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 Grey Templar wrote:
I don't buy that. They could have still done the psychological torture element, which is what everybody was hoping to see, and still censored the decapitation which is what might have actually been a problem.

It's that weird case where the actual blood and splatter is a lot less horrifying than the circumstances around it.

Watch, we'll get a shot of the bloody bassinet this week to taunt us. 50/50 it still has the body inside. So it'll make the lack of seeing the deed live rather pointless.

Things are progressing faster and slightly different than the source material, which is ominous, but worked for the first season. Nothing really egregious in the changes, just some stuff out of order.

Solid episode, as is the norm with this show.

In the book for those that care:

Definitely a better pace to S2 E2. I don’t begrudge S2 E1 being a bit “previously on”, but the quickening pace is welcome all the same.

I feel like I must have watched a different episode than y'all, as I felt like nothing at all happened. What was with the close ups of falling dust? I thought it was super weird when they showed Helaena just zoning out staring at dust, and then they did it again with Rhaenyra when she was talking with Damon's ex.

Also the whole 'twin Kingsguard on opposite sides of the war' thing was so heavily contrived. I feel like that entire thing was set up just so George could have a dramatic showdown at Dragonstone between the two brothers. It's a good thing those two were the same weight, wore their hair exactly the same, and had exactly the same facial hair, especially after they both fled to their respective sides. That was some Star Wars level trash writing right there.

The only interesting thing in the entire episode was the talk between Otto and the King. That was a hell of a good scene.

The show isn't terrible, but it's not great. The acting is superb but the script is god awful. Feels like it's doing just enough to keep me watching.

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
What was with the close ups of falling dust? I thought it was super weird when they showed Helaena just zoning out staring at dust, and then they did it again with Rhaenyra when she was talking with Damon's ex.

I felt it an artistic touch to link the two characters as the mothers of dead children who aren't given a chance to properly mourn.

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
Also the whole 'twin Kingsguard on opposite sides of the war' thing was so heavily contrived. I feel like that entire thing was set up just so George could have a dramatic showdown at Dragonstone between the two brothers. It's a good thing those two were the same weight, wore their hair exactly the same, and had exactly the same facial hair, especially after they both fled to their respective sides.

Yeah, that was the weakest part of the episode. There is a tad bit more subterfuge in the book, from what I remember. Everyone would know they were twins so the assassin spent a lot more time sneaking, avoiding people until a chance encounter with his brother in the halls. It seemed like on the show that dude just got on a boat with his very unique armor on, like he wouldn't stick out like a sore thumb.

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
That was some Star Wars level trash writing right there.

How dare you!

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
The only interesting thing in the entire episode was the talk between Otto and the King. That was a hell of a good scene.

That was indeed a stellar scene. The Daemon/Rhaenyra scene was great too, as was the build up to it at the Black council meeting discussing the murder.

I think the only dumb part of the Twin plot was that for some reason nobody considered the possibility of confusion with the armor of the kingsguard, not even considering the twin angle.

I would have expected one or both sides to have changed the armor or heraldry of the Kingsguard.

I'd argue its because up until that point, they were still hoping there would be no war and as such no need to change uniforms.

Call it hopefulness or arrogance, though the latter is more likely.

Gotta hand it to Allicent's actress for really nailing the 'I started a civil war to protect my children and now my children are dying because I started a civil war' feel.

Her character is kind of a subtle monster but the actress is on point. EDIT: And know what, Aegon's actor too. Maybe we haven't been giving this guy enough credit for his insane acting chops. he really puts them on display this episode.

Also agree that the convo between Aegon and Otto is the best scene of the episode + really highlights the sheer amount of stupidity that's going on with the Greens.

And I like the episode is still trying to give both sides of the conflict their strong and weak points, because there's definitely a sort of pettiness to the Black's side of this that starts rising in this episode that I'll bet will come up later.

Yeah, the acting is all around great.

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
I feel like I must have watched a different episode than y'all, as I felt like nothing at all happened.

The show isn't terrible, but it's not great. The acting is superb but the script is god awful. Feels like it's doing just enough to keep me watching.

Yeah, this. So far second season is much weaker than the first.

Significant deviation from the source material in this episode, though nothing that breaks the narrative moving forward.

While the scene was neat, I disliked the 2 Queens meeting together this early. Seemed like too massive a risk for Rhaenyra to go to Kings Landing like that.

I like the similarities in the Green/Black Councils on how divided they each are and neither side seems truly prepared for the war despite some in each council wanting to be aggressive.

The Alys Rivers/Daemon scene in Harrenhal was interesting too, showing that Daemon seemingly does regret the murder. Milly Alcock guest appearance!

The slowness is definitely starting to lag a bit.

I'm still interested but it also feels like the first 2 episodes could have been compressed into 1 and this last ditch effort to avert war could have been the second episode.

I'm kind of ready for the plot to start moving forward at this point.

Ah the Brackens and Blackwoods. Gotta love them.

It is starting to become House of the Draggin, lets hope this week the blood begins to flow. Khorne is displeased.

I think next episode will be a massive change of pace, given the mention of Rook’s Rest and Criston Coles army on the march.

 Grey Templar wrote:
It is starting to become House of the Draggin

A good one! I think all 3 episodes so far could be easily covered in 1,5 max.

Interesting take on The Battle of Rook’s Rest.

In the book, its not an ambush of just one dragon but 2, and Aegon taking Sunfire isn’t a wrench in the plan. Also when Vagar fell on both dragons its not really said why, (maybe an inexperienced rider, bloodlust of the dragon, confusion of a twisty midair battle, “friendly”…ahem… fire) but this take is a culmination of the bullying Aemond had been getting since he was a kid and Aegon thinking/knowing he’s weak. Good pay off on those threads.

RIP The Queen That Never Was. Was working over Sunfire/Aegon and got some solid hits on Vagar/Aemond.

Well that was a very welcome change of pace! And just as I was thinking “GET ON WITH IT!”, they very much got on with it.

I do hope One Eyed Billy Big-Chin gets it in spectacular style at some poin.

Even with a dragon battle they still somehow managed to release another bland and totally forgettable episode.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Even with a dragon battle they still somehow managed to release another bland and totally forgettable episode.

Are we watching the same show good sir?

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Even with a dragon battle they still somehow managed to release another bland and totally forgettable episode.

Are we watching the same show good sir?

I loved the first season but cannot even like a single episode of the second. Maybe it is the script, maybe the pacing, maybe something else or many things combined? I do not know what but that season fails to deliver for me so far.

Nice battle very nice.

We're getting here what was missing from when Danaerys used her dragons in GoT, and that's the collateral damage.
Nobody on the Targaryen side in GoT got killed by accident whereas here the Blacks do some heavy damage to the Greens but the Greens take a lot of friendly fire as well.
It sells that notion they've been going for where a dragon war is something nobody really wants.

Now that was a boring episode.

Who are these Lords and Ladies? Which side are they on? Because, frankly, I just don’t bloody care.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Now that was a boring episode.

Who are these Lords and Ladies? Which side are they on? Because, frankly, I just don’t bloody care.

Indeed.

While I don’t mind the court intrigue and scheming, the whole Harrenhal arc has been so frustrating. I do like that they’ve made it an actual haunted place, but Daemon’s whole scheme seems particularly suicidal. Basically setting himself up to make himself an enemy of the Greens and Blacks. Not sure if that was his plan all along, or its the Harrenhal ghosts influencing him.

Episode observations:

It doesn’t help they keep chopping and changing actors, or at least did in S1.

It leads to a massive audience disconnect. And that existed in GoT too, at least early on.

But there’s also “oh the Blacks and the Greens and the Yellows and the Skyblue Pinks not to mention the Multi-Coloured-Eye-Melting-Polka-Dot-People-Of-Far-Far-Away-Land” being brought up like I’m meant to know, or care, who it is they’re backing or not backing or sitting the whole thing out, let alone why.

Most egregious example? Opening of a previous episode shows some young toffs poo-talking each other. Then the immediate aftermath of the aptly named Battle Of Not Appearing In This Show, where some, all, of them are dead. With no indication as to who we were meant to root for as the audience, or whether it’s the loss of a significant ally for either or both sides.

It really doesn’t help that they’ve fallen into the fantasy trope of Really Similar Sounding Names. Did he say Aemon, or Daemon? Might been Digimon. I dunno, it’s hard to tell and you’ve given me precisely bugger all reason to feel invested.

Also, aren’t the dark haired Targaryen kids of the one who was meant to be queen the result of her having it off with the Kingsguard who’s now having it off with the mother of the usurper King? And their real Dad is meant to be Dr Who, and nobody has commented or noticed that, despite “keeping it in the family” they look absolutely sod all like their supposed father?

I suppose I could go look it up, but GoT Wikis are crap, and I’m still left singularly unsure who’s called what.

I want to address a couple of the points made:

On the Houses


On Daemon


On Aemond


On Rhaenyra's children

Rhaenyra's dark haired children are meant to be the children of Laenor Velarion, her first gay husband.

Now we know they are actually Strong's kids, but it is less clear in the books because there are actually a lot of Targaryan relatives without white/blonde hair. Rhaenys is actually supposed to have stark black hair, so while Laenor had typical Valeryan features he could plausibly throw brown and black. Combine this with Rhaenyra's mother being from the Vale and it would not be unusual for her children to have brown hair.

The accusations of infidelity were based more around facial features with the hair, but again there should probably be more plausible deniability.

I was so bored with the first two episodes that I decided to read Fire & Blood after all. Now, after finishing it I know what will (probably because they could change many things) happen, and I must say that the 5th episode at last is giving me hope for that season. My prediction would be that the season will end with a certain sea battle, and compulsory death of the main character.

World of Westeros on Youtube is also a good resource for folks who want to keep up or race ahead into spoiler territory. He basically sums up the book in short chapters with a bit of added commentary.

His channel was what made me buy the book that this series is based on.