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Relic is just a bad mission to play. It almost always boils down to first blood or line breaker.

I like using 3 land raiders. Fill them up with abaddon and chosen. With less melta running around for the most part, you can sit and be firing platforms for a turn or 2 and then get aggressive.

 Badablack wrote:
Aren't the assorted land raider variants Forgeworld churns out useable by Chaos? There's a whole slew of different configurations there to check out, no reason to limit yourself to the codex junker.

if only there was a concise list of which IA book has rules for which model. that's one of the few things I dislike about FW... never knowing which damn book I have to buy to find the rules for whatever sexy model I happen to be drooling. it blows my mind that FW doesn't post something like this on their website :(

And I actually like the CSM loadout. Not as much as the SM option that has a multimelta, but still, the lascannon version that carries 10 models is better than the pointless-firepower crusader or redeemer ones that carry a little more, or the extra-lascannon-uber-expensive raiders that aren't really transports anymore.

It's not so bad that they only have one configuration, given that they have the best one.

I disagree entirely about the lascannon raider being the best variant (long range AT guns on an assault transport with all-round armour will never not seem ridiculous to me, plus the crusader is so much better in the transport role and its mid/close range firepower is pretty versatile) - but even if it [i[is[/i] the best variant, the CSM version is a pale imitation of it. The loyalist raider has a 20% higher transport capacity and twice the full-BS firepower on the move. Lugging 10 models around and firing a single lascannon is pathetic by comparison, and the slight points difference doesn't make up for it.

In order to be a worthwhile gun platform, it has to sit still, and if it moves towards the enemy to use its assault ramp, it can barely shoot. It's a sorry excuse for a vehicle.

Well only Vanilla raider has 12 models. BA land raider has 10 models capacity as Chaos LR has. And this is slowed that Vanilla Raider which is same as other normal raiders has bigger capacity.

 Ailaros wrote:
And I actually like the CSM loadout. Not as much as the SM option that has a multimelta, but still, the lascannon version that carries 10 models is better than the pointless-firepower crusader or redeemer ones that carry a little more, or the extra-lascannon-uber-expensive raiders that aren't really transports anymore.

It's not so bad that they only have one configuration, given that they have the best one.

The Crusader is all about transporting a big blob of termies into someone's face. Given that it was invented by the Black Templars who furiously draw up plans to try and get within fisticuffs range, it's no surprise that they invented something whose sole purpose was to drive them closer so they could hit them with their swords. The Redeemer I agree is a little pointless, primarily because it lacks torrent and it has a really hard time unleashing all of it's firepower. It does however, make blobs cry, but if you really, really want blobs dead; accept not substitutes for the Ares.

Oh and the best land raider is the Proteus. Because feth your meltaguns.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Broly33 wrote:
Well only Vanilla raider has 12 models. BA land raider has 10 models capacity as Chaos LR has. And this is slowed that Vanilla Raider which is same as other normal raiders has bigger capacity.

[citation needed]

Grey Knights page 36, BA page 37 SW page 44.
All state that normal Land Raider has transport capacity of 10. Except the Vanilla one which states that it has 12 models.

No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

 Kain wrote:
No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

No. You are wrong. In Codex: Space Marines the Land Raider and Redeemer have 12 transport capacity, and the Crusader 16. This is different to every other codex.

 Kain wrote:
No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

No, Vanilla ones get 12, just like their Drop Pods.
Ward, what else can I say?

 Krellnus wrote:

 Kain wrote:
No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

No, Vanilla ones get 12, just like their Drop Pods.
Ward, what else can I say?

Okay I checked and you're right.

When did they change this? Because it's been 10 for as long as I can remember.

 Krellnus wrote:

 Kain wrote:
No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

No, Vanilla ones get 12, just like their Drop Pods.
Ward, what else can I say?

Actually Ward wrote Vanilla,BA and GK so this is weird even for him.
I wish chaos could transport 12 guys. It's a big difference to transport 5 termies or 5 termies with Lord.

I wish chaos could transport 12 guys. It's a big difference to transport 5 termies or 5 termies with Lord.

Or you could just take 4 termies with a lord it works pretty well.

Broly33 wrote:

 Krellnus wrote:

 Kain wrote:
No it has ten, only the redeemer gets 12.

No, Vanilla ones get 12, just like their Drop Pods.
Ward, what else can I say?

Actually Ward wrote Vanilla,BA and GK so this is weird even for him.
I wish chaos could transport 12 guys. It's a big difference to transport 5 termies or 5 termies with Lord.

Story goes he caught an absolute ton of flak from the higher ups for changing things. It's not like anyone checking over his work would look too closely at the Land Raider, after all it should just be a copy-paste job. I guess Tech-heresy extends to the real world, and unsanctioned modifications to STC vehicles are a big no-no.

Chaos LR are...alright.

I am debating on using them in my Khorne army. I plan to have primary CSM and ally deamons, and the raider are 230 pts just to drive up the board safe. Don't get me wrong, getting combat marines up the table safely is very helpful, but being able to ally with deamons and all the new types of units for chaos I think points spent elsewhere is better.

More units now are faster on there own: Hounds, Mauler, Helldrake, Wings...

I think one LR for an important unit is all you need, paired with other fast chaos units to be fast threat is an optimal build.

230pts just doesn't cut it for me, I just need to figure out what to do with my troops now, I run KB, always have and hopefully always will. It will just take a lot of time and thought to come up with a competitive build for assault.

 Wingeds wrote:
Relic is just a bad mission to play. It almost always boils down to first blood or line breaker.

I like using 3 land raiders. Fill them up with abaddon and chosen. With less melta running around for the most part, you can sit and be firing platforms for a turn or 2 and then get aggressive.

As far as I could find, of all the FW variants, only the Land Raider Proteus can be fielded by chaos.
It can only carry 8 models.
...and it has no assault ramp.

So it's not much of a land raider at all. Just a really really expensive rhino.

As MarsNZ and I were discussing this weekend, All we need is a Land Raider Violator-pattern with Hades Autocannons in the sponsons. That would be enough to make us happy. They've invented new Chaos weapons that would work, let's use 'em!

Though having a decent hull mounted weapon as well would be nice. And really, we should be able to have a bound-imp that allows us the same rule as Machine Spirit for the loyalists...

mp40guy wrote:
I bought a box of Chaos Terminators and was wondering how to get them into the fight fast. I run a Huron army and was going to infiltrate them but I want options. The Chaos Land Raider looks neet ( Typical old school Chaos ie Space Marine stuff with some do dads on it) but its not as powerful as the regular Space Marine ones.

Just deep strike them if you want the terminators to get to the fight fast.

mp40guy wrote:
Is it worth the points?

Yes, but not as a terminator transport.

 McGibs wrote:

 Wingeds wrote:
Relic is just a bad mission to play. It almost always boils down to first blood or line breaker.

I like using 3 land raiders. Fill them up with abaddon and chosen. With less melta running around for the most part, you can sit and be firing platforms for a turn or 2 and then get aggressive.

As far as I could find, of all the FW variants, only the Land Raider Proteus can be fielded by chaos.
It can only carry 8 models.
...and it has no assault ramp.

So it's not much of a land raider at all. Just a really really expensive rhino.

You're being disingenuous, the Proteus gets all sorts of nice options. It's more of a battle tank than an IFV like the Phobos pattern.

A 215 point battle tank with two lascannons. Woo.

 McGibs wrote:
A 215 point battle tank with two lascannons. Woo.

And a crap ton of options (including a lot of heavy flamers if you really hate cover camping tau), scouts, the ability to mess with reserves, and the ability to give meltaguns the middle finger. Oh and it gets the better pintle mounted guns, including a heavy bolter and a multimelta.

Of course the Spartan Assault tank is easily the best metal bawks for either Chaos or Loyalist marines.

 Badablack wrote:
Aren't the assorted land raider variants Forgeworld churns out useable by Chaos? There's a whole slew of different configurations there to check out, no reason to limit yourself to the codex junker.

I want some of these LRs bad but in my meta nobody plays with FW unless you count apoc battles then titans and baneblades and thunderhawks galore. The only argument I've ever gotten when asking different people why they won't play against FW is they always say its too broken compared to regular stuff. One day I hope to be in a meta where I get to add in the fancy stuff.

Exalbaru wrote:

 Badablack wrote:
Aren't the assorted land raider variants Forgeworld churns out useable by Chaos? There's a whole slew of different configurations there to check out, no reason to limit yourself to the codex junker.

I want some of these LRs bad but in my meta nobody plays with FW unless you count apoc battles then titans and baneblades and thunderhawks galore. The only argument I've ever gotten when asking different people why they won't play against FW is they always say its too broken compared to regular stuff. One day I hope to be in a meta where I get to add in the fancy stuff.

Direct them to us where we will show them the errors of their ways.

LR for Chaos are alright, they just aren't worth their points for what they are made to do.

Bettering shooting tanks for half the price are avaliable, and obliterators are a even better option now. Maulerfiends are fast assault threats.

I really want to run Kharn, some zerkers in a LR, but I am just not sure if it is worth it. They are so many other cheap things in the codex where better points can be spent elsewhere.

Many tournaments don't allow FW, either. You always need FW-free lists as back ups. If your entire list centers around FW, that's a bad idea.