that make a DE less than pleased.

Bolter Simulation
Shaken Hits 3.73%
Stunned Hits 1.76%
Weapon Destroyed 2.1%
Immobilized 472 1.89%
Destroyed 479 1.92%
Exploded 0 0%

AutoCannon Simulation
Shaken Hits 4.82%
Stunned Hits 9.96%
Weapon Destroyed 10.03%
Immobilized 9.94%
Destroyed 9.84%
Exploded 14.95%

Seems like black templar terminator assault cannon spam should do the trick.

I think the better question would be, what's good against dark eldar that's decent against MEQ and GUQ.

-Matt

HawaiiMatt wrote:Seems like black templar terminator assault cannon spam should do the trick.

I think the better question would be, what's good against dark eldar that's decent against MEQ and GUQ.

-Matt

Autocannons. They insta-kill DE (great for when you find a character out of a squad). They have great range, so the night-shields do little. As an added bonus, they are great for cracking rhinos, chimera sides, and other low-AV targets.

For the same reasons, plasma weapons are also great vs. DE. A plasma gun double tapping has a decent chance of cracking a eldar vehidle, and the AP2 help greatly when killing the incubi. 3 plasma guns in a chimera can do well in those situations. They also fry BE dead removing their FNP saves, and can be used vs the sides of chimeras and rear of most tanks well.

How about "Whats not good against dark eldar that good vs. MEQ and GEQ"
The answer is melta. Melta guns can have a range of 6" vs. DE with their shields, which is just not enough to really be effective. Melta may be king vs. IG, but against DE, it just falls short. This catches a lot of players with their pants down as their used to thinking that the answer to every solution is the melta. They have been able to hammer in screws for so long, they forgot they had a screwdriver in their toolkit as well.

sennacherib wrote:i just watched the only local DE player dissemble a space wolf player and two different space marine players. one gaem ended on turn three. it just seems like they have a pretty hard to beat dex. I am not looking forward to facing them, this much is certain.

I'm just going to put it out there that maybe this guys just a good player.

Dark Eldar weaknesses are people that don't know how to play them. They're incredibly fragile, and if you don't know how to handle them they're going to fall apart in your hands. Don't try to beat him by bringing a better list, try and beat him by out-thinking him.