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 Grey Templar wrote:
Lol whut, I would say maybe 2 of those demands are even approaching reasonable. You want free tuition if you work for the university? Don't let the door hit you on the way out champ.

Tuition remittance for graduate employees is standard, child. If that doesn't exist, then Mizzou has devolved.

 Vaktathi wrote:

There's also often a limited number of assistantships available that doesn't match the number of spots they have for grad students. They may only need 5 people to set up lab experiments, but may have room for 20 grad students.

If you aren't working for the school, then you aren't a graduate employee.

 dogma wrote:

If you aren't working for the school, then you aren't a graduate employee.

Right, but my point was in response to the earlier statement "If the school you want to go to isn't going to give you tuition remission and pay you to go to grad school, you need to find a school that will."

I also know that I didn't get my tuition waved while working as a graduate employee, it just meant I could pay rent without having to take on additional loans.

But I wasn't in STEM either.

You know its serious when someone smears a poop swastika on the wall.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Right, but my point was in response to the earlier statement "If the school you want to go to isn't going to give you tuition remission and pay you to go to grad school, you need to find a school that will."

A wise statement.

 Vaktathi wrote:

I also know that I didn't get my tuition waved while working as a graduate employee, it just meant I could pay rent without having to take on additional loans.

So you went to a crap school?

 Vaktathi wrote:

But I wasn't in STEM either.

Nor was I, but I got my tuition waved. Didn't even have to fight for it.

 dogma wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Right, but my point was in response to the earlier statement "If the school you want to go to isn't going to give you tuition remission and pay you to go to grad school, you need to find a school that will."

A wise statement.

Sure, but beside my point. Expecting to get be able to get paid to go to grad school is a wee bit silly, as these positions are often more limited than the number of seats they have, and typically tend to focused more in STEM programs than other areas of study. It might make sense to pay say, a Physics grad student as an employee because they're setting up labs and operating specialized equipment for a professor to do research for the school who then sells the patent to a company which in turn funds school operations.

On the other hand, art historians & business profs don't need lab assistants to operate specialized machinery that require someone with a couple of years of advanced training to operate.

So you went to a crap school?

Given that it's ranked as one of the top business schools in the country, I'd assume not. They just didn't pay people to go to school. Of all my other pals that have masters degrees or phd's, only one didn't have to pay tuition, and that was because he was qualified to operate equipment like an industrial level cyclotron.

Nor was I, but I got my tuition waved. Didn't even have to fight for it.

Well, that's great, but the overwhelmingly vast majority of grad students don't get paid to go to school. *Expecting* that as a matter of course is rather ridiculous.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Sure, but beside my point. Expecting to get be able to get paid to go to grad school is a wee bit silly, as these positions are often more limited than the number of seats they have, and typically tend to focused more in STEM programs than other areas of study.

So your argument has now moved towards compensation outside the remission of tuition?

 Vaktathi wrote:

On the other hand, art historians & business profs don't need lab assistants to operate specialized machinery that require someone with a couple of years of advanced training to operate.

What about art labs? Any professor of the history of art will need one, dangerous chemicals and all that.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Given that it's ranked as one of the top business schools in the country, I'd assume not.

Being ranked as a top business school is like getting a Gold Star in Kindergarten .

 dogma wrote:


Being ranked as a top business school is like getting a Gold Star in Kindergarten .

It's totally true though. It's like saying you got an A in Human Communications. How bad do you have to feth up to not get an A in Human Communications

 LordofHats wrote:
It's like saying you got an A in Human Communications. How bad do you have to feth up to not get an A in Human Communications

Me? Fail English? Unpossible!

Hey, on the one hand you actually bothered to learn the rules for Whom. I've had English teachers who don't know that gak

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lol whut, I would say maybe 2 of those demands are even approaching reasonable. You want free tuition if you work for the university? Don't let the door hit you on the way out champ.

Advantage of living in Sweden: all universities are free.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lol whut, I would say maybe 2 of those demands are even approaching reasonable. You want free tuition if you work for the university? Don't let the door hit you on the way out champ.

Advantage of living in Sweden: all universities are free.

Yeah, but first, that is socialism, and you know that THAT is worse than Mr. Hilter and his friendly chaps, and second: MUUUUUURICA!

Back on topic: What is the disavantage for the school not having black players playing? Losing matches and consequently drop of sponsor contracts?
How much of their yearly budget comes from private sources?

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/14081655/missouri-tigers-coach-gary-pinkel-says-players-coaches-united-racial-incidents


Basically, the black football players at U. of Missouri have announced that they will not play football until university president resigns and school "fixes" racial problems...


Any thoughts on what will happen, how this will play out?

Now we see who has more power, the football team or the President.

While some of these acts shouldn't be classified as free speech but are vandalism, others are, and this is a public school, IIRC.


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 hotsauceman1 wrote:
"A Swastika was drawn on a dorm room wall"
And what is the president supposed to do about that? Or about a racially charged attack? All he can do is condemn the stuff.
In all likelyhood, the students will likely loose any scholarship they have. The School is not gonna replace a president for this.

I imagine the power of PC will win with ease here.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
So they're angry that the University President didn't immediately comment on some racial heckling? That seems a little extreme, is there more info on why there is some hatred for the administration? A week doesn't seem that long to wait for some official statement. Maybe on the Swastika, but the verbal insult seems pretty minor. I could see it easily taking a week for that even to filter its way onto the presidents desk. Its not like he knows or can control everything that goes on on campus.

Well, when I looked up further info, according to USA Today, the poo-swastika was merely the "most recent" of a number of racial incidents that have happened since school started this year. And that wasn't in a dorm room, but apparently a common/public area of a dorm building.

That should be pursued as a crime.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lol whut, I would say maybe 2 of those demands are even approaching reasonable. You want free tuition if you work for the university? Don't let the door hit you on the way out champ.

Often grad students (at least doctoral) get free tuition if they are working for the university, at least in certain fields.
EDIT: I see there was a whole discussion on that, including insulting schools and areas of scholarship. Way to go Dogma.
We can't all get a degree in advanced basket weaving.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lol whut, I would say maybe 2 of those demands are even approaching reasonable. You want free tuition if you work for the university? Don't let the door hit you on the way out champ.

Advantage of living in Sweden: all universities are free.

Correction: Someone else is paying for them, not me! Lets party!

 dogma wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Sure, but beside my point. Expecting to get be able to get paid to go to grad school is a wee bit silly, as these positions are often more limited than the number of seats they have, and typically tend to focused more in STEM programs than other areas of study.

So your argument has now moved towards compensation outside the remission of tuition?

no, my point was that if you are looking to go to grad school, you can't just expect to get both paid and have no tuition to pay as a matter of course.

 Vaktathi wrote:

On the other hand, art historians & business profs don't need lab assistants to operate specialized machinery that require someone with a couple of years of advanced training to operate.

What about art labs? Any professor of the history of art will need one, dangerous chemicals and all that.

I'm sure you can cherry pick a couple examples for anything, but most aren't going to have enough to spread to all grad students.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Given that it's ranked as one of the top business schools in the country, I'd assume not.

Being ranked as a top business school is like getting a Gold Star in Kindergarten .

Thats ok. The graduates of the business schools will be telling everyone else what to do later...;-)

 treslibras wrote:

Back on topic: What is the disavantage for the school not having black players playing? Losing matches and consequently drop of sponsor contracts?
How much of their yearly budget comes from private sources?

Well, Mizzou (the utterly stupid abbreviation for "University of Missouri") is an SEC (Southeastern Conference) school, which is a conference that views themselves as gods gift to athletics, particularly football.

Many people think that, in order to attract students you need an awesome football program, so they dump millions into it. It's utterly ridiculous.

But, AFAIK, basically none of the annual budget comes from private sources, because a number of facilities are actually donated by local rich folks (as an example, Phil Knight donated several million bucks and built a new, super hi-tech lockeroom for the Oregon Ducks football team)


Now, yes, for many schools, having a good sports team will mean more air-time, which will mean more money in the school's coffer, which means more money for the astronomy program to look at blinky lights in the nigh sky. But, on the whole, college sports is a drain on most school's resources.

They don't appear to be playing Aggieville, so my concern is much less.

Meanwhile of extreme importance, University of Houston is 9-0 and #1 in the West. In your face Liechtenstein!

Sounds like faculty is joining the show.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/11/09/missouri-to-boycott-season-until-university-president-steps-down/?intcmp=hpbt1

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 treslibras wrote:

Back on topic: What is the disavantage for the school not having black players playing? Losing matches and consequently drop of sponsor contracts?
How much of their yearly budget comes from private sources?

Well, Mizzou (the utterly stupid abbreviation for "University of Missouri") is an SEC (Southeastern Conference) school, which is a conference that views themselves as gods gift to athletics, particularly football.

Many people think that, in order to attract students you need an awesome football program, so they dump millions into it. It's utterly ridiculous.

But, AFAIK, basically none of the annual budget comes from private sources, because a number of facilities are actually donated by local rich folks (as an example, Phil Knight donated several million bucks and built a new, super hi-tech lockeroom for the Oregon Ducks football team)


Now, yes, for many schools, having a good sports team will mean more air-time, which will mean more money in the school's coffer, which means more money for the astronomy program to look at blinky lights in the nigh sky. But, on the whole, college sports is a drain on most school's resources.

As evidenced by all those huge schools with no sports program...

Wolfe Resigned so there's no more Racism!!! YAAAA!

I feel sorry for the lucky bastard who fills his shoes.

Sounds like time to revoke some scholarships.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:


As evidenced by all those huge schools with no sports program...

I'm not saying schools shouldn't have sports. I am pointing out however, that there are numerous articles out there that flat out state that the athletic department of the majority of colleges and universities are a net drain on school resources.

Evidently, there was already bad blood between the Pres and the university faculty, with votes of no confidence prior to this.

Wolfe just resigned. Not a good precedent in my opinion.


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 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:


As evidenced by all those huge schools with no sports program...

I'm not saying schools shouldn't have sports. I am pointing out however, that there are numerous articles out there that flat out state that the athletic department of the majority of colleges and universities are a net drain on school resources.

And football and men's basketball at rarely the reasons.

Title IX can be blamed in large part.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 dogma wrote:

If you aren't working for the school, then you aren't a graduate employee.

Right, but my point was in response to the earlier statement "If the school you want to go to isn't going to give you tuition remission and pay you to go to grad school, you need to find a school that will."

I also know that I didn't get my tuition waved while working as a graduate employee, it just meant I could pay rent without having to take on additional loans.

But I wasn't in STEM either.

I wasn't in a STEM field either, and I got tuition remission, health insurance, and got paid in addition to that. And like Dogma, I didn't have to fight for it.

I'm not sure why you think STEM fields are the only ones that offer benefits. As I mentioned before, in many fields, grad students teach first and second year classes and serve as research assistants as well. All humanities graduate programs that I am aware of (and the only ones that I would considering applying for) offer full funding for graduate assistants. I also realize that at competitive programs, the number of assistantships is smaller than the number of student slots, but that brings me back to my original advice, that if the school you want to go to won't pay you to go to grad school, you need to find one that will. If you can't find a program that will offer you funding, you might want to reconsider whether or not grad school is really the best choice for you (to be clear, I'm not talking about you personally). At the very least, if you're going to grad school unfunded, you should probably have a very clear picture of what the graduate degree is going to do for you.

That said, business programs, law programs, and medical programs might not be as likely to offer assistantships depending on the school. But pretty much anything in the humanities and STEM should have robust programs that offer funding for grad students. And that includes things like art history, in which grad students will often teach first year courses or run undergraduate seminars or discussion sections, among a variety of other incidental duties.

If you're trying to get an MBA, a law degree, or a medical degree, there are still ways to get funding, however, but you might have to look at things not directly related to your field, like working in Residence Life. But in STEM as well as humanities fields, unless you're independently wealthy, if you're not getting funding, you're doing it wrong.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 cincydooley wrote:
And football and men's basketball at rarely the reasons.

lol. I'll admit that it depends on the school, but there are many men's football and basketball programs that are drains on university resources.

wow.



Looks like the Pres Wolfe resigned too.

And he resigned....


Well this bodes well for higher education in America.

Higher education is already plagued by SJW, Trigger Warnings and other things.
Oh well, he will probably get an even cushier job somewhere else.

 Peter Wiggin wrote:

Well this bodes well for higher education in America.

I wouldn't worry too much about that... Plenty of other schools are fething it up all on their own.

Hell, in my poly-sci class, we were just covering education and it's rising costs... You know that UW has something like 37k students, and 12k administrators? Seriously. Those administrators are not faculty, they don't teach or research or do much of anything. And quite a number of them are severely redundant.

 Vaktathi wrote:
no, my point was that if you are looking to go to grad school, you can't just expect to get both paid and have no tuition to pay as a matter of course.

So your argument has moved beyond remission, and the word you should have used to begin your statement is "Yes.".

 Vaktathi wrote:

I'm sure you can cherry pick a couple examples for anything, but most aren't going to have enough to spread to all grad students.

The vast majority of the full-time graduate programs I am aware of limit their admissions according to the amount of money they have available. Law and medicine are obvious exceptions, as is business, but for the most part that statement holds true.

Don't worry bros

 CptJake wrote:


wow.



Looks like the Pres Wolfe resigned too.

Started with Michael Brown? o.O This'll end good...

It also shows that the athletic department has a lot of control over universities.