Books that IYO suck too much...

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**Coolyo294**

I really can't stand many of the Space Marine Battle novels, most significantly Fall of Damnos and The Siege of Castellax.

**Supertony51**

Coolyo294 wrote:
I really can't stand many of the Space Marine Battle novels, most significantly Fall of Damnos and The Siege of Castellax.

Wow im suprised by your second choice, I really enjoyed that book.

Gave you a true sense of just how evil the CSM are.

**Coolyo294**

Supertony51 wrote:
Coolyo294 wrote:
I really can't stand many of the Space Marine Battle novels, most significantly Fall of Damnos and The Siege of Castellax.

Wow im suprised by your second choice, I really enjoyed that book.

Gave you a true sense of just how evil the CSM are.

I feel like it made the Iron Warriors too cartoonishly evil. Warsmith Honsou felt far more evil than any of the Iron Warriors in the book and he didn't need to pointlessly murder a slave every five seconds to do so.

**TheDraconicLord**

I guess I must be the only fan of the Space Marines Battle Novels.

I have the entire collection so far and yes, my two "sucky books" are the Siege of Castelax and The Purging of Kallidus.

The first because the Iron Warriors were complete idiots. I'm a fanboy of the IoM, I admit, a complete fanboy, but when I read CSM stuff, I want villains, not... cartoonish villains like Coolyo294 said.

TPOK because... I don't remember any of it. I was browsing the books at my FLGS and discovered this book I had no memory of reading, something that surprised me because I was sure I had all the books released so far. When I don't even remember owning a book, that's bad... really bad

Edit: I discovered I did read it later on, when I found out it was the one with the funny banter between Ghazghkull and the Bad Moons clan warboss

only good part of that book.

**bogalubov**

I've tried to be selective about what I read so I haven't read too many clunkers.

Salamander was atrocious. Only book I could not bear myself to finish. And it was my only reading material on a 10 hour flight, I still could not bring myself to continue reading.

A book that I finished because I was hoping it would get better was Angel of Fire. The worst possible retelling of the Macharian Crusade. I'm going to pretend that book never happened and will steer clear of the follow ups. William King is just awful.

**tommse**

Purge of Kadillus was pretty boring. The only actor with some kind of character had a rather short show up and the story itself was boring as hell. Thank god the authors next DA book was good.

**DeffDred**

For me the Soul Drinkers books are complete garbage. Eye of Terror is painful too.

**Blakman**

Void__Dragon wrote:
Just Dave wrote:
FWIW, it was noted at at least one point during the novel that the Word Bearers were using pretty weak tactics; because they were too eager to engage and rip apart the Ultramarines in hand-to-hand etc. (think zealousness and fervour). I recall the narration describing how the Word Bearers appeared to eschew ranged weaponry and conventional tactics and this cost them, particularly as the Ultras are the opposite.

Edit: I think this idea may also be because of the Ultramarines viewpoint? It was pretty clear that the Word Bearers were kicking ass all over the planet and the Ultras were suffering heavy losses; it just may have been less overt (although it wasn't really a problem for me) because of the Ventanus-perspective.

What is happening across the planet, aka, that we do not see, means exactly nothing to me. What is written is all that matters.

As written, Ultramarines can take bolter shots to the face (This is actually accurate to the fluff), but Word Bearers do not have the same protection on their friggin' chest plate lol.

Also, this is the same book where we see a Daemon Prince throw a 316 ton Shadowsword with enough force to destroy it, then with a push it destroys the fortified walls of a bunker. Then Ventanus jumps on its head and stabs it. One dead Daemon Prince.

Aye the death of the daemon prince pissed me off immensly, as did the faulty chest plate issue. I did however like the scene where the WB terminator is blasted to bits by an autocannon. Tabletopwise thats not very likely to happen, but I do like that the AC is shown as an extremely destructive weapon, meant for taking out armour.

That being said, I still like this book a lot better than Battle for the Abyss.

Oh another one that sucked more than being a double armamputee with an itchy ass must be Descent of Angels. Total snoozefest that one.

**Skylifter**

'Battle for the Abyss' was one of the worst novels I've ever read in my whole life. 'The Hunt for Voldorius' was only marginally better.

Everything else, even those novels I didn't like too much, doesn't come close to these in crappyness.

**Jimsolo**

Someone bought me the Soul Drinkers omnibus as a gift, but I never managed to finish the first novel.

I also couldn't finish Mechanicum.

That being said, I can't say whether or not they SUCKED, since I never finished them. They might have gotten better, I just couldn't finish.

**Kain**

Blakman wrote:
Void__Dragon wrote:
Just Dave wrote:
FWIW, it was noted at at least one point during the novel that the Word Bearers were using pretty weak tactics; because they were too eager to engage and rip apart the Ultramarines in hand-to-hand etc. (think zealousness and fervour). I recall the narration describing how the Word Bearers appeared to eschew ranged weaponry and conventional tactics and this cost them, particularly as the Ultras are the opposite.

Edit: I think this idea may also be because of the Ultramarines viewpoint? It was pretty clear that the Word Bearers were kicking ass all over the planet and the Ultras were suffering heavy losses; it just may have been less overt (although it wasn't really a problem for me) because of the Ventanus-perspective.

What is happening across the planet, aka, that we do not see, means exactly nothing to me. What is written is all that matters.

As written, Ultramarines can take bolter shots to the face (This is actually accurate to the fluff), but Word Bearers do not have the same protection on their friggin' chest plate lol.

Also, this is the same book where we see a Daemon Prince throw a 316 ton Shadowsword with enough force to destroy it, then with a push it destroys the fortified walls of a bunker. Then Ventanus jumps on its head and stabs it. One dead Daemon Prince.

Aye the death of the daemon prince pissed me off immensly, as did the faulty chest plate issue. I did however like the scene where the WB terminator is blasted to bits by an autocannon. Tabletopwise thats not very likely to happen, but I do like that the AC is shown as an extremely destructive weapon, meant for taking out armour.

That being said, I still like this book a lot better than Battle for the Abyss.

Oh another one that sucked more than being a double armamputee with an itchy ass must be Descent of Angels. Total snoozefest that one.

I am stealing this Metaphor now. Good day sir.

**Artorias the Abysswalker**

Never liked 'The First Heretic' in the first place- never read it after the 1st time. Sometimes ADB's books can be quite tedious.

**Orblivion**

The Space Marine Battle series ones are pretty bad for me too, although Helsreach was good. I think I read Helsreach first and keep buying them thinking they will all be that good.

Worst book overall for me was the 2nd Space Wolf Omnibus, I put it down at one point in frustration and never bothered picking it up again.

@OP: I have to ask about Fear to Tread. If you knew you didn't like the author and you didn't like the subject matter, why did you bother with it? Just trying to get the HH series in it's entirety?

**Beaviz81**

Darth Bob wrote:
Anything by C.S. Goto, as cliche as that sounds.

How about Phil Kelly and Matt Ward? They ain't exactly literary geniuses. I also view whatever the pale nerd Gav Thorpe writes with deep skepticism. Hehe but CS. Multilaser holds a deep hatred for any who loves the Eldar.

**LoneLictor**

Mechanicum was terrible, Just godawful. I could not finish it.

**ashrog**

Jimsolo wrote:Someone bought me the Soul Drinkers omnibus as a gift, but I never managed to finish the first novel.

I also couldn't finish Mechanicum.

That being said, I can't say whether or not they SUCKED, since I never finished them. They might have gotten better, I just couldn't finish.

Agreed, it was hard for me to finish Soul Drinker, but I'm glad I did. There are a couple of neat scenes, mainly those involving the Mechanicus, or taking place ona Daemon world. That said, I doubt I would read it again.

Beaviz81 wrote:
Darth Bob wrote:
Anything by C.S. Goto, as cliche as that sounds.

How about Phil Kelly and Matt Ward? They ain't exactly literary geniuses. I also view whatever the pale nerd Gav Thorpe writes with deep skepticism. Hehe but CS. Multilaser holds a deep hatred for any who loves the Eldar.

I was unaware that Phil Kelly and Matt Ward wrote novels?

**Beaviz81**

Hopefully they never will

**Void__Dragon**

LoneLictor wrote:
Mechanicum was terrible, Just godawful. I could not finish it.

Why not?

**Beaviz81**

Void__Dragon wrote:
LoneLictor wrote:
Mechanicum was terrible, Just godawful. I could not finish it.

Why not?

Because of the already stated reasons?

**Void__Dragon**

No one has given any.

**Darth Bob**

Beaviz81 wrote:
Darth Bob wrote:
Anything by C.S. Goto, as cliche as that sounds.

How about Phil Kelly and Matt Ward? They ain't exactly literary geniuses. I also view whatever the pale nerd Gav Thorpe writes with deep skepticism. Hehe but CS. Multilaser holds a deep hatred for any who loves the Eldar.

**Void__Dragon**

Ward is a worse writer than Goto, lol.

**Beaviz81**

Darth Bob wrote:
Beaviz81 wrote:
Darth Bob wrote:
Anything by C.S. Goto, as cliche as that sounds.

How about Phil Kelly and Matt Ward? They ain't exactly literary geniuses. I also view whatever the pale nerd Gav Thorpe writes with deep skepticism. Hehe but CS. Multilaser holds a deep hatred for any who loves the Eldar.

Well, first of all, they don't write novels. Second, even if they did, their writing abilities have no bearing on C.S. Goto's writing; whose writing inspires hatred in anyone who has even the slightest respect for 40k literature. Khorne Sorcerers, back-flipping Terminators, braying Necrons and Tyranids, Multilasers everywhere, and Eldar vehicles seemingly weak to rocks and sticks are just a brief taste of his idiocy. Third, I don't know how you can compare Phil Kelly to Mat Ward as far as ineptitude for writing fluff material, but I suppose that's a discussion for another topic.

**Popenfresh**

Say what you will about Phil's witting capabilities, Ward's atrocities to the actual content of the fluff are infinitely worse.

**ClassicCarraway**

Of the HH books, Descent of Angels was probably the one I liked the least. It seemed to go nowhere and wasn't really connected to the other books in any way. Mechanicum was probably the slowest read for me, but it finally picked up and grabbed my attention about 2/3 of the way through.

The only book I started to read but couldn't finish was the first Armageddon book by Mike Green. Awful bolter-porn doesn't even begin to describe it.

Another awful book (that I actually finished) was the first Salamanders book. About 80 stranded Marines versus 100,000+ Orks that apparently forgot their cannons and armour and only bothered to take pistols and knives. If Orks were that much of a joke, they would have been wiped out a loooong time ago.

**MarsNZ**

Mechanicum was a stand-out for me, I think there was one or two Space Marines in the entire thing, a recipe for something other than bolter-porn macho crap. Descent of Angels and Fulgrim are the most painful for me so far.

**LumenPraebeo**

In my opinion, all the Black Library writers are pretty average. They write well, and have excellent grammar. They are very descriptive, and I suppose that's what most people look for in a Black Library novel. But their effort lacks ambition. These are tales of war, where men and women fight desperate battles, in which friends and family die, where morals and emotions run high, where humanity wages everything they own and have fought for in gambles of life and death. For such tales like this, the BL authors style of writing lacks perceived effort.

Grammar, and proper writing is important to me in books, but the ability to draw in the reader, to make them invest their emotions into a book, to make them at least care a bit about the protagonist, antagonist, or any other character and what happens to them in the story stands higher on my list of priorities. That's how you tell if a tale is good and if the writer is good. For me, 40K stories are just something for me to pass the time with, something I take out when waiting for someone, resting in the park on my lunch break, or waiting for the doctor. It's not a book I'd take out and read in bed until I'm sleepy.

**Disciple of Fate**

Battle for the Abyss was quite boring. Death of Antigonus just adds to an already mediocre series, you could see every plot twist coming from a mile away.

**LoneLictor**

Void__Dragon wrote:
LoneLictor wrote:Mechanicum was terrible, Just godawful. I could not finish it.

Why not?

Kid Kyoto's review explains it better than I could.

Kid Kyoto wrote:In Games Workshop's Warhammer 40k universe the Adeptus Mechanicus is a mysterious organization of tech priests who worship knowledge and consider technology the divine creations of the Machine God. Mechanicum is supposed to give the history of this organization and reveal its secrets.

It's not worth reading.

The book has two main plots, the first is a young Adept named Dalia's quest for the Dragon of Mars, the second is the brewing civil war among the various forge cities and warrior orders of Mars.

The first two hundred pages of this book are spent trying to bore the reader to death as mysterious tech priest and mighty Titan pilots argue the finer points of Machine God theology and parliamentary procedure. Meanwhile Dalia quickly becomes an irritating Mary Sue character with ill-defined magical powers and a great destiny. Somewhere around page 200 forbidden vaults are opened, the forces of Chaos are unleashed and the action picks up. For a couple of pages. Then we're back to hearing about Dalia's romantic crushes, the proper way to wire a psychic chair and the difficulties of securing a wireless network from demonic computer viruses. It's not until page 300 or so that Dalia gets around to starting her quest, an epic struggle that involves not only a long boring train ride, but also a long boring car ride. There's also a giant robot attack but Dalia's magic powers deal with that before anyone can get too interested.

The civil war, when it finally does come is a confusing mess of Latin names and obscure references to long out of print GW games. If you don't know the difference between a Reaver Titan and a Warlord don't even bother trying to follow it.

Some of GW's writers like Ian Watson, Dan Abnett and Kim (Jack Yeovil) Newman have tremendous skills in using the English language to make the mundane seem mysterious, McNeill does the opposite. His references to maglev trains, wireless networks and fiber optics makes the ancient tech priests of Mars seem about as exciting as my cable company.

Even for fans of the Horus Heresy series there just isn't much here. Mars falls to chaos is about all you need to know if you're following the larger story.

**Void__Dragon**

I told Blax on Skype apparently some people don't like Mechanicum.

He said: "Apparently some people also like Legion. Some people just want to watch the world burn Shane."