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**MarsNZ**

TheRedWingArmada wrote:
Mozzamanx wrote:
I feel that this topic is veering wildly out of hand here.

In terms of points-efficiency, Marking Cultists is a bad idea. It is inefficient compared with the vast majority of choices available. If you are in such a state that you are trying to pump a 1000pt army into 1500pts by taking sub-standard upgrades and generally padding out, you should start with other options well before you turn to Marks. Even when it comes to unnecessary filler and 'fun' options there are better ways to go about it.

Ultimately this is the Tactics forum and so we provide you with efficiencies, plans and army builds. We cannot plan around extenuating circumstances, we can just help you with Warhammer.

You said it yourself. "Points-efficiency" which is not the sole "efficiency" to be taken into account. Like when guys say "Cannon fodder is useless." Sorry, but even if cannon fodder doesn't kill it's return in points, it can still be efficient by keeping more expensive points from being lost.

You're also forgetting the part where I mention that after all options are taken into account x can still be squeezed in. It's just bad mojo to say "Don't do it ever!" and better to say "Do it IF...here is why... unless you have better options." That doesn't happen here. Too many people paint these types of things with an All or Nothing brush, which doesn't always have to be the case.

Let's come up with some more examples of where this attitude can get you in trouble.

Say I had the money to afford more cultists, but the store didn't have them and I proxied out, so now I've got a hole and nothing but Marks to fill it with.
Say I'm playing Kill Team and all I have are Cultists to field.
Say I'm playing a narrative and it says "play with an army of Khorne."

The "extenuating circumstances" I mentioned are more in relation to my own life and less about this game. In terms of this game, they are just circumstances that can happen to anyone. And if you're just helping with Warhammer, then don't say "Don't ever use this! It's dumb!" Explain what it was supposed to be, how it was supposed to be used, what perks you can get from it, and then start the laundry list of "Why-nots."

Jeebus, if everyone took this kind of advice everywhere it is found, we'd all be running the same damn armies. Obviously we don't, because each player plays a strategy tailored to themselves and builds their army accordingly, or vice-versa, but it always comes back to the person and their skill-sets, talents, etc.

You're veering so far off the original course of the thread it's comical. It's weird that you're so aggressive about it when you aren't even the OP.

@OP - I wouldn't recommend any marks on cultists, I rarely give them anything at all (not even autoguns) as they essentially exist to babysit some backfield objective or die in droves while your decent units do the heavy lifting.

**Mozzamanx**

There are reasons to take Marks on your Cultists but they are not grounded in effectiveness, ability or anything that would constitute tactics.

Theme is a player choice to sacrifice ability in favour of style.
Access to models is simply being unable to create a better tactical situation.
'Funsies' is always valid but cannot be confused as a good plan.

This is the tactics forum because we discuss tactics. Whatever your reasons for Marking Cultists, they are not grounded in tactics because there are no situations* when it is the best option. It is a bad tactic and so we write it off in favour of other options, because people ask us for tactical advice.

* Unit at maximum size charging from a Land Raider and you want the absolute maximum number of attacks for your capacity, but don't want to front the points for an actual melee unit?

**Grimskul**

Yikes, after reading this again the thread has taken a definite turn for the worse.

@TheRedWingArmada

Don't take this the wrong way but I think maybe you should take a short break from this topic for a bit. It really seems like you're taking this like a personal attack on what you can and cannot do which the people here are not doing. They're merely suggesting in their honest opinions that marks are generally inefficient in the greater context of the game's units. So far you have yet to provide an argument not based on personal things unrelated to the efficiency of playing an army to the best of its potential. There is nothing to suggest that the OP has any of the issues that you have raised nor is it particularly relevant unless he provides this limitation for us personally. (Not to mention the budgeting tactics one could take anyways to circumvent problems such as budgeting problems and lack of models)

Would you tell a friend to buy a brand new expensive car from a car dealership rather than the same car offered by his other friend which is used but in good condition and also much cheaper simply because there's bad blood between his friend and you? You would hopefully want the best deal for your friend and not suggest the worst deal due to personal issues. Similarly, in the neutral efficiency-based context of tactics unmarked cultists are almost always the best option.

**Slayer le boucher**

To Face Hammernators i usually use Kharn or my JuggerAxelord.

They love Hammernators, now for Kharn its a bit tricky, because you need a full squad with him to soak in the incoming hammer hits.

but the Lord with 4++ and T5 on a bike or Jugger is golden against those pesky Hammernators.

Now i won't pronounce on the cultist as i just don't care about them.

i've always found that if it is to take a troop of weak humans, why not take an IG allied detachement?, they've got special weapons, heavy weapons, orders and you can then take a squadron of Leman Russ with them.

**TheRedWingArmada**

I'm not taking it as a personal attack, rather that there are a great many people like me out there that see these things and get discouraged.

There is Warhammer and then there is Poor'Hammer. I am Poor'Hammer. lol

**Guitarquero**

Khorne is the best mark for them. But other than that Plague zombies are best.

You just have to pick your targets.

I had a great game with them using a 20 man blob (DV) with khorne no autoguns and flamers, and took 2 sqauds of Slaneesh marines with power weapons aiming for boons.

If they go for my marines my cultists live if they go for my cultists my rines live.

Worked fairly well. Also one hitting a LR first turn with a Demo round was helpful.

**Grimskul**

TheRedWingArmada wrote:
I'm not taking it as a personal attack, rather that there are a great many people like me out there that see these things and get discouraged.

There is Warhammer and then there is Poor'Hammer. I am Poor'Hammer. lol

Well to be fair, I would prefer to learn the do's and don'ts regardless of how bitter it might be rather than having a sugar-coated answer and realizing how broken GW game system is after wasting money on an inefficient amount of models or certain unviable units. Learning how to use more non-competitive units seems to be something you worry about AFTER dealing with any financial issues and advancing in your understanding of tactics from articles like these.

**TheRedWingArmada**

Grimskul wrote:
TheRedWingArmada wrote:
I'm not taking it as a personal attack, rather that there are a great many people like me out there that see these things and get discouraged.

There is Warhammer and then there is Poor'Hammer. I am Poor'Hammer. lol

Well to be fair, I would prefer to learn the do's and don'ts regardless of how bitter it might be rather than having a sugar-coated answer and realizing how broken GW game system is after wasting money on an inefficient amount of models or certain unviable units. Learning how to use more non-competitive units seems to be something you worry about AFTER dealing with any financial issues and advancing in your understanding of tactics from articles like these.

I'm out. See: Ethnocentric

**Grimskul**

TheRedWingArmada wrote:
Grimskul wrote:
TheRedWingArmada wrote:
I'm not taking it as a personal attack, rather that there are a great many people like me out there that see these things and get discouraged.

There is Warhammer and then there is Poor'Hammer. I am Poor'Hammer. lol

Well to be fair, I would prefer to learn the do's and don'ts regardless of how bitter it might be rather than having a sugar-coated answer and realizing how broken GW game system is after wasting money on an inefficient amount of models or certain unviable units. Learning how to use more non-competitive units seems to be something you worry about AFTER dealing with any financial issues and advancing in your understanding of tactics from articles like these.

I'm out. See: Ethnocentric

...Okay? Would have liked to see at least an argument with how being poor has to do with tactics when it comes to strictly game statistics and efficiency and not any personal (financial or otherwise) issues. Seems a bit lazy for you to accuse me of Ethnocentrism simply because I disagree with you.

In any case it's up to the OP not either of us. So best of luck, MistressofDesire, towards you trying out different tactics with your cultists!

**Imperator_Class**

Wow.

This is not a forum about peoples personal finances, no matter how rich or poor they may be.

Its tactics. Logical, generally vacuum situation based builds and strategy. You cant afford 15 more cultists and so are blaring your life's story to everyone? Ok.

This may sound cold, but that is not our problem. We say 35 cultists, because it is the tactical decision, outside of things like affordability. Which is what this forum is for.

**Selym**

MistressofDesire wrote:
thanks for all the replies and advice. The meta here where I am is SM. and aLL roll with the TH/SS out of a land raider. so I'm grasping at straws for ways to deal with them at this point. lol. I knew sending my termies against them would be a losing proposition but I figured it's my best chance of tying them up for a turn or two and possibly causing some wounds. I hate those dang things.

Although it looks like something out of a netlist (and it is), these work quite well against SM TH/SS armies:

Typhus
35-70 zombies
Plague Marines
Heldrake

and some HS

Automatically Appended Next Post:

reiner wrote:

b) proxy more basic cultists

Step 1: Use Typhus
Step 2: Find any spare INF models
Step 3: Paint them zombie colours
Step 4: Zombie Horde! (I did this with ~70 Ork boyz

)

**Akiasura**

Selym wrote:
MistressofDesire wrote:
thanks for all the replies and advice. The meta here where I am is SM. and aLL roll with the TH/SS out of a land raider. so I'm grasping at straws for ways to deal with them at this point. lol. I knew sending my termies against them would be a losing proposition but I figured it's my best chance of tying them up for a turn or two and possibly causing some wounds. I hate those dang things.

Although it looks like something out of a netlist (and it is), these work quite well against SM TH/SS armies:

Typhus
35-70 zombies
Plague Marines
Heldrake

and some HS

Automatically Appended Next Post:

reiner wrote:

b) proxy more basic cultists

Step 1: Use Typhus
Step 2: Find any spare INF models
Step 3: Paint them zombie colours
Step 4: Zombie Horde! (I did this with ~70 Ork boyz )

Tbh I am not enjoying the zombies. No guns makes them worthless, and I don't like typhus outside of a Death Star unit. And our death stars area awful, from a relative standpoint.

Best use of cultists are if you run plagues, noise marines have zero use for them. Plagues tend to rhino or run forward, so they need some cheap backfield objective holders, and it doesn't get much cheaper than cultists. Noise marines tend to stay backfield and don't need them.

Using cultists offensively is a mistake IMO, don't bother

Side note: I find both Red Wing and Evil Inc pretty childish and annoying to deal with. Don't take what they say personally

**Selym**

I use the zombies to just take up absurd amounts of room, and be a b***h to get off an objective, due to being fearless.
I then use everything else for offense...