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DarknessEternal wrote:

ChronoCupcake wrote:
wait are you trying to say that the primarchs are equals to the emperor ?, they where essentially fragments of him none of them where individually as strong as him, wouldnt it be a bit redundant to be the leader of mankind then clone 20 copies of yourself that are just as strong and all have there own sentience thats like him asking for the horus heresy to happen. All the primarchs pre heresy knew he was there superior in every way.

No, what I'm saying is they were superior to him physically, not equal. This is borne out in background material.

And the Primarchs knew no such thing. They knew he was smarter and their leader. That's about it. They knew he was inferior to them physically, what with having actually witnessed in battles.

Give me a quote that even remotely suggests this, you do realise that when he found some of the primarchs he beat them in competitions of strength i.e vulkan and even duelled some of them to victory. The primarchs were comparable to him in terms of strength became he was like nothing else in the human race but they still were't "as" strong, theres a quote that talks about how they all embodied different elements of his spirit / nature and the strengths and weaknesses associated with it.


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gendoikari87 wrote:

Off topic butThe Emperor vs Eva unit 1 ? how is that even remotely fair for Eva unit 1, its just a bio organic machine birthed from a highly advanced speicies they call "angels" in the eva universe, that and it has a womans soul giving it a crude sentience and a battery that can run indefinitely. Pretty cool i guess but the emperor could just hadouken its head off.

Your thinking of eva unit 1 like the other eva's, it isn't. the S2 engine doesn't just give it an unlimited battery life it literally gives it unlimited power, and creates a living god. that's what the whole "OMG Seele's using the eva series for human instrumentality" was all about. The ultimate blasphemy, mankind creates a god and merges with it.

God creates the angels,
God destroys the anges,
god creates man,
Man destroys god,
Man creates the angels.

Angels, destroy man.... woman inherits the earth.

http://wiki.evageeks.org/First_Ancestral_Race these were the only remotely god esq dudes in the evangelion universe, the only people that refer to eva unit 1 as a god are seele and there going to be incredibly biased considering there some kind of shady illumanati esq power cabal that runs the world in the evangelion universe. It was more of a hyperbole if anything else, if you read the article it talks about the white moon and the black moon, and how Adam was just "a tree of life" and his children (angels) are just a different species created by the first ancestral race that was supposed to propagate the earth until the black moon crashes and lilith "another tree of life" began birthing lilim (humans). check out the article it'll make sense but in no way is it a god the evanglion universe is way to vague and open to interpretation anyway. Regardless I doubt we should turn this into one of those 40k vs alternate universe threads .

you do realize that is in no way based on eva cannon right? as you said it's all open to interpretation. Seeing as how eva unit one and lilith remoulded all of humanity and the earth... i'll stick with the god thing.

Regardless I doubt we should turn this into one of those 40k vs alternate universe threads

no but we should make one....

ph34r wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:the Emperor was just a man as far as his body went.

You sure, heretic?

HAHA! give the heretics what they deserve

Don't make me call Cthulhu in here! I KNOW he can kick the emperor ass.

Who is Cthulhu?

Pop culture meme, basically a long running joke about it being so powerful can can rip the gods in half.

Why would you stick a bolter on the end of a long stick.

gendoikari87 wrote:

Off topic butThe Emperor vs Eva unit 1 ? how is that even remotely fair for Eva unit 1, its just a bio organic machine birthed from a highly advanced speicies they call "angels" in the eva universe, that and it has a womans soul giving it a crude sentience and a battery that can run indefinitely. Pretty cool i guess but the emperor could just hadouken its head off.

Your thinking of eva unit 1 like the other eva's, it isn't. the S2 engine doesn't just give it an unlimited battery life it literally gives it unlimited power, and creates a living god. that's what the whole "OMG Seele's using the eva series for human instrumentality" was all about. The ultimate blasphemy, mankind creates a god and merges with it.

God creates the angels,
God destroys the anges,
god creates man,
Man destroys god,
Man creates the angels.

Angels, destroy man.... woman inherits the earth.

I just puked a little in my mouth.


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gendoikari87 wrote:Don't make me call Cthulhu in here! I KNOW he can kick the emperor ass.

I did it again.

royal house wrote:Why would you stick a bolter on the end of a long stick.

For better range.


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ChronoCupcake wrote:

DarknessEternal wrote:

ChronoCupcake wrote:
wait are you trying to say that the primarchs are equals to the emperor ?, they where essentially fragments of him none of them where individually as strong as him, wouldnt it be a bit redundant to be the leader of mankind then clone 20 copies of yourself that are just as strong and all have there own sentience thats like him asking for the horus heresy to happen. All the primarchs pre heresy knew he was there superior in every way.

No, what I'm saying is they were superior to him physically, not equal. This is borne out in background material.

And the Primarchs knew no such thing. They knew he was smarter and their leader. That's about it. They knew he was inferior to them physically, what with having actually witnessed in battles.

The Emporer would have used his magic powers to appear as if strong and feirse warrior, but really his body was human.

This thread is about what happens if the Emporer gets hit by a heavy anti-tank missile when he isn't protected by magic powers and armour.

Yes he captured the Void Dragon, but that was a psychic battle not physical. Basically i guess in this situation he dies.

Ok, so apparently it wasn't a simple assumption that the emperor (or emporer depending on where you're from) is stronger than a primarch. Given that's the assumption I've always made, frankly, I haven't heard enough in this thread to convince me otherwise despite some valiant efforts.

Since I believe that a primarch's body, without psychic powers or other such interference would indeed survive such an onslaught, possessing as they do regenerative abilites and so forth (I'm thinking wolverine levels here, albeit not as quick), I am going to agree with Killkrazy and conclude that the emperor would indeed take a wound, but despite ruinous injuries that would fell a normal man, which he patently is not, he would live to fight another day.

Reanimator wrote:Ok, so apparently it wasn't a simple assumption that the emperor (or emporer depending on where you're from) is stronger than a primarch. Given that's the assumption I've always made, frankly, I haven't heard enough in this thread to convince me otherwise despite some valiant efforts.

Since I believe that a primarch's body, without psychic powers or other such interference would indeed survive such an onslaught, possessing as they do regenerative abilites and so forth (I'm thinking wolverine levels here, albeit not as quick), I am going to agree with Killkrazy and conclude that the emperor would indeed take a wound, but despite ruinous injuries that would fell a normal man, which he patently is not, he would live to fight another day.

good theory but heads don't grow back. at least brains don't.

Well now I think we're debating the scope of his regenerative abilities. This I have no scale for, save for what I imagine him to be capable of. Clearly you and I disagree about what the limits of those are, and we may just have to accept that.

PS In a very science geek way I happen to think shaped charges are very cool, and did not intend my earlier dismissal of your mention thereof to be off hand.

not really i just think his godlike powers come from his psychic ability, without that he is just human.

PS In a very science geek way I happen to think shaped charges are very cool, and did not intend my earlier dismissal of your mention thereof to be off hand.

no offense taken, I study them so I can be a bit of a fanboy.

Kilkrazy wrote:The Emporer would have used his magic powers to appear as if strong and feirse warrior, but really his body was human.

This thread is about what happens if the Emporer gets hit by a heavy anti-tank missile when he isn't protected by magic powers and armour.

And just to be clear, you have indeed looked at the canonical picture of the emperor, and decided that the people standing next to him must all be midgets?

What do you mean?

Are you suggesting the Emporer would have have lived in the normal human world for 20,000 years being four feet taller than everyone else, and not bumped his head on the ceiling?

Is it possible that an oil painting might be idealised to exaggerate the Emporer's height?

Kilkrazy wrote:What do you mean?

Are you suggesting the Emporer would have have lived in the normal human world for 20,000 years being four feet taller than everyone else, and not bumped his head on the ceiling?

Is it possible that an oil painting might be idealised to exaggerate the Emporer's height?

Or that the Emperor is a huge dude that uses his powers to fudge everyone's vision so he does not seem out of place.

Considering how he is depicted consistently, and how your theory has 0 support, don't you think it would be a lot more logical for the simpler and more supported answer to be correct?

No.

How does fudging people's vision help the Emporer fit into buildings, furniture and vehicles made for people four feet shorter?

Why bother to conceal his height for 20,000 years?

It doesn't make any sense.

It is more likely that he used his powers to fudge people's vision to seem much taller when it was important to become Emporer.

How is "he's a magical giant that uses magical space magics to magically magic himself into looking shorter" simpler than "he's not ten feet tall, that painting is just an exaggeration"? The Emperor wasn't a genetically engineered abhuman freak like his mutant legions, he was an immensely powerful psyker who existed in human society for millenia without anyone going "oh wow there's a ten foot tall guy running around being a hero, what's up with that?"

Couldn't both be true? He could have been normal height when he wanted to blend in, and now he's the big cheese he's changed his appearance so that your average astartes isn't dwarfing him. Psychic powers to project his new height into the minds of his subjects and psychic powers to actually alter his form are not worlds apart.

There are various possibilities.

1. For no particular reason, the shamans who made the Emporer decided to make him nine feet tall.

Thus, he always was always nine feet tall. Knowing he would not fit into human society when towering over three feet above most people, he used his space magic to conceal his height from everyone until the 20th millennium.

During the previous 30,000 years, he simply put up with not being able to fit into normal clothes, houses, cars and so on, and he had unsatisfyingly small portions when eating out, until McDonald’s was invented.

Because he could not buy the things he needed, he made special, very large things for himself, such as clothes, baths, bicycles and cars. He used his space magic to conceal the size of these things. Sometimes he had things custom made and used space magic to make the workers forget what they had done.

When forced to use a human sized object that he couldn’t get at super size, such as a train, he just put up with the inconvenience.

Thanks to his unnatural physiology, he was able to withstand the constant back strain caused by mixing with ordinary humans inside normal sized buildings.

Once he became Space Emporer, there was no need to conceal his enormous size, so he stopped using space magic and everyone saw him as his natural size.

2. He was normal human size and used his space magic to look bigger when he became Emporer.

3. He was normal human size, but used his space magic to physically grow larger when he became Emporer.

4. He was normal human size, and never looked larger, and the pictures showing him larger than that are artistic licence.

or we could go with the theory that no matter what happens to humans we keep growing and regenerating, but due to the physic powers he has he didnt start to suffer the degeneration effects of human growth, so once he "stopped" growing in the normal terms, its reasonable to presume that he was about 5' 9" - 6' 3" but slowly over the many years he slowly kept going as the decay rate of his cells was phyiscally slower than the regenerative and repair rate of his new cells, so they slowly made him larger, denser, and over time the organs of a primarch finally started growing because finally a human reached the growth point the body goes "hey its time to produce new stem cells to create these organs", a good exaple of this is that a child isnt born with knee caps, they get them at about 2, so after a few thousend years, the dorment blue prints finally had the size and mass to start producing Teir 3 organs in him, im not saying he could survive the blast, im just givin a logical view on the growth and size of the emperour, you get natural giants at 7ft and taller, so why is it so hard to think that over 20000 years he wouldnt actually grow to be about 8-9 feet tall? he might of been human sized once, but after all that time some growth will occer

Truth is we will never know unless anyone lives in the 40k universe.

Malice wrote:Truth is we will never know unless anyone lives in the 40k universe.

That kind of argument really has no place in this forum. It's a given that it's a fictional universe, so simply stating that it is and that the answer is unknowable defies the entire premise of discussing it all, not to mention casting a scornful tone on all those attempting to do so.

Kilkrazy wrote:
3. He was normal human size, but used his space magic to physically grow larger when he became Emporer.

Makes most sense to me.

Two or four make the most sense to me, though I suppose three isn't out of the question, even if it is a bit odd.

My take: Can the emperor die to a krak missile. Yes, especially a face shot if it gets through.

Could the emperor deflect a krak missile, most probably it where his pstychic aura is likely centred, I dont think the Emperor actually needa a helmet outside of a hostile environment protection, and perhaps not even then.

Would blowing the Emperors head off with a krak missile finish him. No, his body would die and he would be reborn somewheere either instantly or nine months later, depending on when the Emperor moves to his next body.

This will be politically inconvenient for everyone but do no lasting harm to the Emperor.

Whenever you see movies of medieval knights & warriors they're played by big burly guys way over 6"

But in reality the average height in the past was much shorter, and most medieval suits of armor are just cute sized.

One of the main reasons we are taller than our ancestors is pre-natal care, especially proper diet and nutrition.

I think it stands to reason that the Emperor, born in the less advanced past (relative to the 40k timeline) would have grown up to be tall, for his time perhaps, but shorter than the primarchs who, as test tube babies, had the best possible pre-natal care and nutrients flooded into their system.

In short I have no problem with 9.5 to 10 ft. tall primarchs and a mere 7 ft. tall emperor.

Kilkrazy wrote:3. He was normal human size, but used his space magic to physically grow larger when he became Emporer.

This. When the Unification wars happened, the Emperor actually needed to go out into the world and kick ass. With his powers, there is no reason that he should remain a tiny year 0 height person.

gendoikari87 wrote:not really i just think his godlike powers come from his psychic ability, without that he is just human.

This is the way I always pictured it too