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1850 Competitive - Pentyrant Tyranids vs AV13 Necrons - ETC Missions (Completed)  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Poll
Have Tyranids finally met their match in Necrons?
No. It's still too many flyrants for Necrons to handle.
Draw. The strengths of each army cancel out.
Yes. Having their devourers nullified will hurt the Tyranid's chances. Necron resiliency takes it.

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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

PanzerLeader wrote:
I don't understand the necron deployment though. I'd have hung back further with the 36" threat range looking for a beta strike. No reason to be up that far.

Hanging back is for wusses. Real robots know no fear. Haha....j.k.!

Seriously , I deployed the way that I did for several reasons.

1. I am very aggressive with my Necrons. I am willing to sacrifice a barge in order to not give my opponent board control. That is why I try to keep my forces near the middle.

2. With all the Onslaughts in the Tyranid army, 36" May not be far enough. I didn't want to concede that much real estate to the bugs.

3. First Blood here in the ETC format is a lot less important than it is in the BAO format.


 herpguy wrote:
I think getting that many onslaughts will be very valuable.

I was actually hoping for Warp Blast in this game. S10 AP2 shots are very useful in this matchup against open-topped vehicles and T5 lords.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/12/22 17:36:52



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Longtime Dakkanaut




Under current (idiotic) rules would the Haywires not be useless against CCB's?

Conveniently my question was answered in YMDC:
Hit pools from Blast and Template weapons are always resolved against the Chariot [profile].

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 06:07:54


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





I was simming a Pentyrant against one of my own groups, and it was doing quite well, until the Vindicare discovered the Skyfire Nexus. I wonder how many semi-dependable ways there are to unsnapshot a ground-pounder against air without using gun emplacements.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

Naw wrote:
Under current (idiotic) rules would the Haywires not be useless against CCB's?

Conveniently my question was answered in YMDC:
Hit pools from Blast and Template weapons are always resolved against the Chariot [profile].

Fortunately for Necrons, there is only 1 army in the game with a haywire template.

Unfortunately for them, they are facing that army in this game.


IsawaBrian wrote:
I was simming a Pentyrant against one of my own groups, and it was doing quite well, until the Vindicare discovered the Skyfire Nexus. I wonder how many semi-dependable ways there are to unsnapshot a ground-pounder against air without using gun emplacements.

You could get lucky with Skyfire objectives, although that isn't an offense you can rely on. It isn't even semi-dependable.




Automatically Appended Next Post:


Battle report completed (on p. 1).


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 16:39:42



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Tunneling Trygon





NJ

Kind of saw this coming after the first few turns. I agree that we'll have to see what happens in January. I seriously doubt the matchup will be the same
   
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Infiltrating Broodlord




UK

Good tactic for the necrons by moving flat out under the flyrants to force them to go to ground but a FMC Nid player should foresee this coming and as as you where playing yourself... well, I kind of think you may have been favouring the necrons game play - just a little!

Anyhow, a very good point for every other Nid player to pick up on - don't get too close to enemy vehicles if you can't hurt a certain AV. otherwise they'll get behind you and jerk you around
   
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Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

 Wilson wrote:
Good tactic for the necrons by moving flat out under the flyrants to force them to go to ground but a FMC Nid player should foresee this coming and as as you where playing yourself... well, I kind of think you may have been favouring the necrons game play - just a little!

Anyhow, a very good point for every other Nid player to pick up on - don't get too close to enemy vehicles if you can't hurt a certain AV. otherwise they'll get behind you and jerk you around

As a Tyranid player, what can you do? Just keep on ignoring stuff that is hard to kill? The best that you could hope for is to just swallow your lumps and try to kill 3 AV13 vehicles in 2 turns. Now you may sacrifice a flyrant, but you are getting 6-VP's (due to Big Guns) as well as handicapping your opponent's shooting majorly.

To win, especially in a matchup that potentially favors your opponent, you can't do it by playing it safe. You have to take risks. As a Tyranid player, I had to try to take out his barges. Because every turn where I play it "safe", that is a turn the Necrons are shooting at me with their barges at full strength.

Yeah, I did know what the Necron player was going to do and as a Tyranid player, I did it anyways because that was what I felt was my greatest chance for a victory....take out the enemy firepower at all costs.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 18:31:12



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What does the AV13 Necron wall with Bargelords do against a Lance list w 3x Knights?

Aftermath can be calculated.

Dark humor is like food, not everyone gets it.  
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

 Lord Commissar wrote:
What does the AV13 Necron wall with Bargelords do against a Lance list w 3x Knights?

Shooting from different arcs.

Sweep attack by the bargelords.

Haywire crypteks and glancing gauss.

Stay in terrain with the bargelords and let the knights charge into terrain.

Oh, and here's my favorite one.....ignore the knights and kill everything else.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 18:49:32



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Infiltrating Broodlord




UK

 jy2 wrote:
 Wilson wrote:
Good tactic for the necrons by moving flat out under the flyrants to force them to go to ground but a FMC Nid player should foresee this coming and as as you where playing yourself... well, I kind of think you may have been favouring the necrons game play - just a little!

Anyhow, a very good point for every other Nid player to pick up on - don't get too close to enemy vehicles if you can't hurt a certain AV. otherwise they'll get behind you and jerk you around

As a Tyranid player, what can you do? Just keep on ignoring stuff that is hard to kill? The best that you could hope for is to just swallow your lumps and try to kill 3 AV13 vehicles in 2 turns. Now you may sacrifice a flyrant, but you are getting 6-VP's (due to Big Guns) as well as handicapping your opponent's shooting majorly.

To win, especially in a matchup that potentially favors your opponent, you can't do it by playing it safe. You have to take risks. As a Tyranid player, I had to try to take out his barges. Because every turn where I play it "safe", that is a turn the Necrons are shooting at me with their barges at full strength.

Yeah, I did know what the Necron player was going to do and as a Tyranid player, I did it anyways because that was what I felt was my greatest chance for a victory....take out the enemy firepower at all costs.



fair enough man but perhaps in this scenario it wouldn't have been a bad idea to deep strike some of the tyrants(2 of them?) to get the rear armour easier. it would have helped you surround the barges and would have meant that you wouldn't have had to go into gliding mode to get shots off.
   
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San Jose, CA

 Wilson wrote:

fair enough man but perhaps in this scenario it wouldn't have been a bad idea to deep strike some of the tyrants(2 of them?) to get the rear armour easier. it would have helped you surround the barges and would have meant that you wouldn't have had to go into gliding mode to get shots off.

That would have also been a mistake IMO, at least from a statistics perspective. 40K is a numbers game. Gernerally speaking, the more you have, the better you are. 5 flyrants against 4 AB's means that Tyranids have the mathematical advantage. 3 flyrants vs 4 AB's will give Necrons the advantage. 3 flyrants isn't even guaranteed to kill 1 AB (there's a 1/3 chance that it would survive with 1HP remaining), but with 5 flyrants, I did 5HP's worth of damage.

Besides, there's the usual risks with deepstriking, including 1) not coming in on Turn 2 even with the re-rolls on reserves, 2) scattering outside of egrubs range and/or rear armor arc and 3) worse yet, mishapping.

Just a word of advice, in most cases (probably 99% of the time), ALWAYS START ALL YOUR FLYRANTS ON THE TABLE.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 21:34:22



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Infiltrating Broodlord




UK

 jy2 wrote:
 Wilson wrote:

fair enough man but perhaps in this scenario it wouldn't have been a bad idea to deep strike some of the tyrants(2 of them?) to get the rear armour easier. it would have helped you surround the barges and would have meant that you wouldn't have had to go into gliding mode to get shots off.

That would have also been a mistake IMO, at least from a statistics perspective. 40K is a numbers game. Gernerally speaking, the more you have, the better you are. 5 flyrants against 4 AB's means that Tyranids have the mathematical advantage. 3 flyrants vs 4 AB's will give Necrons the advantage. 3 flyrants isn't even guaranteed to kill 1 AB (there's a 1/3 chance that it would survive with 1HP remaining), but with 5 flyrants, I did 5HP's worth of damage.

Besides, there's the usual risks with deepstriking, including 1) not coming in on Turn 2 even with the re-rolls on reserves, 2) scattering outside of egrubs range and/or rear armor arc and 3) worse yet, mishapping.

Just a word of advice, in most cases (probably 99% of the time), ALWAYS START ALL YOUR FLYRANTS ON THE TABLE.



Id agree with you 99% of the time but the fact is...
Spoiler:
tyranids lost.
therefore in this particular game, the way you played it - I think you would have been better off with putting at least 1, Maximum of 2 Flyrants in reserve to suround the barges. 3 should just about wreck one barge in turn 1. 4 would almost certainly wreck 1.

Then when 1-2 barges get behind you, you can DS a Flyrant behind them to get the jump on their rear.

I'd like to see this game played again but with you vs another player. Just to see how it would go. Maybe get inControl to play you with the 5 star Flyrant list.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 22:47:31


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





San Jose, CA

Lol. You got me there. I ran the numbers in my head, but the game just didn't pan out for Tyranids statiscally. Oh well, that's a dice game for you. Even when the odds are with you, you can still tank it.



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Longtime Dakkanaut





Eye of Terror

I think a lot of times depending on what you're up against its okay to reserve 2 Flyrants. As Wilson has pointed out it lets you react better plus you don't always need to alpha strike.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/21 23:47:22


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San Jose, CA

 Dozer Blades wrote:
I think a lot of times depending on what you're up against its okay to reserve 2 Flyrants. As Wilson has pointed out it lets you react better plus you don't always need to alpha strike.

It is ok to reserve them if you want to handicap your own army. Let me ask you, why do you think it lets you react better when you've got a flyrant with a 42" threat range? No, when you've got 5 flyrants, each with a 42" threat range? Deepstriking is how you get your units in range when otherwise, they wouldn't be. Flyrants will be in range on Turn 1 or at the very latest, on Turn 2. Why take the risk of deepstriking when you don't need to? Why do you want to nerf your initial firepower when you don't have to?


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/22 01:45:19



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Eye of Terror

Depending on cover and deployment (e.g., H&A) it may not be possible to target everything in your opponent's army. Some units with high rate of fire can outrange the Flyrants such as Lootas. It might be better to come in uncontested for the free shots second turn or later rather than opting for the alpha strike.

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San Jose, CA

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Depending on cover and deployment (e.g., H&A) it may not be possible to target everything in your opponent's army. Some units with high rate of fire can outrange the Flyrants such as Lootas. It might be better to come in uncontested for the free shots second turn or later rather than opting for the alpha strike.

And why would you want to target everything in your opponent's army? You need to focus down 1 unit at a time, not trying to target the entire army. Basically, the strategy that Pentyrants should employ is the surgical strike. Hit one unit and hit it hard until it is dead. Then go on to the next one. You should never be just targeting everything in your opponent's army.

Lootas? Oh please. You know how much damage 1 unit will do? Assuming 15 lootas with 3 shots each, that's 45 shots, 7.5 hits, 5 wounds and 2W goes through if out in the open (3+) or only 1W if in malanthrope range (2+). And that's not factoring in the Void Shields yet.

Let me ask you, in your game against Pentyrants, did you feel that your opponent played it correctly by reserving 2 of his flyrants? Or did you feel that the extra 24 TL-S6 shots that he would have gotten had he deployed those flyrants would have been the better play?



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Infiltrating Broodlord




UK

 jy2 wrote:
 Dozer Blades wrote:
Depending on cover and deployment (e.g., H&A) it may not be possible to target everything in your opponent's army. Some units with high rate of fire can outrange the Flyrants such as Lootas. It might be better to come in uncontested for the free shots second turn or later rather than opting for the alpha strike.

And why would you want to target everything in your opponent's army? You need to focus down 1 unit at a time, not trying to target the entire army. Basically, the strategy that Pentyrants should employ is the surgical strike. Hit one unit and hit it hard until it is dead. Then go on to the next one. You should never be just targeting everything in your opponent's army.

Lootas? Oh please. You know how much damage 1 unit will do? Assuming 15 lootas with 3 shots each, that's 45 shots, 7.5 hits, 5 wounds and 2W goes through if out in the open (3+) or only 1W if in malanthrope range (2+). And that's not factoring in the Void Shields yet.

Let me ask you, in your game against Pentyrants, did you feel that your opponent played it correctly by reserving 2 of his flyrants? Or did you feel that the extra 24 TL-S6 shots that he would have gotten had he deployed those flyrants would have been the better play?



As Dozer said, in situations where your faced with things such as the AV13 spam you just took on, it would make more sense to reserve 1-2 flyrants. Although you may be 24 TL S6 shots down, thats also 24 shots that can't actually hurt anything in turn 1.

The obvious choice (99% of the time) is too put all tyrants on the board to overwhelm the enemy but in this instance I strongly believe you would have had a better shot at taking down this list by deep striking - besides, you had a lictor in your list to DS next too to avoid mishaps anyway.
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut




 Wilson wrote:
Good tactic for the necrons by moving flat out under the flyrants to force them to go to ground but a FMC Nid player should foresee this coming and as as you where playing yourself... well, I kind of think you may have been favouring the necrons game play - just a little!


I felt that the Nids were played too aggressively when they really didn't need to. I expected them to stay put and wait for their ground presence. That or flying off and then coming behind the enemy AB's or fliers.


   
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Eye of Terror

I mentioned Lootaz since I've seen them outshoot Flyrants. As to my game just wait and see how it plays out. For some armies it's best not to reserve and play very aggressive.

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Fort Campbell

Can't find myself disagreeing with the concept of reserving the Tyrants. A smart opponent will mitigate your 1st turn shooting by denying that rear arc as much as possible, so those extra shots aren't going to do much anyways. Keeping them reserved does give you some flexibility turn 2 and on once it starts getting harder and harder for him to keep that rear arc locked up.

Against most armies you shouldn't have to play like that, but against this one, it might have been the better option.

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Louisiana

In this case, where the Tyranid player was going first vs those annihilation barges, the Idea should have been to hide the malanthrope behind the VSG so it wouldn't die, deploy all 5 flyrants, and swoop them off of the table on turn 1. That way all 5 come in on turn 2 with no reserves roll needed, plus as many of the ground troops that make their 3+ reserve roll as well. The necron player would either move up on his turn, or stay back in this DZ and lose a turn of board control.

Been out of the game for awhile, trying to find time to get back into it. 
   
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Infiltrating Broodlord




UK

 tetrisphreak wrote:
In this case, where the Tyranid player was going first vs those annihilation barges, the Idea should have been to hide the malanthrope behind the VSG so it wouldn't die, deploy all 5 flyrants, and swoop them off of the table on turn 1. That way all 5 come in on turn 2 with no reserves roll needed, plus as many of the ground troops that make their 3+ reserve roll as well. The necron player would either move up on his turn, or stay back in this DZ and lose a turn of board control.


great shout tetrisphreak. I think that is exactly how I would have played it.
   
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San Jose, CA

Guys, I'll give you the pros and cons of deepstriking 2 flyrants:

PROS:

1. They come in swooping, thus, making them more survivable.

2. They can get potential rear armor shots at the barges.


CONS:

1. You're giving up another 24 shots or 2 haywire attacks on Turn 1.

2. 3 flyrants isn't guaranteed to kill anything. There's a 1/3 chance an enemy annihilation barge might survive. That means instead of 5 flyrants versus 3 barges on Turn 2, it's 3 flyrants versus 4 barges. You give up the numerical advantage.

3. 1 flyrant isn't guaranteed to wreck a barge, even against rear armor. 12 shots, 11 hits, 3.67 glances/pens, 2 glances/pens gets through the jink saves. Or 6 shots, 5 hits, 1.8 glances/pens, 1 glance/pen gets through jink + 1 haywire = 2 glances/pens. On average, you'll do 2 glances/pens to the rear of a jinking AB.

4. Even with the re-rolls to reserves, flyrants are not guaranteed to come in on Turn 2.

5. They might scatter out of rear arc or egrubs range.

6. They might mishap.

7. So 2 flyrants deepstrike in. I still would have most likely gone into Glide mode with the other 3 flyrants, thus exposing them to the risk of assault anyways.

8. Necron player could have counter-deployed if they knew Tyranids were deepstriking 2 flyrants. Not necessarily with their butts against the board edges, but having them around 6" from the board edges (keep in mind Hammer & Anvil deployment) makes deepstriking to the rear extremely risky while still giving them good range to almost any flyrant on the table.

9. Tyranids were going 1st. Normally, you would reserve in the hopes of getting the beta-strike against enemy flyers, but in this case, my flyrants would have came in before the Necron flyers. So why deepstrike when you can't get the drop on the opponent's reserves?

10. I didn't have the benefit of hindsight in the game. How could you possibly know the results of the game during the game? I went with what I felt was my best chances, and in this case, I felt having the numerical advantage over the Necrons would have given me the best chances. Besides there is no guarantee that deepstriking 2 flyrants would have netted me a better chance at victory.


This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/12/22 15:52:13



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Louisiana

H&A deployment is rough. Even with 24" movement, coming in from the edge on reserve only puts a FMC at the deployment line.

This particular matchup is very tough for tyranids. The av13 wall of skimmers are so difficult to take out, as compared to many of the other lists people see these days. While the necron codex is slated for an update soon, I doubt they'll lose their AV13 spam type lists altogether.

Had all those flyrants who rolled "onslaught" for their power rolled "warp blast" instead, the edge might very well have shifted back in the tyranids' favor. Either way it was tough going, and the result showed how strong and resilient the necron codex still is.

Been out of the game for awhile, trying to find time to get back into it. 
   
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San Jose, CA

Naw wrote:
 Wilson wrote:
Good tactic for the necrons by moving flat out under the flyrants to force them to go to ground but a FMC Nid player should foresee this coming and as as you where playing yourself... well, I kind of think you may have been favouring the necrons game play - just a little!


I felt that the Nids were played too aggressively when they really didn't need to. I expected them to stay put and wait for their ground presence. That or flying off and then coming behind the enemy AB's or fliers.



Tyranids were going 1st. If they fly off on T1, they'd still come back on before Necron flyers came in.

Also, this is H&A deployment. Enemy flyers can come in and stay out of range of flyrants coming in next turn (staying about 54" from the Tyranid's deployment edge means flyrants can do nothing to them on the way in). AB's, if they really wanted to, can stay 30-36" away from the Tyranid board edge to avoid devourers to the rear.


 Wilson wrote:

As Dozer said, in situations where your faced with things such as the AV13 spam you just took on, it would make more sense to reserve 1-2 flyrants. Although you may be 24 TL S6 shots down, thats also 24 shots that can't actually hurt anything in turn 1.

The obvious choice (99% of the time) is too put all tyrants on the board to overwhelm the enemy but in this instance I strongly believe you would have had a better shot at taking down this list by deep striking - besides, you had a lictor in your list to DS next too to avoid mishaps anyway.

In this case, it is not so much the 24 TL shots as it is in the 2 egrubs that you'd be missing.

Lictors have to already be on the table in order for the flyrants to use. Thus, I can't rely on the lictor tactic.


 Dozer Blades wrote:
For some armies it's best not to reserve and play very aggressive.

Right, and this one is it. Don't reserve the flyrants and be very aggressive with them.


 djones520 wrote:
Can't find myself disagreeing with the concept of reserving the Tyrants. A smart opponent will mitigate your 1st turn shooting by denying that rear arc as much as possible, so those extra shots aren't going to do much anyways. Keeping them reserved does give you some flexibility turn 2 and on once it starts getting harder and harder for him to keep that rear arc locked up.

Against most armies you shouldn't have to play like that, but against this one, it might have been the better option.

Flexibility at the expense of loss firepower and added risk to the army.

To me, it wasn't worth it. You reserve them and you might get rear shots, but you keep them on the table and you are guaranteed 2 attacks with the egrubs (as well as rear shots if you really wanted).


 tetrisphreak wrote:
In this case, where the Tyranid player was going first vs those annihilation barges, the Idea should have been to hide the malanthrope behind the VSG so it wouldn't die, deploy all 5 flyrants, and swoop them off of the table on turn 1. That way all 5 come in on turn 2 with no reserves roll needed, plus as many of the ground troops that make their 3+ reserve roll as well. The necron player would either move up on his turn, or stay back in this DZ and lose a turn of board control.

This is what I, as the Necron player, would have done had Tyranids attempted this strategy.

AB's would have stayed back slightly about 36" from the Tyranid board edge. Thus, Tyranids would have to to cast Onslaught in order to have any chance at all to hit the barges with the egrubs. They will be fire support and will take out the void shields.

All 3 bargelords would have moved up 30" on T1 for a T2 assault against the VSG and malanthrope.

Now flyrants could have targeted and killed a bargelord on T2 when they came in. However, the lord has a 50% chance to get up and if he does, then the flyrant offense would have been for nothing.

Necron T2 - flyers come in (assuming 2). Flyrants will have 2+ jink cover, but they will have to bear the brunt of 2 flyers and 4 AB's shooting at them and without VSG protection (AB's should have taken them out last turn). Then the bargelords assault the malanthrope and VSG or any other Tyranid reserves that came in.




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 tetrisphreak wrote:
H&A deployment is rough. Even with 24" movement, coming in from the edge on reserve only puts a FMC at the deployment line.

This particular matchup is very tough for tyranids. The av13 wall of skimmers are so difficult to take out, as compared to many of the other lists people see these days. While the necron codex is slated for an update soon, I doubt they'll lose their AV13 spam type lists altogether.

Had all those flyrants who rolled "onslaught" for their power rolled "warp blast" instead, the edge might very well have shifted back in the tyranids' favor. Either way it was tough going, and the result showed how strong and resilient the necron codex still is.

Yeah, the power that I really wanted was Warp Blast. S10 AP2 vs open-topped vehicles or T5 lords can potentially be very good.

I think with the Necron update, they will still be tough and good, but they won't be as good as they are currently. The nerfhammer is definitely going to drop on them. I'd be surprised if it wasn't.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/22 16:18:22



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 jy2 wrote:

Spamming just for the sake of spamming doesn't necessarily make it a good list. This list, while it will give some armies a difficult time, isn't necessarily a better list. That's because it is less balanced than my current list and has a weaker ground presence. Despite all the hoopla about flyers and flying units, an army lives or dies by its ground presence. One of the good things about the Pentyrant list is that the flyrants can land to give it a stronger ground presence. That is why I don't run a pure Necron Airforce. While it is strong and can dominate a lot of matchups, it is not as great of a Take-All-Comer's list and can be countered hard by some army builds. The same goes with this army using the new Necron detachments.

The key here is to create a balanced list.



You could just as easily drop the night scythes and take two more barge lords, the point I was trying to make was that the new FOC gives necrons the ability to change the current dynamic for necrons pretty heavily. It doesn't really matter in this case because your current necron list for this fight is just a bunch of barge lord spam. Taking three of the most powerful unit and putting it into one army doesn't necessarily make it balanced. It's like triptide or triple wraith knights, there doesn't need to be a whole lot of thought into what you do.
   
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Warmonger2757 wrote:
 jy2 wrote:

Spamming just for the sake of spamming doesn't necessarily make it a good list. This list, while it will give some armies a difficult time, isn't necessarily a better list. That's because it is less balanced than my current list and has a weaker ground presence. Despite all the hoopla about flyers and flying units, an army lives or dies by its ground presence. One of the good things about the Pentyrant list is that the flyrants can land to give it a stronger ground presence. That is why I don't run a pure Necron Airforce. While it is strong and can dominate a lot of matchups, it is not as great of a Take-All-Comer's list and can be countered hard by some army builds. The same goes with this army using the new Necron detachments.

The key here is to create a balanced list.


You could just as easily drop the night scythes and take two more barge lords, the point I was trying to make was that the new FOC gives necrons the ability to change the current dynamic for necrons pretty heavily. It doesn't really matter in this case because your current necron list for this fight is just a bunch of barge lord spam. Taking three of the most powerful unit and putting it into one army doesn't necessarily make it balanced. It's like triptide or triple wraith knights, there doesn't need to be a whole lot of thought into what you do.

We'll see if the bargelords are even worth taking when the new Necron codex comes out. Currently, they are usually the all-stars in my battles, much as the flyrants are the all-stars of the Tyranid army in most cases.

BTW, I'm not too big on the new Meherit Dynasty detachment. While it's true that it allows you to legally run 6 AB's, it also requires you to take 5 troops to be able to run normal CAD + Meherit. IMO, that isn't as optimal a configuration as the one that I am currently running. There is just not enough of a counter-assault presence against assault or deathstar armies (and I've ran 6 AB's dual-CAD necrons before).


 Dozer Blades wrote:
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You could even make it drink if your argument was persuasive enough.


This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/12/22 17:05:39



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 jy2 wrote:
Warmonger2757 wrote:
 jy2 wrote:

Spamming just for the sake of spamming doesn't necessarily make it a good list. This list, while it will give some armies a difficult time, isn't necessarily a better list. That's because it is less balanced than my current list and has a weaker ground presence. Despite all the hoopla about flyers and flying units, an army lives or dies by its ground presence. One of the good things about the Pentyrant list is that the flyrants can land to give it a stronger ground presence. That is why I don't run a pure Necron Airforce. While it is strong and can dominate a lot of matchups, it is not as great of a Take-All-Comer's list and can be countered hard by some army builds. The same goes with this army using the new Necron detachments.

The key here is to create a balanced list.


You could just as easily drop the night scythes and take two more barge lords, the point I was trying to make was that the new FOC gives necrons the ability to change the current dynamic for necrons pretty heavily. It doesn't really matter in this case because your current necron list for this fight is just a bunch of barge lord spam. Taking three of the most powerful unit and putting it into one army doesn't necessarily make it balanced. It's like triptide or triple wraith knights, there doesn't need to be a whole lot of thought into what you do.

We'll see if the bargelords are even worth taking when the new Necron codex comes out. Currently, they are usually the all-stars in my battles, much as the flyrants are the all-stars of the Tyranid army in most cases.

BTW, I'm not too big on the new Meherit Dynasty detachment. While it's true that it allows you to legally run 6 AB's, it also requires you to take 5 troops to be able to run normal CAD + Meherit. IMO, that isn't as optimal a configuration as the one that I am currently running. There is just not enough of a counter-assault presence against assault or deathstar armies (and I've ran 6 AB's dual-CAD necrons before).



That is a minor disadvantage at this point but I think we will see what happens with the new codex. If the Mephrit dynasty is being represented, I have a feeling we are going to see a lot more organizations for necrons. This SOB book and white dwarf is the first love necrons have had since the Tranny C'Tan.

Have you considered fighting a Dark Eldar Army? Razorwings with splinter cannons and disintergrators would be a pretty traumatic event for a hive tyrant. Venom spam could give your hive tyrants fits as well. Like you said, every army has a hard counter and razorwings and deep striking venoms would be able to get the best of most of what is in your army especially with the raider detachment and a null deployment.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/12/22 17:47:25


 
   
 
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