Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
But don't forget the main point - you're already familiar with most French words, which is a huge advantage.

The most important way to learn a language is not through translation or you will constantly try to translate it which will melt the brain.
= flocon de neige.
NOT
= snowflake = flocon de neige.

If I get into another discussion on "closing the light" or "I have cold" again I may lose my little bilingual country mind.

 Talizvar wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
But don't forget the main point - you're already familiar with most French words, which is a huge advantage.

The most important way to learn a language is not through translation or you will constantly try to translate it which will melt the brain.
= flocon de neige.
NOT
= snowflake = flocon de neige.

If I get into another discussion on "closing the light" or "I have cold" again I may lose my little bilingual country mind.

No disrespect, but that confuses the hell out of me

Par exEmple. With an "E" instead of an "A".
Beware of these kind of false friends. For example "Gallery" gets two "l" in english, but "galerie" only has one in french.

There are also words that are similar, but don't mean the same at all. For instance... well "instance" precisely. It means "example" in english but refer to authority in french.


But well, that was just for chatting. In fact I came here 'cause I have another interesting podcast to watch.

It's about Warmachine/Horde : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOc4BpIm_MQ&feature=share

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 Talizvar wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
But don't forget the main point - you're already familiar with most French words, which is a huge advantage.

The most important way to learn a language is not through translation or you will constantly try to translate it which will melt the brain.
= flocon de neige.
NOT
= snowflake = flocon de neige.
If I get into another discussion on "closing the light" or "I have cold" again I may lose my little bilingual country mind.

No disrespect, but that confuses the hell out of me

As the prior poster alluded to, do not get sucked into the trap of equating an English word with a French word 1 to 1.
They may look the same at times and have a completely different meaning.
Trying to translate directly from English to French does not work.

We say "I am cold." direct translation into French is "Je suis froid." which is incorrect, it would mean more like "I am emotionally cold", not the meaning we are looking for.
Correct for "I feel cold (and need to warm up)" is "J'ai froid" where a direct English translation is "I have cold" not to be confused with the sniffles.

You need to look at this like:
How I feel in chilly weather = J'ai froid.

Try to equate a circumstance or feeling to the words or phrase in French directly: try not to interpose the English meaning (pretend you do not know how to speak English...).
My son actually thinks in French and English and has a heck of a time pairing up the French-English meanings: he likes to use the most "appropriate" one at the time and does not treat them as equivalent.

The best I could do to explain it.

If I can find out who decides what inanimate object is male or female in French there will be a reckoning.
it is the single easiest way to tell a newbie to the language: not assigning the right gender to an object.

Currently, I'm attempting to bypass the english part of my brain by imagining the concept behind a french word or phrase. This seems to help link a word/phrase to a meaning, rather than a definition.

 Talizvar wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
But don't forget the main point - you're already familiar with most French words, which is a huge advantage.

The most important way to learn a language is not through translation or you will constantly try to translate it which will melt the brain.
= flocon de neige.
NOT
= snowflake = flocon de neige.

If I get into another discussion on "closing the light" or "I have cold" again I may lose my little bilingual country mind.

Seems like a great idea, but how does that work for abstract or grammatical concepts?

In my experience, if you practice enough, translating is not an issue. It is a stage you need to go through, but the more you practicise, the more fluent you become and the less you will need to translate. Eventually you will realise you have stopped translating completely and are thinking directly in the other language. That is how it goes for me at least.

I've skipped that part for some of my more recent words - mentally associating a word with a thought process/concept, rather than looking at the English translation. I'm on about day 6 of trying to learn French, and for the last two I've been attempting this, and it works like a miracle.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Speaking of "closing the night", how on earth does that work?

 Talizvar wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
But don't forget the main point - you're already familiar with most French words, which is a huge advantage.

The most important way to learn a language is not through translation or you will constantly try to translate it which will melt the brain.
= flocon de neige.
NOT
= snowflake = flocon de neige.

If I get into another discussion on "closing the light" or "I have cold" again I may lose my little bilingual country mind.

This is super-right. This is how I learned English.

 Selym wrote:
...
Speaking of "closing the night", how on earth does that work?

Closing the light
word by word translation: fermer la lumière.
Proper french: éteindre la lumiere

Note: you can say "fermer la lumiere" and everybody will understand.

I use: https://www.duolingo.com/ to learn German and to practice my Irish.

It's pretty cool, it's structured, forces you to listen and pronounce stuff properly, and drills your grammar and so on. And it's structured so that you get "granted XP" for doing stuff and earn little bonuses to make it more fun. Strongly recommend giving it a look.

Duolinguo is actually pretty good. Getting through some stuff I didn't realise I had picked up already, which is a nice morale boost


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Update for stuff that seems to work:

-I now have a french radio app on my phone, which I listen to quite a bit.

-I have a vocab app that presents a word, the translation and gives a recording of it.

-Got a French-English dictionary and phrasebook on my phone, for quick references.

-I've set my browser, Wikipedia, Google, YouTube and my PC games to French.

-I now use Duolinguo.

I'm just curious Selym, what did your school force you to learn instead of French?
I thought a language GCSE was mandatory.

Amusingly I found my old exercise book this morning when cleaning the bedroom, and most of it consists of fictional holidays and jobs to practise tenses.

Last year I worked in a bank where they paid me to remove the bins.
Live the dream, teenage me

I was "taught" french, but it was so poorly done that not only did I not remember any words, but I also had to unlearn pronunciations they gave us. They didn't teach us grammar, they only used really slow audio samples that consisted of the most basic tourist phrases, and spent the majority of the time not really doing anything.

Alors mon Selym, comment se passe ton apprentissage de la langue française ? ^^

(So, my Dear Selym, how is your french learning ?)

Serviteur,

Morikun

Shrug. I've learned a smattering of French, German, Russian and others from X-Men comics. So why not a war games forum?

My french is slowly growing, so I'm on track.

My current goal is to be capable of light conversation by the end of March. If I can exceed that goal early, I will.

The use of a vocab trainer, Duolinguo, French radio and educational YouTube videos is proving effective.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just tried singing in French - my tongue has moved further to the back of my throat, and my throat feels odd. Apparently that means I'm doing it right.

I butchered every single word.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Shrug. I've learned a smattering of French, German, Russian and others from X-Men comics. So why not a war games forum?

I saw some of the things Marvel writers take for German in comics... Here is my reaction at those attemtps in roder of orkmotion:

Seriously, you learn more German from a Kraftwerk song.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Shrug. I've learned a smattering of French, German, Russian and others from X-Men comics. So why not a war games forum?

а sejchas ty umeesh' govorit' po-russkij?

It would be very amazing if you could learn a language from just comics. Comics are pretty helpful in learning a language though. More so than normal books, because comics often contain more simple and informal language that is easier to understand. You also get pictures along with the text to help understanding the text.
Especially if you are learning French, you should most definitely read French comics. There is a very rich tradition of French-language comics from Belgium and France.

And if you decide to learn high level stuff from comics look for Achile Talon by Greg. It's like reading philosophy while laughing. Et merde,que sa langue est dure...

konst80hummel wrote:
And if you decide to learn high level stuff from comics look for Achile Talon by Greg. It's like reading philosophy while laughing. Et merde,que sa langue est dure...

You're absolutely right !! Achille Talon is a fantastic comic book... But if you want to appreciate all the taste of it, you must know a lot of words... But it's an excellent way to learn french ^^

Serviteur,

Morikun

If you want to hurt yourself with high level stuff, you can listen to this :



(It's a audio-only fiction about a group of RPG players in a fantasy setting)

It's full of clever (well, usually clever) and hilarious puns, some pretty good poetry, fancy vocabulary and A LOT of French references that even a French person cannot get.

(For more low-level stuff of the same kind, you can try to listen to Le Donjon de Naheulbeuk. It's still hilarious, but easier to understand)

handy stuff

 treslibras wrote:
Seriously, you learn more German from a Kraftwerk song.

Rammstein! Laibach! Wait, do Laibach use correct German?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Iron_Captain wrote:
Especially if you are learning French, you should most definitely read French comics. There is a very rich tradition of French-language comics from Belgium and France.

Indeed. Tell us what kind of comics you like (short gag strips, long stories, historical setting, sy-fy settings, heroic fantasy settings, humour, adult, edgy, …) and we'll tell you which comics to try out .

I would also recommend picking up some French <<bande dessinée>>. Some popular ones include Blacksad, Launfest de Troy, XIII, Sillage, and the work of Enki Bilal. The one that's occupying my time at the moment is <<Les Sentinelles>> which is an alternate history of the First World War with steampunk cyborgs and superhumans. For deep cuts, you can look through izneo.fr (make sure you change the language to French) and digitally read whatever catches your eye.

Oh, and get your news from lemonde.fr every now and again. After two years of high school French I was able to keep up with most of what was in it.