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purplefood wrote:
Most inquisitors have a retinue of only a few members and so they do a lot of sneaking on their own.

I don't think most is entirely accurate. I think someone who wants a large retinue and has the authority to order anyone short of Marines and Lords of Terra around can have a retinue as large as he wants. Those that don't most likely have small retinues(or none) because they choose to and like doing the work themselves.

I have a feeling retinue size is contingent on how each individual Inq is by personality and operational method.

Platuan4th wrote:

purplefood wrote:
Most inquisitors have a retinue of only a few members and so they do a lot of sneaking on their own.

I don't think most is entirely accurate. I think someone who wants a large retinue and has the authority to order anyone short of Marines and Lords of Terra around can have a retinue as large as he wants. Those that don't most likely have small retinues(or none) because they choose to and like doing the work themselves.

I have a feeling retinue size is contingent on how each individual Inq is by personality and operational method.

Fair point but what you can do with a regiment they could do with about 10 properly skilled individuals, if they need more manpower they can requisition a regiment of guardsmen or an entire battlegroup if they needed to. And, most Inquisitors are doing the whole detecting thing so the smaller their group the better... though admitedly there will always be an exception to the rule.

purplefood wrote:

Platuan4th wrote:

purplefood wrote:
Most inquisitors have a retinue of only a few members and so they do a lot of sneaking on their own.

I don't think most is entirely accurate. I think someone who wants a large retinue and has the authority to order anyone short of Marines and Lords of Terra around can have a retinue as large as he wants. Those that don't most likely have small retinues(or none) because they choose to and like doing the work themselves.

I have a feeling retinue size is contingent on how each individual Inq is by personality and operational method.

Fair point but what you can do with a regiment they could do with about 10 properly skilled individuals, if they need more manpower they can requisition a regiment of guardsmen or an entire battlegroup if they needed to. And, most Inquisitors are doing the whole detecting thing so the smaller their group the better... though admitedly there will always be an exception to the rule.

You can cover an entire system or sector with a larger retinue.

Platuan4th wrote:

purplefood wrote:

Platuan4th wrote:

purplefood wrote:
Most inquisitors have a retinue of only a few members and so they do a lot of sneaking on their own.

I don't think most is entirely accurate. I think someone who wants a large retinue and has the authority to order anyone short of Marines and Lords of Terra around can have a retinue as large as he wants. Those that don't most likely have small retinues(or none) because they choose to and like doing the work themselves.

I have a feeling retinue size is contingent on how each individual Inq is by personality and operational method.

Fair point but what you can do with a regiment they could do with about 10 properly skilled individuals, if they need more manpower they can requisition a regiment of guardsmen or an entire battlegroup if they needed to. And, most Inquisitors are doing the whole detecting thing so the smaller their group the better... though admitedly there will always be an exception to the rule.

You can cover an entire system or sector with a larger retinue.

Fair point but that would be for information gathering at the most wouldn't it?

purplefood wrote:Fair point but that would be for information gathering at the most wouldn't it?

Unless you're Coteaz.

pretre wrote:

purplefood wrote:Fair point but that would be for information gathering at the most wouldn't it?

Unless you're Coteaz.

I haven't even read that but from what i have heard he doesn't exactly sound like a subtle inquisitor

Captain Aphael wrote:

Melissia wrote:I would say he counts as a progenitor to the Grey Knights, but what exactly he and his groups were sent to form is up for debate.

The Emperor Himself is the progenitor of the Grey Knights. Their geneseed was taken directly from Him shortly before Horus began the Seige of Terra. Garro was indeed one of the first Inquisitors, along with Iacton Qruze of the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus, and Amendera Kendel of the Sisters of Silence.

Presenting fan speculation as fact in a fluff debate is both annoying and hinders newbies that what information.

DrDuckman wrote:So where do GKs get their recruits from? Psyckers inside inquisitorial forces perhaps? Even inquisitors themselves? Can anyone help me on that one?

Most Grey Knights are recruited from people being carried on black ships to Terra that are deemed strong enough to endure the process and life of a GK.

As GK are still space marines only young teen males would be selected as they can accept the new organs (this means that IG soldiers couldn't be recruited from as they are too old). As GK have their own geneseed of UNDISCLOSED origin they would not recruit from other space marine chapters (but it could be perfectly reasonable for the grey knights to take an initiate, pre-organ implanting, if an inquisitor believed he was of importance due to the Emperor's tarot). GK have no knowledge of their past life and do not 'socialise' with others outside the GK or ordo malleus so having friends in other chapters is very unlikely, but as seen in the daemonhunters codex, having a nemisis is acceptable.

I remember something from one of the Ultramarines books where a certain space marine and his comrade have to provide proof that they are free from the taint of chaos and have interesting dealings with the GK. They actually went into the Warp I believe to prove their loyalty for some infraction. There were some nice tid-bits in there about crypts on Titan etc... I do remember it gave some good insight into the GK.

I wish I could remember the book!

Also it has been stated that dont accept anything in the HH series as canonical fact, lots of the books, opinions and such are from peoples P.O.V rather than actual this happened period. I know this particular instance is particularly black and white but it could just be there to lead us all into thinking something.

Ugly Green Trog wrote:Also it has been stated that dont accept anything in the HH series as canonical fact.

Citation needed.

BluntmanDC wrote:

Captain Aphael wrote:

Melissia wrote:I would say he counts as a progenitor to the Grey Knights, but what exactly he and his groups were sent to form is up for debate.

The Emperor Himself is the progenitor of the Grey Knights. Their geneseed was taken directly from Him shortly before Horus began the Seige of Terra. Garro was indeed one of the first Inquisitors, along with Iacton Qruze of the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus, and Amendera Kendel of the Sisters of Silence.

Presenting fan speculation as fact in a fluff debate is both annoying and hinders newbies that what information.

Especially since the Inquisition was already an existent force even before the Heresy (the prime opponents of Magnus at the Niceane Coven).

Emperors Faithful wrote:
Especially since the Inquisition was already an existent force even before the Heresy (the prime opponents of Magnus at the Niceane Coven).

Citation needed. I haven't seen any evidence that the Inquisition was at Nikaea.

pretre wrote:

Emperors Faithful wrote:
Especially since the Inquisition was already an existent force even before the Heresy (the prime opponents of Magnus at the Niceane Coven).

Citation needed. I haven't seen any evidence that the Inquisition was at Nikaea.

They weren’t he’s confusing the inquisition with the sisters of silence.The inquisition are a post/late heresy formation.

It is pretty unclear if Garro became an inquisitor or a GK. Still, I dont see a problem with either one. GK and the Custodes both seem to raise the question of their gene-seed relation to the emperor but I doubt they would both be from the emperor's gene-seed.

There was also a side story (white dwarf?) that said that GK recruiters take precedence over normal SM recruitment.

E.g. A GK can recruit someone who has already been taken as SM material but before implants. i.e. they can intercept an ongoing recruitment if the candidate is suitable for them.

Anyone else remember this?

I also liked the story where a suppossedly loyal chapter had been declared hereitcs and went OMGWTF?! when they realized their space fortress was being boarded by GKs.

Not all Inquisitors take the subtle approach.

Commodus Voke from the Eisenhorn series is a rather good example of an Inquisitor who simply jumps in, throws the weight of his title around, and purges the heretic. He takes the blunt force approach, there's absolutely no subtlety about the man, or his apprentice.

That being said, I find it unlikely that an Astartes would become an Inquisitor in the 41st millenium, I think they'd be far more likely to be permanently seconded to the Deathwatch.

---

OP:

Grey Knights are stated to be recruited from the Black Ships as they come in. It also stands to reason that some of the children in the Scholae Progenium that display psychic talent may be recruited.

After psychic talent, they'd look for the same things the other Astartes chapters do. A certain age limit (Generally thought to be 15-16) is the oldest one can begin the implementation of the organs required to be Astartes.

---

As for the debate on Nathaniel Garro, it doesn't state anywhere that him and Iacton Qruze are set to become Inquisitors, but rather that they are to seek out what is hinted to be the founding members of the Inquisition. This is the point where I believe some Space Marines did become the first members of the Inquisition, as an Astartes trusting a mortal to fight daemon-kind, especially as newly-known as it was, is unlikely in my opinion. They're far more likely to recruit those who have been highly-trained in the arts of war, and also display those attributes they require.

While the Emperor is hinted to be their primogenitor in a genetic, gene-seed sense, they would have to have a 'first', which could be named primogenitor as well. From the duels with Chaos Daemons in Flight of the Eisenstein, it seems Garro may be that first.

If you look at Inquisitor Lord Hector Rex from the Imperial Amoury books about the Siege of Vraks.

I guess you could almost say he is a space marine. When the blackships found him, they found him to
be far surperior to the other psykers, so they enhanced him genetically, almost in the same way as an
astarte but not fully.

However if you want a "true" space marine and not just a bulky character, I am not really sure it is normal
for the astarte to join the inquisition, since many of them loathe the inquisition because of how they work.

I am sure that there somewhere in the galaxy will be a space marine inquisitor.
The galaxy is vast and there are tons of interesting stuff out there.

overkill76 wrote:There was also a side story (white dwarf?) that said that GK recruiters take precedence over normal SM recruitment.

E.g. A GK can recruit someone who has already been taken as SM material but before implants. i.e. they can intercept an ongoing recruitment if the candidate is suitable for them.

Anyone else remember this?

yep thats why i posted it

purplefood wrote:Cloning isn't allowed in the Imperium so that's unlikely...

That doesn't stop the Death Korps of Krieg. Nukes are also banned, yet The Death Korps used them as well.

They draw their recruits from the Ordo Psychana and if they come by other gifted individuals across Imperial space. They don't recruit other Space Marines, they are reserved for Deathwatch. As for the IG, they think that Guardsman are to weak minded to become an Grey Knight.
As for cloning, it is rumored that DCoK are clones. Simply because they have to big number for a Death World and no one ever saw their faces. Other than that - cloning is forbiden because there where attempts in the past ( Corax ) that where turned up quite nasty.

Brother Coa wrote:As for cloning, it is rumored that DCoK are clones. Simply because they have to big number for a Death World and no one ever saw their faces. Other than that - cloning is forbiden because there where attempts in the past ( Corax ) that where turned up quite nasty.

It wasn't the cloning that Corax fethed up, it was the growth accelleration that left his new marines pretty deformed.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:As for cloning, it is rumored that DCoK are clones. Simply because they have to big number for a Death World and no one ever saw their faces. Other than that - cloning is forbiden because there where attempts in the past ( Corax ) that where turned up quite nasty.

It wasn't the cloning that Corax fethed up, it was the growth accelleration that left his new marines pretty deformed.

Really? Lexicanum states that he was trying to replenish RG numbers by cloning.

Deathwatch Rulebook, p306 wrote:In a handful of cases, a (Deathwatch) Watch Commander has actually joined the ranks of the Inquisition, appointing his replacement before he leaves the Watch Fortress.

Apart from this quote, I'm sure I've seen old fluff somewhere that states that is is possible for a Space Marine to become an Inquisitor, if very rare.

Brother Coa wrote:

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:As for cloning, it is rumored that DCoK are clones. Simply because they have to big number for a Death World and no one ever saw their faces. Other than that - cloning is forbiden because there where attempts in the past ( Corax ) that where turned up quite nasty.

It wasn't the cloning that Corax fethed up, it was the growth accelleration that left his new marines pretty deformed.

Really? Lexicanum states that he was trying to replenish RG numbers by cloning.

Some clarification:

a) Cloning - creation of viable embrio with genetic material of single being. Thus it's assumed that this embrio will be genetic copy of cloned person. Currently all cloning requires surrogate mother, not so much in M40. Most probably banned in Imperium except for vat-grown bodies for servitors or organ banks.

b) Krieg. They implant viable embrios (of perfectly normal origin or produced by artifical insemination "in vitro") in artifical womb thus alllowing up faster reproduction rate. So while they're "invitro" and can have huge amount of brothers, each kriegsman is unique and still have genetical father and mother. While this allow to grow children in large batches , every child is growing natural way and natural time.

c) Corax used clonning and accelerated growth similar to AM "vat-growth" to mass-produce SMs which leaves question of meddling with gene-seed. In Blood Angels novels BA(and Bile ) experimented with producing full-grown marines but no geneseed implantation was mentioned. Simple acclerated growth wasn't as much useful as you still need do all the things that you do to usuall SM candidate.

AlexTheTitan wrote:

purplefood wrote:Cloning isn't allowed in the Imperium so that's unlikely...

That doesn't stop the Death Korps of Krieg. Nukes are also banned, yet The Death Korps used them as well.

That's
1)Not really cloning
2)They get special dispensation

AlexTheTitan wrote:

purplefood wrote:Cloning isn't allowed in the Imperium so that's unlikely...

That doesn't stop the Death Korps of Krieg. Nukes are also banned, yet The Death Korps used them as well.

As Chyron has pointed out, you have either misunderstood the fluff or misunderstand cloning.

To the OP, seeing as GK armies are usually pretty elite and small, i would think that they would join other armies to bolster the other armies strenght. In real life, one unit of GK marines would be the equivelant of an infinite number of guardsmen (at least, that's what i gather from other peoples words!)


About the cloning, surley they would allow organ cloning?

Also, if the Imperium allows the Exterminatus, why wouldn't they allow nukes? The only viable reason i can see is because it may leave radiation, but there are plenty of things worse than radiation in the 40,000 century!

The don't allow nukes (or don't use them) because they have weapons that are more effective and don't irradiate an area.

purplefood wrote:The don't allow nukes (or don't use them) because they have weapons that are more effective and don't irradiate an area.

ok, cool.

Monk1junk1 wrote:To the OP, seeing as GK armies are usually pretty elite and small

What? They have 3000+ marines. I wouldn't call that small.