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Personally I do not feel the need for a new Tau dex... But if they're going to have one I think that their fluff (that's hateful right now) could be improved... improved, not changed... I would like to see Taus STRUGGLING to follow the greater good. Some fluff showing the distance between their philosophy and the harsh reality of 40K would make them much better... Expanded Farsight fluff ( is he fallen to chaos?), Taus experiencing the touch of the warp and daemons ( they will need to make some experiment about warp travel), Seeing them actually defeated sometimes by races that actually do not want to join GG (actually only DE had this pleasure), showing etereals and commanders actually asking themselves how the hell they will follow the greater good in a crappy situation... In the end, adding some drama to their existence that actually is quite straightlined and totally out of context in 40k ...
This kind of evolution could change this Tau hater in a GG enthusiast...

I once suggested giving them an abilty similar to WHFB "Stand and Shoot", or whatever it is called. So when the enemy charghes, they can fire a volley.

That would be a good idea. Personally, I think Cruddace isn't that bad at writing Codices. He did a solid job on IG, and a reasonable Tyranid Codex.

Reas....reasonable codex? He killed it from a competetive angle, and almost from a friendly view. I mean , I'm trying to deal with it, but seriously. And the rulings, the flipping rulings! Oh god.

I think his problem is that instead of working hard on his rules he simply churns out as many units as possible and hopes for the best. And then we end up with an IG codex where you have things as godawful as Kamir and Deddog, alongside things as hidiously overpowered as Vendettas, and a Tyranid codex where he completely dropped the ball.

Squigsquasher wrote:That would be a good idea. Personally, I think Cruddace isn't that bad at writing Codices. He did a solid job on IG, and a reasonable Tyranid Codex.

His "solid" Job, made the most hideously broken codex of 5th edition, and his "reasonable" job the worst.

If that's his "Solid" and "Reasonable" then I would hate to see his "Good" and "Underpowered" versions.

Or that. Like a "Stand and Shoot" responce.

Deadshot wrote:I once suggested giving them an abilty similar to WHFB "Stand and Shoot", or whatever it is called. So when the enemy charghes, they can fire a volley.

This would be great. Of course, it would need to take into effect the -1 to BS for shooting at a charging enemy, the same way fantasy does. This'll make them hit on 5s against a charging enemy. Morale tests would of course be taken by chargers if they lose too many models. But stand and shoot would be a great idea for them.

I hope they make Pathfinder markerlights Assault instead of Heavy. A Fast Attack that cannot fire its best weapon unless standing still is a bit of a head scratcher.

The only thing I don't like about Cruddace is that he sucked the character out of the Guard Codex, taking out doctrines and putting in that abysmal orders system.

I hope Phily Kelly writes the beloved Tau Codex.

Since they like linking codices through small fluff parts now, my guess is a good portion of new fluff will be based on the Iron Fist crusade, which was started in the Tyranid codex (Guard shows up, helps Tau fight off a Hive Fleet, IoM/Tau hostilities begin anew, ends with something about the Iron Fist crusade 'which is another story'.

It would be good to see more actual fluff about a crusade into Tau space.


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Squigsquasher wrote:That would be a good idea. Personally, I think Cruddace isn't that bad at writing Codices. He did a solid job on IG, and a reasonable Tyranid Codex.

I don't like his style of 'throw options into the codex until some work'. It's pretty obvious he doesn't internally balance. If you look at the Guard codex, the only reason it's a strong codex is he threw many, many more options into it than the Tyranid book. So there's more possible builds with the few jems that stick out. With the Tyranid book, there's gems, but there's maybe a quarter the amount of units and options, so less gems stick out. The Guard book is just as badly internally balanced as the Tyranid book.

He is, however, quite good at writing for Fantasy. They really should keep him there. It just seems he doesn't 'get' 40k.

I'd like to see the Tau get kind of a Chaos Dwarf build; ie a hard core of Tau battlesuits and fire warriors, and a motley collection of specialised alien auxiliaries. One set of aliens for CC, one set for outflanking, etc. Leave the biggest guns to the Tau themselves, but have fewer actual Tau on the board. Of course, the ability to field a wholly Tau force should still be there for those who don't have a lot of Kroot models.

-Loki- wrote:Since they like linking codices through small fluff parts now, my guess is a good portion of new fluff will be based on the Iron Fist crusade, which was started in the Tyranid codex (Guard shows up, helps Tau fight off a Hive Fleet, IoM/Tau hostilities begin anew, ends with something about the Iron Fist crusade 'which is another story'.
It would be good to see more actual fluff about a crusade into Tau space.

There's always the Nimbosa and Damocles Gulf Crusades. They could expand on that in both the Tau and Black Templar Codices

Yeah, but new crusades are always welcome.

As a Tau player, i don't have too many problems with the current form at the moment..

Having said that, some of the things I'd like to see expanded on in a new Codex would be the following:

1) Farsight Enclaves: Regardless of him being possessed/influenced by the sword, he initially rebelled against the GG because he felt he wasn't supported by the commanders
and went off on his own path.
Since they stand outside the normal Empire, they have less Tau recruits and might have to depend more heavily on Drones and/or a new race. Maybe bring in the Heavy Gun Drones from Forgeworld
and developed some newer versions of the XV8 suits. (Different weapons or Support systems, etc.) Yes, this might include a CC weapon or maybe even Firewarriors with CC options such as Pulse Pistol and Close Combat Weapon.
Doubtful that they would develop Power Weapons, but maybe a new race would introduce this to the Farsight Enclaves.

2) Normal Empire: Since everyone loves to complain about the lack of CC and the value of the Kroot, tap into the fanbased Kroot lists that populate the web. Give the Kroot Squads a few options of Mutations.

Units without a Shaper get none, while units with a Shaper may select ONE option.
Examples:
Fleet of Foot: +2 pts per model (Not available to units with Krootox) (This Carnivore band has been feasting on Eldar.)
Increased Toughness or Strength: +2 pts per model (Marines taste good.)
So forth and so on.. Don't have 20 options, but maybe 4 or 5 that could enhance a stat or ability to change what the Squad does on the table.
Give the Kroot the game play to match the story line.

3) Someone posted on giving the Firewarriors some type of Stand and Fire like ability to deal with charging units. My idea would be to use new Technologies to give them this, as opposed to changing the Tau themselves. How about a new type of drone that maybe carries a Fletchette Discharger like other Tau vehicles. The Shas'ui with a HW Drone Controller with a Flechette Drone or two would make an opponent think twice before charging into combat with said warriors.

Work with the existing fluff and story line, but rely on the strengths the Tau already have. They don't need much work to become a viable 5th edition force and some minor tweaks wouldn't make them overpowered.

PoetNWar wrote:As a Tau player, i don't have too many problems with the current form at the moment..

Having said that, some of the things I'd like to see expanded on in a new Codex would be the following:

1) Farsight Enclaves: Regardless of him being possessed/influenced by the sword, he initially rebelled against the GG because he felt he wasn't supported by the commanders
and went off on his own path.
Since they stand outside the normal Empire, they have less Tau recruits and might have to depend more heavily on Drones and/or a new race. Maybe bring in the Heavy Gun Drones from Forgeworld
and developed some newer versions of the XV8 suits. (Different weapons or Support systems, etc.) Yes, this might include a CC weapon or maybe even Firewarriors with CC options such as Pulse Pistol and Close Combat Weapon.
Doubtful that they would develop Power Weapons, but maybe a new race would introduce this to the Farsight Enclaves.

2) Normal Empire: Since everyone loves to complain about the lack of CC and the value of the Kroot, tap into the fanbased Kroot lists that populate the web. Give the Kroot Squads a few options of Mutations.

Units without a Shaper get none, while units with a Shaper may select ONE option.
Examples:
Fleet of Foot: +2 pts per model (Not available to units with Krootox) (This Carnivore band has been feasting on Eldar.)
Increased Toughness or Strength: +2 pts per model (Marines taste good.)
So forth and so on.. Don't have 20 options, but maybe 4 or 5 that could enhance a stat or ability to change what the Squad does on the table.
Give the Kroot the game play to match the story line.

3) Someone posted on giving the Firewarriors some type of Stand and Fire like ability to deal with charging units. My idea would be to use new Technologies to give them this, as opposed to changing the Tau themselves. How about a new type of drone that maybe carries a Fletchette Discharger like other Tau vehicles. The Shas'ui with a HW Drone Controller with a Flechette Drone or two would make an opponent think twice before charging into combat with said warriors.

Work with the existing fluff and story line, but rely on the strengths the Tau already have. They don't need much work to become a viable 5th edition force and some minor tweaks wouldn't make them overpowered.

1) Meh, I'd rather think Farsight's Enclave would be composed of more veterans than T'au, so something along the lines of improved Fire Warrior's BS Skill and different weapon loadouts for Crisis Suits. Farsight is more xenophobic than the Ethereals, so I wouldn't hold my breath to see alien species among his ranks.

2) Don't embellish Kroot use. Just make them, as a whole, cheaper (especially that Shaper, WTF 20 Points?). Allow the Shaper to carry a Melta bomb or a power weapon. Keep the more invigorating ideas for the basic Fire Warriors (who need a bit of a Stim Pack in their stats for 10 Points).

3) Give more drone options period. Something the gun lines can embellish.




With the release of the Necrons and after playing a very horde heavy list, the Tau need a points/weapons/unit audit. They sorely need some blast weapons and another high strength, low AP anti-AV13 long-med range weapon. The Hammerheads and Devilfish are rather expensive, and the Ion Cannon needs a face lift (Heavy 6 or 5 maybe). Crisis Suits really need to be Toughness 5.

Tau lack real decent anti-horde weapons and after trying to down a 20 model unit of Warriors, Crisis Suits cannot cut them down fast enough.

Squigsquasher wrote:That would be a good idea. Personally, I think Cruddace isn't that bad at writing Codices. He did a solid job on IG, and a reasonable Tyranid Codex.

You forgot about Sisters of Battle. What would you say he did there?

1) Meh, I'd rather think Farsight's Enclave would be composed of more veterans than T'au, so something along the lines of improved Fire Warrior's BS Skill and different weapon loadouts for Crisis Suits. Farsight is more xenophobic than the Ethereals, so I wouldn't hold my breath to see alien species among his ranks.

2) Don't embellish Kroot use. Just make them, as a whole, cheaper (especially that Shaper, WTF 20 Points?). Allow the Shaper to carry a Melta bomb or a power weapon. Keep the more invigorating ideas for the basic Fire Warriors (who need a bit of a Stim Pack in their stats for 10 Points).

3) Give more drone options period. Something the gun lines can embellish.




With the release of the Necrons and after playing a very horde heavy list, the Tau need a points/weapons/unit audit. They sorely need some blast weapons and another high strength, low AP anti-AV13 long-med range weapon. The Hammerheads and Devilfish are rather expensive, and the Ion Cannon needs a face lift (Heavy 6 or 5 maybe). Crisis Suits really need to be Toughness 5.

Tau lack real decent anti-horde weapons and after trying to down a 20 model unit of Warriors, Crisis Suits cannot cut them down fast enough.

With Battle Sisiters, they are simply GEQ with an MEQ save. They cost 10pts less than their mEQ counterpart, but have an expernsive HF option. The only thing unique would be their powerful and cheapish Whirlwind variant, the Exorcist.

I liked the SoB DwarfDex...

Deadshot wrote:With Battle Sisiters, they are simply GEQ with an MEQ save. They cost 10pts less than their mEQ counterpart, but have an expernsive HF option. The only thing unique would be their powerful and cheapish Whirlwind variant, the Exorcist.

Um, a sister is 11pts and a tactical marines is 15/16. Grey hunters 14pts. Thats not 10pts difference. I mean, I wouldn't mind if you could get SOB for 5 or 6 points a piece but I doubt GW would do it.

Wait, do you mean per squad?

acekevin8412 wrote:With all the buzz going on about the new Necrons, does anyone else shudder at the thought of what might be in store for the Tau?
While I have no problem with their new fluff by itself, I am disappointed that they put the old fluff to the grave, no pun intended.

They didn't put the old fluff "to the grave".

Before you can do something like that, an army kinda has to have fluff first. Necrons didn't have any. They read more like a monster from an RPG than something you could actually play.

Necrons needed new fluff. Even if it meant putting what had come before out to pasture and retconning half of it because the old fluff didn't form enough of a foundation to really build on. Tau don't have that problem. Their fluff will be just fine.

Hell...the Tau are winning...if anyone in 40k can "win" anything.

The Tau could use a points edit pretty badly, especially their vehicle choices. Probably reduce Fire Warriors by about 2 points and completely rehaul the Kroot both in points and in options. Other than those ambiguous statements, I do have a few other 'wishes' that would make Tau a little easier to field:

1) More Hammerhead Loadouts: A Strength 7 Ion Cannon and the only large blast Rail Gun we got. Perhaps if they raided Imperial Armor 3 and steal the plans for the Plasma Cannons...

2) Crisis Suits need buffs. Period. T5 would be great, and maybe 18 Points per Suit instead of 25.


That aside, I hope whoever writes the Codex does not completely retcon the Tau Fluff like that of the Necrons (I'm not saying the Necrons didn't need it). I don't want to open my brand new codex and learn that Tau have close combat weapons and that they let Kroot under their employ evolve by eating the dead.

punkow wrote:Seeing them actually defeated sometimes by races that actually do not want to join GG (actually only DE had this pleasure)

Space Marines? Imperial Guard? Damocles Gulf Crusade? I'm pretty sure they didn't want to join the Greater Good. In fact, they crushed settled Tau Worlds until hitting the ceramite wall when they attacked a Sept World.

Fluff could be made a lot more less ambiguous.

ChiliPowderKeg wrote:Fluff could be made a lot more less ambiguous.

Your post could be a lot more less ambiguous.

Totalwar1402 wrote:

Deadshot wrote:With Battle Sisiters, they are simply GEQ with an MEQ save. They cost 10pts less than their mEQ counterpart, but have an expernsive HF option. The only thing unique would be their powerful and cheapish Whirlwind variant, the Exorcist.

Um, a sister is 11pts and a tactical marines is 15/16. Grey hunters 14pts. Thats not 10pts difference. I mean, I wouldn't mind if you could get SOB for 5 or 6 points a piece but I doubt GW would do it.

Wait, do you mean per squad?

Yes, per squad.

But I just realized I was comparing Celestians, to Tacs, so no matter.


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KplKeegan wrote:
1) More Hammerhead Loadouts: A Strength 7 Ion Cannon and the only large blast Rail Gun we got. Perhaps if they raided Imperial Armor 3 and steal the plans for the Plasma Cannons...

I am putting pen to paper as we speak, and will soon transfer it to 40K Proposed rules for you to enjoy.