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I apologize if my post has upset some people. It was not my intention but rather a friendly inquiry on who still loved their old beakies and such. If I were to buy any Primaris marines it would be to mix into my original marine units. I have no intention of purchasing them as it is as I have spent to many years working on three original armies. For new players I hope they love the Primaris range as much as I love my older dudes. That's all this post was.
ottokill wrote: I have been gaming for 3 decades and have a made a heavy investment in a lot of different games and miniatures. I for one will not be upgrading my Dark Angels or White Scars with Primaris miniatures. I guess I'm suffering from miniature expansion burnout. I also have an Imperial Guard and Nurgle Chaos marine force. I know some people will just say who cares but I wonder if there are others that feel the same way. I will just continue playing with what I have regardless if they become obsolete or not.
Good for you.
Loving the originals doesn't take away from whatever is new, it just means there's more to be enjoyed.
You're not the only one who finds more to like in the original than the latest version.
I think it's worth pointing out here that like, maybe the reason this happens is because a sizable enough minority of Space Marine fans still really love the originals, and there's something for each of those fans, with regards to Primaris, that doesn't do it for them.
If it elicits this many responses, it seems like it's still a divisive issue, and considering neither Firstborn Marines, nor Primaris show any sign of going anywhere, any time soon, it's maybe a divisive issue in the community, which is surprising, given that we've had Primaris for such a long time.
And yet I never said people shouldn't enjoy their models, I'm just saying why does there need to be a boatload of posts about it like it's going out of style? Further to that how is it a "divisive issue"? Have you had your Firstborn Space Marines taken away from you? Have you lost access to all of their rules? Have you been forced to buy Primaris Marines? Are the Space Marine rules exclusively good for Primaris units? No, so why do people feel the need to post self-satisfying posts about how they're going to keep using Firstborn when the models are sold, the rules are still around and there's been no attempt by anyone to change either of those things?
As much as these threads can get very Primaris-bash-y (god knows, I really have very little positive to say about them), like, so far this thread really isn't that. It's significantly made up of posters saying "I still like my old toys" and nervously wondering if - as so many in the community like to disparagingly call them - Squat Marines will end up just that - Squatted. In which case, what are we to do? Some clearly are cool with playing them as Primaris Marines. With the ascendant popularity of Oldhammer, there seem to be avenues for fans to keep using them, but still, the loss of a rules an minis for a design that has been a real cornerstone of the Warhammer setting is sad, be it Brettonians, Tomb Kings Space Marines, Squats, whatever.
This thread has been better than the usual I agree but regardless it took eleven posts for someone to post silly nonsense about never buying Primaris and then two after that before someone suggested getting rid of Primaris entirely. But one thread/post out of a hundred doesn't make everything better, does it? How far would I have to go into another Space Marine-centric thread to find anti-Primaris posts? How many comments on FB or Instagram would I have to look through to find anti-Primaris sentiment? How about Reddit?
Firstborn lost naff all with the change over to 8th and then got more unit freedom in the 9th Codex. You talk about cornerstones of game systems yet mention Brettonia, the Tomb Kings, and the bloody Squats. You'd be hard-pressed to find many people who would say any of those are the cornerstones of their systems.
As for Oldhammer, people are playing older editions because they don't like the core rules of 8th/9th, not because they want to use Librarians on Bikes. And once again, you've lost almost no rules and there is no indication that you will be losing rules any time soon.
And something else that kinda upset me a little lately.
Back in the Black Templars rumor thread, I made a single, throwaway post about being nervous/frustrated at the thought that there would be nothing compatible with my non-primaris marines.
Immediately I was catching heat from like, 7 other posters? Belittling me, being rude, and even actual sexual harassment. It was wild. I never said anything particularly rude about primaris marines, just talked about how I was kind of hoping for table scraps, and it was too much for some Primaris fans. So as much as yes, some people to get a bit vitriolic when talking about how they don't want Primaris, and threads like this one are certainly not an uncommon occurrence, it's not like this is just some hate-big-marines circlejerk. People are talking about the future of their toys, and how to keep playing with them as best they can, when, for some, the writing is very much on the wall it would seem.
So firstly, abuse is unacceptable and those users are without a doubt certain words that are not allowed on this forum.
Secondly, I would argue that this thread that has seen a more positive tone is uncommon and that the vast majority of posts in such threads are bashing Primaris and the people who don't hate anything new.
I want to ask where you think the "writing on the wall" comes from with regards to Firstborn Marines. Space Marine Heroes has exclusively been Firstborn minis, FW produced 3 new kits for Firstborn, 3 of the 5 latest Limited Ed models for Space Marines have been Firstborn, and to reiterate what I said earlier, Firstborn have seen a net gain in units since 8th Ed.
It might be cool if you could reflect a little bit on why you felt the need to come in here, and start stirring the pot, when it's mostly a bunch of misty-eyed fans talking about their enthusiasm for some toys, when, in my experience, there are actually precious few spaces we can actually openly do that these days, without being shouted down for being a "hater" just because you don't want to buy the same toys as someone else.
Interesting opinion because IMO this entire thread is an attempt at stirring the pot. But how about these posts:
[spoiler]
Stormonu wrote: The marine book certainly needs paring down - there’s too much in it already.
At the very least they can trim down the infantry options, hopefully combining some of the vehicle profiles (Do you want your Rhinos hover or tracked?). If not, I vote for yeeting the Primaris stuff myself.
TinyLegions wrote: They can pry my old marines from my cold dead hands. I will not be buying any primaris marines not now, not ever. I would rather play an older edition or a totally different game if push comes to shove. Rest assured I will be doing the shoving.
Are they not explicitly stirring to annoy those who do like Primaris? Should they need to reflect on their actions? Or is it just me because I expressed the opinion that maintaining the cycle of negativity is stupid?
All this false outrage generated by threads like this does nothing but perpetuate the negativity and combative nature of discussions found in 40k forum space. Nobody is coming for your Space Marines, stop making stuff up to fuel your nerd rage.
[/spoiler]
Lol.
You'd think if you were so against the post existing you wouldn't waste the effort typing & posting all that - thus boosting the thread to the top & keeping it in view of everyone.
So forgive me if I don't take your words seriously.
First the new lore is trash. Second most minis of the Primaris line are utter garbage. Want some examples? Here we go:
- Gravis guys. Terminators just look better.
- Guys with new flying stands. - Guys with strange backpack and a too large autocannon. - Beer belly dread. - Go-Kart marines. - Techmarine on artillery platform. - Antigrav Repulsor madness with guns sticking out of it like the hairs of a hedgehog.
- Skull mask scouts trying to do a Night Lords cosplay. - Annyoing Lt. releases. Up to this point there must be more Lt. than Ork Boyz in the setting.
However there are a few minis which I like though they won´t suffice to start a new army. Nevertheless they are good enough to be painted and put in the cabinet.
- Intercessors. I own a single freebie who stands on the base of one of my IKs.
- Infiltrators (dual kit). They look more high-tech than 40K so could be used in other tabletop games.
All of these are subjective opinions, just so we're clear.
Liking a model is always subjective. There is no such thing as an objective taste analyzer which is used to deem a model´s worth prior it´s release. If GW had access to such tech there would be a lot less threads on Dakka Dakka.
I can't fault the OP for sticking with the army they like.
I have built a pure Primaris army for 9th and kinda sorta regret it. It's a hard road.
I had just figured it would be easy to take out for games or possibly a tournament, all the rules would be widely available. And they were something I had not collected before. Something new for 9th edition.
Really there was little reason beyond that for me to even get into Primaris marines.
I've only managed to play 6 games with this army and 8 games of 9th I think. (Maybe less.)
Would not do it again.
Probably more to do with the game system than the army I chose for it.
I feel like that's the bigger picture. at some point we will just have to decide we've had our fill of new editions and play the ones we actually enjoy. So why spend more money on new things that aren't backwards compatible with older editions.
Sorry I think I drifted off topic.
The rewards of tolerance are treachery and betrayal.
Remember kids, Games Workshop needs you more than you need them.
They can enjoy their army all they want, all the primaris stuff doesn’t stop anyone enjoying old marines. Nothing was taken away.
I would also love to see these “primaris marines are awesome” threads. Never have, or if I have they have quickly become the “I hate primaris” and “GW are evil” threads.
Proteus Teams, IMHO, are still the coolest Daethwatch Kill Teams. I love them. And that box has sooo much stuff in it, for a really great price.
From a narrative point of view, I absolutely loved the Torchbearer Fleet Crusade rules- probably my favourite rules printed in White Dwarf this year.
I totally respect players of all preferences- Primaris only, Firstborn only and mixed. The cool thing about the Torchbearer rules is that it gives you a chance to play all 3 types, with all the drama of initial distrust and hostility gradually fading into a sense of brotherhood.
ottokill wrote: I apologize if my post has upset some people. It was not my intention but rather a friendly inquiry on who still loved their old beakies and such. If I were to buy any Primaris marines it would be to mix into my original marine units. I have no intention of purchasing them as it is as I have spent to many years working on three original armies. For new players I hope they love the Primaris range as much as I love my older dudes. That's all this post was.
I've collected what I think is an entire company of Rogue Trader beakies, complete with some RT era support vehicles. That's going to be my second company of Marines to go along with my other First(True)born.
Space Wolves were one of my first armies to start with and over the years I've collected enough of them that I don't need to collect anymore that what I already have. None of the Primaris designs or lore appealed to me so I'm happy to stick with the dudes I've had for over a decade. So don't worry, you're not alone OP.
Primaris Marines would have been so easy to justify if GW's writing was just better
Lets assume Guilliman comes back, for the sake of keeping the starting point the same.
He orders the a new major founding, and reinforcement of existing Chapters.
To equip these new Marines he designs MkIX armour which is a mix of the protection of VIII and the systems/sensors of IV.
The Mechaniucus can't keep up with the demand for new Terminator plate to equip the new Chapters, so MkX Gravis armour is developed which isn't quite as good, but is easier to produce.
GW release new Marines in the same scale as the Deathwatch Veterans and Thousand Sons with their fancy new armour.
Mucho cashola.
I own quite a bit of firstborn but I also have a ton of Primaris.
Lately I've been having trouble making a primaris list that I feel is as fluffy as a firstborn one.
They'll contain roughly the same units but visually I really like the look of my MKIII/IV marine models and the vehicles the go along with them.
I love how my Primaris do look tho but I guess it's just a function of Primaris not having all of the sculpts out yet. Jes said in an old Voxcast that they designed everything together as a cohesive whole so we have just been exposed to a portion(however big it actually is) of the range.
I think it's worth pointing out here that like, maybe the reason this happens is because a sizable enough minority of Space Marine fans still really love the originals, and there's something for each of those fans, with regards to Primaris, that doesn't do it for them. If it elicits this many responses, it seems like it's still a divisive issue, and considering neither Firstborn Marines, nor Primaris show any sign of going anywhere, any time soon, it's maybe a divisive issue in the community, which is surprising, given that we've had Primaris for such a long time.
And yet I never said people shouldn't enjoy their models, I'm just saying why does there need to be a boatload of posts about it like it's going out of style? Further to that how is it a "divisive issue"? Have you had your Firstborn Space Marines taken away from you? Have you lost access to all of their rules? Have you been forced to buy Primaris Marines? Are the Space Marine rules exclusively good for Primaris units? No, so why do people feel the need to post self-satisfying posts about how they're going to keep using Firstborn when the models are sold, the rules are still around and there's been no attempt by anyone to change either of those things?
If it isn't divisive, why are you in here, getting this upset? People liking their toys shouldn't be this much of a problem, but as I said, and as you are now proving, for some, just existing, being like "yep, I just like the classics better" is so offensive to you that you're in here trying to get this thread locked, and belittling people for liking the wrong tiny space men. As much as you complain that warhammer fans, on a warhammer fan forum, are making "self-satisfying posts" (are not all posts here self-satisfying to some extent? Seems an odd complaint to have on a fan forum?), here you are, making posts to satisfy your own need to stifle this conversation, and shout down opinions you don't agree with. You're correct in that firstborn models haven't gone anywhere yet. GW are famously not great with transparency for their plans, and have done wilder things that retire minis that have been replaced by newer minis. I was speaking as in not I personally am worried that they'll be replaced, but that there very well could be people who are, and indeed, there's nothing that suggests that they couldn't be, either.
As much as these threads can get very Primaris-bash-y (god knows, I really have very little positive to say about them), like, so far this thread really isn't that. It's significantly made up of posters saying "I still like my old toys" and nervously wondering if - as so many in the community like to disparagingly call them - Squat Marines will end up just that - Squatted. In which case, what are we to do? Some clearly are cool with playing them as Primaris Marines. With the ascendant popularity of Oldhammer, there seem to be avenues for fans to keep using them, but still, the loss of a rules an minis for a design that has been a real cornerstone of the Warhammer setting is sad, be it Brettonians, Tomb Kings Space Marines, Squats, whatever.
This thread has been better than the usual I agree but regardless it took eleven posts for someone to post silly nonsense about never buying Primaris and then two after that before someone suggested getting rid of Primaris entirely. But one thread/post out of a hundred doesn't make everything better, does it?
IDK, it was maybe that 1 thread in 100 until you came in here. Guess you succeeded in defending m'lady Primaris's honor at the expense of this conversation. Maybe it would've been nice if all of us could have just had our fun for once, in that 1 thread, instead of joining the other 100. This isn't reddit, nor facebook, not instagram. Those conversations have no bearing here, unless they're brought up, and have no bearing on me. If you don't like those communities, just don't hang out there, I guess? If you see a thread where people are having fun with classic marines, maybe just leave it alone if it upsets you so much.
Firstborn lost naff all with the change over to 8th and then got more unit freedom in the 9th Codex. You talk about cornerstones of game systems yet mention Brettonia, the Tomb Kings, and the bloody Squats. You'd be hard-pressed to find many people who would say any of those are the cornerstones of their systems. As for Oldhammer, people are playing older editions because they don't like the core rules of 8th/9th, not because they want to use Librarians on Bikes. And once again, you've lost almost no rules and there is no indication that you will be losing rules any time soon.
Other than the Outriders, GW sells NO humans mounted on horses in their fantasy range. That's a pretty huge departure from one of the classic fantasy tropes. IDK about you, but since I was a tiny kid, knights in shining armor battling fire-breathing dragons were essential in fantasy for me. Tomb Kings are well-loved enough that their minis fetch INSANE prices on ebay. Squats, okay, fair, hahahaha, but like you even concede firstborn fans have lost units. We've lost unit loadouts, too. We've had stuff relegated to legends. I'm not saying the sky is falling - hence my use of "SOME PEOPLE" - but I think it's clear that some firstborn fans are kind of worried, and not without good reason.
So firstly, abuse is unacceptable and those users are without a doubt certain words that are not allowed on this forum.
You were in that thread and you were one of the people slinging mud at me. You weren't the guy making gross comments, but you were on the same side as him, and no one called him out before the mods deleted his post. It was up for hours, too.
Secondly, I would argue that this thread that has seen a more positive tone is uncommon and that the vast majority of posts in such threads are bashing Primaris and the people who don't hate anything new.
Why do you feel the need to even bring this up? You're poisoning the well. Please stop it, like I said, this was one of the precious few times where this kind of thread was remotely civil and then you showed up.
Space Marine Heroes has exclusively been Firstborn minis,
Space Marine Heroes was a limited time release, the first wave came out at the same time as Primaris, and based off of conversations I've had with GW managers here, the only people who bought them were foreign tourists, which maybe influenced why GW decided to eventually make them globally available. The second wave were indeed, firstborn, but the third were plague marines, so maybe pair back the mistruths, as well as the toxicity, please.
Gert wrote: FW produced 3 new kits for Firstborn, 3 of the 5 latest Limited Ed models for Space Marines have been Firstborn, and to reiterate what I said earlier, Firstborn have seen a net gain in units since 8th Ed.
Which, while I guess is more than Tyranids or Eldar got, is quite small compared to how often firstborn used to get new stuff. Also I'm fully priced out of GW limited edition stuff, $60 for a single monopose mini is $60 I'd rather spend on something more fun, so not much of a consequence to me either way. So 3 non-limited releases since Primaris dropped? Lucky us, eh. Remember how I was talking about table scraps?
Interesting opinion because IMO this entire thread is an attempt at stirring the pot. But how about these posts:
Spoiler:
Stormonu wrote: The marine book certainly needs paring down - there’s too much in it already.
At the very least they can trim down the infantry options, hopefully combining some of the vehicle profiles (Do you want your Rhinos hover or tracked?). If not, I vote for yeeting the Primaris stuff myself.
TinyLegions wrote: They can pry my old marines from my cold dead hands. I will not be buying any primaris marines not now, not ever. I would rather play an older edition or a totally different game if push comes to shove. Rest assured I will be doing the shoving.
Are they not explicitly stirring to annoy those who do like Primaris? Should they need to reflect on their actions? Or is it just me because I expressed the opinion that maintaining the cycle of negativity is stupid?
All this false outrage generated by threads like this does nothing but perpetuate the negativity and combative nature of discussions found in 40k forum space. Nobody is coming for your Space Marines, stop making stuff up to fuel your nerd rage.
What false outrage my guy? The most outraged poster in here is you - those two examples you picked out are legit so inoffensive in tone - one guy talking about rules bloat - an issue in 9th raised across countless threads of late, related and unrelated to the marines 'dex - and then someone throwing out a lil bit of hyperbole with regards to the whole "pry x from my cold dead hands" thing. Maybe a little rich, but they're really not starting trouble, or say... going into a thread for Primaris marines and picking fights, trying to sabotage the tone and atmosphere of the thread. Who's pot are they stirring??? Like, tell me? This is a thread for firstborn fans, and tbh you're off topic for coming in trying to police everyone into never having any opinion other than Primaris are the best. If you actually, really regard those as people looking to start drama, I think you need to chill out, dude, and maybe get a little less upset on the behalf of the dignity of some little pieces of plastic. By your same metric, Stormonu and TinyLegions won't take away your toys, either, so you're good.
Primaris are here to stay, Gert. You won. You and your specific variant of little space man. Does it feel good? Is victory really as sweet as everyone says?
This is a thread celebrating a classic design. Please can we keep on topic now?
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/11/20 02:15:16
I think it's worth pointing out here that like, maybe the reason this happens is because a sizable enough minority of Space Marine fans still really love the originals, and there's something for each of those fans, with regards to Primaris, that doesn't do it for them.
If it elicits this many responses, it seems like it's still a divisive issue, and considering neither Firstborn Marines, nor Primaris show any sign of going anywhere, any time soon, it's maybe a divisive issue in the community, which is surprising, given that we've had Primaris for such a long time.
And yet I never said people shouldn't enjoy their models, I'm just saying why does there need to be a boatload of posts about it like it's going out of style? Further to that how is it a "divisive issue"? Have you had your Firstborn Space Marines taken away from you? Have you lost access to all of their rules? Have you been forced to buy Primaris Marines? Are the Space Marine rules exclusively good for Primaris units? No, so why do people feel the need to post self-satisfying posts about how they're going to keep using Firstborn when the models are sold, the rules are still around and there's been no attempt by anyone to change either of those things?
As much as these threads can get very Primaris-bash-y (god knows, I really have very little positive to say about them), like, so far this thread really isn't that. It's significantly made up of posters saying "I still like my old toys" and nervously wondering if - as so many in the community like to disparagingly call them - Squat Marines will end up just that - Squatted. In which case, what are we to do? Some clearly are cool with playing them as Primaris Marines. With the ascendant popularity of Oldhammer, there seem to be avenues for fans to keep using them, but still, the loss of a rules an minis for a design that has been a real cornerstone of the Warhammer setting is sad, be it Brettonians, Tomb Kings Space Marines, Squats, whatever.
This thread has been better than the usual I agree but regardless it took eleven posts for someone to post silly nonsense about never buying Primaris and then two after that before someone suggested getting rid of Primaris entirely. But one thread/post out of a hundred doesn't make everything better, does it? How far would I have to go into another Space Marine-centric thread to find anti-Primaris posts? How many comments on FB or Instagram would I have to look through to find anti-Primaris sentiment? How about Reddit?
Firstborn lost naff all with the change over to 8th and then got more unit freedom in the 9th Codex. You talk about cornerstones of game systems yet mention Brettonia, the Tomb Kings, and the bloody Squats. You'd be hard-pressed to find many people who would say any of those are the cornerstones of their systems.
As for Oldhammer, people are playing older editions because they don't like the core rules of 8th/9th, not because they want to use Librarians on Bikes. And once again, you've lost almost no rules and there is no indication that you will be losing rules any time soon.
And something else that kinda upset me a little lately.
Back in the Black Templars rumor thread, I made a single, throwaway post about being nervous/frustrated at the thought that there would be nothing compatible with my non-primaris marines.
Immediately I was catching heat from like, 7 other posters? Belittling me, being rude, and even actual sexual harassment. It was wild. I never said anything particularly rude about primaris marines, just talked about how I was kind of hoping for table scraps, and it was too much for some Primaris fans. So as much as yes, some people to get a bit vitriolic when talking about how they don't want Primaris, and threads like this one are certainly not an uncommon occurrence, it's not like this is just some hate-big-marines circlejerk. People are talking about the future of their toys, and how to keep playing with them as best they can, when, for some, the writing is very much on the wall it would seem.
So firstly, abuse is unacceptable and those users are without a doubt certain words that are not allowed on this forum.
Secondly, I would argue that this thread that has seen a more positive tone is uncommon and that the vast majority of posts in such threads are bashing Primaris and the people who don't hate anything new.
I want to ask where you think the "writing on the wall" comes from with regards to Firstborn Marines. Space Marine Heroes has exclusively been Firstborn minis, FW produced 3 new kits for Firstborn, 3 of the 5 latest Limited Ed models for Space Marines have been Firstborn, and to reiterate what I said earlier, Firstborn have seen a net gain in units since 8th Ed.
It might be cool if you could reflect a little bit on why you felt the need to come in here, and start stirring the pot, when it's mostly a bunch of misty-eyed fans talking about their enthusiasm for some toys, when, in my experience, there are actually precious few spaces we can actually openly do that these days, without being shouted down for being a "hater" just because you don't want to buy the same toys as someone else.
Interesting opinion because IMO this entire thread is an attempt at stirring the pot. But how about these posts:
Spoiler:
Stormonu wrote: The marine book certainly needs paring down - there’s too much in it already.
At the very least they can trim down the infantry options, hopefully combining some of the vehicle profiles (Do you want your Rhinos hover or tracked?). If not, I vote for yeeting the Primaris stuff myself.
TinyLegions wrote: They can pry my old marines from my cold dead hands. I will not be buying any primaris marines not now, not ever. I would rather play an older edition or a totally different game if push comes to shove. Rest assured I will be doing the shoving.
Are they not explicitly stirring to annoy those who do like Primaris? Should they need to reflect on their actions? Or is it just me because I expressed the opinion that maintaining the cycle of negativity is stupid?
All this false outrage generated by threads like this does nothing but perpetuate the negativity and combative nature of discussions found in 40k forum space. Nobody is coming for your Space Marines, stop making stuff up to fuel your nerd rage.
You do realize you could just ignore this thread yeah ? The fact you have to get so incited by people saying they love first born marines and don't want primaris shouldn't be enough to get you so riled up, but then maybe you just have to defend the primaris army mans. I didn't even see people bashing on primaris other than to say " I don't like them ". Seriously, if you want people to stop saying they don't like primaris maybe some need to stop saying how much they love them ?
As it stands most of my armies are made up of first born marines and will stay that way for the foreseeable future. The only marine force I have that will have primaris in it will be my Deathwatch. So keep up that old marine love brothers.
I hate the lore but the models are cool, the tanks suffer from having too many guns and look cluttered.
As I've said in other threads they should of just been honest "marines are too small were making ones that scale" then just let people that didn't want to upgrade keep using older models.
Then there's no massive bloat, no division between fans of the old and new.
But that would require GW doing customer research rather than just assuming they knew best.
I don't mind the basic troops and most units based on them, but I don't like the primaris terminators and I think marine tanks are cooler when they are actual tanks rather than hover tanks. Skimmer tanks used to be an eldar or tau thing, and I think it should have stayed that way.
That's the main reason for sticking with older marines for me, I prefer the older vehicle designs and auxilary troops like terminators.
I'm of the same opinion, hover tanks seemed weird to me when they rolled out. Plus if they want to slap that many guns onto a tank I'd have preferred they did that to an Ork vehicle instead
I originally came back to the game after Primaris were launched, but I started with a nostalgic Firstborn Ultramarines force anyway. Then I moved on to Chaos Knights. I was certainly concerned about Firstborn being squatted during 8th, but here we are in 9th with 2W Firstborn
When Hexfire was launched I decided to start two completely new armies - TS and GK. I guess coincidentally there are no Primaris in sight there either. That suits me fine - I like Firstborn units better, and the new truescale models like Crowe and the Infernal Master are superb. Now I find myself ordering a TS Chaos Land Raider and a GK Stormraven. Happy days
hobojebus wrote: I hate the lore but the models are cool, the tanks suffer from having too many guns and look cluttered.
As I've said in other threads they should of just been honest "marines are too small were making ones that scale" then just let people that didn't want to upgrade keep using older models.
Then there's no massive bloat, no division between fans of the old and new.
But that would require GW doing customer research rather than just assuming they knew best.
I think most of us are of that opinion-
GW-here are the new marine sculpts
Fans-cool they look like improved maximus pattern armor
Instead-
GW-you need to re-buy your marine army so we can force you to use stuff we can copyright (and make a truck load of sales). we are going to give them a new name, a BS lore reason to exist and they we are going to make them better in every way from your old collection and as a final straw we are going to encourage older options to not be used by making them "legends" Socially shunning them from the community.
Fans-What the Feth!?!?!?
GAMES-DUST1947/infinity/B5 wars/epic 40K/5th ed 40K/victory at sea/warmachine/battle tactics/monpoc/battletech/battlefleet gothic/castles in the sky,/heavy gear/MCP
hobojebus wrote: I hate the lore but the models are cool, the tanks suffer from having too many guns and look cluttered.
As I've said in other threads they should of just been honest "marines are too small were making ones that scale" then just let people that didn't want to upgrade keep using older models.
Then there's no massive bloat, no division between fans of the old and new.
But that would require GW doing customer research rather than just assuming they knew best.
I think most of us are of that opinion-
GW-here are the new marine sculpts
Fans-cool they look like improved maximus pattern armor
Instead-
GW-you need to re-buy your marine army so we can force you to use stuff we can copyright (and make a truck load of sales). we are going to give them a new name, a BS lore reason to exist and they we are going to make them better in every way from your old collection and as a final straw we are going to encourage older options to not be used by making them "legends" Socially shunning them from the community.
Fans-What the Feth!?!?!?
Yeah, if they instead just upscaled them had cool new units to add no one would have minded at all. This isn't the first time it has happened and players were already expecting it to happen again.
That has been the way of it since then the start with primaris. The infantry mostly, look and feel cool. I'll admit that but I like unit variety and first born give me that as well the tanks have a better feel to them, for me. Makes it easy to want to stick to them. They feel more like " my guys " at the end of the day then the more uniform primaris.
Terminators feel better to me than gravis ever has and phobos well they tend to cause some hmmmms from people, I don't personally mind them but can see why some would dislike them.
GW should have just said these are up sized marines and let that be that and maybe change squad load outs so you can run all rifle units, make upgrades with grenade launchers, etc, make variant terminator suits called " Gravis". As was said they wanted to up sell you though the same army all over again. That was clear when for some reason first born marines can't fit into primaris transports ? Why ? Oh they want to drain your wallets so even if you just like the hover tanks gotta buy those new marines now.
Primaris aren't so large they couldn't fit into a rhino either, and if we look way back the old old rhinos are way smaller than the current sized ones, yet they hold the same first born marines regardless. We know the vehicle room is more about selling you new stuff and not about game balance or size sense. Normal marines have the same wounds now, why not just remove the transport issues and actually combine the forces finally.
They can't or won't go back and just say these are true scale marines but if they did man would it have made people happy. Most would have still bought the new models.
Honestly, I have a fair amount of both and have no issue playing both. I'll be taking all old marines to LVO in January but granted those are bikes and terminators. I do enjoy still using tac sqds and rhinos etc, feels right.
I had just come back to 40K a month after 8th launched, so the Primaris were just one aspect of my bewilderment.
As a Dark Angel player I have certainly run all-classic marine lists with success. The latest Codex certainly pumped up classic Bike and Terminator units and really didn't do too much for Primaris.
Having said all that, I have built up a large collection of Primaris. I like the look of them, for the most part, and they have done good work (Bladeguard, Plasma Inceptors and the occasional Hellblaster Squad for 1997 nostaligia...
Collect and play what you like. The Space Marine faction is a big tent - enjoy it!
All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand
I have a very similar opinion to most here. The problem, realistically, is that GW is too far down the hole to change course.
At the moment, my thinking is that Primaris units should all be shifted to a codex supplement.
The one piece of lore that I think we can all get behind is that Primaris were originally meant to support the marine chapters, not completely replace them. So, if all generic Primaris units in the SM codex are moved to a codex supplement, that's more-or-less what they become, support to the First-born.
Yes, it's yet another fething book, but at least it becomes an optional one.
stirring to annoy those who do like Primaris? Should they need to reflect on their actions? Or is it just me because I expressed the opinion that maintaining the cycle of negativity is stupid?
[1,750] Chaos Knights | 
[1,250] Thousand Sons | 
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