If you made the starter set...

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**Kanluwen**

Flashman wrote:Tau vs Chaos Space Marines

Good vs Evil. Horde(ish) vs Elite. Shooting vs Assault. And you've got some Power Armour in there so the 12 year olds will be happy.

I love how "Power Armour"="12 year olds".

I see more kids playing Tyranids and Dark Eldar than I do Marines locally. Marines(Chaos, Space Wolf, etc) tend towards being 'veterans'.

**blood reaper**

Chaos vs Eldar
Undivided Chaos Forces
Chaos Lord with Terminator armour. Weapons can be swaped with those in the Terminator Lord box set
10 Chaos Marines with 2 assault Weapons
10 Chaos Marines with 2 assault Weapons
4 Chaos marines with Heavy weapons and a Champion
Eldar Forces
Farseer
20 Guardians inculding Support Platforms
3 Jet-bikes
5 Striking Scorpions

**FITZZ**

Kanluwen wrote:
FITZZ wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:
FITZZ wrote:
Kanluen wrote:Guard are pretty much never going to happen, especially any build with any form of tank.

A Sentinel and some Stormtroopers? Maybe.
Ogryns? More likely.

But tanks are definitely out.

Psst...Kan,note the tittle on the thread mate...it's "If you made the starter set"..not "What would probably go in a new starter set",I agree with your observations mind you...there will never be a starter set that doesn't include SM...ever,but what the heck...let's just "bluesky" here.

Personally I'd like to see an IG vs Nidz set.

I like to function as a sort of ceiling fan to the balloons carrying the hopes and dreams of everyone in these wishlisting threads.

Plus, it gives me something to do while I put the finishing touches on my own idea for starter sets.

So I've noticed.
Conversely,what are your own ideas for a starter set?

Well, it would require a major reshuffling of GW ideas/behavior.
But...
Think of the old D&D "Adventure Modules".
Each starter set would be a self-contained "campaign"(namely: the preliminary stages before an actual pivotal moment in 40k/Fantasy lore. Like "The Nimbosan Infiltration" details the Ravenguard's preliminary efforts to sabotage and disrupt the Tau Empire's acquisition of Nimbosa).

But it doesn't just end there. Oh no. The starter sets each detail a series of 'historical' battles, and use the forces that are included within the box.
Going back to "The Nimbosan Infiltration" as an example, we'd see something like:

Raven Guard: 1x Shadow-Captain Matthias(Scout armor equipped Captain armed with a sniper rifle).
10x 'Shadowstalkers'(Scouts with Sniper Rifles).
1x Shadow-Captain Korvydae and 10x 'Shadow Talons'(Tactical Marines equipped with a Heavy Bolter and Meltagun).

Brightsword's Cadre: 1x Commander 'Brightsword' (XV-8 Crisis Suit equipped commander, plasma rifle and missile pod)
2x XV-8 Crisis Suits equipped like Brightsword, and given as a bodyguard.
1x Shas'ui 'Dawnstrike'(Pathfinder equipped with an experimental rail rifle) and 7x Pathfinders armed with Pulse Carbines.

Now, it's a relatively low model count yes.
But that's a good thing, since it's meant to be the size of(at best) a vehicle like the Leman Russ or Devilfish box.
Add in some terrain like a wrecked Stealth Suit that the Tau and Raven Guard are trying to recover due to information contained within, a few Tau styled walls, etc and you get a neat little thing.

And what's more? If done properly, it introduces you to a specific faction in such a way that it doesn't just cram that faction down your throat. Since neither force is really a 'legal' force, it comes down to what grabs your attention and your interest--not simply "the cheapest way to play".

That's actually a pretty cool idea Kan.
Incidentally I hope you know I wasn't taking a jab at you with my comment before.

**Kanluwen**

I know, hence why you weren't smitten by the jabs of my rapier ire!

Oh, and of course the best part about doing it like that?

Every few months, GW shops and FLGSes could rotate which 'campaign module' they play through with the playerbase!

So, let's say January is Nimbosa and then in March they rotate to 'The Cleansing of Kathur' with the men of the Cadian Imperial Guard beginning to purge a Plague Zombie(led by a few Death Guard/Plague Bearers) infested shrineworld.

It benefits the community, as a whole, not just starting out players.

**Slarg232**

Grey Knights vs Daemons of Chaos!

**blood reaper**

Slarg232 wrote:Grey Knights vs Daemons of Chaos!

Grey Knights
Inquistitor Lord
10 Grey Knights
10 Stormtroopers
1 Grey Knight Drednought
Daemons
Hearld of Khorne
Hearld of Tzeentch
10 Horrors
8 Blood Letters
5 Seekers

**FITZZ**

Kanluwen wrote:I know, hence why you weren't smitten by the jabs of my rapier ire!

Oh, and of course the best part about doing it like that?

Every few months, GW shops and FLGSes could rotate which 'campaign module' they play through with the playerbase!

So, let's say January is Nimbosa and then in March they rotate to 'The Cleansing of Kathur' with the men of the Cadian Imperial Guard beginning to purge a Plague Zombie(led by a few Death Guard/Plague Bearers) infested shrineworld.

It benefits the community, as a whole, not just starting out players.

I really like this concept a lot.

**Kanluwen**

Then maybe we should spam it to Games Workshop

**FITZZ**

Kanluwen wrote:Then maybe we should spam it to Games Workshop

If only they listened.

**Kanluwen**

FITZZ wrote:
Kanluwen wrote:Then maybe we should spam it to Games Workshop

If only they listened.

You just have to know who to talk to, I think

**stompydakka**

Who's that?
I have some choice words for them.

**ChrisWWII**

I say we go outside Warhammer World and protest until they let us talk to someone senior enough to use your idea, Kanluwen. However, I still think we'll need one larger starter set in addition to your smaller supplements. Maybe find a way to tie them together somehow.....hmmm...

**MechaEmperor7000**

I still think a Starter set with only 1 or 2 squads worth of models would be a better set than full on armies. That way the players are in now way committed to any one force. However it has a low incentive for veterans to buy it.

**Kanluwen**

ChrisWWII wrote:I say we go outside Warhammer World and protest until they let us talk to someone senior enough to use your idea, Kanluwen. However, I still think we'll need one larger starter set in addition to your smaller supplements. Maybe find a way to tie them together somehow.....hmmm...

See, that was something that I tried to think on at first.

And then I realized it would just be easier for each of the 'campaign packs' to have a book available separately that details one specific force during the "big" part of that campaign.

Have an associated 'bundle' that one can buy online or order through a GW shop, and they've got a damned effective set-up there.

**Samus_aran115**

Space marines vs dark eldar
Librarian
Dreadnought
10 dudes
5 assault dudes
5 devastators(?)

Archon with... Whatever
Talos
10 warriors with a dark lance
Beastmaster with something
Hellions

**Kanluwen**

I would absolutely, 100% refrain from putting the Dark Eldar in a starter set at this point.

Especially against Marines of all things.

**FITZZ**

Samus_aran 115 wrote:Space marines vs dark eldar
Librarian
Dreadnought
10 dudes
5 assault dudes
5 devastators(?)

Archon with... Whatever
Talos
10 warriors with a dark lance
Beastmaster with something
Hellions

So 3rd edition starter set redone with better minis basically.

**Samus_aran115**

FITZZ wrote:
Samus_aran 115 wrote:Space marines vs dark eldar
Librarian
Dreadnought
10 dudes
5 assault dudes
5 devastators(?)

Archon with... Whatever
Talos
10 warriors with a dark lance
Beastmaster with something
Hellions

So 3rd edition starter set redone with better minis basically.

I haven't seen what's exactly in that set, but sure

I thought a librarian
Would be cool, instead of a captain. Captains are dull.
To be honest, the dark eldar would always lose this battle, especially without transports. Maybe throw a voidraveb in there

**FITZZ**

Samus_aran 115 wrote:
FITZZ wrote:
Samus_aran 115 wrote:Space marines vs dark eldar
Librarian
Dreadnought
10 dudes
5 assault dudes
5 devastators(?)

Archon with... Whatever
Talos
10 warriors with a dark lance
Beastmaster with something
Hellions

So 3rd edition starter set redone with better minis basically.

I haven't seen what's exactly in that set, but sure I thought a librarian
Would be cool, instead of a captain. Captains are dull.
To be honest, the dark eldar would always lose this battle, especially without transports. Maybe throw a voidraven in there

3rd Ed box contained a SM tactical squad, a Land Speeder (IIRC),20 DE ,plastic ruins,those goofy trees and the BBB + dice and whippy sticks.

**Orkymike**

Why not pick a certain campaign and put two armies up against each other like Tau and Eldar. Maybe even have some who are facing a little bit of everything (probably be rather expensive considering how many different armies would be in it) but still would give the players a taste of how each army plays firsthand rather than finding out as you play them how your army does against it.

**Kanluwen**

Orkymike wrote:Why not pick a certain campaign and put two armies up against each other like Tau and Eldar. Maybe even have some who are facing a little bit of everything (probably be rather expensive considering how many different armies would be in it) but still would give the players a taste of how each army plays firsthand rather than finding out as you play them how your army does against it.

Because, historically, those two armies have never come into conflict with each other.

The Eldar have, in fact, gone out of their way to aid and protect the Tau.

**Orkymike**

Kanluwen wrote:
Orkymike wrote:Why not pick a certain campaign and put two armies up against each other like Tau and Eldar. Maybe even have some who are facing a little bit of everything (probably be rather expensive considering how many different armies would be in it) but still would give the players a taste of how each army plays firsthand rather than finding out as you play them how your army does against it.

Because, historically, those two armies have never come into conflict with each other.

The Eldar have, in fact, gone out of their way to aid and protect the Tau.

hmmm i was unaware of this. It would stand to reason why almost all the starter sets have humans in it. its true humans are like a virus spreading out and taking over everything they can. and that would cause alot of other races to be angry with them. thus understandable why they would be the center of the universe for the stories.

**Brother SRM**

It doesn't make sense to have two "alien" armies in the box. Most new players like having something human to relate to. I know that's what attracted me to Marines in the first place, and the human element helped me decide on starting Guard.

**Orkymike**

Alright. why not have a starter set with imperial guard and orks then? why should space marines get all the attention?

**Brother SRM**

Orkymike wrote:Alright. why not have a starter set with imperial guard and orks then? why should space marines get all the attention?

I'm pretty sure Kanluwen and I suggested the same thing - an Armageddon starter set would be the coolest damn thing. Steel Legion Imperial Guard and Orks would be badass.

**Goddard**

My starter set would just be a box with $500 bucks inside, with a note saying, "We felt bad."

**Kanluwen**

Brother SRM wrote:
Orkymike wrote:Alright. why not have a starter set with imperial guard and orks then? why should space marines get all the attention?

I'm pretty sure Kanluwen and I suggested the same thing - an Armageddon starter set would be the coolest damn thing. Steel Legion Imperial Guard and Orks would be badass.

I think they'd want to stick with Cadians, simply because they're well-known and have some major plasticage to work from.

There's fluff that would be easy to work from for that too!
In fact one of the Black Library novels details a Cadian Regiment recovering The Fortress of Arrogance for Yarrick following his capture and torture at the hands of the Orks.

**FITZZ**

Brother SRM wrote:
Orkymike wrote:Alright. why not have a starter set with imperial guard and or then? why should space marines get all the attention?

I'm pretty sure Kanluen and I suggested the same thing - an Armageddon starter set would be the coolest damn thing. Steel Legion Imperial Guard and Orks would be badass.

It would be nice to see this,SM may be GWs "flagship army",but I honestly believe that an Armageddon starter set like this would do well.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I do however see a problem in including IG as you would need a Battle Force worth of minis to balance the sides out.

**Kanluwen**

I'd avoid Armageddon.

Why?

Two words: Steel Legion.

The artwork they've had always represents them very close to some of the iconic Wehrmacht imagery. That's...not going to be a good sell.

Cadians and their campaigns(which, let's face it--are damned near innumerable. Cadians get everywhere in the Imperium, just because they're that good and in demand by commanders for troopers with a high standard of training) make a better option.

Or they could do some Gaunt's Ghosts themed campaign packs. The events of "Traitor General" taking place on Gereon would make for a hell of a campaign pack.

**Lord PoPo**

I think that IG vs Nids would give new players the best exposure to 40k that you could have in such a small package. Yes they're both horde armies, but they also represent the two forces that are constantly in conflict with one another in 40k that, I think, makes the game so interesting.

The imperial guard epitomize humanity. Not just because they're human (duh), but because these are people who are a long long way from home, and who have practically consigned themselves to death on the battlefield, and yet still fight on. Some are threatened by shouting commissars, but many fight, and die (in droves... have you ever seen an apocalypse game with guardsmen involved?) even without such provocation.

Then there is the pure, unrelenting malice of the Tyranids. They are THE aliens. There is nothing human about them, only a desire to kill.. Us.. as it turns out. Because we are delicious.

I don't know what these boxes would/shoud include. Obviously the nids couldn't get MCs, as the guard couldn't get tanks.

I really like the campaignesque idea that kanluwen has. But if one box were to come out, I think nids vs Guard would be the best idea.

And as a disclaimer, I play Space Marines. I just think that A) people are right, give the other armies a chance, and B) that space marines don't really represent 40k as well as a guard Vs Tyranid conflict would.