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I actually would like the winning White Scars lists Linked. I'm very curious what people are doing with them and could serve as inspiration for my Minotaurs.
Falcon is busy inputting data from London GT by hand, it might be a week or two before it goes on 40kstats. You might be able to find it on best coast pairings. I think I heard something about index bikes w. SS and storm bolters, that might've been the Rhino's UM list, I didn't pay too close attention to what was what in the podcasts I listened to about the subject.
Yeah unfortunately any list that is using index units or wargear is on the clock from going bye bye, see legends.
I do think the other thing that might help marines initialy is they have been so bad no-one has probably even had to consider how their lost beats a marine list for over a year as even deathwatch with all their marines +1,+1,+1,+1 ness were more a soup garnish than an actual functional codex.
I am worried that it's going to be a bit of a wild ride for the first few months and while it does look like GW might have over done some of the fixes I just hope they actually take the time to understand why certain units & subfaction rules are problems instead of just going nuclear and making a lot of stuff unplayable for anything but 1 chapter.
Ice_can wrote: Yeah unfortunately any list that is using index units or wargear is on the clock from going bye bye, see legends.
I do think the other thing that might help marines initialy is they have been so bad no-one has probably even had to consider how their lost beats a marine list for over a year as even deathwatch with all their marines +1,+1,+1,+1 ness were more a soup garnish than an actual functional codex.
I am worried that it's going to be a bit of a wild ride for the first few months and while it does look like GW might have over done some of the fixes I just hope they actually take the time to understand why certain units & subfaction rules are problems instead of just going nuclear and making a lot of stuff unplayable for anything but 1 chapter.
I'm also worried it'll be a wild ride. I want GW to step back and let the community come up with solutions in the meta instead of listening to people who haven't even played a game complain about how OP it is. All this crybaby nonsense makes me think the community cannot be trusted with assessing the power of anything, ever.
Ice_can wrote: Yeah unfortunately any list that is using index units or wargear is on the clock from going bye bye, see legends.
I do think the other thing that might help marines initialy is they have been so bad no-one has probably even had to consider how their lost beats a marine list for over a year as even deathwatch with all their marines +1,+1,+1,+1 ness were more a soup garnish than an actual functional codex.
I am worried that it's going to be a bit of a wild ride for the first few months and while it does look like GW might have over done some of the fixes I just hope they actually take the time to understand why certain units & subfaction rules are problems instead of just going nuclear and making a lot of stuff unplayable for anything but 1 chapter.
I'm also worried it'll be a wild ride. I want GW to step back and let the community come up with solutions in the meta instead of listening to people who haven't even played a game complain about how OP it is. All this crybaby nonsense makes me think the community cannot be trusted with assessing the power of anything, ever.
'Communities' can't be trusted with anything by their very nature. They're just collections of individuals with their own opinions and different levels of information.
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote: Odds are, assuming he wants to be in melee, whatever he fights wasn't going to survive him anyway, except a knight or something. He'll be making like 6 Thunder Hammer attacks on the forward swing. If he doesn't take first activation, then activate for 2CP and whack him before he goes. Basically, falling back out of melee doesn't add a whole lot of protection assuming he's attacking infantry units; and most vehicle units can't fight back anyway and will die on your turn so he'll be free to charge again anyway. It's really basically just retreating away from knights.
Boyz are not impressed by thunder hammer attacks.
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote: Odds are, assuming he wants to be in melee, whatever he fights wasn't going to survive him anyway, except a knight or something. He'll be making like 6 Thunder Hammer attacks on the forward swing. If he doesn't take first activation, then activate for 2CP and whack him before he goes. Basically, falling back out of melee doesn't add a whole lot of protection assuming he's attacking infantry units; and most vehicle units can't fight back anyway and will die on your turn so he'll be free to charge again anyway. It's really basically just retreating away from knights.
Boyz are not impressed by thunder hammer attacks.
As is any chaff block really?
I mean if you manage to propperly tarpit him via tripointing then it's game over.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
You are pretty unlikely to tri-point a marine character without consolidating. Usual order of operations for boyz is deep strike - shoot - fight - enemy falls back and shoots/charges a ton of primaris into the fray - boyz are wiped out.
Then again, I'm not too worried about one dude with a hammer.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/09/18 11:23:03
7 Ork facts people always get wrong: Ragnar did not win against Thrakka, but suffered two crushing defeats within a few days of each other. A lasgun is powerful enough to sever an ork's appendage or head in a single, well aimed shot. Orks meks have a better understanding of electrics and mechanics than most Tech Priests. Orks actually do not think that purple makes them harder to see. The joke was made canon by Alex Stewart's Caphias Cain books. Gharkull Blackfang did not even come close to killing the emperor. Orks can be corrupted by chaos, but few of them have any interest in what chaos offers. Orks do not have the power of believe.
As I implied in my first post, my main objection to this is that it is so thematically inappropriate. Why on Terra do Iron Hands of all chapters get such an amazing hit and run stratagem? If it was White Scars it would make perfect sense.
Crimson wrote: As I implied in my first post, my main objection to this is that it is so thematically inappropriate. Why on Terra do Iron Hands of all chapters get such an amazing hit and run stratagem? If it was White Scars it would make perfect sense.
maybe they are the only ones emotionless enough to not move towards the nearest enemy? ratehr than following the passion of combat to reach the nearest foe they pull a Vulkin and this target over there is more logical.
My guess is that it was meant to be used to breach a bubble then consolidate into the unit behind it, and GW didn't consider that people would use it to run away from fights
flandarz wrote: My guess is that it was meant to be used to breach a bubble then consolidate into the unit behind it, and GW didn't consider that people would use it to run away from fights
Simple FAQ: add that the unit must end such a move within 1" of an enemy model.
Crimson wrote: As I implied in my first post, my main objection to this is that it is so thematically inappropriate. Why on Terra do Iron Hands of all chapters get such an amazing hit and run stratagem? If it was White Scars it would make perfect sense.
maybe they are the only ones emotionless enough to not move towards the nearest enemy? ratehr than following the passion of combat to reach the nearest foe they pull a Vulkin and this target over there is more logical.
Damn. So all it takes is some emotional restraint to be able to charge some Eldar Aspect warriors with inhumanly fast reflexes, hit them with a power fist and flee before they can even react?
I actually would like the winning White Scars lists Linked. I'm very curious what people are doing with them and could serve as inspiration for my Minotaurs.
Falcon is busy inputting data from London GT by hand, it might be a week or two before it goes on 40kstats. You might be able to find it on best coast pairings. I think I heard something about index bikes w. SS and storm bolters, that might've been the Rhino's UM list, I didn't pay too close attention to what was what in the podcasts I listened to about the subject.
What does the London GT have to do with a winning White Scars list? The Invitational and Open were both won by Eldar Flyer lists.
The highest placing SM was Ultramarines. White Scars was 4th
That is a lot of models. Do White Scares have access to the regular marines Thunderfire cannon stuff,?
If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain.
Crimson wrote: Well, the Iron Hands are known for their swift hit and run tactics. This is also why their land speeders and attack bikes are much better than those of less mobile chapters such as White Scars.
So they can use normal space marine relice,stratas and psychic powers too?
If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain.
I kind of a didn't expect that. So let me guess taking the phobos units as IH or WS is legal too? Is there anything non supplement chapter get, that the supplement don't get ?
If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain.
But then why not make the supplement books, have all the marine stuff too, if they have access to all the stuff. this way everyone has to buy at least 2 books instead of 1. And if they want to try out a different chapter, they have to spend even more money on the supplements.
If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain.
Karol wrote: But then why not make the supplement books, have all the marine stuff too, if they have access to all the stuff. this way everyone has to buy at least 2 books instead of 1. And if they want to try out a different chapter, they have to spend even more money on the supplements.
It certainly is a mystery why GW would want people to buy more books!
Karol wrote: But then why not make the supplement books, have all the marine stuff too, if they have access to all the stuff. this way everyone has to buy at least 2 books instead of 1. And if they want to try out a different chapter, they have to spend even more money on the supplements.
It certainly is a mystery why GW would want people to buy more books!
I know, I don't get it, it's like GW wants our money or something!
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
Karol wrote: But then why not make the supplement books, have all the marine stuff too, if they have access to all the stuff. this way everyone has to buy at least 2 books instead of 1. And if they want to try out a different chapter, they have to spend even more money on the supplements.
It certainly is a mystery why GW would want people to buy more books!
but it is not very consumer friendly, and from what I have been told here, people can use digital books in other countries stores. Meaning if books get split, people will just download them for free. It is like taxs or bus tickets, when they are low, it aint worth the punishment to not pay them, but when they are high everyone stops paying or buying them.
I know, I don't get it, it's like GW wants our money or something!
making so that people download the books and don't pay them at all, doesn't seem like a good way to make money.
If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain.
7000 
