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Hope they hold off for a month or two, kickstarter is all good but so much good stuff is on at the moment, and my wallet needs a rest.

"KS fatigue" is a good way to describe it. And MDS has a good point that the diehard WtA fans have probably not spent much or anything on the V20 stuff so they probably aren't feeling it.


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Ravenblade666 wrote:and my wallet needs a rest.

Man you said it!

would it completely derail this thread if I ask: What's the draw of WtA vs WtF? Unlike VtM fans that flew off of the handle with VR, I hadn't noticed much werewolf rage.

Oh it's definitely there. In a big way.

robertsjf wrote:would it completely derail this thread if I ask: What's the draw of WtA vs WtF? Unlike VtM fans that flew off of the handle with VR, I hadn't noticed much werewolf rage.

Okies going to back away from the thread... +10 dice on the rage roll.. but he somehow passed.

Intersting. I liked WoD and WtA back in the day. I still have a bunch of the books somewhere.

It will be interesting to see how they update WtA as of all the WoD games it has dated the most. WtA had a distinctly early 90s take on environmentalism. It would be hard to envisage how it could be updated without removing the core of the game.

You will be able to get a .pdf explaining how to convert your books with their update.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:

robertsjf wrote:would it completely derail this thread if I ask: What's the draw of WtA vs WtF? Unlike VtM fans that flew off of the handle with VR, I hadn't noticed much werewolf rage.

Okies going to back away from the thread... +10 dice on the rage roll.. but he somehow passed.

Feel free to PM me your rant. I'd be interested in reading it. That's why I made the statement. I have since found a few threads on other forums, but nothing super passionate.

Just a note, it would seem the Werewolf 20th Anniversary edition will be on Kickstarter next week after Gen con.

What was also interesting is the confirmation that the nwod Mummy the Curse game will also be a Kickstarter after W20 finishes.

I still have every WtA book, and WtF was completely worthless, imo, so not sure if this KS is for me. I guess I ought to check it out.

We have other WtA fans here, then? =)

Aye, friend introduced me to Vampire the Masquerade in 92, and I picked up Werewolf in 94, been pretty much playing it off and on since then, my fave published setting by a mile.

I agree with WtF comments, and it still seems I have only managed to find a couple of people who where WtA fans who went on to really like WtF.
Most of the WtA folks I have spoken to despised WtF with a passion, by a large margin of people, around forty so far, which as I'm not actively looking seems to be some pretty solid numbers.

Still finding most WtF fans where either new to the game or played WoD but didn't like the WtA setting.

As to Kickstarter, will be interesting to see what the offers are, but going on previous kickstarters from White Wolf it won't be anything too special. However I'll be looking to get one of my Werewolf npc's listed as a Athro or Elder in the thank you section of the book if I can.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:What was also interesting is the confirmation that the nwod Mummy the Curse game will also be a Kickstarter after W20 finishes.

That's a little ridiculous. This is in every sense of the word a regular release. Maybe they are kickstarting a deluxe edition? That would be more reasonable.


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And yes, that turns out to be the case:

The KS for Mummy is going to be different than some we have done, as it will as usual be for a deluxe edition but this time the KS will run right before or even after the PDF and PoD versions are available.

http://whitewolfblogs.com/blog/2012/07/24/the-ww-schedule-for-aug-2012-aug-2013/

I think that timing shows WW isn't doing a "fund it or you'll be sorry" thing, which is very good. But I can see how they'd be nervous about this. No one knows if MtC will be good and it doesn't have a huge amount of good will from decades of fandom behind it. If they throw a $50,000 price tag out there for a deluxe edition of a game that people already have or simply don't want ...

Ah, fair dues, hard to tell via the email as it wasn't clarified, just noted it would be coming up next after Werewolf.

I liked the original Mummy game, and played one in a vampire game at one point.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Just a note, it would seem the Werewolf 20th Anniversary edition will be on Kickstarter next week after Gen con.

GLEE!

Yeah, I'm looking forward to this. Skipped the VTM stuff - because frankly I like large parts of VTR.... but WTF just... didn't have anything going for it really. I liked a very few concepts they had, but it just didn't gel into a game I wanted to play. I bought a fair number of the splats, but nothing came from it.

WTA on the other hand, is the first RPG I bought - and after DnD it impressed the crap out of me. Played it for years.

WtA was my first non-D&D rpg love.

Its also the first game I ever liked enough to GM.

Wait wait wait. I havent been keeping up with WW much since nWoD was released. I like the system well enough but WtA and CtD were my avsolute favorite games from them. When WtF came out I didnt check into Ct?. Is there an updated version of thoae two settings available for purchaae or something? I would google but Im at work and limited to my phone for internet...

There was a Changeling nwod game, Its called Changeling the Lost.

I believe from what I've read fans of the WoD often note that the new Changeling game, along with Hunter where two of the best updates for the nwod.

Yes, those are the ones that people generally seem to like more than the oWoD versions. But looking at the old changeling compared to the new ... it's hard to see many similarities.

My biggest concern, or whatever with the nWoD was why they felt they had to change the Vampire Clans/Werewolf Tribes. I get rebooting the franchises, but there was so much recognizability with Tremere and Gangrel and Brujah, etc.

TV shows, video games, etc all had those in them. I could never figure out why they'd make a business decision to erase all that and start over from nothing.

I have a idea on that. I always felt that the CCP buyout must have been on the cards for a while, and when you look at the changes, it seems very MMO friendly.

I maybe way off base, but much like D&D tried with 4th ed, I think White Wolf backed by the fact CCP where looking to buy/do a MMO in the future went down the path of trying to appeal to MMO players, with a similar tighter structure.

An idea I really don't get as MMO fans who aren't into tabletop RPG are probably not going to be swayed by the fact the game sorta has a similar creation style as a MMO.

Of course the changing of the story hurt the nwod, apart from a couple of nice ideas in VtR, Mage the Awakening, and obviously the two above (not counting new games like Promethian) the story was 90% poorer than the WoD. As I have noted many times the nwod felt like a diet version of the WoD, all the good flavour had been taken out.

Thus CCP when the finally got around to doing a MMO, looked at nwod, and WoD and saw plainly what many of us knew already. The WoD story was miles better than the nwod, and would make a much more interesting backdrop.

My other theory is that White Wolf wanted to stop paying Mark Rein.Hagan royalties on every book they released, so changed it for the reason.

Either way, I think it was a bad move, and didn't turn around White Wolfs falling sales, in fact I'd think it only helped speed up the damage.

Isnt the MMO using the original Vampire the Masquerade?

Yeah.

I better explain how I write about them, to me WoD - is Vampire the Masquerade, apocalypse etc.

nwod is just a fail.

I won't even acknowledge it by using owod some folks coin for the Original World of Darkness, to me it is WoD.

nwod is some train wreck that means nothing to me.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:There was a Changeling nwod game, Its called Changeling the Lost.

I believe from what I've read fans of the WoD often note that the new Changeling game, along with Hunter where two of the best updates for the nwod.

Manchu wrote:Yes, those are the ones that people generally seem to like more than the oWoD versions. But looking at the old changeling compared to the new ... it's hard to see many similarities.

TO AMAZON!

So that's a yes to a new WtA system with the original setting then? Is that what the W20 kickstarter is going to be? I absolutely loved that setting. The hopeless fight of the Werewolves against the Wyrm and all that. I like a good number of the changes that went into the base system of NWoD vs OWoD, so a merge of the two would save me a major headache...

Its basically going to be a 2nd edition/revised Werewolf edition, trying to back off the metaplot that led into the Apocalypse.

It'll have all the tribes in it, plus some extras if the V20 is anything to go by, but limited new fluff/metaplot to fill in the blanks as the WoD didn't end in 2004.

There will be new art, should be full colour and I am hoping they will do at least one or two W20 books to follow and back up the main release.

As to the Lost compatibility, sadly limited and will need a little work. There is a V20 conversion guide, giving ideas how to cross over the rules between the nwod rule set and V20, but it is not a actual convertor in itself, a literal ideas guide on what you could do to make it work.

Probably worth picking up if you like the idea of Lost and Apocalypse together though. Of course they might do a W20 conversion guide as well, no idea as yet.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Its basically going to be a 2nd edition/revised Werewolf edition, trying to back off the metaplot that led into the Apocalypse.

3rd/4th edition, actually. WtA has already been through 2 editions(1992 and 1994). 3 if you count 2000's Revised Edition.

Yeah like I said, basically rules wise its revised, which is good as 2nd had a couple of minor niggles. However fluff/plot wise its more like 2nd, where there was no real sign the end is coming.

I'm pretty sure there will be no mention of Anthelios in W20 for example.

Interesting. Its also too bad I dont know anyone playing these games anymore. LOL

Chomping at the bit, any updated news as to when W20 goes up?