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Pretty much all the 40k books are horrendous and unreadable. Everyone always cites Dan Abnett as one of the better authors, but I think he's just a prolific hack. I read all 800 pages or so of the Eisenhorn trilogy and wished I could get my time back.

The only 40k book I've read that was even passable was Flight of the Eisenstein. I guess that was an HH book.

The Fantasy books, on the other hand, are pretty good. The Gotrek and Felix series is absolutely amazing, and Palace of the Plague God wasn't half bad.

LoneLictor wrote:I'm sick and bored, so I'm gonna ask this. Anyone else read multiple books in the HH series and then decide that it wasn't worth it?

A lot of BL offerings are pretty shoddy, but what is this "it" you refer to? Your time? Meh, reading involves your mind and even with a crappy book in hand, it's a better way to spend the time than watching American Idol or whatever.

Money? If that's an issue, just pirate it.

Necroagogo wrote:The quality's certainly variable but I think, on balance, the good outweighs the bad. IMO, there's only one real howling clunker in the series (Battle for the Abysmal).

One thing I like is the constant drip-feeding of clues regarding the two missing Legions. Worth skimming each new one to try and catch 'em.

Nemesis. I had to stop reading about half way through due to how shockingly bad it was.

Thats one reason Ive always stayed away from scifi/fantasy books based on a franchise (star wars, star trek, etc) is the quality is so varied. Been reading HH series recently though and at there has been good ones. At least they are so short you dont waste a lot of time with them.

Just wait until the last Book in the HH series, where the battle between Horus and the Emperor is written by C.S. Goto...

I started reading them all in order.
I stopped after Tales of Heresy it's just that Legion left a bad taste in my mouth and I wasn't looking forward to reading Fallen Angels since I'm not a fan of DA.

Now it just seems that the books/audio books are coming out faster and faster, I just don't have the time or money to keep up.

Cerebrium wrote: Nemesis. I had to stop reading about half way through due to how shockingly bad it was.

I think I wanted Nemesis to be better than it was, as I liked the idea of the temples working together. It was one of the poorer efforts, though. Except for the Eversor - he rocked, in a bargain-basement Wolverine-type way.

LoneLictor wrote:I'm sick and bored, so I'm gonna ask this. Anyone else read multiple books in the HH series and then decide that it wasn't worth it? It's had a few good books (Horus Rising, The First Heretic, A Thousand Sons) but I got tired of wading through gak for the occasional gem of actual literature. Now I'm reading books like Fight Club and Flowers for Algernon and other gak that's, ya know, good. So yeah.

I've only had issues with two of the books: Nemesis just wasn't drawing me in so I put it aside to try again later. The other one that I had issues with was the first half of the Descent of Angels I really wasn't interested as it read more like a WFB book and had nothing to do with 40k. I've really enjoyed the series as a whole, though. I have long enjoyed the heresy timeline in the back story and have really enjoyed seeing it detailed out more fully in this series of novels.

I am a little more forgiving when reading "gaming" related fiction. I expect to get to take a fun peek at the gaming world I enjoy so much and if that happens I am a happy camper. I expect more from non-gaming related fiction though since I don't already share an "in" with the author and the background necessarily.

Skriker

Not all of the HH books are winners, that's clear. I haven't liked a lot of the short stories from the collections, but there are some good ones in there.

I'm reading Mechanicum now. I put it down the first time as I found it very boring after having just read Thousand Sons and Prospero Burns. It seems a little better now than the previous attempt, but I also just finished ADB's Soul Hunter and Blood Reaver. It falls short of these, too.

Has anyone had a xhance.to get The Primarchs yet? My friend got it before it came out but hasn't read.it yet.

Deadshot wrote:Has anyone had a xhance.to get The Primarchs yet? My friend got it before it came out but hasn't read.it yet.

In the news and rumors section, there is a Black Library thread. This book got a lot of coverage there.

Much appreciated, thank you.

LoneLictor wrote:

Cryonicleech wrote:Quickly though, am I the only one who didn't like The First Heretic? The writing was solid, but it's so lame to see Lorgar portrayed as this wishy-washy undecided prick.

I liked the First Heretic, but I can see what you're saying. I'm like that with the Night Lords series; I just gave up on the first book because Talos was horrible. ADB has an excellent writing style/prose/whatever you'd call it, but his characters are hit or miss.

You mean characters with more than one dimension who don't always know exactly what they want to do? Perish the thought!

<quotation of deleted post redacted --Janthkin>

Brother SRM wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:

Cryonicleech wrote:Quickly though, am I the only one who didn't like The First Heretic? The writing was solid, but it's so lame to see Lorgar portrayed as this wishy-washy undecided prick.

I liked the First Heretic, but I can see what you're saying. I'm like that with the Night Lords series; I just gave up on the first book because Talos was horrible. ADB has an excellent writing style/prose/whatever you'd call it, but his characters are hit or miss.

You mean characters with more than one dimension who don't always know exactly what they want to do? Perish the thought!

No, I didn't like Talos because he's a whiny Mary Sue. The weird thing is that in the book most of the other members of First Claw were really well written (Cyrion is great, man), but the main character is just awful.

My thought about the Horus Heresy books was that the Primarchs who have major 'screentime' don't seem to be great leaders to me. In fact most of them are just big d-bags. Fulgrim is pretty indecisive and weak-willed and I expected so much more of him. Lorgar was pathetic and spineless. Magnus seemed cool at first in his book but turned out to be a colossal idiot. Lion El'Jonson has no understanding of people so I can't understand how he can lead a legion properly. I can't really judge Russ though without more to go on. Most of them seem like Greek Gods with serious daddy issues. I would have preferred more time with Mortarion.

I've read them all up to Deliverance Lost and I've only thought that only Horus and Corax are any decent as the demigods they are. Horus was only cool for 2 books or so unfortunately. Still bolter porn or not ,all of the books were at least decent (they were at least entertaining) and some were real gems. I at least understand how so many legions completely turned after reading them. I'm itching to see Sanguinius and read about Guilliman in Know no Fear which I am reading currently.

I read them all. I may not like them all - but I do read them all.

KplKeegan wrote:Just wait until the last Book in the HH series, where the battle between Horus and the Emperor is written by C.S. Goto...

Ducking under a multilaser bolt, the emperor was forced to watch as his favoured son charged. Horus' power was warping the area but he couldn't bring himself to kill him. As he hurled a land raider at him, he looked on in horror as it changed into a razorback before being slammed aside. At that moment, Ollanius 'Macha' Pius walked in. Horus flayed her for a hundred pages of torture before shooting his 'brother' with a multilaser. At that moment, the emperor let out a mighty bellow as he realised - his son was lost. Summoning all his rage at the blatant abuse of canon, he cast out all thought of continuity and obliterated Horus. Collapsing on the floor, he saw a dim figure enter the room. Brother captain Mattias ward looked on and smiled, he retconned the emperor with all his power, retconning him into the golden throne until finally, he had had exhausted his power. Now the last obstacle to his rule of canon was complete. Soon, the whole galaxy would worship him as their spiritual liege...

I gave up after mechanicus.

I'd rather read twilight, tbh or watch MLP (and I'd sooner remove my eyes with a dull spoon than do either).

The setting doesn't interest me (retelling of Paradise lost - with skulls and spikes). The characters don't interest me.

The thing that I do find somewhat ironic is that, when first pointed to the HH series, I was directed by a friend of mine to read an article that GW put out in some publication (or perhaps their website somewhere, it escapes me at the moment) where they outlined jut what exactly this series of books from the 31st Milenium were about and cover.... In it they explicitly stated that this series was going to be 35 books released over a 15 year period. There was supposed to be at a minimum, one book per original legion showcasing their role, and most likely their fall from grace or not (as the case may be). It took what, 4 or 5 books to showcase the fall of the Luna Wolves? Another two to showcase the fall of the Thousand Sons (c'mon really, the Prospero Burns and Thousand Sons novels were really both about the 1k Sons, with the Wolves really just being there, even if one was written "from the wolves perspective")

I think at the rate they are going, we'll be there and beyond and still not have the Siege of Terra covered yet

I can't help but feel there was a definite plan for the series started with the first few books, then someone though 'Hang on, these are selling really well, we can drag this series on FOR EVER and make a lot more money.'
While I can't argue with that from an economics point of view, I find it insulting that some of the books are just 'filler' and serve no real purpose in the series. I'm glad that Deliverance Lost and Know No Fear have at least covered important events of the HH and are moving things on somewhat. Apparently the next novel ('The Primarchs' I think? I haven't got it yet.) is just a short story filler book.

Deadshot wrote:I think with the HH, the anticipation is greaater than the books. You start out "OMG the Horus Heresy, where 40k started!" but you read it and realise to GW it's just another book.

Which is why they should've never been written IMO. The images and scenarios you can conjour in your head of the grandeur of the siege of Terra for example will invariably be let down by whatever they write down. They're pulling back too much of the curtain for the sake of profit.

Grimtuff wrote:

Deadshot wrote:I think with the HH, the anticipation is greaater than the books. You start out "OMG the Horus Heresy, where 40k started!" but you read it and realise to GW it's just another book.

Which is why they should've never been written IMO. The images and scenarios you can conjour in your head of the grandeur of the siege of Terra for example will invariably be let down by whatever they write down. They're pulling back too much of the curtain for the sake of profit.

Exactly right. Great way to articulate it. This is why I've stayed away from the HH books. I understand they're in this to make money, and that's fine, but, I have always thought the Horus Heresy was something that should be covered only in the broadest brushstrokes, and then we should fill in the blanks with our own imaginations. You are right; they are "pulling back too much of the curtain". Part of the appeal of the 40k mythos is that it's opaque and mysterious. The HH books are just turning it into a comic book.

Cryonicleech wrote:Quickly though, am I the only one who didn't like The First Heretic? The writing was solid, but it's so lame to see Lorgar portrayed as this wishy-washy undecided prick.

That's Lorgar.

I mean, think about the character for a second. He gets chastised by his dad, and in a sullen, emo manner, wanders off to find somebody who will appreciate him. He harbors an enormous grudge against his brothers that he perceives as being favored by his father where he was spurned, especially Guilliman, whom he hates most irrationally for destroying Monarchia. Something he only did at the instruction of the Emperor, not because he wanted to. Instead of being angry at the Emperor, who ordered the destruction of the planet, instead he focuses on his brother, because he's jealous of Guilliman's accomplishments and jealous that his brother is a better general, leader, and warrior. Since Lorgar knows that he was supposed to be a great general, this weighs on him the most. But he also hates Guilliman simply for being around when he was humiliated. He hates his brother so much that he is easily tricked by the Chaos gods into worshiping pure evil, and betraying his father, brothers, and the Imperium itself.

You should be glad that A-D-B at least made Lorgar out to be somewhat sympathetic, but he's always been a sullen, whiny bitch, lol.

Read all of them up to Nemesis and it took me well over 6 months to finish that CRAP. That's the only one I've had a single issue with to date. I've got every space marine omnibus HH and space marine battle novel under my belt to the point of nemsis in the HH and man that crap was SO slow and boring =[ I'm going to go back to them one day. I just started "Architect of fate" and it's...terrible it's the worst space marine battle to date...so it's all on the novel but I'm beginning to see the writer's that are always quality hit and miss and then avoid at all costs...I'm sure I'll get flamed when I say this but *cringe* I can't stand to see Ben Counter or James Swallow on a cover anymore =[

Gharron wrote:I'm sure I'll get flamed when I say this but *cringe* I can't stand to see Ben Counter or James Swallow on a cover anymore =[

They're widely regarded as two of the worst writers BL still employs, so I think you can leave your flame retardant jacket at home.

Gharron wrote: I just started "Architect of fate" and it's...terrible it's the worst space marine battle to date...

Doesn't that one have a story featuring my beloved Relictors? How do they come across in it?

Brother SRM wrote:

Gharron wrote:I'm sure I'll get flamed when I say this but *cringe* I can't stand to see Ben Counter or James Swallow on a cover anymore =[

They're widely regarded as two of the worst writers BL still employs, so I think you can leave your flame retardant jacket at home.

Decided to look up a particular book that I found atrocious. What do you know, Ben Counter wrote the soul drinkers book.

Necroshea wrote:

Brother SRM wrote:

Gharron wrote:I'm sure I'll get flamed when I say this but *cringe* I can't stand to see Ben Counter or James Swallow on a cover anymore =[

They're widely regarded as two of the worst writers BL still employs, so I think you can leave your flame retardant jacket at home.

Decided to look up a particular book that I found atrocious. What do you know, Ben Counter wrote the soul drinkers book.

Counter wrote soul drinkers AND grey knights omnibus' and man..I loved the grey knights in it's entirety and I fell in love with the soul drinkers about halfway through the second book. I just don't like their HH work and most of the time their work is so very.very.VERY. Slow. The third book of the grey knights was literally 1/3rd ok...so I'm going to do something OHNOEZ SEERY PROT TWIST. Wait for it....wait for it...ok now things are cool again =/

I just check online for which HH books to avoid.

So far I have read HR, FG, GiF, FotE, Fulgrim (the first 5 are compulsory to understand the rest), The First Heretic, Age of Darkness, A Thousand Sons, and Know No Fear.

Most of them I thought were very good, anything involving the garro/birth of the inquisition plot-line are my favourite. False Gods and Galaxy in Flames were a bit too depressing for me and ill disagree with most and say for the most part I found a thousand sons rather dull.

My favourites are the Flight of the Eisenstein, Age of Darkness and Know no Fear in that order (although the first heretic contests 3rd place).

Necroagogo wrote:

Gharron wrote: I just started "Architect of fate" and it's...terrible it's the worst space marine battle to date...

Doesn't that one have a story featuring my beloved Relictors? How do they come across in it?

That they're one step from chaos at all times. I don't know anything about them...I just know that if the wolves or fists or...well any of the original legions went to war with them and saw how close to chaos they REALLY are...we probably would have had another soul drinkers on our hands XD I like the book...kind of...again it's slow and they make the star dragons and for the life of me I can't remember the other chapter that they're with at the start seem like space marines have no discipline and they are very....hmm I guess for lack of a better term not very macho AT ALL. They just don't feel like space marines they feel like glorified guardsmen. I dunno I like it and I don't. I'm hoping when the imperial fists ACTUALLY make it into the book it'll be good. But with 4 writers and one of them making space marines seem very...disorganized I dunno what to expect XD