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Made in ca
Gargantuan Gargant






 the_scotsman wrote:
 Fergie0044 wrote:
Stephen1974 wrote:
 Haighus wrote:
Stephen1974 wrote:
We generally work off of a 40 hour week in the UK, its largely only council or places run on behalf of the council that still do 37.5 hrs as full time.


ONS data suggests the average (pre-COVID) hovers pretty consistently around 37 hours/week for full time workers. It has been lower since the pandemic.

Edit: the above may be referring to hours worked after leave or other absences are deducted, I can't access the original dataset to scrutinise their definitions from my phone, so I cannot check. If it does reduce the hours worked compared to contracted hours, then Stephen1974 is likely correct and I apologise and retract this post.


You may be right. When you take in to account government / council work (nhs etc biggest employer and all that) it probably is 37.5, but I think outside of government/council work its closer to 40.

Doesnt really matter though, its not exactly a big difference at the end of the day.


Speaking as someone who has done both (different civil engineering firms, not government work) I strongly disagree! An extra half hour a day can feel like murder on a Monday

On topic, it's a real shame that the codex fluff sections are so poor, when Black Library has demonstrated quite well that 40k can be turned into amazing books (plenty of stinkers too mind). Why not pay ADB or Chris Wraight for a few hours of their time? Ah yes, money. I was gobsmacked when that story came out about lead designers at GW and the salary. It seems like absolute pittance when GW has been making record profits for the 4-5 years (whenever the new guy took over and released 8th edition 40k) It really shouldn't be hard for Nottingham to hire 4 new staff on a competitive wage. Two new writers to come up with competent prose and 2 new editors to proof read said writing and the rules sections. But then, this is why I'm not a millionaire CEO...


It's super weird, it seems like for all the effort we go through to automate these ultra-cheap minimum wage jobs like grocery store cashier - designing these self-scanning machines, putting in more security cameras, presumably hiring security staffers to watch them....why has no company tried automating their CEO position? CEOs often cost as much as hundreds or even thousands of other employees, think of the savings if you could just design sort of a holographic hatsune miku of an above average height tall man in a suit to give the occasional speech, host board meetings and do lines of coke on company time.


I assume its economy of scale, since companies are generally made to support the upper half of the company and there's only ever one CEO position whereas there's tons of the entry level ones, so streamlining a single CEO position is never seen as efficient (including from a relatively selfish perspective of the person who would be in the CEO position). I can't remember which company who did it, but they tried cutting the salary of the CEO for their company and they struggled to find someone who would actually take the position afterwards and then had to basically jack up the salary again to actually get the leadership talent they need. Salaries and wages unfortunately grow quite exponentially depending on the sector and once you've basically gone into realm of high level executive management, you're in a nebulous area where the standard is so high that no one will settle for anything lower.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/09 13:28:51


 
   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





 Gadzilla666 wrote:
5th edition? There’s two whole paragraphs of the Night Lords lore in the 8th edition CSM codex that are verbatim from the 2nd edition Chaos Codex, and another that only slightly alters another. Half of another is lifted straight from 3.5. The reason that the new codexes sound just like the old ones is because gw just keeps reusing the exact same stuff.


which was forgivable when nothing had changed but in 8th edition it reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally became apparent

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in us
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The dark hollows of Kentucky

BrianDavion wrote:
 Gadzilla666 wrote:
5th edition? There’s two whole paragraphs of the Night Lords lore in the 8th edition CSM codex that are verbatim from the 2nd edition Chaos Codex, and another that only slightly alters another. Half of another is lifted straight from 3.5. The reason that the new codexes sound just like the old ones is because gw just keeps reusing the exact same stuff.


which was forgivable when nothing had changed but in 8th edition it reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally became apparent

Eh, the two paragraphs that are copied from the 2nd edition Chaos Codex are descriptions about the Legion's history during and after the Heresy, while the "half a paragraph" from 3.5 describes their preferred tactics. Those things haven't changed. It is funny that they copied them 100% though. If you want "new stuff", the 8th edition codex gives some details about what the 8th Legion have been up to since the fall of Cadia. And of course there's Vigilus Ablaze and Faith and Fury.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/13 14:16:05


 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






I have no problems with copying old fluff over. The alternative is rewording the same thing a different way each time, which also happens, and gets old. If they hit on a good way to describe something, don't change it.

The shrinking of fluff from 8th to 9th is a big disappointment to me. But what is there isn't worse than what was present in previous editions. I think there is a lot of nostalgia for those early codex, but go back to read them and there's just barely anything there. I do think 40k fluff has stagnated in a way, where it feels like the writers are continually rehashing the same thing and so it becomes increasingly bland to us, because we've read it all before. Copy and/or add new stuff, but rewording the same needs to be for the purpose of improvement.

Certainly AoS fluff has kept me very happy with its quality and improvement over time.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/14 20:21:33


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Made in fr
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 the_scotsman wrote:



It's super weird, it seems like for all the effort we go through to automate these ultra-cheap minimum wage jobs like grocery store cashier - designing these self-scanning machines, putting in more security cameras, presumably hiring security staffers to watch them....why has no company tried automating their CEO position? CEOs often cost as much as hundreds or even thousands of other employees, think of the savings if you could just design sort of a holographic hatsune miku of an above average height tall man in a suit to give the occasional speech, host board meetings and do lines of coke on company time.


This was just beautiful. it reminded me of the opening of "Lexx" where the 'courts' were just holographic recordings of a judge listing charges, a hologram defense attorney saying his client pleaded guilt and threw himself on the mercy of the court, followed by the judge recording pronouncing a death sentence.
   
Made in fr
Fresh-Faced New User




because gw is a monopoly and therefore has no competition, so has no motivation to treat its customers as anything but ATMs they can pound on and abuse while getting more money from them.

   
Made in au
Dakka Veteran




 NinthMusketeer wrote:
The shrinking of fluff from 8th to 9th is a big disappointment to me. But what is there isn't worse than what was present in previous editions. I think there is a lot of nostalgia for those early codex, but go back to read them and there's just barely anything there. I do think 40k fluff has stagnated in a way, where it feels like the writers are continually rehashing the same thing and so it becomes increasingly bland to us, because we've read it all before. Copy and/or add new stuff, but rewording the same needs to be for the purpose of improvement.


Yeah, the lack of lore is definitely disappointing. Completely agree with you.

I've been suggesting for GW to add all the older rulebooks and codexes up to 7th edition to the Warhammer+ library. At least that way newer players have the ability to see the older rule, as well as older players having the chance to either catch up on books they missed or reread books they no longer have.
   
Made in de
Terrifying Doombull






Nuremberg

They would make a chunk of money off me, I'd buy all the pdfs if they were good quality. Access to old rules would get me to sign up to warhammer +. It hasn't done WOTC any harm but GW is a weird company.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I’d say the following reasons are more likely:

The company thinks there’s more money in targeting competitive players so rules rules rules

GW feel they are repeating readily available fluff in each codex, relating to the origin of said faction etc, so just pay lip service to it and don’t waste money on the ink

Less fluff in codexes means more book sales as people hungry for fluff will buy both
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






mrFickle wrote:
The company thinks there’s more money in targeting competitive players so rules rules rules

That's a hefty "X" to doubt considering Comp players aren't the majority in the hobby.

I actually started thinking about this again and decided to do some maths.
Taking a look at the 9th Ed Codexes and Supplements I have to hand we have the following for "background" content (I say roughly because some pages are double spread for art and background):
Spoiler:
Codex Space Marines - roughly 65 pages/208 (31%)
Supplement Deathwatch - roughly 17 pages/64 (26%)
Codex Drukhari - roughly 26 pages/120 (21%)
For the two remaining 8th Ed Codexes I own (CSM and IG) those sit at about 50% and a friend tells me their older Codexes are similar (with Dark Angels being an outlier at 25%).

However, is this due to a reduction in background or an increase in rules content?
Ignoring Space Marines for obvious reasons, Druhkari has only 21% of the Codex dedicated to background. That being said there are a good 40 pages that wouldn't have existed in many previous editions. These are as follows:
Spoiler:
Battle-forged Rules - 4 pages
Subfaction Rules - 14 pages
Matched Play Rules - 1 page
Army Rules - 2 pages
Crusade Rules - 10 Pages

I would say that while there has been some reduction in background (whether or not this is justified is subjective), there has also been a considerable increase in rules which changes the ratio.
Personally, I do love my background (my post numbers speak for themselves in this regard) but I do think that 1/4 of the Codex being dedicated to background isn't too much of an issue when the main purpose of a Codex is to play the 40k game, it is a rulebook after all. It should be down to Campaign supplements, Black Library novels, and the players themselves to expand the background of the 40k universe.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/22 19:27:38


 
   
Made in us
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I think a codex should be equal parts rules and lore, if not more lore. The lord connects you to the faction and gives you a reason to play as that faction, even just in matched play you can get into character
   
Made in us
Warp-Screaming Noise Marine




 the_scotsman wrote:
 Fergie0044 wrote:
Stephen1974 wrote:
 Haighus wrote:
Stephen1974 wrote:
We generally work off of a 40 hour week in the UK, its largely only council or places run on behalf of the council that still do 37.5 hrs as full time.


ONS data suggests the average (pre-COVID) hovers pretty consistently around 37 hours/week for full time workers. It has been lower since the pandemic.

Edit: the above may be referring to hours worked after leave or other absences are deducted, I can't access the original dataset to scrutinise their definitions from my phone, so I cannot check. If it does reduce the hours worked compared to contracted hours, then Stephen1974 is likely correct and I apologise and retract this post.


You may be right. When you take in to account government / council work (nhs etc biggest employer and all that) it probably is 37.5, but I think outside of government/council work its closer to 40.

Doesnt really matter though, its not exactly a big difference at the end of the day.


Speaking as someone who has done both (different civil engineering firms, not government work) I strongly disagree! An extra half hour a day can feel like murder on a Monday

On topic, it's a real shame that the codex fluff sections are so poor, when Black Library has demonstrated quite well that 40k can be turned into amazing books (plenty of stinkers too mind). Why not pay ADB or Chris Wraight for a few hours of their time? Ah yes, money. I was gobsmacked when that story came out about lead designers at GW and the salary. It seems like absolute pittance when GW has been making record profits for the 4-5 years (whenever the new guy took over and released 8th edition 40k) It really shouldn't be hard for Nottingham to hire 4 new staff on a competitive wage. Two new writers to come up with competent prose and 2 new editors to proof read said writing and the rules sections. But then, this is why I'm not a millionaire CEO...


It's super weird, it seems like for all the effort we go through to automate these ultra-cheap minimum wage jobs like grocery store cashier - designing these self-scanning machines, putting in more security cameras, presumably hiring security staffers to watch them....why has no company tried automating their CEO position? CEOs often cost as much as hundreds or even thousands of other employees, think of the savings if you could just design sort of a holographic hatsune miku of an above average height tall man in a suit to give the occasional speech, host board meetings and do lines of coke on company time.


And just like that worker coops were born.

Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. -Kurt Vonnegut 
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran





Has anyone of you read the new BT codex yet? I was thinking about buying it for the lore and art, but I haven't heard good things about GW's recent publications, so I'm hesitant.
   
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It's just as bad in the books written by established authors. I'm reading Mechanicum by Graham McNeill. Not even halfway through I've lost count of how many things are "immeasurable" or "unimaginable" in size. It's like he has no idea what the scales are for anything so he just uses that instead. We get it, things are really big 30k years in the future...
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






 Toofast wrote:
It's just as bad in the books written by established authors. I'm reading Mechanicum by Graham McNeill. Not even halfway through I've lost count of how many things are "immeasurable" or "unimaginable" in size. It's like he has no idea what the scales are for anything so he just uses that instead. We get it, things are really big 30k years in the future...

Just wait until the finale...
   
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Decrepit Dakkanaut





Tampa,FL USA

 Toofast wrote:
It's just as bad in the books written by established authors. I'm reading Mechanicum by Graham McNeill. Not even halfway through I've lost count of how many things are "immeasurable" or "unimaginable" in size. It's like he has no idea what the scales are for anything so he just uses that instead. We get it, things are really big 30k years in the future...


Scale has always been a problem with 40K. Check out the participating forces numbers in the 3rd Ed Armageddon supplement(I believe someone did the math and there's fewer defenders across the entire planet of Armageddon than the amount of people that died in WWI alone) and realize that 40K writers in general think a million humans is a huge amount on a galactic scale.


Also, everyone disappointed with the amount of lore in Codexes would have HATED 3rd ed books.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/12/01 18:29:00


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Made in us
Scarred Ultramarine Tyrannic War Veteran






haha... Not quite what I thought the OP was going to say.

I have to agree with the sentiment that most current Codex's are a bit worse than their previous editions. Lore gets the axe so GW can pack more and more and more rules, units, etc. into the book.
   
Made in gb
Lit By the Flames of Prospero






mrFickle wrote:
I think a codex should be equal parts rules and lore, if not more lore. The lord connects you to the faction and gives you a reason to play as that faction, even just in matched play you can get into character

I would argue that even with the background dedication present in Codexes now, the majority of players are still choosing armies/subfactions based on that background. Obviously, there are outliers such as Cult of Strife Druhkari in 9th and Iron Hands in 8th but you can't blame the competitive scene for chasing the meta.
I do miss the timeline section to a degree but we also have to look at how much of it was just repetition for edition after edition. Entire pages for unit descriptions were also unnecessary to a degree, like for units with very similar loadouts like Terminators or the many Guard infantry units.

I think the biggest issue comes from the way the documents are named. Codex is a term used to describe the precursors to books so it fills out the requirement of SciFi/Space Fantasy vibe but doesn't actually say anything about the content of the book which could be just background, rules, or a mix of the two. AoS has Battletomes, which to me says a lot more about the purpose of the book, it's clearly intended to show you the rules for the army you are playing. This isn't a case of blame or trickery but rather just a commentary on the names GW uses to promote its products and the differences in opinion that arise from that.
   
 
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