Codex: Grey Knights Halberds

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**Atropamin**

Desubot wrote:
ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Reach=/=martial arts.

If anything it should just let them fight 3" rather than 2" from a friendly in base

I support that

Also, as it is a game with fictional background, I think it hardly matters if the rules for the glaiv...ehm halberd are realistic.
But, I do not think that a +1 WS is justified as it is upt to the wielder, how good he uses a weapon.
Though I really liked the +2 Ini in the last Codex, +1 to str isn't too bad... (still... an additional +1 to Ini would be nice...)

**Powerfisting**

Halberds are like those god-awful spearmen in Dark Souls 2 that can hit you 18 yards away. Without fail, the spearmen will strike you before you strike them. +1 Initiative is the only logical buff from a spear. It will allow you, in the internal fiction of a 40k game, to stick the other guys in the gut before you can because you are hitting him with it as he gets in range of you.

**ALEXisAWESOME**

Ok, lets assume you implement this change to Grey Knight Helberds because it makes more logical sense, i also assume you will give them a dire negative as well?

You have said that a longer blade allows you to dictate a fight, which may be true, but it also gives you a terrible disadvantage once the opponent closes in to your effective range.

So +1 Ws first turn would represent the Helberd being used to strike first, but turn 2 you would have to have -2 Ws to represent the enemy to of pushed in and is now fighting at his own terms. Use my Space Elf example, if the Grey Knight fails to skewer her with his longer weapon, she will push in with her Knives because they are a faster weapon. Once she has closed in the Helberd effectively becomes a pole, which would have no chance to deflect a flurry of blows.

Of course, all this is complicated and unnecessary when we already have rules for Helberds. So +1 strength would have to suffice.

**Deadshot**

Halberds should in no way give +1 WS. Even the lowliest newbie GK can choose to wield a Halberd, or the most skillful duelist outside the Brotherhood Champions. Fighting with a weapon doesn't make you more skilful.

Halberds gave +2 Int to represeny the fact the holder can spin and deflect attacks easier the weapon and has a long reach, able to kill the opponent before he even gets in range to attack.

There is also the option, instead if the spinning twirling stuff (think Darth Maul from Star Wars), grasp it by the end and use the length to empower your slashes. The further away the blade is from the pivot (the hands at the end of the haft), the easier the blade will be to swing (due to centripedal force) and the less strength the wielder will need to swing with the same strength
Simply put, he can hold it at the end and swing harder for harder hits.

**pelicaniforce**

Xca|iber wrote:Now, you disagree with statement A. Fine. But consider this: Two identical fencers start a fixed distance apart. One is given a noticeably longer blade. In fencing, the match ends when one side scores a touch. Now if these fighters were to fence 10 times, I would bet that 9 out of 10 times the fencer with the longer sword would score. So statistically speaking, the longer weapon provided a higher chance of hitting.

It is called a "bout."

Your bet is very dependent on the fencers being identical, and it is also a bet I would take at only like 5:3.

Gildred wrote:

P4 .According to the basic rulebook the chance to hit an opponent in close combat is represented by WS.

P5. In order to represent an increased chance to hit your opponent you would have a higher WS.

C. Halberds could represent an advantage by increasing the WS of the wielder.

If your grey knight is fighting a ws3 model, going to ws5 does not improve his roll to hit. If your grey knight is fighting a ws5, 6, or 8 model, going to ws5 does not improve his roll to hit.

You need a different rule.

Deadshot wrote:Halberds gave +2 Int to represeny the fact the holder can spin and deflect attacks easier the weapon and has a long reach, able to kill the opponent before he even gets in range to attack.

There is also the option, instead if the spinning twirling stuff (think Darth Maul from Star Wars),

That is not how that works.

**ClockworkZion**

Just to toss in a small $.02 regarding why Halberds are +1S: it makes them fall in line with the rules for power weapons. 6th edition listed them as something that followed the rules for a Power Axe, thus when they updated it they changed it to fall in line with the rules they already wrote.

**Exergy**

Anpu42 wrote:
Well the current Halberds are actually more like "Glaives"
Having used them in real life having a S+1 is quite reasonable.
As for reach, +1 to Initiative would not be out of line or Counter Attack.

+1 init maybe, +2 like they use to have was OP

As for WS5, Grey Knights should have that in general, but so should Vanguard Vets and Wolf Guard.

Once you open that box, there are a LOT of units out there that deserve higher WS. Wyches, Bloodbrides, Truborn, Nobz, Chosen, CSM terminators..... the list goes on and on

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Gildred wrote:
I submitted this to Gamefaqs@gwplc.com and thought I'd open up a discussion on it. (some details removed to preserve GW secrecy)

The new GK Halberd change from an increase in initiative to an increase in strength struck me as odd. Let me show why:

Codex: Space Marines
Power Sword
Power Axe

The above is a free exchange and gives a distinct choice between 2 different battlefield roles.

Codex: Grey Knights
Force Sword
Force Halberd

The above seems strangely balanced vs the generic SM option. Also, from an army construction standpoint it’s a somewhat bland choice that doesn't represent significant change in battlefield roles

Given that previous GK codices (and the fluff) represented the GK as highly trained/skilled even by astartes standards I assert that a move to the following profile would be desirable.

+2 pts - Force Halberd: S user AP3 WS+1

Reasons:

1. It would give GK players a clear distinction in battlefield roles between the wargear options presented.
2. Increased WS was a hallmark of GK units in the past.
3. Fits the flavour and fluff of the army.
4. Reach often confers an advantage in combat between equally skilled opponents.

really why couldnt it be the same as a force ax? Everyone else who wants to wield a power halberd has to call it a power ax or for C:SM only they can call it a relic blade.

GK get Halberds, great. How is a GK NFW halberd different from a space marine Power Halberd(obviously it isnt a NFW). But still I never got why GK got a different version of power weapons that no one else had access to.

If Halberds are so great, shouldnt the entire game have access to Power Haberds?