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 Bryan01 wrote:
After facing quad mortars, yeah, for 12 Melta bombs a pop, they are just a tad bit good. They are pretty good vs most target types as well.

Even if the shatter shells became a 10pt upgrade in 40k too they'd still be amazing. Also, the fact that they are not vehicles is a huge bonus. The Land Raider ideas do sound like a lot of fun but I think I'll pass until LRs get a noticeable point cost reduction.

Why not ally in a Command Leman Russ punisher with heavy bolter hull and sponson weapons, backed up by a second Punisher or Eradicator? Throw a veteran squad with 2x flamers and a Heavy Flamer in a Chimera with a hull and turret mounted Heavy Flamer as the allied troops choice with the Leman Russ HQ and call it a day.

That's 40 Punisher cannon shots, half of which hit on 3+, with 18 Heavy Bolter shots, of which 9 hit on 3+ coming from 2 tanks. Then you have a Chimera that can potentially kick out 2x Heavy Flamer templates a turn (if stationary) and dump a squad out that can drop three more templates as well, two flamer and one heavy flamer.

If that doesn't make a dent in a 30 man ork mob I don't know what will.

For extra icing, throw a pair, or even a trio, of Wyverns in the allied section as a heavy support choice and rain mortars down on one squad while your punisher cannon(s) rip into other infantry.

Just thinking out loud. Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

 Red__Thirst wrote:
Why not ally in a Command Leman Russ punisher with heavy bolter hull and sponson weapons, backed up by a second Punisher or Eradicator? Throw a veteran squad with 2x flamers and a Heavy Flamer in a Chimera with a hull and turret mounted Heavy Flamer as the allied troops choice with the Leman Russ HQ and call it a day.

That's 40 Punisher cannon shots, half of which hit on 3+, with 18 Heavy Bolter shots, of which 9 hit on 3+ coming from 2 tanks. Then you have a Chimera that can potentially kick out 2x Heavy Flamer templates a turn (if stationary) and dump a squad out that can drop three more templates as well, two flamer and one heavy flamer.

If that doesn't make a dent in a 30 man ork mob I don't know what will.

For extra icing, throw a pair, or even a trio, of Wyverns in the allied section as a heavy support choice and rain mortars down on one squad while your punisher cannon(s) rip into other infantry.

Just thinking out loud. Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

While what you wrote is a valid suggestion it most definitely does not help me with how to deal with hordes as DA. This is how you deal with hordes as IG.

Lion's Blade Detachment with two Demi-companies, take the free rhinos and use them to build a wall to protect your guys. Pick some of them off with long-ranged weapons (plasma cannons, frag missile launchers, heavy bolters). By the time they are able to reach you, and after BS4 Overwatch, you'll have weakened them enough to defeat them in close combat.

or you know just block them off with your tanks

Cause morale checks early in your turn with tank shock, and when they get a fail capitalise on that by spamming morale checks at every opportunity to keep forcing addition fall back moves (more tank shocks, 25% casualties from psychics and again from shooting) to try push them off the board.

Once you have a few enemy units falling back (again tank shock spam is useful to achieve this) use something disposable to declare multiple charges against the falling back units and hopefully knock out a couple due to failed regroup tests.

I believe zombies are fearless and orks have mob rule making morale a bit unreliable as a strategy.

Id maybe go with psychic shriek libbies and walls of bolter marines with flamer/plasmacannon. Triple Worldwinds with shred isnt a bad call, vindicators are good too but like you say the rest of his army will probably be gunning for it. At the end of the day, things like zombies are a real pain for DA's

Thinking about it, 4 cannon plasmadev squads would be pretty good. Maybe in a bunker with an ammo store to reroll gets hot. 4 templates, Kills zombies and orks on a 2+ and ignores zombies FNP. Also has the bonus of being effective against ork vehicles, bikes, and MA, and pretty much anything CSM have barring helldrakes and tanks. Am I right in thinking plasmacannons are 4 meltabombs each? That makes a 150pt Unit (215 with the ammo bunker) that should be pretty points effective?

Bobug wrote:
I believe zombies are fearless and orks have mob rule making morale a bit unreliable as a strategy.

Id maybe go with psychic shriek libbies and walls of bolter marines with flamer/plasmacannon. Triple Worldwinds with shred isnt a bad call, vindicators are good too but like you say the rest of his army will probably be gunning for it. At the end of the day, things like zombies are a real pain for DA's

Thinking about it, 4 cannon plasmadev squads would be pretty good. Maybe in a bunker with an ammo store to reroll gets hot. 4 templates, Kills zombies and orks on a 2+ and ignores zombies FNP. Also has the bonus of being effective against ork vehicles, bikes, and MA, and pretty much anything CSM have barring helldrakes and tanks. Am I right in thinking plasmacannons are 4 meltabombs each? That makes a 150pt Unit (215 with the ammo bunker) that should be pretty points effective?

I think PCs are 3 melta bombs so they'd be a bit more effective than what you calculated. Bonus points for a suggestion that is not reliant on vehicles but the ammo store won't allow you to reroll Gets Hot if you don't roll to hit at all.

Oh damn of course my bad. Even so, maybe a viable solution. And flexible vs the other units likely to be encountered should the zombies be out of LOS or range.

Tarpit the tarpit, those zombies can't do anything when there's a giant brick of av 12 in front of it. (Dreadnought)

psychic shriek does a lot of wounds against zombies with theur leadership of 0.

peirceg wrote:
psychic shriek does a lot of wounds against zombies with theur leadership of 0.

But whatever the amount of wounds you do, 4+ FNP will save the day. So at most, you are expecting to see 6 dead zombies. On average 3,5.

For zombies perhaps it might be an idea to think outside the box and use a Dreadnought, they can multi-assault a couple of units and keep them tied up for the rest of the game with something they cannot hurt or run away from? Since the are fearless, they cannot opt to run away using 'our weapons are useless!'and because they aren't being destroyed they will not be recycled.

Orks just die to bolt guns and forcing moral effects...

I never had problems against hordes with DA except with deathwing.

Ravenwing has the allmighty Ravenwing Support Squadron that usually uses Typhoons. 6 Blasts is VERY nice
;-)

A interrogator Chappy on Bike with Blackknights destroys large blobs easily, specially with 1 grenade launcher to set up your assault.

Even a unit of Deathwing Terminators can help you alot when deepstriking because of twin linked + Assault cannon + splitfire. Finish of smaller squads or really hurt bigger blobs of orcs/guardsmen/nids.

 Lammikkovalas wrote:

peirceg wrote:
psychic shriek does a lot of wounds against zombies with theur leadership of 0.

But whatever the amount of wounds you do, 4+ FNP will save the day. So at most, you are expecting to see 6 dead zombies. On average 3,5.

3d6 - ld0 = an average of 3.5?

3 man bike squad with 2 flamers is 90 points. wall of death + hit and run makes it a surprisingly efficient unit

also, vengeance speeders. large blast with no fnp for anyone

If you know your opponent is playing hoard, throw a Dread at em. Boyz can't really do jack to them. You don't need to kill the Boyz, you just need to tie them up for a few rounds. The only thing with a Boyz squad to worry about is the PK. But even if it takes that Nob 2 turns to hack that dread apart, that's two turns you don't have to deal with that squad.

Against Zombies, dreads can just sit there and tarpit the entire squad. They won't be doing anything to the dread and they'll go no where all game.

Remember, you don't need to KILL EVERYTHING to win. Just keep their numbers busy with stuff they can't hurt but will also struggle to get away from even if they use 'our weapons are useless'.

 jokerkd wrote:

 Lammikkovalas wrote:

peirceg wrote:
psychic shriek does a lot of wounds against zombies with theur leadership of 0.

But whatever the amount of wounds you do, 4+ FNP will save the day. So at most, you are expecting to see 6 dead zombies. On average 3,5.

3d6 - ld0 = an average of 3.5?

3 man bike squad with 2 flamers is 90 points. wall of death + hit and run makes it a surprisingly efficient unit

also, vengeance speeders. large blast with no fnp for anyone

Forgot that it was 3d6, that does increase the average to 5 and with three sixes up to 9 wounds. Nothing too spectacular still.

Flamer squads don't do much after you force them to jink, same with Vengeance.