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Lotet wrote:the picture of Valkia in the Army Book shows she has an extra piece of metal from her colar that covers the middle of the boob plate.

I knew there was a reason I liked her art.

Also, FFS, can we please not turn this thread into a misogynistic spank-fest? The man (woman, dog, whatever) wanted advice on making an army of girl-Warriors-of-Chaos. The OP did not ask for your opinion of such a project. If you've got nothing constructive to add, stay the heck in your cave.

And as long as the models were well represented you wouldnt be able to argue if I see the rules correctly.

Btw thanks for the heads up on the sisters of battle front. Back to the drawing board then.....

Now I have to find some other models. I'm thinking might have to be dark eldar wyches or witch elves maybe


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And electric paladin thanks for pointing that out some people seem to have forgotten that's what I asked.


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Just another thought what about the howling banshee torso and weapon with some dark eldar wych heads and either an extra weapon or shield?

KorPhaeron77 wrote:Oh and Lhunara In the Malus Darkblade series becomes a powerful Chaos Knight. She nearly brought down Naggoroth with a massive horde of Norsemen. She was again dedicated to Khorne, due to her intense hatred of Malus.

what the heck man? I only read that she died TODAY! how could you do this to me?

For a minute there I thought I was reading the 40k section...

Griffin55k wrote:And as long as the models were well represented you wouldnt be able to argue if I see the rules correctly.

Btw thanks for the heads up on the sisters of battle front. Back to the drawing board then.....

Now I have to find some other models. I'm thinking might have to be dark eldar wyches or witch elves maybe


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And electric paladin thanks for pointing that out some people seem to have forgotten that's what I asked.


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Just another thought what about the howling banshee torso and weapon with some dark eldar wych heads and either an extra weapon or shield?

The howling banshee might work, but IMO it's still pretty lightly armored in comparison to the standard WoC. Also, they are finecast and will cost A TON of money. You get 5 for 35 (obo online). If you do a 2kish list, you will need probably 30 of them if they are Warriors, and at least 60 of them if they are marauders.

Honestly, I think that your cheapest option for a decent looking one is probably the Male WoC bodies with Female heads. Most of the strictly female models I can think of are very dynamic, making them very difficult to rank up. Have you considered the Dark Elf warriors or witch elves? Again, you would mostly be looking at head swaps, and they at least have female bodies.

Ah dark elves didn't check their model range.

I'm maybe thinking of just making one unit to start with. Cost of howling banshee wouldn't be a massive problem as I would eBay most of them.

And in that case you will be finding Metal Banshees or Finecast ones with defects.

Griffin55k wrote:So your saying that women are inferior to men with regards combat?

I disagree men are stronger but women are more agile a combat between them could very much be equal especially if they are both well trained.

To me here it seems that people are quite narrow minded with regards the abilities of the sexes. And to the person who said the men would butcher a woman not true since from what I gather if someone has a patron in the pantheon of the chaos gods then.warriors would flock to fight under his or her banner

That is exactly what I am saying, and there's nothing you can present that will change that fact that it's right.

The Males will always be bigger and stronger, and chaos warriors respect strength, and strength alone.

Even today, it's not narrow minded to say that an equally skilled male and female in a fight would result with the man winning, because without things like guns, knives, tasers, and bats, the man will be stronger, and it is much easier for men to fan the flames of instinct to kill.

Stronger doesn't mean less agile, unless you're talking Arnie VS a cheetah.


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ElectricPaladin wrote:

Lotet wrote:the picture of Valkia in the Army Book shows she has an extra piece of metal from her colar that covers the middle of the boob plate.

I knew there was a reason I liked her art.

Also, FFS, can we please not turn this thread into a misogynistic spank-fest? The man (woman, dog, whatever) wanted advice on making an army of girl-Warriors-of-Chaos. The OP did not ask for your opinion of such a project. If you've got nothing constructive to add, stay the heck in your cave.

It's posted on the internet, accept the reality that people will judge and state opinions about it and there's nothing you can do to stop it.

The OP would be just as guilty of arguing why females are more agile than stronger men, which is the complete opposite of being indifferent or accepting different opinions.

Also, you do not help the situation by calling it a mysoginistic spank fest.

TL;DR children trying to lecture children on maturity.

Clearly all women around all universes are weaker than men.

Lol love the picture.

You know I was reading earlier tonight about tzeentch and it says he is also the god of conspiracy so to me it seems he would respect the workings of a intelligent schemes of a woman as much as a man and no matter what anyone says a chaos enhanced woman would bring the respect of men folk even if the Norse were as male chauvinist as some here would say.

Equally that woman would most likely encourage other women to join her in battle. So therefore a female tzeentch sorceress as Lord/general with other female heroes representing the other gods might well be possible.

But still the original pojbt still stands re. Which is the best models to represent them. I'm still pulled towards eldar howling banshee in all that I've seen.

the leader of my tzeentch force is female, the leader of my marauder unit is also female.. I wish I could find suitable enough for actual chaos warriors myself but I'm yet to find anything I really like. The closest thing I could find would have to be used as a lord choice.

I'm interested to see what you come up with though, I wish there was an actual female chaos knight or female knight unit that were viable to use in there place.

As far as fluff goes, whether your army is nurgle, khorne or slaanesh you can pretty much use whatever you feel like generally. The lord of change works with all pantheons whether they know it or not, a female unit or army of WoC would just be another curve ball that people in general like those that complained here already would GREATLY under-estimate.

Well I'm getting some banshee free I'll have a try at converting them.... Gonna have to ask for help off a mate for that. When I eventually get them done I'll post them on here for you to see Sass0mg.

cool

HoverBoy wrote:Clearly all women around all universes are weaker than men.

One in 1000 exception doesn't disprove the average majority.

Lol I love how the extremes are here. Woman ARE physically weaker than men that is a medical fact but that's in general. There are physically weak men and physically strong women. What a lot of people are mistaking here is fighting prowess with physical strength. They are not interchangeable....just because someone is physically capable of greater feats of strength does not make them a good fighter.

Besides all said and done physical strength is more based on environmental factors compared to genetically factors.
For example a man born in a Monestry who reads books and.does very little physical exercise will be weaker than a lot of women. And that woman picture is probably a lot stronger than most men.

Griffin55k wrote:Lol I love how the extremes are here. Woman ARE physically weaker than men that is a medical fact but that's in general. There are physically weak men and physically strong women. What a lot of people are mistaking here is fighting prowess with physical strength. They are not interchangeable....just because someone is physically capable of greater feats of strength does not make them a good fighter.

Besides all said and done physical strength is more based on environmental factors compared to genetically factors.
For example a man born in a Monestry who reads books and.does very little physical exercise will be weaker than a lot of women. And that woman picture is probably a lot stronger than most men.

That and..
People also seem to forget the part where this is a member of WoC in general. If any one of the chaos gods felt like it they could imbue a women with so much power that it would in general threaten the demise of many civilisations. So I don't see where these medical facts even matter, that and its WHFB, why should RL information even matter that much, its not like anyone can launch fireballs from there fingertips either so at what point should anyone try to decide what a women, a chaos women at that would and would not be capable of.

Far as I've been able to tell. The chaos gods are equal opportunity employers . And yeah. The physical disadvantages become less relevant when you factor stuff like mutation and magic into the situation.

Good luck on the project OP. But sadly I think you will have to practice your converting skills a lot more to get a tournament legal army to play with. Or get someone who can help.

All statements here about the "physical weakness" of women are falling into a relatively common - but no less excusable - logical fallacy.

The fact is not that all women are physically weaker than all men. First of all, that's an exaggeration. The "fact" runs more like this: statistically, women have less upper body strength than men.

There are three important parts of this statement that many people forget: statistically and upper body. Let's tackle the second one first.

Upper body strength refers to the skeletal muscles anchored to the arms, shoulders, and torso. It does not refer to the muscles that move your legs, or the many muscles that do many other jobs in your body, whose health and strength are also related to your combat effectiveness. In other words, women are not categorically weaker than men. Women can apply a little less force with their upper body. This doesn't mean that they can't carry just as much, for just as long (in fact, women also tend to have higher endurance and pain tolerance than men). This doesn't mean that they can't out-fight a man (they just need to train in hand-to-hand combat styles that stress lower body or core-muscle strength rather than simply punching and grappling). It just means that when it comes to heaving tree trunks out of the way or something, the average man might be better for the job.

I'd like to thank Hoverboy for his awesome picture, because that brings us to my next point: statistically.

Statistically doesn't mean "always true all the time." It means "tends to be true, on average, over a large number." It's also important to remember that statistical differences are not necessarily true across all echelons.

So, while a randomly selected woman stands a good chance of having less upper body strength than a randomly selected man, how many armies are made of randomly selected women? And if you were to test the strength of the "intentionally selected" (soldier) women vs. the strength of the "intentionally selected" (soldier) man, would the statistical difference still hold true?

Now we're getting into territory that even I don't understand. However, my instinct is to say that it won't. The physiques of female body builders imply that there is no upper limit on the muscle development women are capable of. It's just a little harder for them to get there. But they can get there if they work at it, which female soldiers certainly do.

I don't think anyone said that ALL women were weaker then men. I believe it was stated as a general fact(which means most women are weaker then most men)

When it comes to fighting with swords and other melee weapons, upper body srength is the most important area of the body.


Chaos mutations and enhancements of course make all things equal.

Grey Templar wrote:I don't think anyone said that ALL women were weaker then men. I believe it was stated as a general fact(which means most women are weaker then most men)

When it comes to fighting with swords and other melee weapons, upper body srength is the most important area of the body.


Chaos mutations and enhancements of course make all things equal.

That is true. I hope OP stays away from Chaos Ogres if he/she wants a WOC army.

Grey Templar wrote:
When it comes to fighting with swords and other melee weapons, upper body srength is the most important area of the body.

I don't think I agree with you about that. My weapons training is limited to some European-style fencing and some Aikido (which includes a few sword forms), and I recall footwork, endurance, and precision being pretty important. Of course, neither of those styles has a lot to do with rank-and-file melee - but then, I don't think we're going to find a lot of people on Dakka or anywhere in this century with that kind of training.

The real point I've yet to hear anyone respond to is this: exactly how much weaker are women supposed to be and to what degree does this supposed weakness hold true of women who are professional soldiers?

Grey Templar wrote:
Chaos mutations and enhancements of course make all things equal.

True, that.

This is where the conversation becomes kind of absurd, to me. I mean, you've got a game with giants and lizard-dudes and rat-dudes and giant bells that make you sick if you hear them ring, and we're even bothering to talk about the realism of female warriors in a fantasy setting? Give me a break. If it has four limbs and a brain, it can fight in this setting. The obsession with "upper body strength" and the fact that it's pretty much the only nod to "realism" that anyone ever even thinks about in this game really smacks of sexism to me.

Fencing is very different to fighting with real swords and shields. And martial arts are a whole different ball of wax.


I fence with both Sabre and Foil and have also had "real" sword training. The real weaponry requires alot of upper body strength(especially two handed swords)

BronzeJon wrote:

HoverBoy wrote:Clearly all women around all universes are weaker than men.

One in 1000 exception doesn't disprove the average majority.

Actually the fact is that any male that dedicates to strength training will be greatly stronger than a women who does. That said it is very easy for a women to become much stronger than an untrained male.


With a similar skill set a male fighter will always be superior to a female fighter due to greater strength and endurance. However this is a fantasy setting and such rules need not be applied. I see nothing wrong with creating a female WoC army and encourage the OP to do so despite attacks made by individuals who live in utter fear of strong women.

Concur. Women can be strong, and can be good fighters, but even if neither of those were true it's a fantasy world where evil gods give incredible physical power to devotees and worshippers, and they don't give a damn how physically strong you are to start. It might be a bit harder to gain Khorne's notice by the usual route of martial prowess, but it's certainly not impossible. And the Chaos gods select champions for a lot of other reasons than just fighting skill.

Regardless of any arguments, any of these three, trained to the level you'd expect for a Chaos Warrior, is going to rip the average Empire warrior apart.

At least 2 of those 3 are taking massive amounts of steroids.

Maybe, who knows, but then in Fantasy Steriods = Chaos Power/Boons.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Maybe, who knows, but then in Fantasy Steriods = Chaos Power/Boons.

There's no maybe about it, women do not produce enough testosterone naturally to get incredibly bulky. Hell, the top chick is close to having a build similar to the upper limit of natural male bodybuilders.

I've not looked into it enough to know to be honest, regardless, they sure as hell make a good point about viable female Chaos Warriors.

Put that top girl in Chaos Armour, and tell me you wouldn't run like hell.

Actually physical strength and sheer size do not always correlate, but I would probably run like hell simply because she looks like a dude.