Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Its nice to read this...untill very recently I had been "away" for almost 15 years, totally lost touch with the core game rules as its all changed but always kept my oar in as it were by playing GW based PC games or the odd copy of White Dwarf if something caught my eye.

I finally desided to return to gaming or more so the modelling side of it just for fun really. I went straight to the "specialist games" section as alot of that was new releases in my youth haha. Man, its all so expenisve now, I used to be able to pick up a lead terminator for like £2 but I do think some of the plastic kits are truely amazing and make for some awesome conversions!

I hope you find the answer you're looking for...I think a like minded bunch of mates is the key to great gaming experience...sadly I don't have any gaming chums as yet but I'm building a few projects for fun/the challenge of it first and playing them as a second really.

Eilif wrote:

Smacks wrote:Get back into the hobby sure, but stay away from Games Workshop. I don't really see how anyone could recommend getting into GW at the moment.

I understand your feelings, but I can recommend getting into GW for the same reasons that -while I'm not into 40k right now- I still hold onto my two 40k armies. 40k has a background that nothing else is quite like, and if you want to game, or if no one wants to play the games you like, there's always a huge built-in 40k player base.

40k isn't the best by any means, but it has some very strong advantages that should not be ignored.

Respectfully I disagree. The OP already has 9k of marines and I expect he already knows the 40k background inside out. He was talking about starting again, collecting new armies, and if it was worth it right now. I would say GW is probably less "worth it" now than it ever has been. Since they are more expensive now than they ever have been, the quality of their content seems to be on the decline. And alternative systems are more popular now than they ever have been.

I think the idea that it is more difficult to find opponents for non-GW games is actually just hype. If you are able to find people who like playing GW games with you, then chances are they will like playing other games with you too. The only place you have problems with none Games Workshop games is inside Games Workshops.

Smacks wrote:I think the idea that it is more difficult to find opponents for non-GW games is actually just hype. If you are able to find people who like playing GW games with you, then chances are they will like playing other games with you too. The only place you have problems with none Games Workshop games is inside Games Workshops.

That's a pretty broad brush you're using there.

Speaking of my area, I can find someone to play 40k pretty easily. My FLGS is packed on Saturdays with a 40k league and pickup games, and busy on Sunday as well. My brother and two other friends play 40k. To say I could drive to a friends house or my FLGS and expect to find a quick game of 40k is not an exaggeration at all.

However, I barely find anyone playing Warmahordes at my FLGS and my brother and friends simply will not play it for various reasons. Infinity and Malifaux are only played in leagues. Flames of War is played on and off when local groups want to play. Warmahordes used to run two gaming days (Thursday and Sunday) a week when the GW embargo happened, but according to my FLGS owner, the crowds have thinned, and barely anyone is there to play on Sunday, and Thursday doesn't happen anymore, and the gaming population is purely the TFGs that are left.

Every single gaming area is different.

-Loki- wrote:

Speaking of my area, I can find someone to play 40k pretty easily. My FLGS is packed on Saturdays with a 40k league and pickup games, and busy on Sunday as well. My brother and two other friends play 40k. To say I could drive to a friends house or my FLGS and expect to find a quick game of 40k is not an exaggeration at all.

Well, I want to disagree with you.....but I can't. Love them or hate them, GW has done an awesome job of promoting their products, other companies really need to focus on this area if they're ever to overcome this constant issue.

What annoys me is, there are numerous ways in which a company can increase its profile awareness yet the various owners don't seem either interested or aware of how to do this.

Delephont wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

Speaking of my area, I can find someone to play 40k pretty easily. My FLGS is packed on Saturdays with a 40k league and pickup games, and busy on Sunday as well. My brother and two other friends play 40k. To say I could drive to a friends house or my FLGS and expect to find a quick game of 40k is not an exaggeration at all.

Well, I want to disagree with you.....but I can't. Love them or hate them, GW has done an awesome job of promoting their products, other companies really need to focus on this area if they're ever to overcome this constant issue.

I appreciate that GW is the most popular. But I don't like how that is so often used to scare people away from alternatives. Basically feeding into the cycle of GW being the most popular, because it is the most popular. I think it is better to pick a game you enjoy, and then find people who enjoy it too. Or even introduce new people to it, and raise the profile yourself.

I think that is far more positive than just sticking with GW out of fear, and advising others to do the same. In the end, that only makes GW more powerful, and makes you, and all the rest of us, slaves to their price hikes.

Kilkrazy wrote:Navarro, don't get rid of your 28mm stuff.

If there is no room in your flat in the UK you can store them in a local storage warehouse fairly cheaply.

15mm is a great scale for large battles and modern/SF skirmish, though.

20mm also has a lot to offer for WW2 and more recent periods, thanks to the huge selection of 1/27 scale kits on the market.

I can't justify the extra hobby expenses at this point in my life because migrating/ rearranging my life from scratch/ hunting a new job is really not compatible with large volumes... So I sold offered etc a chunk of 28mm. But the 28mm core collection still here.

rob-or-ross wrote:

NAVARRO wrote:Its hard to put myself on anyone shoes because everyone do have different preferences etc But I will share my current experience hoping it will help... I have been a collector for many years and have a huge 28mm collection form many ranges... next year I will migrate to the UK and its going to be impossible to take my hobby with me for the first years so I had either to give it up or change something.

I searched for a option and I looked into things that I discarded before so I rediscovered my hobby all over again by starting 15mm, its small minis I can carry them with me on my first years without to much hassle... I will manage to still paint a bit.

What I'm saying if I was you I would look very well for options and go with the one that suits my reality better, whatever you do dont give up because hobbies are quite rewarding to your personal balance.

Don't sell up.
If you ask on the forums there is bound to be someone who will let you keep your minis in their attic.
In fact - if you are going to be in North Kent you can put them in mine. No charge.

Thats very generous of you, thanks!
For the first year or so before I get things more organized I'm keeping my collections in my home country and then the plan is start shipping small parcels for my new address... Its going to take time and in that time 15mm is going to be my Hobby advanced outpost since they fit on the backpack.

Sometimes people have to change habits or collections in order to keep themselves on this hobby, with my move I noticed how much volume our hobby takes, not very practical.
As for the OP preference of 40k, GW games are always more popular but other games are getting more fans depending on your area of residence, if your more into having a bit of fun with friends you should check out other rules systems even if you use your 40k minis, don't be stuck to what any company says you should do, just use your resources and minis and try new games, you may be surprised with what's out there.

Smacks wrote:

I think that is far more positive than just sticking with GW out of fear, and advising others to do the same. In the end, that only makes GW more powerful, and makes you and tall the rest of us slaves to their price hikes.

Although this is happening less now than at any time before. I travelled the other day to a new shop in Bristol, in the south west of the UK, called Cut and Thrust gaming. They have a massive mix of stuff on offer. A new shop is also opened in Evesham, 'Total Wargamer' (they have a pretty cheap internet store), again selling a wide range of wargames, not just GW. One of the stores is running a FoW as well as Infinity campaign.
Certainly from this experience it has never been better for the wargamer in terms of choice available, and also the ability to find other players who are willing to try a new game with you.

I can completely understand one of the main fears of the budding wargamer, or perhaps someone coming back to the hobby - that the army they choose to collect and spend time and money on will be invalid and they won't be able to find an opponent. But I think this is a viewpoint that has become almost completely baseless in the last year or so. In a way GW had been, especially in the UK, very effective in spreading their own hobby stores while helping to push out independents, to the point where at one time it was almost impossible to play other games. Now however the situation has changed, I think the format of the US (which I think has had a far larger variety of games played for a lot longer, based on people's comments) is starting to spread over the Atlantic and to the UK. The internet has helped connect people - look at Infinity's living database for instance, or forums where we can easily meet other players. Many new independents have opened here in the southwest, remarkable considering the economic problems but perhaps proof of the gap that has opened in the industry. I think also the cost and perhaps size of other manufacturer's games have helped them, they are pulling gamers away from a company which I would argue has become a little overweight and lazy while sat on the top of the pile.

Finally, I would like to point out that wargaming shouldn't be an 'either/or' thing. Sometimes these forums remind me of arguments my friends and I used to have about which was better, a Sega Megadrive (genesis) or a SNES - we would rigorously defend our corner, scorning anything that appeared on the other machine, even if really we knew within our hearts (if we were honest) that it was probably a great game and we would have liked to play it. I still play 40k and WFB, I play some of GW's wonderful back catalogue of specialist games, I still buy some of their paints (although more from habit, as the new design from them is bloody terrible ). At the same time I have recently enjoyed collecting Infinity, and the game system I would say is the greatest thing to come out of the industry in the last decade or more, I collect Mantic and Gamezone miniatures, as well as Flames of War. I like the look of SAGA, and I only wish that there were more hours in the day! These need not be mutually exclusive from each other, no-one here is wearing a red or blue t-shirt and waiting outside kebab shops to fight with fans from the other team.

The point being there has never been a better time to be a wargamer. The advances in technology (both with design and methods of communication between hobbyists) have helped to create a myriad of new games, and I feel that this is self-perpetuating now to the point where I am sure in a decade or so there will be even more on offer, and fears of not being able to get a game will be far less valid. While the companies in the industry fight it out for your time and your money, I think the ultimate beneficiary of all of it will be us.

It would be great if wargaming could eventually develop a real pro level like MTG

In regards to the OP, i would recommend buying non-GW stuff until the advent of sixth ed. Because if they feth that up then i don't think (and im pretty sure other people would agree) they will ever really recover. But alternativley if they pull out a great rule set and stop raising prices so much then GW has a chance.

Smacks wrote:

Delephont wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

Speaking of my area, I can find someone to play 40k pretty easily. My FLGS is packed on Saturdays with a 40k league and pickup games, and busy on Sunday as well. My brother and two other friends play 40k. To say I could drive to a friends house or my FLGS and expect to find a quick game of 40k is not an exaggeration at all.

Well, I want to disagree with you.....but I can't. Love them or hate them, GW has done an awesome job of promoting their products, other companies really need to focus on this area if they're ever to overcome this constant issue.

I appreciate that GW is the most popular. But I don't like how that is so often used to scare people away from alternatives. Basically feeding into the cycle of GW being the most popular, because it is the most popular. I think it is better to pick a game you enjoy, and then find people who enjoy it too. Or even introduce new people to it, and raise the profile yourself.

I think that is far more positive than just sticking with GW out of fear, and advising others to do the same. In the end, that only makes GW more powerful, and makes you, and all the rest of us, slaves to their price hikes.

Arguments such as this, perhaps don't help the if you are trying to win people over.

I can see both sides of the argument. In one way the gamer needs to be confident enough to build his/her own gaming environment, however, on the other hand, if a company want's to be successful it is in their interest to make the transition or entry to their game as painless and enjoyable as possible.

GW has ticked the box in both quarters, and they are reaping the benfits of doing so.

GW is going to cost you more than any other game system currently out there to collect and paint an army. If you have $500 (or more) to drop and love GW minis, go for it.

If not, there's lots of good alternatives available now for skirmish and squad level games.

Also, GW is a declining player base rather than a growing one. If they had the same number of people buying the same number of models as 10 years ago, they'd be making double the money and that's not even counting inflation into the equation.

Every year they raise the prices and their revenue pretty much stays flat. This means that less people are buying less product (total revenue = units sold X average price).

Some of the reaon you'll find complete contempt for non-GW games by some of GW's customers is they have a very good reason to be afraid that competing miniature games will reduce their available local player base. That they'll be the ones struggling to find opponents.

Locally for example, I can show up to a local shop with a warmachine army on a Saturday and I'll find an opponent without any pre-scheduling. 10 years ago, that would be unthinkable. If I showed up with a 40k army, the odds of getting a game without pre-scheduling would be pretty much zero.

Smacks wrote:[ The OP already has 9k of marines and I expect he already knows the 40k background inside out. He was talking about starting again, collecting new armies, and if it was worth it right now. I would say GW is probably less "worth it" now than it ever has been. Since they are more expensive now than they ever have been, the quality of their content seems to be on the decline. And alternative systems are more popular now than they ever have been.

I think the idea that it is more difficult to find opponents for non-GW games is actually just hype. If you are able to find people who like playing GW games with you, then chances are they will like playing other games with you too. .

I agree that GW is less worth it now than ever, but the OP does seem to like the 40k'verse and is already very invested. Thus, if he has the $ to invest, I recommend sticking with what he enjoys/enjoyed.

Smacks wrote:
I think the idea that it is more difficult to find opponents for non-GW games is actually just hype. If you are able to find people who like playing GW games with you, then chances are they will like playing other games with you too. .

Sorry, but you're dead wrong on this one. It might not be as hard as some hardore GW apologists would have you think, but walk into a game store on a weekday evening set down you ultramarine army and a game pretty much presents itself. Do the same thing with your infinity crew, Malifaux band, etc, etc, and (unless you're there for a game specific night) you can hear the crickets chirping.

PP is the exception to this some locations, but in many places it's still GW or nothing.

It is possible to develop a community of folks playing other games (I've done this), but it takes concerted effort. Nothing is as easy to find a game for as 40k.

Pacific wrote:
Finally, I would like to point out that wargaming shouldn't be an 'either/or' thing.

This is a very good point. Playing more than one game is a good thing. You may have to paint/collect both sides of the less popular game, but why not collect a new 40k army as well as a couple of warbands for Infinity or Brushfire, or Malifaux, or Song of Blades, or....

frozenwastes wrote:Also, GW is a declining player base rather than a growing one....

Might be true, but it's still the biggest dog on the block by far.

frozenwastes wrote:Locally for example, I can show up to a local shop with a warmachine army on a Saturday and I'll find an opponent without any pre-scheduling. 10 years ago, that would be unthinkable. If I showed up with a 40k army, the odds of getting a game without pre-scheduling would be pretty much zero.

Your FLGS is by far the exception. at most FLGS's you're more (or much more) likely to find a 40k game than WM.

You do make a good point though. If the OP decides that WM models and fluff is of interest to them, there is enough of a community for WM that it will likely not be difficult for them to find a game.

I say go for it. I left the hobby around 2004, having played from the start until the end of 3E. Just last month, I came back to it. Assembling and painting minis has been a great stress relief. Like you, I went from being a high school/college aged kid with limited budget to a professional, so budget isn't as big a deal, but time can be.

I haven't gotten back into the gaming side of things yet, so I am just enjoying the modeling and painting for now. Not sure when I'll get back to a gaming table. As you pointed out, there seems to be a lot of "spam" based net lists which seem to ignore tactics, fluff and flavor in favor of finding the absolutely most efficient single units and buying a lot of them.

As far as finding games goes, I have two game stores (one GW, one independent) within half an hour either way. Both of them have regular 40k games, both pick-up games and organized events.

OP here.

Yeah I am going to. I still love the game and models. We'll see where 6th heads. If nothing else I will play in silly APOC games and whatnot, where beer and happy shenanigans are more prevalent then WAAC tragic and sad shenanigans.

Pulled out my Fantasy Chaos and Empire, and am starting to get back into it with those. I'll start maybe piecing together another 40k and expand the Templar even more in the spring. I also have Menoth which I will finish painting the last 15pts worth of so I have 35pts there.

And now to trek to the local shops and see the community.

-Eric

I have been out for 4 years and I got back into and I kept all of my models. 5000 of "werewolf" CSM, 2000 of "werewolf" orks, 2500 pts of TAU EMPIRE, 10 Leman Russes, 6 Bassies, and I am starting a DraigoWing (1750 pts) using old style Grey Knights.

I am and was into 40k because of the modeling and who won or lost the game really did not bother me.

RandomX wrote:OP here.

Yeah I am going to. I still love the game and models. We'll see where 6th heads. If nothing else I will play in silly APOC games and whatnot, where beer and happy shenanigans are more prevalent then WAAC tragic and sad shenanigans.

Pulled out my Fantasy Chaos and Empire, and am starting to get back into it with those. I'll start maybe piecing together another 40k and expand the Templar even more in the spring. I also have Menoth which I will finish painting the last 15pts worth of so I have 35pts there.

And now to trek to the local shops and see the community.

-Eric

Ignore the cries of "declining player base" and "GW is EEEEEVVVVIIIILLLLLL". You have 9k of templars, bust open that Apocalypse book and take them for a spin.


A few house rules between you and your buds, and you'll find Apoc to be the 40k you remember from back in the day, full of carnage and possibilities.

You also have fantasy and warmachine? My advice is work on it ALL, then get out there and stomp some face in all 3 games!

Battle Ready Studios wrote:

RandomX wrote:OP here.

Yeah I am going to. I still love the game and models. We'll see where 6th heads. If nothing else I will play in silly APOC games and whatnot, where beer and happy shenanigans are more prevalent then WAAC tragic and sad shenanigans.

Pulled out my Fantasy Chaos and Empire, and am starting to get back into it with those. I'll start maybe piecing together another 40k and expand the Templar even more in the spring. I also have Menoth which I will finish painting the last 15pts worth of so I have 35pts there.

And now to trek to the local shops and see the community.

-Eric

Ignore the cries of "declining player base" and "GW is EEEEEVVVVIIIILLLLLL". You have 9k of templars, bust open that Apocalypse book and take them for a spin.


A few house rules between you and your buds, and you'll find Apoc to be the 40k you remember from back in the day, full of carnage and possibilities.

You also have fantasy and warmachine? My advice is work on it ALL, then get out there and stomp some face in all 3 games!

Pretty much this. If you already have a pile of models, all you need is some current books.

Also: if you have other games and you can find people to play those games with, great! Go for it.

The biggest favor you can do for yourself is to disregard all of the internet whining from the bitter kids with agendas and find what you enjoy.

Worglock wrote:

Battle Ready Studios wrote:

RandomX wrote:OP here.

Yeah I am going to. I still love the game and models. We'll see where 6th heads. If nothing else I will play in silly APOC games and whatnot, where beer and happy shenanigans are more prevalent then WAAC tragic and sad shenanigans.

Pulled out my Fantasy Chaos and Empire, and am starting to get back into it with those. I'll start maybe piecing together another 40k and expand the Templar even more in the spring. I also have Menoth which I will finish painting the last 15pts worth of so I have 35pts there.

And now to trek to the local shops and see the community.

-Eric

Ignore the cries of "declining player base" and "GW is EEEEEVVVVIIIILLLLLL". You have 9k of templars, bust open that Apocalypse book and take them for a spin.


A few house rules between you and your buds, and you'll find Apoc to be the 40k you remember from back in the day, full of carnage and possibilities.

You also have fantasy and warmachine? My advice is work on it ALL, then get out there and stomp some face in all 3 games!

Pretty much this. If you already have a pile of models, all you need is some current books.

Also: if you have other games and you can find people to play those games with, great! Go for it.

The biggest favor you can do for yourself is to disregard all of the internet whining from the bitter kids with agendas and find what you enjoy.

For that last line mate, you should just put it into your signature, will save you the effort of writing it each and every single time you make a post.

Worglock wrote:
The biggest favor you can do for yourself is to disregard all of the internet whining from the bitter kids with agendas and find what you enjoy.

Pot, I have someone here to meet you, his name is kettle...

Pacific wrote:

For that last line mate, you should just put it into your signature, will save you the effort of writing it each and every single time you make a post.

Indeed!

Physician heal thyself!

Alpharius wrote:

Pacific wrote:

For that last line mate, you should just put it into your signature, will save you the effort of writing it each and every single time you make a post.

Indeed!

Physician heal thyself!

I'm healed just fine thanks.

I'm much more interested in pointing out the obvious, having my person attacked for it on this forum and then seeing what (doesn't) happen(s) purely as a social experiment and a side bet with a friend.

Do you have "Get banned - again" in that pool?

Worglock wrote:I'm much more interested in pointing out the obvious, having my person attacked for it on this forum and then seeing what (doesn't) happen(s) purely as a social experiment and a side bet with a friend.

let's see:

-Refuses to see how his posts are in any way inflammatory
-Complains of personal attacks
-Makes vague insinuations that moderation allows attacks against him (probably to silence his viewpoint)
-Claims his posting behavior is part of some "above the game" agenda

This is a very nice specimen!

You get the paranoid/martyr/naive/puppetmaster quadfecta, which is very rare to see in the wild.

Polonius wrote:

Worglock wrote:I'm much more interested in pointing out the obvious, having my person attacked for it on this forum and then seeing what (doesn't) happen(s) purely as a social experiment and a side bet with a friend.

let's see:

-Refuses to see how his posts are in any way inflammatory
-Complains of personal attacks
-Makes vague insinuations that moderation allows attacks against him (probably to silence his viewpoint)
-Claims his posting behavior is part of some "above the game" agenda

This is a very nice specimen!

You get the paranoid/martyr/naive/puppetmaster quadfecta, which is very rare to see in the wild.

You sir wins the Worglocks!
I don't think i have ever laughed so hard.
Sigged