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Isn't the ork stuff correct though? It is just that the "they think" isn't fully explained. They are gene moded race, which has war technology baked in on a DNA level and on top of that they do happen to be an extremly psychic race. If enough orcs are in a spot and they all think that "red goes fast" it will go faster. SoB do that too, to a much smaller degree. I mean we have lore examples of orks shoting guns and doing damage with weapons that didn't have a barrel, but just a solid piece of metal.

In the end one has to blame the evolution, or rather deevulotion of language and modes of communication. When stuff stops to have one precise meaning and "talking" drops to level of picto grams, it is understandable that all fandoms get affected by it.

But yeah some stuff like the G-man+Eldar is stupid. But GW writes more stupid stuff on their own, so the level of getting angry about it is a bit limited in the end.

Karol wrote:
When stuff stops to have one precise meaning and "talking" drops to level of picto grams, it is understandable that all fandoms get affected by it.

I'm not at all concerned about it happening to fandoms, even ones I like. Mostly, people can just post, "Magnus did nothing wrong," we all get a chuckle, and move on.

It's when it happens to real-life conversations and very serious matters that I start to worry. <HERESY INTENSIFIES> just doesn't bother me.

Karol wrote:
Isn't the ork stuff correct though? It is just that the "they think" isn't fully explained. They are gene moded race, which has war technology baked in on a DNA level and on top of that they do happen to be an extremly psychic race. If enough orcs are in a spot and they all think that "red goes fast" it will go faster. SoB do that too, to a much smaller degree. I mean we have lore examples of orks shoting guns and doing damage with weapons that didn't have a barrel, but just a solid piece of metal.

Firstly, I'm not convinced that the last bit is true because I've never heard anyone come up with its source.

Secondly, the psychic field generated by large gatherings of Orks doesn't mean they can do anything they think of. The psychic field greases the wheels, it doesn't allow them to bend reality to their whim just by thinking it.
A group of Orks couldn't just "wish" a horde of squigs into existence.

Orks believing things into existence is the in-universe version of the ancient Egyptians couldn't have built the pyramids because they were obviously too primative.

I don't think we have any lore examples of a metal brick turning into an Ork gun either, but would like someone to share if they know of any?

We have other counter examples of humans using Ork technology and it working well too, Ciaphas Cain driving an Ork trukk and the Armageddon Ork Hunters using Ork sluggas and shootas.

Not to mention Diggas regularly trading with Orks on Angelus.

As mentioned earlier, the Tech Priest’s observations can be explained by his own ignorance. A gun might have a palm reader safety. Or it might rely on the Ork’s bioelectrics. It could be the Shoota was working, but something broke, and the owning Ork tried to patch it up, totally buggering it.

But we can also look to older background, specifically one of my favourites, the Daemon Possessed Weirboy Warphead. In short? An Ork’s sense of self is so strong, there’s nothing for the Daemon to really get hold of. It just can’t bend the Ork to its will.

That’s suggestive of a very strong will, which with their latent psychic potential (regular Boyz, not Weirdboyz. Nowt latent about Weirdboyz) could cause minor miracles. Not “I believe this block of metal is a gun, therefore it’s now a gun”. But enough to overcome engineering short comings, or help adjust aerodynamics allowing slightly more speed during a race.

I don't understand where that "Trump as an Emperor" meme came from. I cannot imagine anyone more un-emperorlike IRL than that guy. I'm 1000% convinced he has zero physchic powers, and doesnt care about humanity in the slightest. Logic and reason are abominations to him. He loves religions. Just too dumb really. Whoever came up with it has zero clue on 40K lore

I believe it was originally mean to mock him. Then, well...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 StudentOfEtherium wrote:

 Bosskelot wrote:

1d4chan has also done incredible harm to discourse surrounding the IP.

i can't think of a single thing 4chan has touched that came out better for it. all the worst parts of anime fandom can be traced back to 4chan, for example

I think the tales of Bjorn stuff has some amusing mockery of what the space wolves have become. Not least the best reaction to the advent of Primaris marines.

 tauist wrote:
I don't understand where that "Trump as an Emperor" meme came from. I cannot imagine anyone more un-emperorlike IRL than that guy. I'm 1000% convinced he has zero physchic powers, and doesnt care about humanity in the slightest. Logic and reason are abominations to him. He loves religions. Just too dumb really. Whoever came up with it has zero clue on 40K lore

This wasn't intended to be a flattering comparison. And if anyone thought it was flattering, it didn't make them look good, either.

The meme is also sometimes used to comment on the perceived decline of the Imperium of Man, mirroring the perceived decline of the United States or Western civilization under Trump's leadership.

The Imperial Guard, as a whole. Almost every meme involving Guardsmen will have them either die, or will be dying soon or talks about how they're only good at dying. Then there's the way most memes involving the Guard always involve a Commissar as leading a unit, as if officers or NCOs aren't a thing (I partially blame Gaunt and Cain for that, tbh)

Some people also have an odd fixation about killing Guardsmen in their mind, where there's always going to be a comment on a Guard meme (including those not mentioned above) about how the Commissar is going to turn up and shoot them. Or how they immediately all died after *meme*

The 15 Hour novel did incredible damage to the reputation of the Imperial Guard as a whole, the way people assume no Guardsmen can live past 15 hours and all that.

And finally, anything involving the Death Korps.

 Bobthehero wrote:
The Imperial Guard, as a whole. Almost every meme involving Guardsmen will have them either die, or will be dying soon or talks about how they're only good at dying. Then there's the way most memes involving the Guard always involve a Commissar as leading a unit, as if officers or NCOs aren't a thing (I partially blame Gaunt and Cain for that, tbh)

Some people also have an odd fixation about killing Guardsmen in their mind, where there's always going to be a comment on a Guard meme (including those not mentioned above) about how the Commissar is going to turn up and shoot them. Or how they immediately all died after *meme*

The 15 Hour novel did incredible damage to the reputation of the Imperial Guard as a whole, the way people assume no Guardsmen can live past 15 hours and all that.

And finally, anything involving the Death Korps.

Maybe it's just a personal observation or impression, but the Dawn of War games, especially the first one, certainly added to that. You put a Commissar in every squad and shot someone as soon as the shooting began because it doubled the dps.
Though, as you hinted yourself, it's a meme that actually has a lot of substance in the fluff. Even the guard codizes comment on the nameless Billion of Guardsmen used in the imperial warmachine. Soo, the more I think about it the more I wonder if those memes are actually that far from the actual fluff. They're relatively small hyperboles compared to... communist fishmen Tau or purple orks which have no basis in fluff at all.

They tend to go against anything written in the BL books. DOW 2 had a decent bit about the General saying he sends Guardsmen where they *can* die, but he doesn't waste them.

Memes make it sound like every Guard commander is a Chenkov, when it's pretty obvious that's not the case

The memes treat the Guard as a homogenous whole, which of course isn’t the case.

Chenkov isn’t the only one to expend his troops in that way. But there are also Commanders who see their troops as a resource not to be squandered. That truly wasted lives are a sin against The Emperor.

Commissar Cain and his Command are notably loathe to send troops on no-hope missions. Sometimes it is unavoidable, where a forlorn hope or sacrificial rearguard is the only way to preserve the rest of the regiment, but it’s always in extremis, and when there’s no avoiding it. Death is still common among the ranks, but their plans and tactics aren’t careless or reckless. After all, that’s how you get your Companies and Regiments of hardened veterans, where fresh recruits can benefit from the knowledge and experience of the longer serving Guard.

Thanks for expressing that more clearly than I could

!Disclaimer! It's all a money making IP, different authors write different things and put their own spin on the fluff, anyone arguing too heatedly seriously about in-fluff gak needs to wear a GENIUS AT WORK shirt !Disclaimer!

With all that being said I am *authoritatively * declaring that orks build weapons that can technically function but it's their orky-psychic-aura-fing that actually means a weapon that has every component visibly rattle as it fires keeps on firing as opposed to jamming or exploding after the first round. Chaos theory playing on their side as it were.

I think it's definitely somewhat annoying the extent this happens, and sometimes it just come across as wilful ignorance. The Krieg one for example, there's one of the 40k animations of Krieg VS Tau. In that animation, a Krieger takes on a Tau battlesuit, hitting it with melee. I've seen several times when the video is posted somewhere, claims that it's an instance of the Krieg shovel meme happening, tau vs shovel....but If you, yknow, actually bother to watch that scene, it's quite apparant that character is not holding a shovel. He has a trench mace.

There are a few smaller bits of lore that now are unfortunately canon because of memes, too. For years the community has claimed that purple is a sneaky ork colour, which has never been mentioned in the lore - yet they parrot it anyway, not realizing it was a joke. That has now, been mentioned in one of the recent novels. So its now canon.

The other, is the whole thing with the Nicassar. The only time they have ever canonically been given a description, is in the recent novel shadowsun by Phil Kelly, close to 20 years after their introduction. The are described as Ursine-like. The community for years before that official description, has been claiming that the Niccassar are Ursine like, because years ago someone at GW gave a joke description out-of-universe and called them "like giant flat polar bears". It wasn't canon and wasn't serious, but that apparantly didn't matter and became the assumed form of them, even mentioned on the wiki. So now, because memes and no one realizing it was even a meme/joke, that is canon.

I get the impression that either means authors use memelore as if it's a source of canon lore, use the wiki, or just follow the memes in general and want to make them true. All 3 options seem somewhat unfortunate.

Karol wrote:
Isn't the ork stuff correct though? It is just that the "they think" isn't fully explained. They are gene moded race, which has war technology baked in on a DNA level and on top of that they do happen to be an extremly psychic race. If enough orcs are in a spot and they all think that "red goes fast" it will go faster. SoB do that too, to a much smaller degree. I mean we have lore examples of orks shoting guns and doing damage with weapons that didn't have a barrel, but just a solid piece of metal.

We do not have lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

What we have is the community claiming there are lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

Which, every single time it gets asked for source, no one is able to provide any sort of quote or evidence of it existing and the most provided ends up "somewhere, trust me!", with the claim being repeated by those who haven't seen it themselves simply because they saw someone else who also hadn't seen it claim it's somewhere and that's it.

The whole Orks believing things into happening is the result of taking 3rd edition speculation from a tech priest entirely out of context and exaggerating what his questionable theory was to absurd levels. He was meant to be underestimating Orks and the things he was saying were not reliable, but even then his claim was not that they can do literally anything. The community saw that, and because apparently the idea of unreliable sources aren't a thing even when the character is outright said to be one and that's the whole theme of the Imperials in the codex, and parroted some of that lore entirely without its very important context - which since then, has been taken to such nonsensical levels far, far beyond what it actually said so now we have people thinking things like "Orks can believe anything into happening, it's why the Emperor is alive!" is how Orks work despite the lore never saying anything like that. All because no one reads the lore.

 Mentlegen324 wrote:
...because apparently the idea of unreliable sources aren't a thing even when the character is outright said to be one and that's the whole theme of the Imperials in the codex...

An honestly quite black pilling moment for me was 'The Emperor defeated the Void Dragon in combat' being the takeaway from Mechanicum.

 Mentlegen324 wrote:

Karol wrote:
Isn't the ork stuff correct though? It is just that the "they think" isn't fully explained. They are gene moded race, which has war technology baked in on a DNA level and on top of that they do happen to be an extremly psychic race. If enough orcs are in a spot and they all think that "red goes fast" it will go faster. SoB do that too, to a much smaller degree. I mean we have lore examples of orks shoting guns and doing damage with weapons that didn't have a barrel, but just a solid piece of metal.

We do not have lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

What we have is the community claiming there are lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

Which, every single time it gets asked for source, no one is able to provide any sort of quote or evidence of it existing and the most provided ends up "somewhere, trust me!", with the claim being repeated by those who haven't seen it themselves simply because they saw someone else who also hadn't seen it claim it's somewhere and that's it.

The whole Orks believing things into happening is the result of taking 3rd edition speculation from a tech priest entirely out of context and exaggerating what his questionable theory was to absurd levels. He was meant to be underestimating Orks and the things he was saying were not reliable, but even then his claim was not that they can do literally anything. The community saw that, and because apparently the idea of unreliable sources aren't a thing even when the character is outright said to be one and that's the whole theme of the Imperials in the codex, and parroted some of that lore entirely without its very important context - which since then, has been taken to such nonsensical levels far, far beyond what it actually said so now we have people thinking things like "Orks can believe anything into happening, it's why the Emperor is alive!" is how Orks work despite the lore never saying anything like that. All because no one reads the lore.

Exactly. You've put it into words so much better than I ever could.

The community seems infatuated with intentionally misrepresenting the Orks because it makes themselves feel better. If this trash had been in the codex as intended I for one would not have played Orks for the better part of 30 years. It's just too stupid. Which tells me everything I need to know about people who believe it's true.
Orks went form a funny army full of more or less injokes for Orks as per them laughing when another one dies or what have you to magic space clown mushrooms.
In a weird way this was like making Orks into a meme, of sorts, before we even knew what memes were. Weird.
If I'm honest it's also given me pause at game shops when other potential opponents discover I was playing Orks. They make dumb jokes nd I decide maybe I don't like those people very much. I didn't turn up at a shop for that kind of interaction.

On a slightly related note, I was part of a GIJOE group on face Book,. I enjoyed that they'd post the old comic issues. Sadly the fanbois are obsessed with fanboy art of the female characters in very adult situations and clothing, or less than pants if you well. Thanks for ruining my childhood. Complain to a mod and get the old, "I am sorry this upsets you I have no idea why your upset. " Or "I don't see the problem "

The community is just dumb and toxic in both cases. The worse part is the stupid ideas they've come up with have become the lore of the community and I'd expect it to leak off into the codex lore sooner or later. I've said from time to time that enjoying GW games is like being in an abusive relationship and it's true. The so called community are a part of why I see it that way.

 warhead01 wrote:

 Mentlegen324 wrote:

Karol wrote:
Isn't the ork stuff correct though? It is just that the "they think" isn't fully explained. They are gene moded race, which has war technology baked in on a DNA level and on top of that they do happen to be an extremly psychic race. If enough orcs are in a spot and they all think that "red goes fast" it will go faster. SoB do that too, to a much smaller degree. I mean we have lore examples of orks shoting guns and doing damage with weapons that didn't have a barrel, but just a solid piece of metal.

We do not have lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

What we have is the community claiming there are lore examples of Orks using weapons that did not even have a barrel but were completely solid.

Which, every single time it gets asked for source, no one is able to provide any sort of quote or evidence of it existing and the most provided ends up "somewhere, trust me!", with the claim being repeated by those who haven't seen it themselves simply because they saw someone else who also hadn't seen it claim it's somewhere and that's it.

The whole Orks believing things into happening is the result of taking 3rd edition speculation from a tech priest entirely out of context and exaggerating what his questionable theory was to absurd levels. He was meant to be underestimating Orks and the things he was saying were not reliable, but even then his claim was not that they can do literally anything. The community saw that, and because apparently the idea of unreliable sources aren't a thing even when the character is outright said to be one and that's the whole theme of the Imperials in the codex, and parroted some of that lore entirely without its very important context - which since then, has been taken to such nonsensical levels far, far beyond what it actually said so now we have people thinking things like "Orks can believe anything into happening, it's why the Emperor is alive!" is how Orks work despite the lore never saying anything like that. All because no one reads the lore.

Exactly. You've put it into words so much better than I ever could.

The community seems infatuated with intentionally misrepresenting the Orks because it makes themselves feel better. If this trash had been in the codex as intended I for one would not have played Orks for the better part of 30 years. It's just too stupid. Which tells me everything I need to know about people who believe it's true.
Orks went form a funny army full of more or less injokes for Orks as per them laughing when another one dies or what have you to magic space clown mushrooms.
In a weird way this was like making Orks into a meme, of sorts, before we even knew what memes were. Weird.
If I'm honest it's also given me pause at game shops when other potential opponents discover I was playing Orks. They make dumb jokes nd I decide maybe I don't like those people very much. I didn't turn up at a shop for that kind of interaction.

Orks are meant to be a terrifying genetically engineered super fungus with the inbuilt skills and capabilities to wage war at a moments notice whereever they end up, because they have the subconscious knowledge required to do that. Instead some act as if they're just silly magical cosplayers who can't do actually do anything, all because they've seen someone (usually youtubers) who hasn't read the lore repeating what someone else who hasn't read the lore repeating what someone years ago completely took out of context or said as a joke with no one within all of that actually bothering to look into it any further. It's completely against what the lore actually says about them and I think really undermines them.

And usually, whenever someone tries to explain how Orks actually are talked about in the lore and doesn't agree with the whole "Orks can believe anything into happening, their tech doesn't even work!!!" nonsense memelore and tries to show how it isn't a thing because its not in the lore, the responses tend to be something along the lines of "I don't care what the lore actually says!" / "You're making them BORING!" / "Orks are so silly and fun, that ruins them!" / "Orks are magic and it's funny!" and other things like that adamantly denying it even when outright presented with quotes and evidence (but of course, them going with the meme claims in the first place didn't require any proof!), which just comes across as somewhat disingenuous.

Orks are, background wise, probably my favourite thing in 40k.

Because, they are comedy. But they’re also, depending on how you look at it all, terrifyingly alien.

They kind of ish look like us, and even seem to speak a bit like us (though Orkish is a language, we read an anglicised version).

Where their language is presented as crude? It’s not because they’re thick, but because they see no point in florid language. They have an instinctive understanding of war, strategy and tactics. To the point “get over there and crump those gits” is, ultimately all the instruction they need. They’re given a location, target and desired outcome. Their instincts fill in the How, and usually with success.

They don’t exactly enjoy pain, but they don’t fear it. Not just because unlike us, you can just nail their arm, leg, even head, back on and he’ll probably be fine, but because those injuries prove how ‘ard you are, and helps the Ork get even ‘Arder.

Their treatment of slaves is arguably not even malicious. Every single Snot, Grot and Ork of any social standing knows might makes right, and fully accepts that. They don’t torture and abuse prisoners and slaves for sadistic reasons, it’s just how, within their own society, they sort out the pecking order. And it may not cross their mind that say, weedy ‘Umies can’t long tolerate such brutal treatment and scant resources.

That’s not to say they do it with only best intentions of course. But active malice and evil? I don’t see it that way.

They’re a fascinating species to read about and “study”, because ever since Waaargh! The Orks!, we’ve had a lot of quite in depth information about their society and sub cultures, far more so than say, Eldar. And, importantly? They’re the only species really having fun in the galaxy. They live largely free from ego, certainly so in direct comparison to other sentient species.

And since their (re?) introduction to the setting, the Kin of the Leagues of Votann serve as an interesting counter point, a technological “other side of the coin”.

Both Kin and Orks are the result of genetic engineering, which extends to their psychological makeup. Kin love mining and resource gathering, Orks love a punch up of pretty much any scope and scale. Neither truly has free will, but neither, thanks to the underlying genetic manipulation, are actually capable of caring that they don’t truly have free will.

Where you might be able to get the scales to fall from another devotee? Kin and Ork would both wonder what you’re gabbing about, and probably kick your head in. Well, definitely kick your head in if it’s an Ork.

And the genetic tampering also helps ensure they have a stable society. Where Ork population density triggers and maintains the appearance of Oddboyz, the Votann’s Cloneskein banks predict and ensure the latest generation of Kin are tailored to whatever tasks lie ahead.

Same outcome, different paths.

 Bobthehero wrote:


The 15 Hour novel did incredible damage to the reputation of the Imperial Guard as a whole, the way people assume no Guardsmen can live past 15 hours and all that.

Though I thought that concept was based around WW1 and Crimea experiences. You have the meme of an officer having an average life expectancy of a day (it might have been in some battles, but overall I think from memory it was 13 weeks). There was a 123% chance of becoming a casualty for front line combat troops (not rear echelon or support troops), 25% of dying during service (again front line troops), 11 day life expectancy for airmen during periods of technological change and between 1 in 4 and 1 in five young men affected by the war (dead, injured, imprisoned, etc.). 15 hours was the grimdark version of that.

15 hours was specifically for new arrivals to one area of one defence line on one planet. But most people took it as herp de derp guardsmen all die in less than a day.

The other troops in said battle have been there for ten years without dying!

Feels like that statistic that floats around that 80% of the casualties of a battle are fresh troops who die in their first engagement, and then anyone who survives that has increasingly higher odds of surviving the war.

The numbers change (though I'm sure there's an actual number somewhere) across the internet, but that idea gets around.

Each battle you survive you're increasingly likely to survive the next, and you're most likely to die in your first. As far as I'm aware that idea originates in casualty stats from the 1st or 2nd world war, but I'm not sure what the actual origin for the idea is. As with many things the Internet tends to grab an idea and run the phone game with it.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The memes treat the Guard as a homogenous whole, which of course isn’t the case.

Chenkov isn’t the only one to expend his troops in that way. But there are also Commanders who see their troops as a resource not to be squandered. That truly wasted lives are a sin against The Emperor.

Commissar Cain and his Command are notably loathe to send troops on no-hope missions. Sometimes it is unavoidable, where a forlorn hope or sacrificial rearguard is the only way to preserve the rest of the regiment, but it’s always in extremis, and when there’s no avoiding it. Death is still common among the ranks, but their plans and tactics aren’t careless or reckless. After all, that’s how you get your Companies and Regiments of hardened veterans, where fresh recruits can benefit from the knowledge and experience of the longer serving Guard.

What's really bizarre is when people will say that about the Guard but then for some reason claim that the Tau are some kind of all-volunteer force who would never sacrifice troops to accomplish some important objective. What do you think happens in an actual game of 40k? Do the Tau all just hide in one corner to minimize casualties and let the Orks score unlimited victory points?

As far as I can tell the way that the Tau and Cadians operate is pretty much identical, at least insofar as their resources allow. They are hyper-militarized societies (at least for the Fire Caste) in which everyone is forced to fight wars. They have strong but not rabid religious/ideological beliefs that motivate them. Their leadership is generally competent and tries to minimize casualties, but is willing to sacrifice their troops if it's truly needed. They are generally well-equipped but grunts still have to make do with less advanced weapons and armor than officers and elite specialists. They permit abhumans/auxiliaries to fight with them but must do from their own units. They prefer a combined-arms fighting style in which infantry is well-supported but they can't always manage it and still have a fairly high casualty rate due to the strength of their enemies.

Yet people have wildly different views of them based on memes and in-jokes.

The difference as I see it between the Guard and the Tau is that even the most sane of Guard Commanders will, if it is how victory can be secured, send their men to their deaths in droves. Not lightly. Not just for laughs. Not because they don’t care about the lives of their soldiers. But because in the bigger picture, sometimes a locally pyrrhic victory can mean a lasting victory in the overall theatre.

Where the fun really begins for the Guard is you never truly know what the makeup of your overall forces will be.

You could end up with the perfect mix of Catachans, Valhallans and Cadians, on a planet or in a system with environs of worlds where those troops are particularly well suited, and can be expected to punch well above their manpower weight, due to their specialist experience and generations of conditioning.

Or, you could end up with predominantly Light Infantry up against an Orky Armoured Column, hundreds or possibly thousands of vehicles strong.

And those can occur because sometime, somewhere, three of the six assigned Regiments were misrecorded as Armoured Companies. Just as Cain’s regiment remains in excellent fighting strength, and thus spirit, as according to the Munitorum its still supply two separate Regiments. So even if it’s a short order on materials, they’re getting twice what any other single Regiment in that area is getting,

And to miss or ignore such nuggets is to misunderstand the setting.

The Imperium absolutely is a bureaucratic nightmare, and it can be massively wasteful and inefficient. But for the most part, the sheer volume of Guard and the variety of its constituent Regiments means you’re usually going to have a decent mix of fighting options. And from there, it’s probably ego over who’s going to be in overall command that’s your biggest hurdle.

For every General Patton, there’s a Sir Henry Simmerson, a preening, clueless twit utterly convinced they’re a tactical genius.

And many, many Major Lennox

True that!

 Orkeosaurus wrote:
Do the Tau all just hide in one corner to minimize casualties and let the Orks score unlimited victory points?

I mean.. lore wise yeah?
The Tau are (effectively) hiding in one small corner of the galaxy. In grand strategy terms they barely exist as a footnote.

The Guard meanwhile are everywhere.

Whether Guard Commanders are explicitly cavalier with their soldier's lives can be debated (I often find it weird how WW1 British commanders are meant not to have cared, but this is accusation is rarely raised about literally everyone else in the conflict. Well, maybe the Italians...)
But they are fighting all over the galaxy - and its an incredibly lethal place. I'm afraid are dying in the billions whether their commanders care or not.

It's not like generals in the real world haven't thrown waves of bodies at their enemies. It certainly feels like the general plan for D-Day was to have more bodies than the Germans had bullets.