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I've never used them; are they worth buying a few of?

M.

Foundation and Washes from citadel imo the only things to be bought from them.

Foundation have so much pigment that it really doesnt matter what primer you used on a fig. Great for quick works

I also know that vallejo has a opaque line or something but never tried it myself

You can replace them with cheaper things, but you won't find them as easily accessible and ready made.

I use the washes because they are right there and are premixed. The foundations are the same stuff as base paint from other companies, but you'll have to look for some quality ones.

Yes! For army painting they are superb, but thats about it though. You'll still need a couple of coats to get a smooth, even finish, but much less than the normal acrylics.

What? How does anyone survive without foundations? You guys are crazy

Foundations are a marvel of recent technology

Hehh

Nah, they're just very cheap (not cost of course!) acrylic paints with alot of vinyl and a bit of extra pigment in them.

Great for drybrushing too, I might add.

Edit - Oh, and they build up to saturation point very quickly, and any subsequent layers will just slide off it when thinned, and/or won't adhere properly with it, and washes and glazes will tear just by looking at it too! No no no, not good at all for quality painting. Great for getting light colours solid over black UC though.

There are also some super colours in the range - ie Dheneb stone, Khemri brown, Charadon granite, Knarloc green, and Gretchin green.

I haven't heard or experienced any problems with glazes or "saturation" using foundation paints. They just have really high opacity.

It happens to all paints when built up too much, though Foundations are exeptionally vulnerable to it due to the extra vinyl content. It basically looses it's tooth and it becomes very hard for any subsequent layers to adhere to it.

It's like trying to paint on a waxy plastic object like say tupperware, or little green army men. It just ain't gonna happen with any degree of success.

Orki wrote:It happens to all paints when built up too much, though Foundations are exeptionally vulnerable to it due to the extra vinyl content. It basically looses it's tooth and it becomes very hard for any subsequent layers to adhere to it.

It's like trying to paint on a waxy plastic object like say tupperware, or little green army men. It just ain't gonna happen with any degree of success.

Is that what that tiny layer of black stuff is? I bought some older dheneb stone from a FLGS. I had to shake it for like 20 minutes to get it to blend together!

Gawd knows what that consists of tbh. There are many compounds in acrylic paint that are there for more reasons than us mortals could fathom. It's the binder (and whatever else it contains) that sits on the top when it separates though basically.

I know what you mean about the shaking. I wrecked my shoulder doing the box of them, and had to enlist the help of mates to finish it off. Gah.

I thought the opposite tbh Orki

I like the foundation paints firstly because of there pigment contents and opacity (with the exception of the orange one which was transparent for some reason), but also beacuse they have a tooth.

I have never had problems with a slippery finish with them.
Sounds like you may be painting them too thickly and/or not stirring the pots thoroughly so there is too much medium in proportion to the pigment.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:I thought the opposite tbh Orki

I like the foundation paints firstly because of there pigment contents and opacity (with the exception of the orange one which was transparent for some reason), but also beacuse they have a tooth.

Indeed. I like them for those reasons too.

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:
I have never had problems with a slippery finish with them.
Sounds like you may be painting them pon too thickly and/or not stirring the pots thoroughly so there is too much medium in proportion to the pigment.

No chance. I've haven't done any of those since about 1988! I paint only with thinned paint and always paint with freshly mixed tubs.

I was on this dude here, an Empire Wizard commission. The HG purple done it, and at some point all the others have too. I've learn't that painting too thinly (and many, many layers) with foundations can also cause it, to the same effect of putting too much on in the first place. The pastier looking Foundations are more resilient to this, but the stuff that hasn't got the extra white pigment in it like Necron abyss are prime culprits for this unwanted effect, and are glossier out of the pot at a glance.

I could have possibly got a duff batch? But all of them? Or maybe man was never meant to thin foundations that much... Or, maybe that 4hour shaking sesh when they were new just never quite lifted some rather important part of the paint off the bottom. Either way, quality paints they ain't. Good for getting a strong basecoat in a hurry is all they are.




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Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:I thought the opposite tbh Orki

Just had a thought, I think I know what you mean. As in they are more matt than std GW acrylics? Thats not the same thing though, and I have no problems layering glazes over the Foundations shineyer cousins, even citadels old, old acrylics. Particle saturation isn't the same thing, despite similar visual appearance and texture.

If thats what you meant?

Nice work
'specially with the white.

I thought they were base paints, nothing more?
never used more than two coats, usually if I have over thinned a tad. So usually 1 coat and then normal paints on top.

Are you just thinning with water?

I tried the orange one as I said and that was a bit thin and shiny so after one figure stopped using it.
Not tried the purple iirc so it could be the same.
But I never shake the pots especially new ones. Always stirred not shaken, whatever Bond says!

Will have a little play if i remember in the morning

tired now and the percentage of typos is accelerating out of control!

Oh and back to the OP. Yes mate they are good for getting a quick, solid basecoat for army painting, but they thin badly and seperate due to the high vinyl content, but cover well because of it.

But no they're not better. Just a one-trick pony, albeit very good at it.


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Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Nice work
'specially with the white.

Ta mate.

I thought they were base paints, nothing more?
never used more than two coats, usually if I have over thinned a tad. So usually 1 coat and then normal paints on top.

Are you just thinning with water?

Yeah, basically they are. It was clients choice and I didn't have a VMC equivalent to hand. Flow improver does help with the separation though I usually use just water.

I tried the orange one as I said and that was a bit thin and shiny so after one figure stopped using it.
Not tried the purple iirc so it could be the same.
But I never shake the pots especially new ones. Always stirred not shaken, whatever Bond says!

Bond did indeed say that originally, though it got changed to the other way round for the films as they felt it flowed better (despite defeating the purpose of the catchphrase!)

HG purple is one of the chalkier ones too yet it has done it. Mebbe it was from when the pot was newer and I hadn't agitated the mix enough initially, but the first few layers were fine. It was a long time ago now. It basically just repelled the coats of black/purp that went on top of it which were thinned to a tinted water consistency, as always with fine layering.

Will have a little play if i remember in the morning

tired now and the percentage of typos is accelerating out of control!

heh, smae hree