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I'm sick and bored, so I'm gonna ask this. Anyone else read multiple books in the HH series and then decide that it wasn't worth it? It's had a few good books (Horus Rising, The First Heretic, A Thousand Sons) but I got tired of wading through gak for the occasional gem of actual literature. Now I'm reading books like Fight Club and Flowers for Algernon and other gak that's, ya know, good. So yeah.

Fulgrim is generally considered the best HH book.
But yeah I judge them on their individual merits. As a series it stops being good 3/4 books in.

Joey wrote:Fulgrim is generally considered the best HH book.
But yeah I judge them on their individual merits. As a series it stops being good 3/4 books in.

Oh yeah, Fulgrim was another good book in the series. But good books are still the minority.

I haven't kept up with them, I just pick out odd ones here and there by authors I like, like Aaron Dembski-Bowden and Dan Abnett. Keeping up with 20+ books sounds like it would have burnt me out on that particular timeline.

Honestly, I just cherry pick the HH novel's that seem interesting or are critically acclaimed. Then I turn to the internet to fill me in on the rest.

I used to read a lot of Star Wars EU novels and eventually came to the conclusion that it isn't worth plowing through an ocean of mediocrity to find the occasional pearl of excellence. I can only assume the same is true for Warhammer Fantasy and 40k novels (hell, most novels in general) simply because they exist not as notable works of literature, but as additional canon to be devoured by the ever ravenous fans of which a good portion (teenagers) have questionable taste.

Lexicanum and the various codices/army books supply me with the canon that I'm interested in.

Amaya wrote:I used to read a lot of Star Wars EU novels and eventually came to the conclusion that it isn't worth plowing through an ocean of mediocrity to find the occasional pearl of excellence. I can only assume the same is true for Warhammer Fantasy and 40k novels (hell, most novels in general) simply because they exist not as notable works of literature, but as additional canon to be devoured by the ever ravenous fans of which a good portion (teenagers) have questionable taste.

Lexicanum and the various codices/army books supply me with the canon that I'm interested in.

It's just a matter of finding the good writers and the series they write. Aaron Dembski-Bowden and Dan Abnett are good writers, and it's worth reading the majority of the books they put out. ADB's Night Lords series is above and beyond 40k fiction for me; it's good writing first, and a 40k book second. There are no shortage of bolter porn novels out there which are basically 400 pages of "Big man go here, big man shoot bad man and win" from some of the lesser authors, and they're fun but hollow.

I will say that 40k books as of late are very good for licensed fiction though. They're not replacing all the Frank Herbert, Heinlein, Philip K. Dick and Asimov on my shelf, but they're definitely improving and very readable.

The quality's certainly variable but I think, on balance, the good outweighs the bad. IMO, there's only one real howling clunker in the series (Battle for the Abysmal).

One thing I like is the constant drip-feeding of clues regarding the two missing Legions. Worth skimming each new one to try and catch 'em.

Amaya wrote:I used to read a lot of Star Wars EU novels and eventually came to the conclusion that it isn't worth plowing through an ocean of mediocrity to find the occasional pearl of excellence. I can only assume the same is true for Warhammer Fantasy and 40k novels (hell, most novels in general) simply because they exist not as notable works of literature, but as additional canon to be devoured by the ever ravenous fans of which a good portion (teenagers) have questionable taste.

Lexicanum and the various codices/army books supply me with the canon that I'm interested in.

well thats slightly insulting lol

im 28 and so far have liked all the HH books, i judge them on there own merit, if it gives me several hours ofmuch needed escapism then its a good book in my eyes, im not looking for "War and peace" im looking for a cheesy sci-fi novel, and thats what the HH series (and all sci-fi, apart from dune) gives you, Fulgrim was a brilliant book, horus rising was again very good, the abyss was not that good, but the World eater was truelly a cool character.. infact that is the only one that stands out as "Goto" bad

And i agree about the EU books, some are great others not so much, try reading some of the star trek ones, there trully abismal

I have two pet peeves regarding the HH novels.

The first is misspellings. It can't be that hard for an author to simply do a spell-check before submission, and ALL of them have failed on this point. Combined with horrible grammar it really leaves the impression that the Black Library does not employ editors.

The second issue I have is contradictions in the story line. You would think something as complex and important as the Heresy would be pretty well governed. However, it looks like after the first 4 books continuity was thrown out the window.

Fulgrim, First Heretic and Prospero Burns were very good reads.

Fulgrim I won't even talk about. It could be a stand alone book.if needed for a school lesson. Brothers close as can be, forged in battle and fire and then one kills the other, how awesome?

First Heretic was my first of the series. It actually goes before Great Crusade and shows you how the Heresy olall started, centuries before Horus slew Sanguinius and was pwned himself.

Prospero Burns is very good. Many people think of Russ' lads as violent brutes but according to this they are quite cultured.

I have read all the HH books though not in order of release and yes there are bad books but also great ones among them. I judge them all as individual books rather than a series following a common plot, which for me makes them more enjoyable. I love the various viewpoints that appear, giving a nice depiction of the 31st millennium.
I have begun to like the 30k world more than the 40k setting through these books, maybe because everything isn't planted completely in shades of black.
I probably won't stop reading HH at least until they cover the siege of Earth. But knowing money grabbing companies that part of the heresy will probably be stretched through five books and all of them made into limited releases with through the roof prices.

clively wrote:
The first is misspellings. It can't be that hard for an author to simply do a spell-check before submission, and ALL of them have failed on this point. Combined with horrible grammar it really leaves the impression that the Black Library does not employ editors.

This is prevalent in all BL books, not just HH ones. I'm yet to find a glaring typo in Void Stalker and Know No Fear only had one near the end, but Rynn's World was packed to the gills with spelling and grammar errors. On average I was finding one every 5-10 pages.

Any work in its first editions will have, on average, the same number of typos as the HH novels which I have read.

On the note of grammar, proper grammar, while preferred, has never been considered a key element of creative writing. In fact the abuse or misuse of grammar can often be used to convey a message in a more interesting format, or simply to convey a message.

Besides, what sounds better?
1. To go boldly...
2. To boldly go...

I have every HH Novel in first ed print and I still haven't started reading them. I will be starting as soon as the series is finished.

On the subject of misspellings:

Could it be that certain U.K words (colour, sulpher, etc) are not re-drafted when they're sent across the pond? I've never spotted anything glaring in my time (that said, I wasn't looking).

I have read up to Legion, except Fulgrim. so obviously I am slightly slowed now knowing I missed probably the best one so far. I’m glad ik now though. from what you guys have been saying I’m scared I’m going to be deeply disappointed if I go on. I'm sorta in love with the Mechanicum and the Machine god so pls don’t tell me that one sucks too :''(

Mechanicum, IIRC was written by Dan Abnett and was quite good. ... So far, I haven enjoyed the first few up to Fulgrim.. I especially loved Flight and Fulgrim, then First Heretic, Legion and Mechanicum.

As a Raven Guard fan, I wanted Deliverance Lost to be better than it was, the audio book they made for the RG was a tad better.

I'm currently reading both Prospero, and 1k Sons, and so far I've enjoyed them both pretty well.

They're mostly mediocre. I have to agree. Once they stepped off the main plot line, it got less interesting. But hey, the stuff sells, and every legion needs its time to shine I guess. Even if most of the legion spin-offs have been pretty bland. The last few have been pretty disappointing. I listened to the Deliverance Lost audio-book and don't feel like I missed much by only half-paying attention to it, lol.

Similar review of Outcast Dead. Like most of McNeill's novels, he writes interesting human characters, and wholly uninteresting Space Marines. Book had some glimpses of something interesting, but ultimately it wasn't very well conceptualized or executed. Sorta like McNeill's blundering Ultramarines series.

Know No Fear was okay, but it was just a shoot-em-up with no real plot, magically disappearing, reappearing characters, and some strange, incongruous, pace-destroying sub plot (Oll Person).


I know they're dragging this out because it's a money maker, but they need to get back on track with the plot. But they won't. The sales of the fringe books is boosted by the interest level maintained by not finishing the series.

Lightcavalier wrote:Any work in its first editions will have, on average, the same number of typos as the HH novels which I have read.

On the note of grammar, proper grammar, while preferred, has never been considered a key element of creative writing. In fact the abuse or misuse of grammar can often be used to convey a message in a more interesting format, or simply to convey a message.

Besides, what sounds better?
1. To go boldly...
2. To boldly go...

Well that certainly has its place. Know No Fear has a lot of sequences that are full of sentence fragments and streams of consciousness, but they represent how the characters feel and it works very well. Unfortunately many other novels just aren't written terribly well and have some wonky or misleading grammar as a result.

Fulgrim is the best one I've read so far.

Mechanicum was decent, except for its ending, which was just stupid - a problem it shares with most BL writing.


The rest was, mostly, drivel. I find that, actually, most of the best 40K background comes from the various RPG's FF games bring out - Dark Heresy and Rogue Trader in particular, simply because it lacks the one-upmanship and drive to.

Like the OP, I've gone back to reading good scifi (mostly classics) from other sources.
Gateway, Jem, Lord of Light, Tau Zero, Eon, and so on and so forth.

I have a bit of sympathy for the writers of BL. I mean, they're writing for a universe full of rabid fanbois, (we'll say "fairly interested readers, from this point out), so at times I understand if they're under pressure to keep things "good"

Yeah, sure, there's the one or two crapfests in the series, but for science fiction, it's pretty good. Much, much better when compared to some of the other stuff out there.


Quickly though, am I the only one who didn't like The First Heretic? The writing was solid, but it's so lame to see Lorgar portrayed as this wishy-washy undecided prick.

Cryonicleech wrote:Quickly though, am I the only one who didn't like The First Heretic? The writing was solid, but it's so lame to see Lorgar portrayed as this wishy-washy undecided prick.

I liked the First Heretic, but I can see what you're saying. I'm like that with the Night Lords series; I just gave up on the first book because Talos was horrible. ADB has an excellent writing style/prose/whatever you'd call it, but his characters are hit or miss.

I'm eight hours ahead, so tomorrow is today! Argh!

My personal favorite was Flight of the Eisenstein, but nearly all of the books had some sort of length where I stopped reading for a week or something. But after 12 books I can say I really enjoyed it so far (I read the German translation, so if you complain about typos....).

Yeah I read the first 3 or 4 but basically it's more like reading awful fanfiction than books. They are at least better than the cain series so I guess there's that.

I've bought all books in the series so far, but for some time now found it rather boring. Or at least not as exciting as when it started. Haven't even opened the last two or three ones yet.

I think with the HH, the anticipation is greaater than the books. You start out "OMG the Horus Heresy, where 40k started!" but you read it and realise to GW it's just another book.

JaqTaar wrote:I've bought all books in the series so far, but for some time now found it rather boring. Or at least not as exciting as when it started. Haven't even opened the last two or three ones yet.

Know No Fear is a good one.

LoneLictor wrote:Anyone else read multiple books in the HH series and then decide that it wasn't worth it?

Nope. I buy and enjoy every single one (without exception) as the story of the most defining feature of the 40k background slowly unfolds.



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