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I haven't had much luck in running them myself. It ends up being to many points wrapped up in whats essentially one shot. I'll admit a lot of that just comes down to luck on the dice.

That being said, if you want to run them, tactics wise I see running it two ways.

If the enemy brought armor. Sit back, preferably behind cover and shoot and hopefully profit.

If there is no armor or you killed it all already. Force it down your enemy's throat, hopefully getting them to target it instead of stuff that can do more damage.

The Vanquisher is truly a situational gun in usefulness that can be matched in power by cheaper units. It's only distinguishing feature is its long range.

 Testify wrote:

What sort of list would you have that would you would to be spending those sorts of points on it?

Used it in concert with a STR7 Gun-blob with Rune Priest. Casting Prescience on them and on a Pasquisher worked nicely. Sure, there probably were better things; but I won my Tourney games, and it still got kills. Even ID'd Sicarius (Because I felt hitting him with a Tank-Penetrating Round was hilarious.)

Pasquisher with LC and Camo nets clocks in at 230 points. Sure, that's a lot, but frankly, I had the space and the points to spare, so I figured I'd run the Vanq for the sake of running an under-appreciated tank.

Like I've said, and still say; no, it's not a great tank. No one can say it is, but it is viable if you want it to be, and if you want to put points into it.

Plus, it got seriously underestimated, which is nice. Didn't take a lot of shots, and the camo nets saved 'em.

Seriously; it's not like if you field it, it won't do ANYTHING

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 pie zuri wrote:


The Vanquisher is truly a situational gun in usefulness that can be matched in power by cheaper units. It's only distinguishing feature is its long range.

And it's one of a handful of AV14 tanks in the game.

I found that the forgeworld armoured battlegroup vanquishers can be alright.
Command or commissar vanquisher (bs4), with coaxial stubber (twin link cannon), with 1 reroll per game (whatever that ace skill is called.)
Theyre better, cheaper pask vanquishers, and they give a ld10 bubble or ignore shaken bubble, so they do alright sitting at the back plunking away at things.
But still, if you have no juicy targets, theyre a one trick pony.

The vanilla IG vanquishers? Those are garbage.

What, besides AV14 and AP2, does a Vanquisher do that a Manticore doesn't? The potential for 3 S10 pie plates at the same range and a lower price seems far better and for less points.

 Canadian 5th wrote:
What, besides AV14 and AP2, does a Vanquisher do that a Manticore doesn't? The potential for 3 S10 pie plates at the same range and a lower price seems far better and for less points.

Fallacy alert.

That's like saying

"What, besides access to combi-weapons all around, special ammunition, and double heavy weapons does a Sternguard Squad do that a Tactical squad doesn't? Clearly Tac squads are better."

I don't disagree, but that logic is suuuuuper warped.

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Canadian 5th wrote:
What, besides AV14 and AP2, does a Vanquisher do that a Manticore doesn't? The potential for 3 S10 pie plates at the same range and a lower price seems far better and for less points.

Fallacy alert.

That's like saying

"What, besides access to combi-weapons all around, special ammunition, and double heavy weapons does a Sternguard Squad do that a Tactical squad doesn't? Clearly Tac squads are better."

I don't disagree, but that logic is suuuuuper warped.

The job is killing vheicles at range and surviving counter fire. The large blasts are better at getting hits and being outside of LOS is better for surviving, or, if you want you can make it even better with dirrect fire.

 Canadian 5th wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Canadian 5th wrote:
What, besides AV14 and AP2, does a Vanquisher do that a Manticore doesn't? The potential for 3 S10 pie plates at the same range and a lower price seems far better and for less points.

Fallacy alert.

That's like saying

"What, besides access to combi-weapons all around, special ammunition, and double heavy weapons does a Sternguard Squad do that a Tactical squad doesn't? Clearly Tac squads are better."

I don't disagree, but that logic is suuuuuper warped.

The job is killing vheicles at range and surviving counter fire. The large blasts are better at getting hits and being outside of LOS is better for surviving, or, if you want you can make it even better with dirrect fire.

Never said I disagree'd with you chief; just said that you can't discount two major facets of something and then argue against it. The AV and AP are all valid strengths of the Vanquisher that can't be directly ignored.

 Canadian 5th wrote:
What, besides AV14 and AP2, does a Vanquisher do that a Manticore doesn't? The potential for 3 S10 pie plates at the same range and a lower price seems far better and for less points.

It's also more accurate against most things.
But yeah, the Vanquisher is useless.

 TheCaptain wrote:
Never said I disagree'd with you chief; just said that you can't discount two major facets of something and then argue against it. The AV and AP are all valid strengths of the Vanquisher that can't be directly ignored.

True enough.

-----

Basically with the Vaquisher you're paying extra points for armor you don't want to be using and for a gun that has no purpose against certain armies. The Manticore is more accurate, can potentially cause 3 S10 hits in a single round, can hide out of LOS, can snipe characters out of squads. The only things it lacks is the ability to move and fire, AV14, and AP2.

As everyone has mentioned, you don't see these alot because people like to take effective units. Personally, I like to change things up and have variety rather then the same unit 4+ times. It makes modelling soo much more fun!




Here is my Vanquisher 'Kronos' I'm going to probably give him plasma sponsons.

The Vanquisher is all about the rule of cool. It fails with style!

hehe, plus its great when it does kill something, and your opponent starts freaking out and throwing shots at it

I think the situation where a Vanquisher with Pask would be most effective would be against Necrons.
All Necron ground vehicles are at least AV13, but as soon as they take a penetrating hit they drop to AV11.
That Necron vehicle is now AV 11 open-topped with 1-2 hull points left, IF it survives the 2 AP2 shots. The tank can now be picked apart by the many autocannons and missile launchers an IG army can field.
Necrons are extremely effective if they are within 24", so the best way to avoid damage would be to stay outside of that range, which is just what the Paskquisher can.
I know this is an extremely niche role, but I actually had a game where I really wished that I had a Vanquisher with me.

Just to get the record straight. Its 2d6 armour penetration, right?

Meaning with Pask you get 2d6 + 9 AP -> you need to roll 5 on 2d6 to glance AV 14. 6 to penetrate. That is (5/6 = 83%) to glance and (26/36 = 72%) to penetrate.

At BS 4 hitting 2/3 you get (2/3) * (26/36) = 48% chance to get a penetrating hit on AV 14.

Am I missing something?


Reference: http://www.thedarkfortress.co.uk/tech_reports/2_dice_rolls.htm

zoat wrote:

Am I missing something?

The fact that it costs >200 points?

Recommending Pask/Vanquisher is bordering on trolling

Ah, I didn't mean to say it is great.... I was just confused by the numbers posted earlier in this thread and wanted to verify I read the rules right.

It looks cool as the leader of an armoured company in apocalypse games, that's about all it's good for

Vanqs looks awesome but thats about it, standard Russ' are better HS options IMO and can do what the vanq can (less ably), while the vanq sucks at taking out anything other than vehicles. My personal choice is to whack a Devil Dog into the tank company with hull multi melta. Not too expensive points wise and moves quickly between cover. Basically send that on a suicide mission any time an enemy fields something like a land raider and watch both tanks go boom. Cheaper than a vanq, doesn't use a HS slot, and much more fun

 Bonde wrote:
I think the situation where a Vanquisher with Pask would be most effective would be against Necrons.
All Necron ground vehicles are at least AV13, but as soon as they take a penetrating hit they drop to AV11.
That Necron vehicle is now AV 11 open-topped with 1-2 hull points left, IF it survives the 2 AP2 shots. The tank can now be picked apart by the many autocannons and missile launchers an IG army can field.
Necrons are extremely effective if they are within 24", so the best way to avoid damage would be to stay outside of that range, which is just what the Paskquisher can.
I know this is an extremely niche role, but I actually had a game where I really wished that I had a Vanquisher with me.

Only problem is 200pts can get you a TON of lascannons, that will perform that job and many others, as well as provide volume of fire, which I've found is far more important than a single, quality shot. When I kill things, it's because I pointed 9 lascannons at them, not a single vanquisher cannon.

That said, if you're running a vanquisher, it's pask, or nothing. Or if you're running armored battlegroup, a commander/commissar tank with the reroll ability would make a handy one that is not only cheaper, but more flexible. Those would probably be a lot more worth it to run in standard games.

while I am a big fan of the vanquisher, I can honestly say that I do not use it outside of apocalypse games now.

the original Vanquisher from IA was 175 points, gave you a 96" range a coaxial stubber or storm bolter and the option to switch between AT and standard Battle cannon rounds. And It Worked!

the Vanquisher's main problem is that its a single shot, which means that BS3 is a serious handicap, once you hit, your pretty likely to do dammage, however you need to hit first. while one answer is to give it Pask for BS4, honestly If I could give it anything It would be a coaxial weapon for re-rolls... unfortunately the Codex didnt get that from IA. Thus my awesome looking tank is relegated to the monthly game of Apocalypse where It can be as awesome as it should be :(

not worth it, if it was like the old forgeworld one where you could choose solid shot or blast I'd pay a couple more points for it, but as is sure if you hit you likely will pen, 2d6 and it's ord. (if I remember) But the AP 2 kills it.

Without pask, in a 6 turn game
you hit 3 times
We'll say you pen them all
we'll be nice and say they only make 1 cover save
You kill about 2/3 of a tank and get 1 other result
If it gets to shoot the entire game.

With pask you get 4 pens. they make 1-2 cover saves, So now your at/or almost at 1 dead tank, and thats still IF it gets to shoot for 6 entire turns.

And if you don't have any worth while targets lets say they are a foot based army or didn't bring anything more dangerous than rhinos, your stats don't get any better. I prefer a demolisher with deviation in 6th now you almost always hit sometimes you get 2 hits if they are stuck together, it will pen or glance armor 14 3/4 of the time, and it can lay the hurt of some Termies. and thats a stock vairent, sure it has a shorter range but 24" is a pretty good junk of the battlefield as you can move and shoot

 Amaya wrote:
Statistics don't justify it.

Even with Pask you're only hitting 66.7% of the time. That's a lot of misses.
Add the Lascannon on and most of the time you'll be scoring at least 1 hit, but you're paying 220 for that.

Is it really s8+2d6? I thought it was s8 + roll 2d6 and pick the highest. It can reliably knock 2 HPs off of AV10-12, but it's not a true tank hunter.

Honestly, for hunting AV12 and lower Hydra Flak Tanks are better. You can take 3 of them for the price of one Pask'squisher'.

That's 12 twin linked s7 shots, 9 hits, 1.5 pens against AV12. And they are better against flyers, monstrous creatures, and squadrons.

I don't see why people would take anything other than Hydras or Medusas. Greco-Roman Mythology > Space Wolves.

Hydras don't have the intercept rule, so they would have to snapfire anything that isn't a flyer. So Hydra's aren't as affective.

But an exterminator would be for popping transports.

I like the vanquisher, but that was before 6th edition. I thought it was great at being a tank sniper. Throw a lascannon on the front and have it pop stuff every turn. Granted I don't play gaurd, so I would have to have a few games in with each leman russ varient against multiple armies to see which ones really perform the best. That is the only true way to know which ones works best for you. Try them all out and play the ones that work.

I use a paskuisher for gun line guard armies when I don't have chimeras or vendettas to get melta vets in range. He can reach out and touch any armor value at any distance. Stunning that terminator filled land raider (no one takes extra armor) can be just as good as destroying it.