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I've just been reading some of the fluff on Imperial jetbikes an it seems to say that that they have fallen out of favour with only one known example in existence (belonging to the Dark Angels). Apparently ani garv vehicles are now concidered too alien to be used for man to quote

"Jetbikes and their technology are now distrusted by Mankind as being alien and inhuman, purely in the realm of the Eldar and Tau"

Yet they still make and produce Land Speeders and these don't seem to suffer that same distrust and stigma as Jetbikes and they strike me as being harder to produce than a Jetbike (other than the fact that jetbikes may require more tech in miniaturisation).

Does any one have any explanation for this?

Land Speeders are made using an STC.

Jetbikes are not.

Therefore, Jetbikes are Xeno technology.

Land speeders have more rivets and places to put skulls, so it is OK.

The explanation is taht they took our jetbikes away and had to come up with an after-the-fact excuse. But they're not going to take away landspeeders, as tehre are too many marine players that use them. Sales is all.

Jetbikes were used during the Great Crusade and were used by the Imperium long before Land Speeders.

"Imperial jetbikes were sleek craft utilizing anti-grav technology, and were in common use by the Space Marine Legions during the Great Crusade. After the Horus Heresy however, the ability to produce them was eventually lost and now only one Imperial jetbike is known to exist. "

This wold indicate that Jetbikes were made from Terran tech and that the STC has just been lost.

"Land Speeders are based on STC data recovered in M31"

and

"As they were rediscovered after the Horus Heresy there are no Land Speeders in Chaos Space Marines armies"

Meaning that they only came in to use after the Horus Heresy. Therefor in Imperial terms the jetbikes would have predated Land Speeder by at least 200 years. (Also as a side note that I have just realised Chaos Legions may still poses Jetbikes).

Appologies if this comes over as bulshy its not ment to, I am the first to admit that I am no Adeptus Mechanicus Lexmechanic. So is it the case that unless the Adeptus Mechanicus have a STC the tech is assumed to be Xenos until proven otherwise?

Unless there's an STC, the only way to make the jetbikes is via Xeno technology.

I don't think STC or not has anything to do with it because if an STC was found that showed how to make jetbikes then boom the Imperium (or at least the Space Marines) would have jetbikes. I think they lost the technology to build it so they have become a rarer sight (with only one known that's pretty rare) in the armies of the Imperium.

But since they are so popular for races such as the Tau and Eldar it's looked down on because anything else would be heresy. Say the Imperium lost the ability to produce plasma weapons, they would be distrustfull of them because the only ones to really have them anymore would be aliens and alien tech is bad.

Thanks all I think thats answered my question

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote: Say the Imperium lost the ability to produce plasma weapons, they would be distrustfull of them because the only ones to really have them anymore would be aliens and alien tech is bad.

I already don't trust plasma weaponry unless it's twin-linked or on a tank.

Kurgash wrote:

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote: Say the Imperium lost the ability to produce plasma weapons, they would be distrustfull of them because the only ones to really have them anymore would be aliens and alien tech is bad.

I already don't trust plasma weaponry unless it's twin-linked or on a tank.

What about in a squad with FNP? That's pretty safe.

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:I don't think STC or not has anything to do with it because if an STC was found that showed how to make jetbikes then boom the Imperium (or at least the Space Marines) would have jetbikes.

Yeah, that was kind of the point

i would love to see jetbikes again

i think the answers people have said so far really explain it.

Obsidian wrote:Jetbikes were used during the Great Crusade and were used by the Imperium long before Land Speeders.

"Imperial jetbikes were sleek craft utilizing anti-grav technology, and were in common use by the Space Marine Legions during the Great Crusade. After the Horus Heresy however, the ability to produce them was eventually lost and now only one Imperial jetbike is known to exist. "

This wold indicate that Jetbikes were made from Terran tech and that the STC has just been lost.

"Land Speeders are based on STC data recovered in M31"

and

"As they were rediscovered after the Horus Heresy there are no Land Speeders in Chaos Space Marines armies"

Meaning that they only came in to use after the Horus Heresy. Therefor in Imperial terms the jetbikes would have predated Land Speeder by at least 200 years. (Also as a side note that I have just realised Chaos Legions may still poses Jetbikes).

Appologies if this comes over as bulshy its not ment to, I am the first to admit that I am no Adeptus Mechanicus Lexmechanic. So is it the case that unless the Adeptus Mechanicus have a STC the tech is assumed to be Xenos until proven otherwise?

unfortunately, the sources for the above disagree with each other. while i don't doubt what you're saying and that GW printed it (i vaguely rmemeber it from 3rd edition), the horus heresy card game (and art book from which i get the info) disagrees. there are pics of preheresy world eaters and other chaos legions before they went chaos piloting the old 2nd edition metal type speeders.

SaintHazard wrote:

Kurgash wrote:

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote: Say the Imperium lost the ability to produce plasma weapons, they would be distrustfull of them because the only ones to really have them anymore would be aliens and alien tech is bad.

I already don't trust plasma weaponry unless it's twin-linked or on a tank.

What about in a squad with FNP? That's pretty safe.

Getting off-topic I know, but AP2 weapons ignore FNP dont they?

All plasma weaponry is AP2 is it not?

Although you do get your armour save so I guess its not the same as taking a plasma hit!

PrometheusZero wrote:

SaintHazard wrote:

Kurgash wrote:

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote: Say the Imperium lost the ability to produce plasma weapons, they would be distrustfull of them because the only ones to really have them anymore would be aliens and alien tech is bad.

I already don't trust plasma weaponry unless it's twin-linked or on a tank.

What about in a squad with FNP? That's pretty safe.

Getting off-topic I know, but AP2 weapons ignore FNP dont they?

All plasma weaponry is AP2 is it not?

Although you do get your armour save so I guess its not the same as taking a plasma hit!

Your last sentence is correct, and this is a common misconception. Gets Hot! wounds do not use the weapon profile, the rulebook simply states that they are wounds (not hits, so no roll to wound) and also that you can take saves against them (armor and invulnerable).

So actually FNP is a godsend in a squad with plasma. That's why you see a lot of IG CCS and PCS with 3x plasma guns and a medi-pack. Plasma guns in Plague Marine squads is also a common sight due to this.

*raises hand*

Doesn't humanity not have the STC anymore? Which I imagine means the Techpriests are out and about looking for it.

Shadowbrand wrote:*raises hand*

Doesn't humanity not have the STC anymore? Which I imagine means the Techpriests are out and about looking for it.

There are many STC. In fact, each STC produces one thing, and only one thing.

beezley1981 wrote:There are many STC. In fact, each STC produces one thing, and only one thing.

The Standard Template Constructor in that one Gaunt's Ghost novel did. But the Standard Template Construct systems from the main fluff could provide blueprints for nearly anything. Those systems are all lost, what is usually referred to as an "STC" is a copy of a blueprint provided by an STC system.

warboss wrote:

Obsidian wrote:Jetbikes were used during the Great Crusade and were used by the Imperium long before Land Speeders.

"Imperial jetbikes were sleek craft utilizing anti-grav technology, and were in common use by the Space Marine Legions during the Great Crusade. After the Horus Heresy however, the ability to produce them was eventually lost and now only one Imperial jetbike is known to exist. "

This wold indicate that Jetbikes were made from Terran tech and that the STC has just been lost.

"Land Speeders are based on STC data recovered in M31"

and

"As they were rediscovered after the Horus Heresy there are no Land Speeders in Chaos Space Marines armies"

Meaning that they only came in to use after the Horus Heresy. Therefor in Imperial terms the jetbikes would have predated Land Speeder by at least 200 years. (Also as a side note that I have just realised Chaos Legions may still poses Jetbikes).

Appologies if this comes over as bulshy its not ment to, I am the first to admit that I am no Adeptus Mechanicus Lexmechanic. So is it the case that unless the Adeptus Mechanicus have a STC the tech is assumed to be Xenos until proven otherwise?

unfortunately, the sources for the above disagree with each other. while i don't doubt what you're saying and that GW printed it (i vaguely rmemeber it from 3rd edition), the horus heresy card game (and art book from which i get the info) disagrees. there are pics of preheresy world eaters and other chaos legions before they went chaos piloting the old 2nd edition metal type speeders.

I agree, the Visions of the Heresy book is loaded with Speeder photos. I do believe though, their variant were called "Chariots".