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ph34r wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:the Emperor was just a man as far as his body went.

You sure, heretic?

Off-Topic: Is that how guardian spears look? I pictured the bolter much more.. integrated i suppose

Sanguinius smashed boulders with his bare hands. Horus smashed Sanguinius like a bug. The Emeror killed Horus. A Hunter-Killer Missile would do as much damage as bugs do to your windshield.

The way I look at it is that the Emperor is the god of humanity in the same way that Mork and Gork are the ork gods. The emperor was the god of humanity, so it makes sense that he would have a human form, though it would be a perfected human form.

The Emperor isn't just glowy and psychic, he's at least 8 feet tall. Maybe 9.

Greatest thread ever.

We've been through all this nine foot stuff before. If the Emporer was nine feet tall, he would have got a bad back from thousands of years of living in houses built for human sized humans.

More to the point, how would the Emporer be T10 without loads of Geneseeds, when SMs are only T4 with loads of Geneseeds?

If the Emporer could grow to T10 without Geneseeds, why did he need to make Geneseeds in order to make SMs T4?

Eh?

Kilkrazy wrote:We've been through all this nine foot stuff before. If the Emporer was nine feet tall, he would have got a bad back from thousands of years of living in houses built for human sized humans.

More to the point, how would the Emporer be T10 without loads of Geneseeds, when SMs are only T4 with loads of Geneseeds?

If the Emporer could grow to T10 without Geneseeds, why did he need to make Geneseeds in order to make SMs T4?

Eh?

Because the geneseed is, more or less, a weak copy of a copy of the Emperor's own genes? Top that off with the fact that geneseed needs to be compatible with different genetical setups and it doesn't seem too far-fetched with T10...

As for the size of the Emperor, IIRC there's a scene in one of the HH novels where either Perturabo or Mortarion appearently "towers" above the Emperor. This leads me to believe that the Emperor is of normal human height. Worrying about back-problems on such a being seems silly tho'.

Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

Lol, the emperor most certainly NOT the size of an average human. He is AT LEAST as large as normal SM, even tho' I think that he IS 8-9 feet tall.
A hunter-killer to the face would result in a slightly blackened by smoke but otherwise unharmed Empeor. Anyone who says otherwise, or in a different way doubts The Emperor's godness will be reported to the Ordo Hereticum.

Kilkrazy wrote:Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

Quoted from WH40K Wiki:

"In the end they decided to pool their psychic energies by reincarnating as a single soul in a single human body. The thousands of shamans, as one, took poison, and as one, died. A year later the man who would become the Emperor was born. His psychic power was so potent that its energies altered his physiology and rendered him immortal so he would no longer need to reincarnate and could not be assaulted by the daemonic creatures of the Immaterium upon his death. As he grew older, his potent psychic powers began to manifest. Over many millennia, he traveled among the many peoples of mankind, using his ancient wisdom to help where he could in the guise of many different legendary, historical and religious personages."

Many quoted Black Library sources at the bottom of the wiki page.

Hope that helps.

Kilkrazy wrote:Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

The Walmart super clearenace section. I take it youve never been into the back room... You can buy it by the bucket.

Reanimator wrote:Assuming that the big e is at least a physical match for primarchs, which he is, then I reckon yes, he'd live. Most hh novels talk about primarch organics being superior in every conceivable way to human physiology. Things like bone density and skin toughness etc clearly make him more resilient. Talk of shaped charges and such is all well and good, but his body strength in relative terms is a complete unknown. Also, talk of discounting his psychic powers is like saying could he do it with no arms.. It's a part of what makes him as strong as he is, so the idea of him resisting damage by sheer force of will is entirely probable.

Irrelevant, shaped charges are several times more powerful than needed for most tanks, With the possible exception of several feet of adamantium. you need psychic powers to protect against them. Gen II are several times less powerful than gen III, and i imagine most HK's are gen II, and even Gen II would cut through any organic and most non organic material, it's basically a large clunky HIGH PRESSURE plasma weapon. Gen III are several times more powerful. Even looking at the highly abstract and inaccurate game system even if he were T10, he could still be wounded on a 6, and straight to his head would kill him (think Special ID rule for having your brain removed) Gen III being much more powerful would break the game system.

Man the emperor would cleave eva 01 with a glance of his incredibly chiselled masculine features, im still of the impression the Emperor could just hold his particles together through sheer force of will.

the emperor is not a god, Eva unit 1 however, IS.


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Mr Nobody wrote:Zoanthropes can produce warp shields, so imagine the emperor would have something similar along the surface of his body.

we are excluding psychic abilities though. if we added that in, I imagine not much could phase the emperor. Maybe a special high gamma source that was disguised so he didn't know it as killing him till he was too dead to do anything about it.


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Kilkrazy wrote:Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

the emperor had no parents, several thousand of old earths greatest mages got together and sacrificed themselves to create a near godlike being.

GazzyG wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

Quoted from WH40K Wiki:

"In the end they decided to pool their psychic energies by reincarnating as a single soul in a single human body. The thousands of shamans, as one, took poison, and as one, died. A year later the man who would become the Emperor was born. His psychic power was so potent that its energies altered his physiology and rendered him immortal so he would no longer need to reincarnate and could not be assaulted by the daemonic creatures of the Immaterium upon his death. As he grew older, his potent psychic powers began to manifest. Over many millennia, he traveled among the many peoples of mankind, using his ancient wisdom to help where he could in the guise of many different legendary, historical and religious personages."

Many quoted Black Library sources at the bottom of the wiki page.

Hope that helps.

Physiology and genes aren't the same thing.

If the Emporer was nine feet tall, how did he keep going into peoples' houses without having to bend down and get a bad back?

Kilkrazy wrote:

If the Emporer was nine feet tall, how did he keep going into peoples' houses without having to bend down and get a bad back?

Hint: "the last church". The Emperor as a normal sized human. You see what he wants you to see.

I actually doubt that a HKM would get near the Emperor...
Thousands of guardsmen would be kicked in front of it and if that isn't enough then they send in ten thousands more.

Any kind of missile would hurt badly and a anti tank weapon would probably kill or a least seriously wound him. His abilities were down to skill, inteligence and being an amazing psyker. His body wasn't much more powerful than a SM. By comparing all the fluff he seems about as physically powerful as an ork warboss (his strength and toughness not skill).

Unless his face is as tough as a LR (in which case why is he wearing armour) a missile is going to do some damage. The reason he lasted so long was because he could deflect them with his powers, move out of the way or get some other guy to take the shot for him.

1hadhq- yes he can change what he looks like but thats how you see him, in reality he is still the same size and being so huge is going to be very impractical. It won't take people long to realise they should just built low rooms.

wrong thread

Da Boss wrote:An ork boy nearly choked the life out of the Big E according to my 2nd Ed fluff, and Horus saved his life. So I'm thinking a Hunter Killer Missile to the face would probably mess him up good-o.

Dang, I was going to bring this up but I was beaten to the punch.

In summary, the Emperor was still in a human body. If, for some reasons, all his defenses failed and he was actually struck by an anti-tank missile, he'd get obliterated.

That seems to be what the actual question is about. So it's not useful to discuss what defenses he actually had or how helpful they would be.


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ChronoCupcake wrote:
I beg to differ in the BA dex it says that mephistons gene seed activated a second time a previously unheard of phenomena, which I'd theorise made him closer to a primarch's strengh then an average marine. So assuming vanilla marine t4, mephiston t6, then a primarch would be roughly t8 ? which would ideally place the Emperor at t10.

This logic is entirely flawed since it assumes the Emperor was more physically capable than the Primarchs. He was not. He built them to be physical monsters*.

The only beings the Emperor ever bests in physical combat are the Primarchs, but that would only imply his superiority to them in those terms if we didn't also have evidence of his inferiority to other beings that were essentially annoyances to them.

If anything, it implies he coded in some "let me beat you up" backdoors into their psyches. Since he built them from the ground up, that is well within possibility.

*Also, we have GW official statistics for one Primarch, and he's Toughness 6.

4M2A wrote:
1hadhq- yes he can change what he looks like but thats how you see him, in reality he is still the same size and being so huge is going to be very impractical. It won't take people long to realise they should just built low rooms.

The same size of ?
As I see it, the Emperor is a great mind bound with a shell to this realm. Size may be undefined and may adapt to needs.
Or the other way round, some archeotech seems to provide more space inside than outside, especially the vault of the Dragon.

And why should anyone built low rooms?
Chaos to hide from him?

it was a warlord not a boy, and twas huge, plus i always thought he allowed it to happen so Horus had to save him, thus when he made Horus warmaster there would be less decent.. howd that pan out?

Also, wasn't it Rogal Dorn, not Horus?

Ashryu wrote:Greatest thread ever.

Hehehe ill admit It was a bit of a tongue in cheek post, was half expecting it to get closed.


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Kilkrazy wrote:

GazzyG wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:Where did the Emporer get all his special genes, then, if not from his parents? If his parents had them, why weren't they special?

Quoted from WH40K Wiki:

"In the end they decided to pool their psychic energies by reincarnating as a single soul in a single human body. The thousands of shamans, as one, took poison, and as one, died. A year later the man who would become the Emperor was born. His psychic power was so potent that its energies altered his physiology and rendered him immortal so he would no longer need to reincarnate and could not be assaulted by the daemonic creatures of the Immaterium upon his death. As he grew older, his potent psychic powers began to manifest. Over many millennia, he traveled among the many peoples of mankind, using his ancient wisdom to help where he could in the guise of many different legendary, historical and religious personages."

Many quoted Black Library sources at the bottom of the wiki page.

Hope that helps.

Physiology and genes aren't the same thing.

If the Emporer was nine feet tall, how did he keep going into peoples' houses without having to bend down and get a bad back?

His physiology is dependant on his genes and I really dont think you can bring science into it, as far as psychic powers are concerned he could go from a psychic infant to the size of a greater demon if he had the psychic power, kinda how chaos marines bloat in size and become larger and more durable the more psychic influence they absorb from the warp.

1hadhq wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:

If the Emporer was nine feet tall, how did he keep going into peoples' houses without having to bend down and get a bad back?

Hint: "the last church". The Emperor as a normal sized human. You see what he wants you to see.

This is more or less how i see it too

1hadhq wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:

If the Emporer was nine feet tall, how did he keep going into peoples' houses without having to bend down and get a bad back?

Hint: "the last church". The Emperor as a normal sized human. You see what he wants you to see.

Im of the opinion that the Emperor could change his shape and appearance at will, hence why he appears in so many different guises at different periods of time. I mean in the jac draco books he can stop the flow of time, so its already shown that hes strong enough to toy with the fabrics of reality. So he could appear as an old shrivelled man or a 10 ft tall hulking giant, he appeared in different forms infront of the primarchs right ?.


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DarknessEternal wrote:

Da Boss wrote:An ork boy nearly choked the life out of the Big E according to my 2nd Ed fluff, and Horus saved his life. So I'm thinking a Hunter Killer Missile to the face would probably mess him up good-o.

Dang, I was going to bring this up but I was beaten to the punch.

In summary, the Emperor was still in a human body. If, for some reasons, all his defenses failed and he was actually struck by an anti-tank missile, he'd get obliterated.

That seems to be what the actual question is about. So it's not useful to discuss what defenses he actually had or how helpful they would be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

ChronoCupcake wrote:
I beg to differ in the BA dex it says that mephistons gene seed activated a second time a previously unheard of phenomena, which I'd theorise made him closer to a primarch's strengh then an average marine. So assuming vanilla marine t4, mephiston t6, then a primarch would be roughly t8 ? which would ideally place the Emperor at t10.

This logic is entirely flawed since it assumes the Emperor was more physically capable than the Primarchs. He was not. He built them to be physical monsters*.

The only beings the Emperor ever bests in physical combat are the Primarchs, but that would only imply his superiority to them in those terms if we didn't also have evidence of his inferiority to other beings that were essentially annoyances to them.

If anything, it implies he coded in some "let me beat you up" backdoors into their psyches. Since he built them from the ground up, that is well within possibility.

*Also, we have GW official statistics for one Primarch, and he's Toughness 6.

wait are you trying to say that the primarchs are equals to the emperor ?, they where essentially fragments of him none of them where individually as strong as him, wouldnt it be a bit redundant to be the leader of mankind then clone 20 copies of yourself that are just as strong and all have there own sentience thats like him asking for the horus heresy to happen. All the primarchs pre heresy knew he was there superior in every way.


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Man the emperor would cleave eva 01 with a glance of his incredibly chiselled masculine features, im still of the impression the Emperor could just hold his particles together through sheer force of will.

the emperor is not a god, Eva unit 1 however, IS.

Off topic butThe Emperor vs Eva unit 1 ? how is that even remotely fair for Eva unit 1, its just a bio organic machine birthed from a highly advanced speicies they call "angels" in the eva universe, that and it has a womans soul giving it a crude sentience and a battery that can run indefinitely. Pretty cool i guess but the emperor could just hadouken its head off.

ChronoCupcake wrote:
wait are you trying to say that the primarchs are equals to the emperor ?, they where essentially fragments of him none of them where individually as strong as him, wouldnt it be a bit redundant to be the leader of mankind then clone 20 copies of yourself that are just as strong and all have there own sentience thats like him asking for the horus heresy to happen. All the primarchs pre heresy knew he was there superior in every way.

No, what I'm saying is they were superior to him physically, not equal. This is borne out in background material.

And the Primarchs knew no such thing. They knew he was smarter and their leader. That's about it. They knew he was inferior to them physically, what with having actually witnessed in battles.

didnt he capture a ctan? the void dragon iirc.

Yes.

Off topic butThe Emperor vs Eva unit 1 ? how is that even remotely fair for Eva unit 1, its just a bio organic machine birthed from a highly advanced speicies they call "angels" in the eva universe, that and it has a womans soul giving it a crude sentience and a battery that can run indefinitely. Pretty cool i guess but the emperor could just hadouken its head off.

Your thinking of eva unit 1 like the other eva's, it isn't. the S2 engine doesn't just give it an unlimited battery life it literally gives it unlimited power, and creates a living god. that's what the whole "OMG Seele's using the eva series for human instrumentality" was all about. The ultimate blasphemy, mankind creates a god and merges with it.

God creates the angels,
God destroys the anges,
god creates man,
Man destroys god,
Man creates the angels.

Angels, destroy man.... woman inherits the earth.

Kilkrazy wrote:We've been through all this nine foot stuff before. If the Emporer was nine feet tall, he would have got a bad back from thousands of years of living in houses built for human sized humans.

More to the point, how would the Emporer be T10 without loads of Geneseeds, when SMs are only T4 with loads of Geneseeds?

If the Emporer could grow to T10 without Geneseeds, why did he need to make Geneseeds in order to make SMs T4?

Eh?

Did you look at the picture? Have we been over the "look at picture it's not that hard" stuff before?

I think he would survive through force of will, but he would be wounded he would end up on the Golden Throne. Which would leave Horus free to run around, which the Big E being able to smack him down.

he captured a god for feth sake! and you think a HK missle can kill him? HAH!