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I'd like to see this happen as well. Infinity is growing fast, and will only get bigger. Having it's own forum would help to keep things in one place.

*Hears a whisper in the distance...*

"If you build it... they will come..."

How about a 30 day trial Lego? If the subforum isn't meeting optimal numbers then it reverts back down to skirmish?

The question is: Is there a big enough population to actually fully support a Infinity Forum?

Skimming the forum, I would say yes. Good luck, Gentlemen and Ladies!

BlueDagger wrote:*Hears a whisper in the distance...*

"If you build it... they will come..."

How about a 30 day trial Lego? If the subforum isn't meeting optimal numbers then it reverts back down to skirmish?

Adding a forum and then removing it is a risky business due to a large number of very lazy shortcuts I've made in the code over the years. There is also a moderate amount of overhead involved, and quite a few possible security issues that I'm keen to avoid. All I can recommend is keep posting about infinity in the existing forum, and once enough people are talking about it and reading about it (based on metrics I have access to), then it will get its own section.

Understood and thanks for your consideration

legoburner wrote:Adding a forum and then removing it is a risky business due to a large number of very lazy shortcuts I've made in the code over the years. There is also a moderate amount of overhead involved, and quite a few possible security issues that I'm keen to avoid. All I can recommend is keep posting about infinity in the existing forum, and once enough people are talking about it and reading about it (based on metrics I have access to), then it will get its own section.

No worries, thank you for keeping us all in the loop!

Well, that's a great shame! If Warmahordes has only just hit the required numbers (and I heard that game is approaching 50% market share in the US) then I guess we are a ways off!

TBH, Infinity threads are most of the top topics in the 'Malifaux, Infinity & other games' section anyway, so I'm sure ultimately it won't make that much difference..

We'll just have to keep working on making an active Infinity forum here on Dakka...

I am confident that we'll get there!

Hmmm, will have to make sure I check through the infinity threads each time I'm on then.

Sometimes I don't go near there for a week or two, will change my viewing habits. Would like to see this happen in the long term.

Looking at other similar biggish games (Tier 2 ?) like Flames of War in the historical section, assuming it covers the same sort of size readership here, it pootles along okay with a few extra treads a week.

It would seem like allot of hassle (as Lego alluded to) to set up a new forum for probably low traffic. There would be no benefit to extracting FoW except to have two lowish traffic areas rather than one moderately used single place.

I guess I see Infinity as probably occupying the same sort of spot?

It is not quite time yet. As mentioned in the FoW forum request area, I monitor traffic levels consistently, and warmachine only qualified for its own forum fairly recently. FoW will probably be next, but still does not have the critical mass it needs to support it. Infinity is still a ways off. We would just add a few forums for each major/minor game out there if we could, but the structure of the site means that there is quite a bit of overhead (in terms of memory and CPU time) in doing so, so we tend to to err on the side of caution and wait until things are big enough to justify the extra efforts on our part to maintain it.

I cannot hide my dissapointment with that answer.

I'm dont want to sound rude or disrespectful at all, but this means that Dakka Dakka will only support big games from big companies. I can understand the reasons and I can also understand the "we don't want ghettos" argument but... We've been living in the GW ghetto for 30 years. For many wargamers WH40k is the only game they have ever played and probably the ONLY wargame they will ever play. This is like eating the same food or listening to the same CD for life. Today for a wargamer it is difficult to step aside GW's path and try new different games. GW likes this, GW wants you to buy Space Marines and do not try any other game ever.

This is supporting a game/company that doesn't need any support at all. They are already huge. Finally, this is taking us to the same problem, that there is a giant game/company and no one even tries anything different.
If web traffic is the main reason then, why not making a "Finecast Subforum"? Boy, that will sure make people write about it. Ehm? what? that it is about awesomeness and not epic fail, ok, then I guess Infinity has much more awesomeness than Finecast.

I know nothing about hosting and admin a forum. But I know that forums and even gaming stores are born because of the enthusiasm of people. It is obvious that legoburner is not an Infinity fan and that is why we have not an INFINITY subforum. If the admin here were Bluedagger or any other user we would be writing in the subforum by now.
The thing here IMHO is that the Infinity community will get bigger and better if Dakka Dakka had an Infinity Subforum.

Dissapointed BobbaFett is dissapointed.

I suppose the key thing would be risk factor, do you risk opening up a forum that stays as it is, or would opening up a dedicated forum bring more fans of that game type driving up overal site hits.

Without knowing which way it would go I can see the reason for the doubts. Of course if a move paid off, it would be well worth it.

The question in both FoW and Infinities case, would more people come to Dakka if they had dedicated forums for their favourite or main game? Hard to tell.

Has Warmachines gone up much since it got its own forum?

I'm sorry i wasn't around to throw my name down when this thread went but i'll do it now.

While i'm disappointed with the decision i understand the reasons behind it.
Would it be possible to hear the exact specifications we have to meet before Infinity gets its own subforum?

Thanks for the reply Lego. It's entirely understandable to not want to break out the Infinity threads into a separate section just yet, especially if there are other systems that have more/more popular threads dedicated to them that are still pootling along in sub forums.

I guess it's up to us to try and raise the profile of Infinity within Dakka in a different way for now.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BobbaFett wrote:I know nothing about hosting and admin a forum. But I know that forums and even gaming stores are born because of the enthusiasm of people. It is obvious that legoburner is not an Infinity fan and that is why we have not an INFINITY subforum.

Hosting, developing and managing a forum like Dakka is a massive task; I'm certainly in awe of Lego's ability to keep it running as smoothly as it does without going mental. I have enough trouble keeping high-end, off-the-shelf web systems running as smoothly.

Suggesting that his like/dislike of a system relates to which games have their own sub-forums is funny as he's a FoW player... so if it is as you suggest, we'd have a massive FoW section on the site. We don't, so please don't be mean and accept it when he says it's currently not worth the work to try adding a new section to Dakka for the current level of traffic the Infinity threads have.

Instead, use it as incentive to try and build the existing Infinity community and support/prod any existing threads and players on Dakka. A community needs to be built by the players, not the Admins.

BobbaFett wrote:I'm dont want to sound rude or disrespectful at all, but this means that Dakka Dakka will only support big games from big companies. I can understand the reasons and I can also understand the "we don't want ghettos" argument but... We've been living in the GW ghetto for 30 years. For many wargamers WH40k is the only game they have ever played and probably the ONLY wargame they will ever play. This is like eating the same food or listening to the same CD for life. Today for a wargamer it is difficult to step aside GW's path and try new different games. GW likes this, GW wants you to buy Space Marines and do not try any other game ever.

Company size is irrelevant, we have forums for games people talk about. Adding more forums has overhead so is a measured decision with a high bar to entry. There has never been as much choice for wargamers as there is right now, and the news and rumours forum shows and breeds that very well.

FWIW, at the moment, GW have between 1-3 million people with at least a passing interest in their games. FoW is around 50-90,000 or so total. Infinity is even less than that. Numbers based on various bits of data I've gathered over the years (and excludes anything from NDAs I've had to sign). 10% of fans of a system might browse dakka, but only 1% of people might register, and only 10% of them might comment on something.

BobbaFett wrote:This is supporting a game/company that doesn't need any support at all. They are already huge. Finally, this is taking us to the same problem, that there is a giant game/company and no one even tries anything different.
If web traffic is the main reason then, why not making a "Finecast Subforum"? Boy, that will sure make people write about it. Ehm? what? that it is about awesomeness and not epic fail, ok, then I guess Infinity has much more awesomeness than Finecast.

It is not about getting in new traffic, it is about facilitating discussion of our hobbies. Regardless of any other issues, more forums = less focus and less eyeballs on interesting things from smaller companies.

BobbaFett wrote:I know nothing about hosting and admin a forum. But I know that forums and even gaming stores are born because of the enthusiasm of people. It is obvious that legoburner is not an Infinity fan and that is why we have not an INFINITY subforum. If the admin here were Bluedagger or any other user we would be writing in the subforum by now.
The thing here IMHO is that the Infinity community will get bigger and better if Dakka Dakka had an Infinity Subforum.

Dakka is the largest GW forum by post rate in the world, the largest FoW forum outside of the official FoW forums, the largest warmachine/pp forum outside of their official forum, and it will likely be the same for Infinity, using the tried and true structure we have in place to bring in more eyeballs for smaller ranges until critical mass is reached. I do own the Infinity rulebook, and it is decent, and I especially like the MicroArtsStudio terrain. My main game is FoW though, which you will also note does not have a dedicated forum or section yet.

The data on growing a community by adding new forums is still being collected as the warmachine forums were affected by too many outside events to give a fair reflection of growth. I appreciate the frustration you might feel as I would really like a dedicated FoW section so that I didnt have to use the slow, restrictive official forums as much, but it is not time yet.

I take this as a positive challenge!

Let's continue to work at growing the best "Non-Official" Infinity forum on the net.

IF we can do that, then we'll get our own Infinity section here on Dakka Dakka.

Wow informative post there Lego. Thanks.

Yeh, thanks for taking the time to write these replies, Lego. You have been very attentive with us.

Thanks a bunch Lego as a site admin myself it's nice to see the insight of someone who runs a forum 100 fold my size. My only worry is the damage we are possibly doing to the other skirmish based games since their threads quickly drop like a rock underneath the Infinity threads popping up.

But this is probably the same case with FoW

Absolutionis wrote:I support this action.

Slarg's "So what is infinity?" thread has gotten more posts in it than the entire Campaigns subforum has gotten in its lifetime.

Half of that was a flame war, it don't count

legoburner wrote:It is not quite time yet. As mentioned in the FoW forum request area, I monitor traffic levels consistently, and warmachine only qualified for its own forum fairly recently. FoW will probably be next, but still does not have the critical mass it needs to support it. Infinity is still a ways off. We would just add a few forums for each major/minor game out there if we could, but the structure of the site means that there is quite a bit of overhead (in terms of memory and CPU time) in doing so, so we tend to to err on the side of caution and wait until things are big enough to justify the extra efforts on our part to maintain it.

Fair enough, thanks for the response Legoburner!

Alpharius wrote:I take this as a positive challenge!

Let's continue to work at growing the best "Non-Official" Infinity forum on the net.

IF we can do that, then we'll get our own Infinity section here on Dakka Dakka.

Great minds... See my latest post in Malifaux, Infinity & Other Skirmish Scale Games.

Alpharius wrote:I take this as a positive challenge!

Let's continue to work at growing the best "Non-Official" Infinity forum on the net.

IF we can do that, then we'll get our own Infinity section here on Dakka Dakka.

I completely agree with this!

Thanks for the reply Lego Burner! I do kind of understand BobbaFett's comments, in that you can imagine it being some kind of 'vicious circle', where the games are small, so they don't get much coverage, and so they don't grow.

On the other hand, I'm glad we have at least the name 'Infinity' in one of the sub forums. Case in point, it is not the same for Mantic, and Mantic discussion by and large on this forum is very low. Warseer does have a Mantic-labelled sub forum, and as such the community there is thriving, with new threads and comments every day.

endtransmission wrote: I'm certainly in awe of Lego's ability to keep it running as smoothly as it does without going mental.

The dude Burns Lego's, how is he not Mental?






I joke because I love, Lego.

Definitely needs a sub-forum all to its self

Well haven't been on the forum in ages, been playing Infinity over 40K and carn't stand FOW (But thats my opinion and not put here to start any flames etc) and thought I would offer my support and it gave a reason to come back over.

Good luck, I shall watch with interest.

I would absolutely be down for an Infinity forum. The game is amazing...

Since the question has already been answered above, I'll lock this now.