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yakface wrote:
Here are the undocumented updates in the digital version of the Necron codex that to my knowledge aren't represented in the FAQ.

I will get a sticky up at some point to keep track of these things:

Pg 47 - Monolith Heavy: references Heavy type rules in the rulebook.

Pg 52 - Catacomb Command Barge: Sweep Attack special rule removed.

Pg 55 - Imotekh Staff of the Destroyer: changed last sentence to clarify that it only hits the actual number of models under the line (not every model in a unit crossed by the line).

Pg 59 - Trazyn's Surrogate Hosts rule: replace references to 'kill points' with 'victory points'.

Pg 81 - Hyperphase Sword: S of user, AP3, melee.

Pg 85 - Voltaic Staff: Haywire rule text now matches the version of Haywire in the rulebook.

Is the digital codex only available for iPADs? If so, does anyone else see a problem with this? With the understanding that the digital codex differs from both the print codex and official PDF FAQ on GW's site.

-Yad

Yad wrote:

yakface wrote:
Here are the undocumented updates in the digital version of the Necron codex that to my knowledge aren't represented in the FAQ.

I will get a sticky up at some point to keep track of these things:

Pg 47 - Monolith Heavy: references Heavy type rules in the rulebook.

Pg 52 - Catacomb Command Barge: Sweep Attack special rule removed.

Pg 55 - Imotekh Staff of the Destroyer: changed last sentence to clarify that it only hits the actual number of models under the line (not every model in a unit crossed by the line).

Pg 59 - Trazyn's Surrogate Hosts rule: replace references to 'kill points' with 'victory points'.

Pg 81 - Hyperphase Sword: S of user, AP3, melee.

Pg 85 - Voltaic Staff: Haywire rule text now matches the version of Haywire in the rulebook.

Is the digital codex only available for iPADs? If so, does anyone else see a problem with this? With the understanding that the digital codex differs from both the print codex and official PDF FAQ on GW's site.

-Yad

GW's digital dex's are a joke, cost more than physical, and require an over priced device made by slave labor. It will suck if this is the way they are going to correct rules.

yakface wrote:
Here are the undocumented updates in the digital version of the Necron codex that to my knowledge aren't represented in the FAQ.

I will get a sticky up at some point to keep track of these things:

Pg 47 - Monolith Heavy: references Heavy type rules in the rulebook.

Pg 52 - Catacomb Command Barge: Sweep Attack special rule removed.

Pg 55 - Imotekh Staff of the Destroyer: changed last sentence to clarify that it only hits the actual number of models under the line (not every model in a unit crossed by the line).

Pg 59 - Trazyn's Surrogate Hosts rule: replace references to 'kill points' with 'victory points'.

Pg 81 - Hyperphase Sword: S of user, AP3, melee.

Pg 85 - Voltaic Staff: Haywire rule text now matches the version of Haywire in the rulebook.

Hey Yakface, have they included a profile for weapons like the Aeonstave and Gauntlet of Flame? I assume (and how I use them) is to use the default Close Combat weapon stats in the BRB with their special rule but it'd be nice if they were given a specific profile or fell under an generic rule like Unusual Close Combat Weapons (like Unusual Power Weapons)

This sounds like my "Digital vs Hardback" thread is carrying a bit more weight now Also in regards to "THEY LOOK LIKE AXES ARE YOU CRAZY" I do belive the intent of the model was to look like a Kopesh (google it) seeing as the "NEW" Necrons are supposed to be space Egyptians/Tomb Kings.

google egyptian axe, second row of pics you have your axe answer and it looks nothing like a kopesh.

Dooley wrote:This sounds like my "Digital vs Hardback" thread is carrying a bit more weight now Also in regards to "THEY LOOK LIKE AXES ARE YOU CRAZY" I do belive the intent of the model was to look like a Kopesh (google it) seeing as the "NEW" Necrons are supposed to be space Egyptians/Tomb Kings.

I think it was the other way around, people saying it was clearly a sword. This kind of restriction is very counter-intuitive, especially when it's not in the FAQ. Under 5th Ed it was perfectly legal to arm your Lychguard with Hyperphase Mauls, Hyperphase Axes, Hyperphase Hammers, Hyperphase Pointy Sticks, but that is now not allowed: They have to be swords. :(

Looks as if I was misunderstood. A Kopesh is a type of Sword, it works the same way as a saber. TO ME it looks as if the Lytch Guard Hyperphase Sword was modeld after a Kopesh.. Either way back to tthe OP, they are equiped with Swords. Unless you give them other unit upgrades instead of the HPS.

Amazing how quickly everyone tries to finagle their power weapons into being axes once axes get a stat boost...

yakface wrote:
Here are the undocumented updates in the digital version of the Necron codex that to my knowledge aren't represented in the FAQ.

I will get a sticky up at some point to keep track of these things:

Pg 47 - Monolith Heavy: references Heavy type rules in the rulebook.

Pg 52 - Catacomb Command Barge: Sweep Attack special rule removed.

Pg 55 - Imotekh Staff of the Destroyer: changed last sentence to clarify that it only hits the actual number of models under the line (not every model in a unit crossed by the line).

Pg 59 - Trazyn's Surrogate Hosts rule: replace references to 'kill points' with 'victory points'.

Pg 81 - Hyperphase Sword: S of user, AP3, melee.

Pg 85 - Voltaic Staff: Haywire rule text now matches the version of Haywire in the rulebook.

Until GW updates the FAQs this is going to be a huge mess. People are going to be showing up to games with two different interpretations of certain rules, and trying to argue over which rules interpretation is legal. GW really dropped the ball on this, by updating digital versions of their codexes without at the same time, updating the FAQs for the majority of their customer base, who are not yet using digital codexes.

Seems rather simple to me.
Necron 'dex says Lychguard can be equipped with a Hyperphase Sword....

The Hyperphase Sword entry states that it is a power weapon.

Therefor no modeling it to use a power ax or stave or maul etc.

If the 'dex said they could be equipped with a power weapon without specifying what type then that would be a different story.

Voodoo_Chile wrote:

Hey Yakface, have they included a profile for weapons like the Aeonstave and Gauntlet of Flame? I assume (and how I use them) is to use the default Close Combat weapon stats in the BRB with their special rule but it'd be nice if they were given a specific profile or fell under an generic rule like Unusual Close Combat Weapons (like Unusual Power Weapons)

The Gauntlet is still exactly what it says it is. A close combat weapon that rerolls failed hits and wounds. It's not a power weapon or a force weapon so it only has SX/AP- where X=User.

The Aeonstave is the same, it's just a close combat weapon. SX/AP- where X=User.

Aftersong wrote:What came first the didgital codex or 6th edition?

If I were you I would put them with perhaps dispersion shields and swords then throw a lord in there that has a warscyth among other wargear

Orr put the lychguard all with warscyths and just keep them well hidden and dont engage them with a unit that will armor pierce them

the best place to put lych guard is on the shelf.

tgf wrote:the best place to put lych guard is on the shelf.

You're crazy. And probably thinking of praetorians. Sword and board lychguard are one of our most survivable and still one of our most melee threatening units.

Excuse me? Praetorians got far better in 6th edition, especially when coupled with a Destroyer Lord. While still not excellent, Preatorians offer quite the punch and are fully capable of laying waste to TEQs, even if they don't get the charge, and are even better and more survivable with a Destroyer Lord. Sure, they only have a 3+ save, but when you can get back up on a 4+, it doesn't really matter.

McNinja wrote:Excuse me? Praetorians got far better in 6th edition, especially when coupled with a Destroyer Lord. While still not excellent, Preatorians offer quite the punch and are fully capable of laying waste to TEQs, even if they don't get the charge, and are even better and more survivable with a Destroyer Lord. Sure, they only have a 3+ save, but when you can get back up on a 4+, it doesn't really matter.

I'm sorry, but a full squad of Init 1 dudes with no REAL invul is still not great. I do agree that they seemingly got better in 6th edition, but with the changes to jump infantry and their weapons (and the fact they're still priced the same as lychguard), they're still going to get wiped just as easily as before by any competent player.

Honestly, with their lack of an invul they should have had a 2+ armor save.

Wraiths or bust boys, lychguard are too slow and now not killy enough with the HPS nerf. In addition they are still 1 wound 45 point models with only 2 attacks.

Praetorian have the speed but die to easier than lych guard and have only one attack.

Wraith have the combination of best movement, no such thing as difficult for them, natural S6 2 wounds and great invuln save. whip coils are nice. Pair them with a d-lord and you have one of the nastier CC units in the necron army. I would not play with any of the elite CC specialists, the necron army is filled with goodness, why waste time on mediocre.

Lastly before all you guys pile on the lychguard are good give them a chance bandwagon, I would like to point out if you are hard up for a cc option outside or wraiths use the typically empty 5 lord slots in your royal court.

Lords start at 35 points each for the same stat line as a lychguard with the much more customizable wargear and can ride an armor 13 open topped ghost ark into battle (just buy one for your warriors and evict them). Allowing them protection from small arms fire till they need to charge and far more mobility. They also all have ever living which means they always get their WBB should something unfortunate like squad wipe out happen.

tgf wrote:Wraiths or bust boys, lychguard are too slow and now not killy enough with the HPS nerf. In addition they are still 1 wound 45 point models with only 2 attacks.

Praetorian have the speed but die to easier than lych guard and have only one attack.

Wraith have the combination of best movement, no such thing as difficult for them, natural S6 2 wounds and great invuln save. whip coils are nice. Pair them with a d-lord and you have one of the nastier CC units in the necron army. I would not play with any of the elite CC specialists, the necron army is filled with goodness, why waste time on mediocre.

Lastly before all you guys pile on the lychguard are good give them a chance bandwagon, I would like to point out if you are hard up for a cc option outside or wraiths use the typically empty 5 lord slots in your royal court.

Lords start at 35 points each for the same stat line as a lychguard with the much more customizable wargear and can ride an armor 13 open topped ghost ark into battle (just buy one for your warriors and evict them). Allowing them protection from small arms fire till they need to charge and far more mobility. They also all have ever living which means they always get their WBB should something unfortunate like squad wipe out happen.

Wraiths get ID'd by str 8+, even with their invul they're still susceptible to high firepower or p.fist (or equivalent). They aren't necrons so no RP rolls, they also can't get royal court members joined to them. They ARE still susceptible to difficult terrain depending on how you move but odds are if you assault through difficult or dangerous they're still going at Init 1. Yes, I love wraiths as much as the next guy but they are not the end all squad they were in fifth edition anymore.

And since when is "only 2 attacks" a bad thing with power weapons? You get the charge, that's 30 AP 3 attacks with a full squad. Sure, power weapons got a little nerf so they aren't the termy killers they were before but AP 3 is still nothing to scoff at.

Lords can only join in a ghost ark if you take a troop choice of 9 guys or less. Unless you're talking about taking a solo lord in which case he "can't" be in a ghost ark because a lord on his own (or still with the royal court) is not a valid option to board a ghost ark.

You realize though that 5 lords with similar benefits to lychguard are going to be close to double the cost of the lychguard, right? Sure they start at 35 points but if you add in the invul save then that's another, what is it 30 or 45 points? Then you have to give them a power weapon (since you're against the HPS apparently, that's 10 points for the warscythe I believe).

So, let's add this up - If the phase shifter is 45 points per model and the warscythe is 10 (my codex is not in hand at the moment), for 5 lords you're looking at....450 points. The same cost for 10 sword and board lychguard. Which also get double the attacks on the charge and can be put in a night scythe.

Kevin949 wrote:Lords can only join in a ghost ark if you take a troop choice of 9 guys or less. Unless you're talking about taking a solo lord in which case he "can't" be in a ghost ark because a lord on his own (or still with the royal court) is not a valid option to board a ghost ark.

You might want to cite some rules to back that up. It can absolutely board a ghost ark, either as a royal court, solo, or attached to a warrior squad.

Kevin949 wrote:

McNinja wrote:Excuse me? Praetorians got far better in 6th edition, especially when coupled with a Destroyer Lord. While still not excellent, Preatorians offer quite the punch and are fully capable of laying waste to TEQs, even if they don't get the charge, and are even better and more survivable with a Destroyer Lord. Sure, they only have a 3+ save, but when you can get back up on a 4+, it doesn't really matter.

I'm sorry, but a full squad of Init 1 dudes with no REAL invul is still not great. I do agree that they seemingly got better in 6th edition, but with the changes to jump infantry and their weapons (and the fact they're still priced the same as lychguard), they're still going to get wiped just as easily as before by any competent player.

Honestly, with their lack of an invul they should have had a 2+ armor save.

If anything, they should have +1 A and Lychguard should have a 2+ save. Anywallaby, if they were to be fighting TH/SS assault Terminators, they would strike at the same time (not including their S5 AP2 ranged attack). Also, I fail to see how a 4+ (with Dlord) RP roll is bad, considering that those TH/SS terminators will actually stay dead, whereas your praetorians have a 50/50 shot at coming back to life and killing more terminators, whom Praetorians wound on 2s. That's also not mentioning the Hammer of Wrath attack they get if they jump into CC.

Kevin949 wrote:

Wraiths get ID'd by str 8+, even with their invul they're still susceptible to high firepower or p.fist (or equivalent). They aren't necrons so no RP rolls, they also can't get royal court members joined to them. They ARE still susceptible to difficult terrain depending on how you move but odds are if you assault through difficult or dangerous they're still going at Init 1. Yes, I love wraiths as much as the next guy but they are not the end all squad they were in fifth edition anymore.

And since when is "only 2 attacks" a bad thing with power weapons? You get the charge, that's 30 AP 3 attacks with a full squad. Sure, power weapons got a little nerf so they aren't the termy killers they were before but AP 3 is still nothing to scoff at.

Lords can only join in a ghost ark if you take a troop choice of 9 guys or less. Unless you're talking about taking a solo lord in which case he "can't" be in a ghost ark because a lord on his own (or still with the royal court) is not a valid option to board a ghost ark.

You realize though that 5 lords with similar benefits to lychguard are going to be close to double the cost of the lychguard, right? Sure they start at 35 points but if you add in the invul save then that's another, what is it 30 or 45 points? Then you have to give them a power weapon (since you're against the HPS apparently, that's 10 points for the warscythe I believe).

So, let's add this up - If the phase shifter is 45 points per model and the warscythe is 10 (my codex is not in hand at the moment), for 5 lords you're looking at....450 points. The same cost for 10 sword and board lychguard. Which also get double the attacks on the charge and can be put in a night scythe.

I acknowledge that wraith are not necrons and propose to you it doesn't mater, all it means you d-lord that hangs with them doesn't need a res orb and can use his full movement. In the long haul, 6 wraiths with 12 wounds and no RP, will live the same amount of time 6 lychguard with 6 wounds and RP when facing the same S8 AP3 weapons all day long because of the simple math of their save being better even though they get ID. Go ahead and run the numbers on krak missiles vs both squads. Assuming pure averages it takes 18 missiles per squad assuming success come before failures for both squads. If you roll failures first wraith take 15 missiles to kill and lychguard take 12. Obviously averages don't always reflect real life but you can judge a unit unbiased by the numbers.

The reality of the numbers is T5 4++ W1 RP and T4 3++ W2 have the exact same survivability vs. AP3 S8 or better weapons. Against all other AP and S weapons wraith have better survivability because of the number of wounds. The Lychguard are tougher argument does not hold up to the plain old math of the situation.

As someone else pointed out you don't know the rules for ghost arks, I will let you read up on them.

Why in the world would you put phase shifters on one wound lords. You take a few warsythes, and mind shackle scarabs, a single res orb and not other wargear (they are lych guard the way they should have been. They don't need the i save because they ride in the ark and you can arrange the charge out of the glorious open topped armor 13 transport with MSS to nullify any power weapons in the target squad.

The Royal Court of Asswhoop can actually deal with dreadnaughts and MC's far easier than lych guard actually sword board lych guard all die to a dread without a peep.


Pop quiz
Given a single 1 wound model with T5 and a 4++ save or a 2 wound model with T4 and a 3++ save taking a S8 AP2 fist hit, who lives more often? Hint, the number of wounds and T value don't mean anything.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

McNinja wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

McNinja wrote:Excuse me? Praetorians got far better in 6th edition, especially when coupled with a Destroyer Lord. While still not excellent, Preatorians offer quite the punch and are fully capable of laying waste to TEQs, even if they don't get the charge, and are even better and more survivable with a Destroyer Lord. Sure, they only have a 3+ save, but when you can get back up on a 4+, it doesn't really matter.

I'm sorry, but a full squad of Init 1 dudes with no REAL invul is still not great. I do agree that they seemingly got better in 6th edition, but with the changes to jump infantry and their weapons (and the fact they're still priced the same as lychguard), they're still going to get wiped just as easily as before by any competent player.

Honestly, with their lack of an invul they should have had a 2+ armor save.

If anything, they should have +1 A and Lychguard should have a 2+ save. Anywallaby, if they were to be fighting TH/SS assault Terminators, they would strike at the same time (not including their S5 AP2 ranged attack). Also, I fail to see how a 4+ (with Dlord) RP roll is bad, considering that those TH/SS terminators will actually stay dead, whereas your praetorians have a 50/50 shot at coming back to life and killing more terminators, whom Praetorians wound on 2s. That's also not mentioning the Hammer of Wrath attack they get if they jump into CC.

Hammer this fight out at same points value both sides and the TH terminators wipe the Praetorian in 2 rounds or less 4+ RP or no.

Maelstrom808 wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:Lords can only join in a ghost ark if you take a troop choice of 9 guys or less. Unless you're talking about taking a solo lord in which case he "can't" be in a ghost ark because a lord on his own (or still with the royal court) is not a valid option to board a ghost ark.

You might want to cite some rules to back that up. It can absolutely board a ghost ark, either as a royal court, solo, or attached to a warrior squad.

Ya, I'll admit I was wrong on that. I thought the wording for them was warriors only or IC's and attached lords/crypteks. I never use ghost arks as I think they're mostly garbage so I really have never needed to reference the rule during gameplay. My mistake.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

McNinja wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:

McNinja wrote:Excuse me? Praetorians got far better in 6th edition, especially when coupled with a Destroyer Lord. While still not excellent, Preatorians offer quite the punch and are fully capable of laying waste to TEQs, even if they don't get the charge, and are even better and more survivable with a Destroyer Lord. Sure, they only have a 3+ save, but when you can get back up on a 4+, it doesn't really matter.

I'm sorry, but a full squad of Init 1 dudes with no REAL invul is still not great. I do agree that they seemingly got better in 6th edition, but with the changes to jump infantry and their weapons (and the fact they're still priced the same as lychguard), they're still going to get wiped just as easily as before by any competent player.

Honestly, with their lack of an invul they should have had a 2+ armor save.

If anything, they should have +1 A and Lychguard should have a 2+ save. Anywallaby, if they were to be fighting TH/SS assault Terminators, they would strike at the same time (not including their S5 AP2 ranged attack). Also, I fail to see how a 4+ (with Dlord) RP roll is bad, considering that those TH/SS terminators will actually stay dead, whereas your praetorians have a 50/50 shot at coming back to life and killing more terminators, whom Praetorians wound on 2s. That's also not mentioning the Hammer of Wrath attack they get if they jump into CC.

I'm not saying their 4+ RP is bad, but it's not as good as the termy 3++. The shooting attack does even things out a bit (and to a lesser extent the hammer of wrath attack), but they still get a really good save against both of those attacks so you'll be pretty lucky if you take out more than 2 guys combined (bad rolls are known to happen on both sides). So basically, the fact the termy's get a better save in CC and more base attacks than praetorians and the fact that the 4+ RP hinges on the praetorians surviving the termy's attacks (20 rolls to hit with a 50/50 hit chance and wounding on a 2+ is pretty much all dead praetorians, even if you take out a few termy's they still have good odds of dropping the squad by quite a few members and then round 2 will be even worse for the praets).

Praetorians against non-cc units or units with a CC specialized sergeant (or equiv) will do pretty well however.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tgf wrote:I acknowledge that wraith are not necrons and propose to you it doesn't mater, all it means you d-lord that hangs with them doesn't need a res orb and can use his full movement. In the long haul, 6 wraiths with 12 wounds and no RP, will live the same amount of time 6 lychguard with 6 wounds and RP when facing the same S8 AP3 weapons all day long because of the simple math of their save being better even though they get ID. Go ahead and run the numbers on krak missiles vs both squads. Assuming pure averages it takes 18 missiles per squad assuming success come before failures for both squads. If you roll failures first wraith take 15 missiles to kill and lychguard take 12. Obviously averages don't always reflect real life but you can judge a unit unbiased by the numbers.

The reality of the numbers is T5 4++ W1 RP and T4 3++ W2 have the exact same survivability vs. AP3 S8 or better weapons. Against all other AP and S weapons wraith have better survivability because of the number of wounds. The Lychguard are tougher argument does not hold up to the plain old math of the situation.

As someone else pointed out you don't know the rules for ghost arks, I will let you read up on them.

Why in the world would you put phase shifters on one wound lords. You take a few warsythes, and mind shackle scarabs, a single res orb and not other wargear (they are lych guard the way they should have been. They don't need the i save because they ride in the ark and you can arrange the charge out of the glorious open topped armor 13 transport with MSS to nullify any power weapons in the target squad.

The Royal Court of Asswhoop can actually deal with dreadnaughts and MC's far easier than lych guard actually sword board lych guard all die to a dread without a peep.


Pop quiz
Given a single 1 wound model with T5 and a 4++ save or a 2 wound model with T4 and a 3++ save taking a S8 AP2 fist hit, who lives more often? Hint, the number of wounds and T value don't mean anything.

I'll start with your pop quiz...you're not factoring in the 5+ (or 4+) RP roll for the lychguard, so they will potentially live longer.

So, I'm not talking about shooting attacks at all. They're a completely different animal from close combat as typically you'll only be receiving a small amount of high strength firepower upon a single squad. Either due to your opponent not having that many str8+ weapons, or maybe LOS issues, or perhaps they just don't want to focus everything on one squad because of other threats. However, with CC you're looking at potentially 30-40 str 8+ attacks that typically break through your armor forcing you to rely on invul saves. Which yes, the wraiths have a good invul (as do termy's). Sure, they're 2 wounds but as you said it doesn't matter. So, they're effectively 1 wound now with a better invul but no extra get-up roll. Also, their return fire on their CC weapons is worse, in general, than lychguard. Keep in mind, I AM NOT SAYING THEY ARE BAD. I love wraiths. But they fill a completely different niche in the army from lychguard.

I'll put it into perspective here...I've never had my lychguard wiped out. I've had my wraiths dropped twice at least since the new dex. I play pretty aggressively with both squads as well. I'm not a bad player either, at least I don't think so and I'm sure my opponents would agree.

As for your dreadnought comment...that is why you put a lord with a warscythe and an orb in the squad with the lychguard. Also, there are MANY other options to deal with dreads now. Like, EVERYTHING WITH GAUSS WEAPONS since you just glance the hell out of them and drop their hull points to 0 in like one mass volley of warrior fire. Vehicles are a joke to necrons now.

As for the phase shifters on lords...who said you should? I was putting lords on equal footing (in stats) with lychguard, or as close possible anyway.

you need to reread my post, the math accounts for RP, wraith are more surviable or as survable in every possible scenario.

tgf wrote:you need to reread my post, the math accounts for RP, wraith are more survivable or as survivable in every possible scenario.

No, I read your post. I don't argue theory, I state practice and experience.

The only real problem with preatorians is that they are now Int 1, so they swing at the same time as hammers and fists. But without the extra attacks. They should have higher weapons skill if they are going to have such few attacks. Lychgaurd are great against anything without 2+ armor, hordes especially

Kevin949 wrote: No, I read your post. I don't argue theory, I state practice and experience.

So... you state your opinion?

I'm all for using whatever you want, I use dem big choppaz because they look like proppa gitcrushaz. But if I argued that my preference meant something against the statistically better pk nob I'd expect someone to come correct me asap, because I'd be wrong to think opinion meant anything in the face of facts.

So use what you want, it's a game of dice, in the end grots is 'gonna kill demon princes and vindicares are going to miss potshots. You don't need to prove they're statistically better to use them.


EDIT(on topic): Is it worth it to notice that maybe, just maybe, the digital version selected something to show for the weapon? I mean, this is definitely something that should be FAQ'd for serious play, But I've given my Lychguard spears, and the groups I play with haven't had any issues. Mostly because It's pretty clear in the rules: Hyper phase swords are power weapons, not power swords. That means they CAN be power swords, but they can also be anything else offered. Just because the digital codex offers a basic choice doesn't mean it's the only choice (which makes sense, as we're getting into what I'd think of as advanced army building and converting).

You want Lych Guard with War Scythes. Attach a lord and/or overlord with 2+ armor to take some hits.
Warscythe is hands down the best melee weapon in the game.

-Matt

Viti wrote: Hyper phase swords are power weapons, not power swords. That means they CAN be power swords, but they can also be anything else offered. Just because the digital codex offers a basic choice doesn't mean it's the only choice (which makes sense, as we're getting into what I'd think of as advanced army building and converting).

Wrong... Power weapons don't allow you to convert whatever you want... they simply tell you what GW will probably make them when they get around to re-doing all the codexes. You are supposed to play them based upon what they look like, not freedom to give them whatever you wish. And since they have redone the necron codex, they have clarified they *ARE* power swords. You may not choose anything else... any conversions you do can be pretty but cannot be played as anything but User STR AP3.

They are power swords. You cannot play them as anything else. If the stock model has a default set of weapons... like Harlequins... Modifying the weapons to gain other weapons is modeling for advantage.

You are as wrong about this as you are about Burnalances.

Viti wrote:

Kevin949 wrote: No, I read your post. I don't argue theory, I state practice and experience.

So... you state your opinion?

I'm all for using whatever you want, I use dem big choppaz because they look like proppa gitcrushaz. But if I argued that my preference meant something against the statistically better pk nob I'd expect someone to come correct me asap, because I'd be wrong to think opinion meant anything in the face of facts.

So use what you want, it's a game of dice, in the end grots is 'gonna kill demon princes and vindicares are going to miss potshots. You don't need to prove they're statistically better to use them.

opinion =\= experience.

Denial of reality does not make it any less true.