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GW official fluff(meaning codex and BGB exclusively) has given orks the ability to loot anything and do anything if they believe in it hard enough. They are the comic relief in the grim darkness of 40k, ignoring silly restrictions like "that's stupid" and "how could they possibly do that". To argue anything regarding their tech and looting skills as less than that is hilariously wrong.

A quick run down of the impossible/ridiculous things orks have done from the variety of codexes and BGB just off the top of my head:

-sailed into the eye of terror simply to fight daemons
-shokk attack guns
-kustom force fields
-taken a bolter round to the head, walk away holding his head together, and becoming the most powerful single living figure in the universe

The fluff is literally full of silly things like these, so trying to justify it or denying hypotheticals is foolish. How is looting a monolith more bizarre or unbelievable than a species of angry green fungus that enjoys warfare?

-cgmckenzie

bombboy1252 wrote:

NL_Cirrus wrote:
We must have two different definitions of "word salad" as I understand it word salad is an incoherent random conglomeration of words. Key word being INCOHERENT. My example was not incoherent nor was it random, I chose each word to be conflicting so that it would provide a good example as to why saying "just because they didn't say we couldn't" is a BAD support for any argument. That being said it wasn't incoherent because it had a Noun a Verb and several prepositional phrases all linked with appropriate artical adjectives and described by and elaborated with adjectives and adverbs, some are my own personal adjectives and adverbs that I just made up to express an as-of-yet undefined quality -'crony: ADJ the look and feel of necron based tech- ,but this IS english and in english you can do that. As for being a conglomeration of words...You got me it fulfills 1/3 of the prerequisites of word salad, as does every sentence ever made but never mind that, so it MUST BE WORD SALAD!

Spoiler:

some what inappropriate and insulting but I spent so long on it I couldn't leave it out and I think its kinda funny.

A Tomb World that has a golden thrown and an emperor of man with a hive mind backed by the four powers of chaos using their 'crony field to power ultimate doom cannon to vaporize whole planets when their robotic grey 'nid demons can't take them. Would ,in fact, be a planet housing a Necron Tomb complex containing a seat of high authority plated in gold with a leader of the humans feudalistic government sharing a conciseness with every being -both organic inorganic or a combination therein- in the empire as well as possessing the endorsement of the quartet of warp entities usually referred to as the chaos gods and, possessing a large weapon that fires projectiles with an intergalactic rang, powered by energy fields generated by each of the metallic bodies of the necrons, that is used to break down the atomic bonds of all planets/planetoids that it comes in contact with, but only under the condition that the large monstrous creatures clad in the armor of grey knights whilst synonymously using bio-mechanical prosthesis powered by Necron technology and drawing power from the warp to further enhance their strength.

I CAN USE BIG WORDS TOO!

Their a difference in something completely crazy like you said, and something that could actually happen like a looted monolith. It also seems like you thought what he said was "Big scary words".......I find that funny.

1st I never said they were scary but even you must admit at least a few were inordinately large.

Well now your just getting down to perspective, Because I don't think a "looted" monolith is not possible and therefor would -to me- be a crazy statement. However what I said before is entirely possible, a bit unorthodox sure, but possible.

bombboy1252 wrote:

NL_Cirrus wrote:

The only problem with that statement is, that all Necrons come back to full operational capacity unless they are destroyed at the molecular level, ork weapons are incapable of this. AND orks themselves are limited in there number because they would eventually deplete the soil of nutrients making sporing impossible meaning that ANY loss would be dear, and as we've seen orks don't care about taking casualties.

Where do you get that all Necrons get back to full operational capacity unless destroyed at the molecular level? If that was the case, than they would be completely impossible to beat, unless you dropped exterminatus bombs all over the tomb worlds.

I didn't mean that they stood back up, I meant they they would phase out to the tomb world/tomb ship/repair base thingy unless you destroyed every -even molecular- trace of them other wise they would teleport through transdimentional travel back to the repair center and be rebuilt back to perfect fighting condition.

bombboy1252 wrote:

NL_Cirrus wrote:

1st You seem to forget that the orks were programed by the Old Ones that themselves were defeated by the Necrons, so how could the Old Ones program the Orks to do something thet they CAN'T. Further more the Old Ones didn't understand Necron tech other wise they would have used it too or disrupted it's operation. So, once again, how could the Old Ones program the orks to do what they CAN'T.

2nd Using technology you don't understand is easy, manipulating or disrupting something you don't under stand is NOT. EX: Almost any one in, lets say Canada, can OPERATE a radio, However if you gave a average Canadian civilian a HAM radio and some other equipment could they jam radio frequencies? NO, because using and modifying something you don't understand is WORLDS apart.

1: The Old ones could have beaten the Necrons, but the C'tan were bloated with Necrontyr souls and were just too powerful. So yes, the Old ones could have beaten the Necrons. And how do you know the Old Ones didn't understand Necron tech by the time they created the Orks and the Eldar?

2" You forget we are talking about orks here, orks don't need to understand anything to make it work and use it their advantage. No it doesn't always work (Read the story in the Necron dex' where the Necrons were getting slaughtered by a Waaagh!, so they gave the Orks a dozen Annihilation barges. So the orks tried to use them and got blown up) but it does work sometimes, it just depends on how good of a big mek you have with you.

MrFlutterPie wrote:Yes!!!

I'm writing a story about Ork kammando's infiltrating Terra and looting the Emperor himself!

I'm up to the point where da boyz have made it planet side.

We Custodes can never drink some coffee..

There are some limits to the WAAAGH! power, but there are none when it comes to technology. They can loot anything per the fluff, simple as that. If a mek gets it in his head to loot or build something, nothing will stop him from finishing that project.

-cgmckenzie

cgmckenzie wrote:There are some limits to the WAAAGH! power, but there are none when it comes to technology. They can loot anything per the fluff, simple as that. If a mek gets it in his head to loot or build something, nothing will stop him from finishing that project.

-cgmckenzie

Except, of course, for the omnipresent fact that he doesn't know what he's doing. It's POSSIBLE for an Ork Mek to build very nearly anything. . . but most of them will accidentally blow themselves up partway through the process.

The limit to Waaagh! power is the number of orks present

NL_Cirrus: Ever thought about that every codex portraits the army in question as invincible? The best Evidence is the War of Armageddon. Every marine chapter(BA, BT, Ultra Marines, Space Wolves) is sure they saved the day, and no one else, the imperial guard tells that Yarrik's genius tactics ran Thrakka off, the Black Templar say they helped Yarrik do it, the ork codex says he left out of boredom over the stalemate while the Eldar claim to have orchestrated the whole thing.

Necron fluff clearly states that not every necron tech ever will be phased out in danger of getting looted. If power is too low or the unit in question has taken too much damage, they attempt to self-destruct - this may also fail. In addition the codix explains that many sleeping tomb worlds have been lost due to other species(for example, Orks) entering the tombs and destroying them. And we all know that orks will take any useful scrap with them.

A looted monolith doesn't have to utilize the green glowing necron tech. I have seen a model with a Leman Russ turret mounted on top instead of the whip and big shootaz instead of flux projectors. It's still a looted monolith.


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BeRzErKeR wrote:

cgmckenzie wrote:There are some limits to the WAAAGH! power, but there are none when it comes to technology. They can loot anything per the fluff, simple as that. If a mek gets it in his head to loot or build something, nothing will stop him from finishing that project.

-cgmckenzie

Except, of course, for the omnipresent fact that he doesn't know what he's doing. It's POSSIBLE for an Ork Mek to build very nearly anything. . . but most of them will accidentally blow themselves up partway through the process.

You might give Imperial Armor 8 a read to find a Mek who knows exactly what he is doing, and is so good at it, that Terra sends an entire Regiment of Elysian drop troops and four companies of Raven Guard to their death, just to kill a single mek.

And the raid in IA:8 went about as well as you could expect; the invading forces were all but wiped out and the orks get new stuff!

-cgmckenzie

The older model Deff Dredd has a severed necron head on it's banner pole, so i'd say the argument that all Necron Living Metal auto-phases out NO MATTER WHAT is a bit shaky


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Pg 162 Main rulebook- (da big green page)

Orks salvage teleport nodes from Scythia.

thenoobbomb wrote:

MrFlutterPie wrote:Yes!!!

I'm writing a story about Ork kammando's infiltrating Terra and looting the Emperor himself!

I'm up to the point where da boyz have made it planet side.

We Custodes can never drink some coffee..

I don't quite get your meaning?

Jidmah wrote:The limit to Waaagh! power is the number of orks present

So your saying if a group of orks numbering in the quadrillion's all focused on a Russ that that Russ would than turn in to a looted wagon and the guardsmen into orks. IF that's true -which I doubt- then why have orks ever lost a battle since all orks always believe they will win?

Jidmah wrote:
NL_Cirrus: Ever thought about that every codex portraits the army in question as invincible? The best Evidence is the War of Armageddon. Every marine chapter(BA, BT, Ultra Marines, Space Wolves) is sure they saved the day, and no one else, the imperial guard tells that Yarrik's genius tactics ran Thrakka off, the Black Templar say they helped Yarrik do it, the ork codex says he left out of boredom over the stalemate while the Eldar claim to have orchestrated the whole thing.

Necron fluff clearly states that not every necron tech ever will be phased out in danger of getting looted. If power is too low or the unit in question has taken too much damage, they attempt to self-destruct - this may also fail. In addition the codix explains that many sleeping tomb worlds have been lost due to other species(for example, Orks) entering the tombs and destroying them. And we all know that orks will take any useful scrap with them.

A looted monolith doesn't have to utilize the green glowing necron tech. I have seen a model with a Leman Russ turret mounted on top instead of the whip and big shootaz instead of flux projectors. It's still a looted monolith.

Yes, I understand that every armies codex is made to makes that army look good. I also understand that Necrons won't always win. I've said that before.

I know that Necron stuff doesn't always phase out -usually due to damage to the tomb world,since that's what is phasing them out not the unit its self -, Although the only time I've ever read any where of captured Necrons was in a story in Dakka fiction.

Have you even read my previous posts? I said before that I don't consider just strapping rokkits and kopta blades to a piece of living metal "looting," and with out the "green glowing necron tech" thats all any of their stuff is. Also as I've said before, IF that IS your definition of "looting" then yes orks can "loot" anything, but by the same logic I can "loot" anything as well.






Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Ascalam I never said

Ascalam wrote:all Necron Living Metal auto-phases out NO MATTER WHAT

I said

NL_Cirrus wrote:Wouldn't it depend on what your definition of "loot" is?

After all if you define "loot" as using as in just having a piece of what ever it is in your new construct -EX: a Space Marine strapped to the front of a battle wagon = looted SM- Sure -although in the Necron's case you'd need to get past phase out -assuming that it is in the new 'dex.-

And I don't have a main rule book I have the mini-rule book, so unfortunately I can't look on page 162 as mine doesn't have that many pages. :(

Edits=fixing quote boxes

Strapping a SM to a battlewagon as a hood ornament would be a form of looting, yes.

So would gutting the hull of a Monolith, and using it as a frame for a vehicle. Monoliths can be damaged and shut down in the fluff without phasing out. The SM do so in FOD. It doesn't vanish, but drifts to the ground inactive.

Gutting the thing from the inside is possible, as the portal shuts down when they do this. There are fluff examples of folk looking at the inside of Liths IIRC.

Living metal, these days, is a bit pathetic armourwise. I used to play Necrons when it was good

These days there's nothing to stop someone cutting through the hull and wrecking the gubbins inside, then rebuilding it, especially if one of those gubbins is the tranciever that the Tomb World is receiving status from.

The old codex has an example of a wrecked Lith that didn't poof-disappear also

MrFlutterPie wrote: I'm writing a story about Ork kammando's infiltrating Terra and looting the Emperor himself!

This could make for a great campaign

Cyvash wrote:Orks being able to loot stuff is like Chaos being able to curropt almost anything if they want it its practly theirs.

They cannot corrupt CROWE OR DRAAAAAIIIIIGGGGGOOOOOOO!*

*meant to be said in enigmatic slow-mo!

Ascalam wrote:Strapping a SM to a battlewagon as a hood ornament would be a form of looting, yes.

So would gutting the hull of a Monolith, and using it as a frame for a vehicle. Monoliths can be damaged and shut down in the fluff without phasing out. The SM do so in FOD. It doesn't vanish, but drifts to the ground inactive.

Gutting the thing from the inside is possible, as the portal shuts down when they do this. There are fluff examples of folk looking at the inside of Liths IIRC.

Living metal, these days, is a bit pathetic armourwise. I used to play Necrons when it was good

These days there's nothing to stop someone cutting through the hull and wrecking the gubbins inside, then rebuilding it, especially if one of those gubbins is the tranciever that the Tomb World is receiving status from.

The old codex has an example of a wrecked Lith that didn't poof-disappear also *

Well as I said I don't consider that "looting," because it demands nothing other than you have part of the "looted" object on your vehicle/person/armor/whatever and under that definition say orks can "loot" anything it pointless because anyone can "loot" anything they just don't because the can just build what they need instead of scavenging for it.

Ya, :(, the living metal nerf is a major bummer. And in the old days there were no "grubbins inside" the 'lith so you couldn't really disable it, other than temporally immobilizing it or decreasing the power going to the Gauss Flux Arcs, only damage it to the point that it would phase out or self-destruct if it couldn't phase out.

* The only story I can think of is the "meteorite" that turned out to be a MONOLITH IN SPACE(hulk), and how that happened, we probably will never know. Maybe the C'tan were playing foot ball?

I consider it looting, as looting something involves getting ahold of something that isn't yours, and doing what you like with it. No-one said it has to remain in pristine condition, and no looted wagon the orks have ever does YMMV, so i'll agree to disagree there

I liked it better the old way. The new 'codex' turned me off necrons in about 10 minutes, and i sold my whole army.

That's the one. Very dinged up Lith embedded in a spacehulk. Could have been planted there as a trap also, but i doubt it... Great story though.

The old book's fluff and vibe is so far better than the new that it makes me wince to feel how far Necrons have fallen, new units/wiztricks notwithstanding...

I'll agree to disagree on what qualifies as "looted."

I hate the new fluff as well. Egyptian robots IN SPACE is NOT what I think of as Necron.

Theres a captured necron in Xenology. And a severed necron arm. And the whole story takes place inside a necron monolith thats been converted to imperial use.

Not inside.

There is a Monolith on the roof though

Alrighty Loremaster time here, First off all opponents of Necron Fluff are mistaken please reference a story inside the Last Edition Necron Fluff which dealt with an Inquistor using an Odyessus bolter round to track a Necron warrior to his tomb world and and destroy it from the inside. This statement proves that necron phase out technology is hardly flawless but extremely difficult to track this proves that it is scientifically possible for the Imperium fo Mankind to disassemble the insubstantial ghosting effects of Phase out. So to conclude this first point I would like to bring to the attention of these Necron supporters that do this Day the Imperium cannot dismantle or understand how our Ork Technology Works. What this means is orky tech is in a sense more difficult to understand or simply more advanced while being disguised as 'crude' since the Imperium doesn't understand it.

Lets move onto survival of race vs race. Both make valid points but both are VERY mistaken with how the physiology of the other works. I use to be an necron player, their bodies are modified automatons meaning the system would do the best it could to replace and repair damaged limbs from the wreckage of it's own body but by no means was foolproof simply durable. However if we get into the realm of Ressurection orbs the older codex talked about a group of Necron Warriors who were liquified by a leman russ's Battle Cannon (Effective auto killing them) The Necron lord using his ress orb simply held it up and from the molten steel the Warriors crawled out like lost souls slowly reforming themselves from the mystic powers of the orb which presumeably was a small sliver of the c'tan reshaping their golem-lke shells in an instant. Orks will create spores when they die if even a small piece of them exists, they do no need nutrients just like mushrooms in real-life do not, simply a semi non-hostile enviroment (i.e not constantly on fire or acid or the like) even then some orks are able to survive from the spores. Effectively this is a wash, in normal circumstances orks will start to repopulate, but so will the necron you guass technology may remove the ability of a few orks that are entirely evaporated (instant kill) but the traditional warriors guard weaponry flays the skin, then muscle, then bone of the ork the process leaves time to create spores. I would unfortunately gives orks the advantage here in a side on side conflict mostly due to 2 factors (gameplay & fluf). Orks have dealt with the cron on many ocassions and call dem the shiny boyz (referencing their metal bodies) so by no mean is it considered unheard of anymore. But along with this necrons fight a war of endless fear, domination and crippling the abilities of an army one at a time like percise machines while Orks are the not able to really give into these things while in combat. If anything the Necron would see no advantage in facing the orks unless trying to retrieve something and they would just simply retrieve it and move on!

Big mek vs. Necrons, This is accurate. The Orks are masters of technology despite the obvious crude appearance and mannerism of the race. Gubbins or specialty tools are often employed by orks to get the upper hand and a previous poster is correct. History has proven that when you confront the orks with new tech they will try their best to mimic it or reverse engineer it, Look to titans, loota boys, battle wagons and down right to the simple shoota, you have to know at one point someone attacked the orks with Bolters and thus Big meks desired to make Shootas and they wanted to dismantle them to figure out how they worked. Same with melta weaponry, jump packs, teleportation and warp travel all things the ork proves a true understanding of (For a Big Mek at least, 98% of orks ...not so much lol). With the Necron facing orks it would come to this a Big Mek really would be upset he was deprived a fight from ghostly robot cowards. he would probably design an auger/auspex and wait to hear about a new fight involving dem shiny boyz After wiping them up a bit on their planet (against assuming the necron are running patrols or the like, but war is just fine for the big mek as well) he would start to get an understanding of their phase out technology with each use of his nifty little tool. year might pass and the Big Mek completes his project with a grin marking it off of his very long list of projects. He'd try it out, it'd fail. He resume scans until he got it right and should the battle actually favor the orks invading a tomb world they would have the perfect opportunity to loot whatever and whenever they wanted.

Look necron players, I get it you want to feel like you are special and that you are too mysterious and advanced to be looted; here's the thing don't you feel like the Eldar, Tau, heck even the Imperium wanted to say no way we are way more advanced than those clods! Obviously when the idea of Orks looting things was premiered no one liked the idea.... no one wanted to see a land raider desecrated! The thing about orks is this is more or less their life, they exist to bring endless war to the galaxy and the best way to do that is match the tech of your enemies, and have overwhelming numbers and orky power. To your benefit though you get the satisfaction of knowing the orks will never understand the finer points of your tech for example a looted Monolith's power core could be turned into a boom gun pretty easy in my opinion. Just simply overcharge the power into a large point of damage getting rid of those auxiliary things like levitation and portal rifts in favor for a big boom!

personally I think the flame war needs to end here, It's never wise to tell an ork he "can't" do something because he has the uncanny ability to prove you wrong even if it involves twisting reality to do it... i mean just look at the SAG!

Anyway dats my 2 teef about dis runty arguement, I'll take just stompin ya tin heads any day o' da week! WAAAAAAAGH!

^^^^^

This sums things up pretty nicely.

-cgmckenzie

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:Alrighty Loremaster time here, First off all opponents of Necron Fluff are mistaken please reference a story inside the Last Edition Necron Fluff which dealt with an Inquistor using an Odyessus bolter round to track a Necron warrior to his tomb world and and destroy it from the inside. This statement proves that necron phase out technology is hardly flawless but extremely difficult to track this proves that it is scientifically possible for the Imperium fo Mankind to disassemble the insubstantial ghosting effects of Phase out. So to conclude this first point I would like to bring to the attention of these Necron supporters that do this Day the Imperium cannot dismantle or understand how our Ork Technology Works. What this means is orky tech is in a sense more difficult to understand or simply more advanced while being disguised as 'crude' since the Imperium doesn't understand it.

Lets move onto survival of race vs race. Both make valid points but both are VERY mistaken with how the physiology of the other works. I use to be an necron player, their bodies are modified automatons meaning the system would do the best it could to replace and repair damaged limbs from the wreckage of it's own body but by no means was foolproof simply durable. However if we get into the realm of Ressurection orbs the older codex talked about a group of Necron Warriors who were liquified by a leman russ's Battle Cannon (Effective auto killing them) The Necron lord using his ress orb simply held it up and from the molten steel the Warriors crawled out like lost souls slowly reforming themselves from the mystic powers of the orb which presumeably was a small sliver of the c'tan reshaping their golem-lke shells in an instant. Orks will create spores when they die if even a small piece of them exists, they do no need nutrients just like mushrooms in real-life do not, simply a semi non-hostile enviroment (i.e not constantly on fire or acid or the like) even then some orks are able to survive from the spores. Effectively this is a wash, in normal circumstances orks will start to repopulate, but so will the necron you guass technology may remove the ability of a few orks that are entirely evaporated (instant kill) but the traditional warriors guard weaponry flays the skin, then muscle, then bone of the ork the process leaves time to create spores. I would unfortunately gives orks the advantage here in a side on side conflict mostly due to 2 factors (gameplay & fluf). Orks have dealt with the cron on many ocassions and call dem the shiny boyz (referencing their metal bodies) so by no mean is it considered unheard of anymore. But along with this necrons fight a war of endless fear, domination and crippling the abilities of an army one at a time like percise machines while Orks are the not able to really give into these things while in combat. If anything the Necron would see no advantage in facing the orks unless trying to retrieve something and they would just simply retrieve it and move on!

Big mek vs. Necrons, This is accurate. The Orks are masters of technology despite the obvious crude appearance and mannerism of the race. Gubbins or specialty tools are often employed by orks to get the upper hand and a previous poster is correct. History has proven that when you confront the orks with new tech they will try their best to mimic it or reverse engineer it, Look to titans, loota boys, battle wagons and down right to the simple shoota, you have to know at one point someone attacked the orks with Bolters and thus Big meks desired to make Shootas and they wanted to dismantle them to figure out how they worked. Same with melta weaponry, jump packs, teleportation and warp travel all things the ork proves a true understanding of (For a Big Mek at least, 98% of orks ...not so much lol). With the Necron facing orks it would come to this a Big Mek really would be upset he was deprived a fight from ghostly robot cowards. he would probably design an auger/auspex and wait to hear about a new fight involving dem shiny boyz After wiping them up a bit on their planet (against assuming the necron are running patrols or the like, but war is just fine for the big mek as well) he would start to get an understanding of their phase out technology with each use of his nifty little tool. year might pass and the Big Mek completes his project with a grin marking it off of his very long list of projects. He'd try it out, it'd fail. He resume scans until he got it right and should the battle actually favor the orks invading a tomb world they would have the perfect opportunity to loot whatever and whenever they wanted.

Look necron players, I get it you want to feel like you are special and that you are too mysterious and advanced to be looted; here's the thing don't you feel like the Eldar, Tau, heck even the Imperium wanted to say no way we are way more advanced than those clods! Obviously when the idea of Orks looting things was premiered no one liked the idea.... no one wanted to see a land raider desecrated! The thing about orks is this is more or less their life, they exist to bring endless war to the galaxy and the best way to do that is match the tech of your enemies, and have overwhelming numbers and orky power. To your benefit though you get the satisfaction of knowing the orks will never understand the finer points of your tech for example a looted Monolith's power core could be turned into a boom gun pretty easy in my opinion. Just simply overcharge the power into a large point of damage getting rid of those auxiliary things like levitation and portal rifts in favor for a big boom!

personally I think the flame war needs to end here, It's never wise to tell an ork he "can't" do something because he has the uncanny ability to prove you wrong even if it involves twisting reality to do it... i mean just look at the SAG!

Anyway dats my 2 teef about dis runty arguement, I'll take just stompin ya tin heads any day o' da week! WAAAAAAAGH!

Dat was so proppa

Silly tin 'eads

Note that the Necron war with the Old Ones was a lost cause, even with their tech until they got help. So its not so difficult to belive that they could program orks to fight the necrons extremly well, possibly even loot it.

NL_Cirrus wrote:I'll agree to disagree on what qualifies as "looted."

I hate the new fluff as well. Egyptian robots IN SPACE is NOT what I think of as Necron.

They were ALWAYS Egyptians in space..............Their only vehicle before was a floating Pyramid.....


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Big Mek Wurrzog is the kind of ork player I want to sit down and have coffee with, while shooting people and yelling Waaagh!......

bombboy1252 wrote:

NL_Cirrus wrote:I'll agree to disagree on what qualifies as "looted."

I hate the new fluff as well. Egyptian robots IN SPACE is NOT what I think of as Necron.

They were ALWAYS Egyptians in space..............Their only vehicle before was a floating Pyramid.....


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Big Mek Wurrzog is the kind of ork player I want to sit down and have coffee with, while shooting people and yelling Waaagh!......

thanks man, this topic made my night that I could post and people.. *gasp* listened? Also on a side note Necron players have you thought about looting orks? No i don't mean our tech I mean gut us open and have flayed ones make a fashion statement :p

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:
Also on a side note Necron players have you thought about looting orks? No i don't mean our tech I mean gut us open and have flayed ones make a fashion statement :p

HERESY!! HERESY!!

-cgmckenzie

The Orks can loot anything because it's hilarious when creative players model it up and nothing about the Orks is meant to be taken seriously. I mean, really, they've only gotten sillier over the years, to where the concept of Orks has grown to some kind of absurd sentient space fungus with a Cockney accent.

And that is why I love them! In the grim darkness of the 41st millennium, there is only war. Of all the factions that wage war, the orks are the only ones that have fun while doing so!

-cgmckenzie

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:Alrighty Loremaster time here, First off all opponents of Necron Fluff are mistaken please reference a story inside the Last Edition Necron Fluff which dealt with an Inquistor using an Odyessus bolter round to track a Necron warrior to his tomb world and and destroy it from the inside. This statement proves that necron phase out technology is hardly flawless but extremely difficult to track this proves that it is scientifically possible for the Imperium fo Mankind to disassemble the insubstantial ghosting effects of Phase out. So to conclude this first point I would like to bring to the attention of these Necron supporters that do this Day the Imperium cannot dismantle or understand how our Ork Technology Works. What this means is orky tech is in a sense more difficult to understand or simply more advanced while being disguised as 'crude' since the Imperium doesn't understand it.

Possible, yes, with their current tech, no. And the Imperium can't figure out how ork tech works because it doesn't. They're Whaagh field changes physics to make them work and is therefor a psyker power and therefor can't be dismantled. All in all if the orks got near, the now extinct, Pariahs their guns would stop working due to no warp connection near Pariahs, Same if they when anywhere else in which the warp is severed from the materium.

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:Lets move onto survival of race vs race. Both make valid points but both are VERY mistaken with how the physiology of the other works. I use to be an necron player, their bodies are modified automatons meaning the system would do the best it could to replace and repair damaged limbs from the wreckage of it's own body but by no means was foolproof simply durable. However if we get into the realm of Ressurection orbs the older codex talked about a group of Necron Warriors who were liquified by a leman russ's Battle Cannon (Effective auto killing them) The Necron lord using his ress orb simply held it up and from the molten steel the Warriors crawled out like lost souls slowly reforming themselves from the mystic powers of the orb which presumeably was a small sliver of the c'tan reshaping their golem-lke shells in an instant. Orks will create spores when they die if even a small piece of them exists, they do no need nutrients just like mushrooms in real-life do not, simply a semi non-hostile enviroment (i.e not constantly on fire or acid or the like) even then some orks are able to survive from the spores. Effectively this is a wash, in normal circumstances orks will start to repopulate, but so will the necron you guass technology may remove the ability of a few orks that are entirely evaporated (instant kill) but the traditional warriors guard weaponry flays the skin, then muscle, then bone of the ork the process leaves time to create spores. I would unfortunately gives orks the advantage here in a side on side conflict mostly due to 2 factors (gameplay & fluf). Orks have dealt with the cron on many ocassions and call dem the shiny boyz (referencing their metal bodies) so by no mean is it considered unheard of anymore. But along with this necrons fight a war of endless fear, domination and crippling the abilities of an army one at a time like percise machines while Orks are the not able to really give into these things while in combat. If anything the Necron would see no advantage in facing the orks unless trying to retrieve something and they would just simply retrieve it and move on!

The "mystic powers of the orb" could also be little more than extra power.

"they do no need nutrients just like mushrooms in real-life do not, simply a semi non-hostile enviroment"
What kind of super shroom have you been growing? ALL LIVING THINGS NEED NUTRIENTS. Have you ever seen a mushroom sprout out of a rock? No? well that's because there is no nutrients in ROCKS. Same qustion for your bathtube/shower. No? Thats because there is no nutrients in your shower. How about your carpet? the road? a steel box? a volcano? a desert? No? well that's because there is no nutrients in any of those places -with the possible exceptions of the latter two that would depend on where in those regions and a lack of shroomage would probably be due more to lack of water which they also need.-
Haven't you ever taken biology?

"but the traditional warriors guard weaponry flays the skin, then muscle, then bone of the ork the process leaves time to create spores."
Exactly how fast do you think that happens? apparently not very fast. I regret to be the one that must inform you, but it happens almost instantly. haven't you ever seen the picture of the guardsman down to nothing but bones befor he could even move? Its on page 22 of the old Codex.

"But along with this necrons fight a war of endless fear, domination and crippling the abilities of an army one at a time like percise machines while Orks are the not able to really give into these things while in combat. If anything the Necron would see no advantage in facing the orks unless trying to retrieve something and they would just simply retrieve it and move on!"

Your partially right. Orks would not give in to fear,as long as they had plenty of boyz. As for being immune to being crippled, No army -including the tyranids, necrons, deamons, and orks- is immune to being crippled. Unless of course your going to tell me that their "Whaagh field" spontaneously generates ammo when their ammo stores are destroyed. Or help them with mystical artillery when their looted boom gunz are destroyed before the battle begins. Or summon a new warboss from the warp when their leader is assassinated by wraiths, or poop out more boys from the warp when their camp is sneak attacked in the dead of night by flayed ones. No army is immune to being crippled, you just need to know how and what to do.

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:Big mek vs. Necrons, This is accurate. The Orks are masters of technology despite the obvious crude appearance and mannerism of the race. Gubbins or specialty tools are often employed by orks to get the upper hand and a previous poster is correct. History has proven that when you confront the orks with new tech they will try their best to mimic it or reverse engineer it, Look to titans, loota boys, battle wagons and down right to the simple shoota, you have to know at one point someone attacked the orks with Bolters and thus Big meks desired to make Shootas and they wanted to dismantle them to figure out how they worked. Same with melta weaponry, jump packs, teleportation and warp travel all things the ork proves a true understanding of (For a Big Mek at least, 98% of orks ...not so much lol). With the Necron facing orks it would come to this a Big Mek really would be upset he was deprived a fight from ghostly robot cowards. he would probably design an auger/auspex and wait to hear about a new fight involving dem shiny boyz After wiping them up a bit on their planet (against assuming the necron are running patrols or the like, but war is just fine for the big mek as well) he would start to get an understanding of their phase out technology with each use of his nifty little tool. year might pass and the Big Mek completes his project with a grin marking it off of his very long list of projects. He'd try it out, it'd fail. He resume scans until he got it right and should the battle actually favor the orks invading a tomb world they would have the perfect opportunity to loot whatever and whenever they wanted.

Saying Orks are masters of technology is like saying the new Crypteks are master pyskers. One quote that should help clarify here is "sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" -I can't remember who- or rather in this case 'sufficiently programed magic is indistinguishable from technological prowess.' Orks are in NO WAYS the masters of technology, and their "crude appearance and mannerism" is exactly as it appears, If they were in fact masters of technology, Why would they even have the Whaagh field? And as for the "grubbins" stopping phase out, I said this before but that is like barbarians jamming satellite signals. Even if they were "masters of technology" their current tech level is too low to interfere with stuff that far more advanced. And if your implying warp powers would help them that still doesn't make any sense because you must know how some thing works before you can stop it even with pysker powers.

Big Mek Wurrzog wrote:Look necron players, I get it you want to feel like you are special and that you are too mysterious and advanced to be looted; here's the thing don't you feel like the Eldar, Tau, heck even the Imperium wanted to say no way we are way more advanced than those clods! Obviously when the idea of Orks looting things was premiered no one liked the idea.... no one wanted to see a land raider desecrated! The thing about orks is this is more or less their life, they exist to bring endless war to the galaxy and the best way to do that is match the tech of your enemies, and have overwhelming numbers and orky power. To your benefit though you get the satisfaction of knowing the orks will never understand the finer points of your tech for example a looted Monolith's power core could be turned into a boom gun pretty easy in my opinion. Just simply overcharge the power into a large point of damage getting rid of those auxiliary things like levitation and portal rifts in favor for a big boom!

Eldar I get, they are pretty advanced, But Tau and the Imperium, HA! Imperial tech is hardly that far more advanced then modern Earth with a few exceptions -such as man portable laser weapons, and plasma weapons along with ICE that run on anything-, and Tau are Sci-Fi anime in SPACE -which isn't all that uncommon- My point is we know how their stuff could work, but Necrons are so far more advanced then THAT. We can't even give proper explanations to how their stuff works.
Also AS I SAID BEFORE I know it possible to "loot" necron stuff as in just making it the base of a vehicle -EX: a tomb spyder beung used as the base of a deff copta where all they did was slap on a par of rokkits and a choppa blad and call it looted.- and AS I ALSO SAID BEFORE that is not what I consider looting. HOWEVER actually operating Necron stuff the orks will never be able to do. That would be like asking a knight of the middle ages to run a Nuclear reactor, he just doesn't know how and would probably end up causing a melt down IF the reactor was already going, if not he would be unable to do any thing.

Asherian Command wrote:Orks can loot anything. The codex even says so.

I agree. In fact, this topic seems a bit sad to me. The idea of Orks looting things is to give them a fun flavor for their armies and modeling ideas. Looting things just means that they are able to salvage something. Looting doesn't mean that it works the way it did originally. So, in my mind.....yes a monolith can be looted. However, it might not work the way it did originally. Obviously, the looted wagon rules prevent it from doing all the things a Necron 'Lith could, but for a Necron player to get mad about that is sad. Maybe the Big Mek can't get it exactly working the way it should so he mounted it on BattleWagon Treads....why not? Anyway, the whole looted thing is being taken way to literally here.....I mean people show looted Rhinos and Land Raiders all the time......I mean if this was to seriously happen there is no way the Orks would get it to run the way it did before. The don't have the "power of the machine spirit" or whatever the marines use. I don't play marines so my names may be wrong, but the idea is solid.

Think of it like a classic car.....you might be able to make it run now, but it sure isn't the way it did originally.

I think a monolith on BattleWagon Treads with a massive turret on top would be a fantastic beginning to a custom stompa.

bombboy1252 wrote:

NL_Cirrus wrote:I'll agree to disagree on what qualifies as "looted."

I hate the new fluff as well. Egyptian robots IN SPACE is NOT what I think of as Necron.

They were ALWAYS Egyptians in space..............Their only vehicle before was a floating Pyramid.....

They only had 2 things that were Egyptian like, the Pyramidal shape of the monolith and the scarab. THAT WAS IT.
Now they have stupid head dresses and are covered in Egyptian like clothes, and have Stupid Egyptian names and titles like Phaeron, and Imotekh, Like really IMOTEKH! why even put up the farce maybe they should have "Necron Overlord Tut" and just get the humiliation of the Necrons over with!



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MakersHitstheMark wrote:

Asherian Command wrote:Orks can loot anything. The codex even says so.

I agree. In fact, this topic seems a bit sad to me. The idea of Orks looting things is to give them a fun flavor for their armies and modeling ideas. Looting things just means that they are able to salvage something. Looting doesn't mean that it works the way it did originally. So, in my mind.....yes a monolith can be looted. However, it might not work the way it did originally. Obviously, the looted wagon rules prevent it from doing all the things a Necron 'Lith could, but for a Necron player to get mad about that is sad. Maybe the Big Mek can't get it exactly working the way it should so he mounted it on BattleWagon Treads....why not? Anyway, the whole looted thing is being taken way to literally here.....I mean people show looted Rhinos and Land Raiders all the time......I mean if this was to seriously happen there is no way the Orks would get it to run the way it did before. The don't have the "power of the machine spirit" or whatever the marines use. I don't play marines so my names may be wrong, but the idea is solid.

Think of it like a classic car.....you might be able to make it run now, but it sure isn't the way it did originally.

I think a monolith on BattleWagon Treads with a massive turret on top would be a fantastic beginning to a custom stompa.

By a "Necron Player" I assume your referring to me.
I never said I was against the the Monolith model being turned in to a looted wagon. In fact in my first post -Not that anyone seems to read it- I said

NL_Cirrus wrote:Wouldn't it depend on what your definition of "loot" is?

After all if you define "loot" as using as in just having a piece of what ever it is in your new construct -EX: a Space Marine strapped to the front of a battle wagon = looted SM- Sure -although in the Necron's case you'd need to get past phase out -assuming that it is in the new 'dex.-

If, however, your definition of loot is using as in how it was originally designed to work, no.
1 There are some thing that no matter how strong your mystic "We're gonna ing rape physics and logic in the ing hole" field is you still cant steal them.
2 just because some one can make a picture or model depicting this DOES NOT mean it can actually happen
3 If they really can steal anything then why isn't there any fluff in which an ork whaagh HAS a 'lith after all last codex it was the most resilient vehicle in the game.

Now, if your a "Orkses kan doz ANYTHIN' if wez BULEEV" then I ask you this, why have orks lost battles if they all always believe that they will win?

Notice the second sentence I said it WAS true. -and I'm speaking entirely fluff-wise, as modeling-wise anyone can do any thing they want.-
What you propose I'm entirely fine with -I may not let you near my monolith, but I'm fine with it- Its when people start saying that orks can basically take whatever they want from whoever they want and nothing in the universe will stop them, that's when it gets under my skin, even more so when the only support for their statement is "just 'cause they're ORKZ." Or if it is doing something that is utterly impossible, such as orks hacking into a 'lith's OS and making it work for them and a monolith won't function as it should -as in at all- with out its programing telling it what to do and how everything should be working and you can't change software with hand tools and belief. See rihnos and land raiders i can understand they not to different from what the orks already have. However landraider is to Monolith as abacus is to supercomputer.