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 xttz wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
As for rolling to-hit, its a focused witchfire, read the witchfire rules.

Those rules are ambiguously written to the point that many people have been asking for a FAQ since they came out. Unfortunately popular opinion errs against the Maleceptor...

They have?
I fail to find anything not clear about these.

 beardman3000 wrote:

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Where's the option for both? I'll probably eventually get both. I especially like the look of the Malaceptor, even though it's rules seem quite lackluster.

Sorry I forgot one .... But I am just gonna wait until i see how they play, like the previous commenter, they don't seem to me they will get there points back... So i shall wait for reviews on him then decide!

You already lost. I can't believe people still say "make my points back". I haven't played for a long time and I still know you don't play by "making my points back."

A 1000 point unit can kill one point and still win the game. A one point unit can kill 1000 points and you can still loose the game. Don't worry about making points back, play what the objectives are. Again, like the model buy it.

Am I missing something about the Focused Witchfire rules here? Why on earth wouldn't it need to hit after manifesting the powers when the rules for Focused Witchfire state that they follow the rules for Witchfire powers, which state they need to roll to hit?

I'm going to proxy the Maleceptor or however it's spelled before deciding, but I want to like it. Maybe I'll try one in the new pod< but may just toss in 3 zoans instead. I don't put alot of faith in melee units, so I'll probably pass on the Toxicrene.

Those new drop pods just made Toxicrenes VERY sexy imo.
Drop em near a ruin close to the enemy, disembark in the cover and fire your large blast.
Next turn, you charge 'em dead.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Am I missing something about the Focused Witchfire rules here? Why on earth wouldn't it need to hit after manifesting the powers when the rules for Focused Witchfire state that they follow the rules for Witchfire powers, which state they need to roll to hit?

There is a WHOLE thread on this. Knock yourself out

I will touch on this briefly.

As a Witchfire power, you need to roll To Hit. At this point is breaks down into two arguments:
1. As there is no profile, the number of dice needed is undefined. Even then it does not matter as only To Wound rolls are directly tied to successful Hits (and the power does not make a To Wound roll). Since we are still told to resolve the power, like anything else that requires undefined numbers (such as a vehicle suffering -1 Toughness from Enfeeble), the roll To Hit can be skipped.
2. Per the rulebook, most models only get to fire a single shot. Therefore, you roll a single To Hit dice, and if you miss, you do not resolve the power. The power would have the following profile: Range 24" S- AP - Type Assault 1, Instead of rolling to wound or armour pen the model takes a Leadership test (vehicles count as Ld 10) on 3d6, suffering D3 wounds that ignore cover and armour saves or a single glancing hit that ignores cover saves, on a failure.

Both sides will then bicker back and forth for 10+ pages about how the other side is not presenting any rules to back up their arguments and should be marked HYWPI. Others will then wonder why the Mods are not locking the thread.

And the answer to this problem is to explain your interpretation of the rule to your opponent before the power is used, or before the game if you remember and I know I normally forget to inform, and just go from there. On the actual table it's never been an issue in my experience.

On their own, now that I have the White Dwarf with the rules, I would pass on both. But, these 'rumors' of the new spores means that they have a delivery system and can be very useful. I love Deep Strike bugs and these fit the bill as a terror up close. The Toxicrine especially.

I still think the Maleceptor could be useful, especially against MC's. I run Grey Knights as my main army and it horrifies me that it can remove D3 wounds on each of my Dreadknights each turn and ignore my 2+. Those Dreadknights are a HUGE part of my army and in theory (long stretch I know) can remove both of them in two turns for WC2 as they don't need to focus witchfire on them. Also, now I have to spend my warp charge on sanctuary to try and get that 4++. It just seems that they will be very situational.

 Bellzo wrote:
I still think the Maleceptor could be useful, especially against MC's. I run Grey Knights as my main army and it horrifies me that it can remove D3 wounds on each of my Dreadknights each turn and ignore my 2+. Those Dreadknights are a HUGE part of my army and in theory (long stretch I know) can remove both of them in two turns for WC2 as they don't need to focus witchfire on them. Also, now I have to spend my warp charge on sanctuary to try and get that 4++. It just seems that they will be very situational.

A. Poison gaunts are more effective. Or a Hive Tyrant with a LW/BS.

B. Psychic powers will never work against GK, because you deny on a 5+ or even a 4+ most of the time. Because, makes sense, right?

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Bellzo wrote:
I still think the Maleceptor could be useful, especially against MC's. I run Grey Knights as my main army and it horrifies me that it can remove D3 wounds on each of my Dreadknights each turn and ignore my 2+. Those Dreadknights are a HUGE part of my army and in theory (long stretch I know) can remove both of them in two turns for WC2 as they don't need to focus witchfire on them. Also, now I have to spend my warp charge on sanctuary to try and get that 4++. It just seems that they will be very situational.

A. Poison gaunts are more effective. Or a Hive Tyrant with a LW/BS.

B. Psychic powers will never work against GK, because you deny on a 5+ or even a 4+ most of the time. Because, makes sense, right?

Haha I'm trying man, I really am. I want to like the Maleceptor so bad!

 Bellzo wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Bellzo wrote:
I still think the Maleceptor could be useful, especially against MC's. I run Grey Knights as my main army and it horrifies me that it can remove D3 wounds on each of my Dreadknights each turn and ignore my 2+. Those Dreadknights are a HUGE part of my army and in theory (long stretch I know) can remove both of them in two turns for WC2 as they don't need to focus witchfire on them. Also, now I have to spend my warp charge on sanctuary to try and get that 4++. It just seems that they will be very situational.

A. Poison gaunts are more effective. Or a Hive Tyrant with a LW/BS.

B. Psychic powers will never work against GK, because you deny on a 5+ or even a 4+ most of the time. Because, makes sense, right?

Haha I'm trying man, I really am. I want to like the Maleceptor so bad!

Exactly. When you have to try so hard to like something, something is wrong.

The malceptor is GW's attempt to say "Hey everyone! We re-made the Doom of Malan'tai! Serious! It is just* as** good***"

*nothing like it
**worse
***buy this even though it's meh and has rules that barely function

I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

It is important to note that the Maleceptor is even more effective against enemy psykers because Shadow in the Warp makes their leadership drop. Thus, for taking out Grey Knights, it seems like it would work out quite nicely, if they don't deny the witch.

Why do people keep saying the maleceptor is somehow a doom reincarnation?

At what point were they noted to be related to each other? and what kind of similarity they share that is greater than to an other random psyker bug?

The two are not related, stop trying to force it.

The upcoming Neurothrope MIGHT have a tiny bit of relation to the doom. but the maleceptor does not.

 BoomWolf wrote:
Why do people keep saying the maleceptor is somehow a doom reincarnation?

At what point were they noted to be related to each other? and what kind of similarity they share that is greater than to an other random psyker bug?

The two are not related, stop trying to force it.

The upcoming Neurothrope MIGHT have a tiny bit of relation to the doom. but the maleceptor does not.

The Neruothrope is more than a tiny relationship so far. It even has the Spirit Leech power.

Nothing will be released that is quite as powerful as the Doom though.

 BoomWolf wrote:
Why do people keep saying the maleceptor is somehow a doom reincarnation?

I haven't really heard many people saying it.

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

Neither, I would rather have a bank account.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

And even with T5, I would hardly call a single attack a good chance.1/2 will miss, 1/6 will still manage to fail to wound.

 BoomWolf wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

And even with T5, I would hardly call a single attack a good chance.1/2 will miss, 1/6 will still manage to fail to wound.

Plus the Toxicrene would be going first, and a single 6 will do that Riptide in.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

The Toxicrene and the Maleceptor are both T6....


The Toxicrene is Strength 5 though.

 Sasori wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

The Toxicrene and the Maleceptor are both T6....


The Toxicrene is Strength 5 though.

Oh, really? I could've swore that the Maleceptor was T5, but if I'm wrong, that kind of helps me like it a bit more. But not quite enough....

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

The Toxicrene and the Maleceptor are both T6....


The Toxicrene is Strength 5 though.

Oh, really? I could've swore that the Maleceptor was T5, but if I'm wrong, that kind of helps me like it a bit more. But not quite enough....

The Maleceptor still sucks, don't get me wrong. I got one Maleceptor and one Toxicrene because I like the models, and to support this release.

I hope the Leviathan supplement makes them a little better, but I'm not holding out hope.

 Sasori wrote:


The Maleceptor still sucks, don't get me wrong. I got one Maleceptor and one Toxicrene because I like the models, and to support this release.

I hope the Leviathan supplement makes them a little better, but I'm not holding out hope.

I don't think I'd ever buy one, god no. But a Toxicrene I would love to have, especially with the new Drop pods. I just, for the life of me, don't understand why GW would give him the rules they did (The Maleceptor, I mean). Like, really?

 BoomWolf wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

takonite wrote:
I like the Toxicrene, and feel it is fairly costs, especially with pods it should be quite tasty. I feel that if it under preforms it is either the fault of the user or other it had to fight an OP riptide and died. Otherwise it seems like it's on the right track, I love poison too so I might get one.
I hate that the tentacles on the model are SO long though, I'd need to convert that away

as for the other guy...ya...mmm...no, maybe math hammer will prove me wrong but wouldn't tentaclids just be infinitely better. It should have just had warp blast with an extended range

A Toxicrene would destroy a Riptide in CC. And I can see how the power has it's uses, and after thinking about it, I would totally use the Maleceptor as is...............if the power was WC 1 and he was like, 170 points....

Depends though, the Riptide has a very reasonable chance of getting ID on the Toxicrene with a smash attack. If it can hit, then there's a good chance the Toxicrene will go splat.

A toxicrene is T6, the Maleceptor is T5. So yeah...

And even with T5, I would hardly call a single attack a good chance.1/2 will miss, 1/6 will still manage to fail to wound.

Ah, I glanced at the rules and must have gotten its S and T mixed up. Glad to see the chances of IDing it are pretty slim!

And, assuming it was T5, a 42% chance to kill it in one shot isn't THAT bad. Most 40k players would kill for a weapon that could one-shot models 42% of the time.

42% to One-shot on the condition you'd survive though. and you might not.