US & NA Politics Thread

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**warhead01**

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:

And on that note, folks who were pro separating children from those detained on immigration violations, how do you feel about 450+ parents deported without their kids?

I'm neither for or against. I have heard that people are selling their children to persons trying to get into the US. So I doubt all of those were families. With all the rape going on against illegal migrants by the various persons "aiding" them in getting to the US. I can't believe all of those raped were adults. So maybe leaving the children behind at home or in the US facilities is better for the children.
At any rate 450+ isn't even a lot of people. For all I know some of those parents were just trying to put their kids in the US for a better life. Maybe they made it. Who knows.

**Da Boss**

Wow, that is extremely callous of you. Are you a christian?

**BaronIveagh**

warhead01 wrote:

At any rate 450+ isn't even a lot of people. For all I know some of those parents were just trying to put their kids in the US for a better life. Maybe they made it. Who knows.

Your honor, members of the jury, it's not much to say my client admits to killing and eating 450 people, that's not many people anyway. Who knows if they were really human at all, just meat for the beast, know what I'm saying?

**AlmightyWalrus**

Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

**TheMeanDM**

The whole "reunite families by x date" really is just for show.

A *federal judge* ordered the *federal government* to do this.

WTG is really going to happen when the deadline passes?

The government isn't gping to fine itself.
Nobody is going to go to jail.

Nothing....nothing is going to happen.

**BaronIveagh**

TheMeanDM wrote:

WTG is really going to happen when the deadline passes?

The government isn't gping to fine itself.
Nobody is going to go to jail.

Having seen those things happen in my own department, well, no, you are wrong. Those things do happen, and people do get fired on top that.

Though I do admit that firings and pay shenanigans are the most likely occurrence.

**feeder**

AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

Callous or edgelord? It's the new iteration of Poe's Law!

**Xenomancers**

AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

He actually makes good points. Sometimes logic is cold.

**feeder**

Xenomancers wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

He actually makes good points. Sometimes logic is cold.

He repeats wild speculation and uses it to justify unconscionable acts.

**War Drone**

feeder wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

Callous or edgelord? It's the new iteration of Poe's Law!

"Edgelord" ...

I didn't know that was a thing. But I instinctively understand it (not in the sexual context, which I also understand).
Great word

**YeOldSaltPotato**

Xenomancers wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

He actually makes good points. Sometimes logic is cold.

What good points? Baseless speculation, whataboutism, concern trolling and dismissing a massive feth up all wrapped up in a cute little edgy package?

It's cynicism without the benefit of truth being used to dismiss a real problem. But that's about what I expected.

**Asherian Command**

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:
Xenomancers wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

He actually makes good points. Sometimes logic is cold.

What good points? Baseless speculation, whataboutism, concern trolling and dismissing a massive feth up all wrapped up in a cute little edgy package?

It's cynicism without the benefit of truth being used to dismiss a real problem. But that's about what I expected.

Yeah sounds about right.

**ChargerIIC**

TheMeanDM wrote:
The whole "reunite families by x date" really is just for show.

A *federal judge* ordered the *federal government* to do this.

WTG is really going to happen when the deadline passes?

The government isn't gping to fine itself.
Nobody is going to go to jail.

Nothing....nothing is going to happen.

I write software for government agencies - they do fine each other, with surprising regulatory. Nothing like being told there are no raises this year because Hanson couldn't do his work properly...

**warhead01**

Da Boss wrote:
Wow, that is extremely callous of you. Are you a christian?

So what. does feeling bad and sending thoughts and prayres over the internet change the facts on the ground?
If people don't like the policies they need to get organized and with a unified front contact their representatives to voice their issues with those policies.
My callousness is irrelevant.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaronIveagh wrote:
warhead01 wrote:

At any rate 450+ isn't even a lot of people. For all I know some of those parents were just trying to put their kids in the US for a better life. Maybe they made it. Who knows.

Your honor, members of the jury, it's not much to say my client admits to killing and eating 450 people, that's not many people anyway. Who knows if they were really human at all, just meat for the beast, know what I'm saying?

That's actually really funny if you read it in a Hunter S. Thompson voice.

**Asherian Command**

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/trump-air-force-one-cnn-melania-leaked-emails-white-house-a8462526.html?utm_source=reddit.com

On the first couple’s recent trip overseas, Melania Trump’s television aboard Air Force One was tuned to CNN. President Donald Trump was not pleased.

He raged at his staff for violating a rule that the White House entourage should begin each trip tuned to Fox – his preferred network over what he considers the “fake news” CNN – and caused “a bit of a stir” aboard Air Force One, according to an email obtained by The New York Times.

The email, an internal exchange between officials in the White House Military Office and the White House Communications Agency last Thursday, also called for the ordering of two additional televisions to support Beam, a TiVo-like streaming device, to make sure the president and first lady could both watch TV in their separate hotel rooms when they travel.

At the end of the email chain, officials confirmed that tuning the TVs to Fox would be standard operating procedure going forward.

The channel-flipping flap was the latest example of how Donald Trump, at a pivotal moment in his presidency, is increasingly living in a world of selected information and bending the truth to his own narrative. As his aides work to keep him insulated from the outside world, Mr Trump is doubling down in his efforts to tell supporters to trust him over the words of critics and news reports.

For now, his approach is working: His standing with Republicans continues to rise, according to a series of new polls.

“Stick with us. Don’t believe the crap you see from these people, the fake news,” Mr Trump said on Thursday at the annual convention of the Veterans of Foreign Wars in Kansas City, Missouri.

And then: “What you’re seeing and what you’re reading is not what’s happening.”

Similarly, as the negative headlines continue after Mr Trump’s meeting in Finland last week with President Vladimir Putin of Russia, Mr Trump has shifted from blaming US institutions for a bad relationship with Russia to telling people not to believe the facts of what they have seen or heard.

On Tuesday, the president effectively said black was white when he claimed without evidence that Russians would be helping Democrats – but not him – in the coming midterm elections. In January 2017, US intelligence agencies assessed that Russia had interfered in the 2016 presidential election in an effort to help Mr Trump.

“I’m very concerned that Russia will be fighting very hard to have an impact on the upcoming Election,” Mr Trump wrote on Twitter. “Based on the fact that no President has been tougher on Russia than me, they will be pushing very hard for the Democrats. They definitely don’t want Trump!”

In his tweet, Mr Trump made no mention of the fact that he has been told repeatedly that Russia ordered a series of attacks to sway the 2016 election. Nor did he say that he has struck a conciliatory view towards Mr Putin even as his administration and Congress have moved to impose harsher relations.

Over the weekend, Mr Trump claimed with no evidence in a series of tweets that his administration’s release of top-secret documents related to the surveillance of a former campaign aide had confirmed that the Justice Department and the FBI “misled the courts” in the early stages of the Russia investigation.

But the documents appeared to do the opposite. They presented in stark detail why the FBI was interested in the former campaign adviser, Carter Page: “The FBI believes Page has been the subject of targeted recruitment by the Russian government.” The documents also said Mr Page had “established relationships with Russian government officials, including Russian intelligence officers,” and had been “collaborating and conspiring with the Russian government.”

Analysts, including Stephen Vladeck, a professor who specialises in national security law at the University of Texas School of Law, said the president was “cherry picking” bits of the warrant that would be most useful to him.

In the White House, little of the outside criticism breaks through. People who have worked for Mr Trump say he tends to view everything through the lens of a battle. His goal is bring everyone over to his view.

REMOVED

Highlight :

"Just remember: What you’re seeing and what you’re reading is not what's happening, just stick with us. Don’t believe the crap you see from these people — the fake news.” -Donald Trump,

AKA : “The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.” -George Orwell, 1984

**Vaktathi**

The Air Force One thing is pretty strange and absurd, but absolutely on target for Trump. Dude is a fragile manchild...

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

**Asherian Command**

Vaktathi wrote:
The Air Force One thing is pretty strange and absurd, but absolutely on target for Trump. Dude is a fragile manchild...

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

Thats good, hopefully it wasn't just them editting stuff. Thank goodness. An actual error.

**feeder**

Don't quote HuffPo. It's trash. Go into the piece and see where they sourced the story from and read that instead.

**Tannhauser42**

Vaktathi wrote:

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

Yeah, a few years ago it would have been suspected to be an error right away, or people would have at least suspected some sort of error in translation for Putin to directly answer a question like that with that answer. Today, though, believing it to be intentional is the new normal.

**Asherian Command**

Tannhauser42 wrote:
Vaktathi wrote:

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

Yeah, a few years ago it would have been suspected to be an error right away, or people would have at least suspected some sort of error in translation for Putin to directly answer a question like that with that answer. Today, though, believing it to be intentional is the new normal.

With this administration with how much crap we have to sow through, its really easy, hell I got tricked by it. Its really easy to believe something gakky about this government because well... This government has done objectively worse things than change words on a page.

**BaronIveagh**

Vaktathi wrote:
The Air Force One thing is pretty strange and absurd, but absolutely on target for Trump. Dude is a fragile manchild...

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

Can't read article so is this something actual or is it spin due to getting caught?

**Asherian Command**

BaronIveagh wrote:
Vaktathi wrote:
The Air Force One thing is pretty strange and absurd, but absolutely on target for Trump. Dude is a fragile manchild...

The transcript thing however is apparently a legitimate error based on which feed the transcript was using.

Can't read article so is this something actual or is it spin due to getting caught?

No it was a mistake, but the white house still hasn't retracted the uneditted version for a week now.

**Xenomancers**

YeOldSaltPotato wrote:
Xenomancers wrote:
AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Jesus, you're not supposed to try to get nominated for "most callous post of the year" on purpose.

He actually makes good points. Sometimes logic is cold.

What good points? Baseless speculation, whataboutism, concern trolling and dismissing a massive feth up all wrapped up in a cute little edgy package?

It's cynicism without the benefit of truth being used to dismiss a real problem. But that's about what I expected.

I wouldn't call it a massive gak up and I wouldn't call the speculation baseless - because you can't prove otherwise. He said she said is not good enough. His speculation is as good as yours as long as it's grounded in reason - which it is. A good portion of those families probably intentionally abandoned their children - in hopes that the US government would take them in. You'd have to be incredibly naive to not think that isn't going on. Parents do that all the time here in the states...mothers will just drop their kid off at a hospital or an orphanage if they can't take care of them and run away. Or the crazy ones...just put their kids to sleep while they go out partying and sometimes those kids die. Also - the same thing would happen to an american family here if they had a kid with them and couldn't prove that it belonged with them. Then - even if it was theirs - the state could still hold the kid if the parents were considered unfit (These are indisputable facts). For some reason - you want to give illegal immigrants a different standard? It makes no sense.

You'd also have to be incredibly Niave to think that this is the fault of Republicans. This is the result of going soft as gak on immigration for decades while our country was literally invaded by illegal aliens at will - encouraging the next eager batch. Due to the fact their are safe havens and people willing to employ these illegals. If it were up to me. employing an illegal alien would have much more serious consequences eventually - with no work - they would have stopped coming anyways.

What world do you live in where everyone is good? No one lies? No one cheats? It is human nature. It's not cynical to assume the worst out of a criminal. Get it right - these people are criminals.

When it comes to people who are willing to cheat a system...break laws and break into a country illegally. I will always assume the worst. The gak they had to do to get here. Pay off human traffickers. Travel through the burning desert with children - these people are willing to do anything.

**ScarletRose**

because you can't prove otherwise.

War is peace, ignorance is truth, people with brown skin are evil - you can't prove otherwise!

I really wonder at when people people lost all ability to reason.

You'd also have to be incredibly Niave to think that this is the fault of Republicans

So, the policy of child interment camps put in place by a Republican president isn't the Republicans fault?

our country was literally invaded

And speaking of racist talking points...

You want to follow that up with some gak about "white genocide" next?

these people are willing to do anything.

People will do anything to have a better life, or a chance at life at all. Somehow that's blameworthy in the eyes of ridiculous people.

**Xenomancers**

INVASION

1.) an instance of invading a country or region with an armed force.
"the Allied invasion of Normandy"
synonyms: occupation, capture, seizure, annexation, annexing, takeover; More
antonyms: withdrawal
2.) an incursion by a large number of people or things into a place or sphere of activity.
"stadium guards are preparing for another invasion of fans"
synonyms: influx, inundation, flood, rush, torrent, deluge, avalanche, juggernaut
"an invasion of tourists"
3.) an unwelcome intrusion into another's domain.
"random drug testing of employees is an unwarranted invasion of privacy"

I love how using the correct words to describe what is happening is considered racist.

"People will do anything to have a better life, or a chance at life at all. Somehow that's blameworthy in the eyes of ridiculous people."

Yeah - including/ lie/ cheat/ murder/ steal. Do you believe anyone is a criminal. Are you an anarchist or something? Our nation hinges on something called "Rule of law" without it...we might as well join them down in south America where they have no such thing and people risk death, incarceration, rape, and lowing their children to get here. Because their countries are lawless.

Also - it is just plain false that this is the fault of republicans. This was going on under Obama too - it's been going on for decades. The problem is not new. I'll explain to you what is happening here because I really don't think you people understand.

Group of illegals are caught at the boarder. Boarder control officers then take them to a holding area and they are processed - they try to identify them. Some people don't have identification and can't prove the child is theirs. Okay...so are we just to allow random people to take random children? Uhh...you can't claim to be a humanist and think that is a good idea. Imagine if the people at daycare did this with your kid?

Okay...so why don't we do a paternity test... uhhh...not only does that take time and is expensive. It's also not something we can force people to do. We send them home so they can get their necessary papers and then they can prove the child is theirs and they get them back - MOST OF THEM are just trying to game the system anyways. Want to make a difference? Make the paternity test enforceable by boarder patrol officers. You might not like the results though.

**feeder**

Invasion is problematic because it implies there are a horde of illegals, when it is at worst a trickle.

Illegals are a net gain for your society, unless of course you are vying for that fruit picker or unskilled construction labourer job. Then they suck for you. Otherwise, you directly benefit from illegal labour.

And again, not everyone whose lives have been torn apart by this gakstorm implementation of a gakshow policy are illegal border jumpers. Read that sentence. Internalize it. Even if you subscribe to morally dubious theory that border jumpers "deserve it", not all victims of this policy fit that criteria.

**NinthMusketeer**

ScarletRose wrote:
because you can't prove otherwise.

War is peace, ignorance is truth, people with brown skin are evil - you can't prove otherwise!

I really wonder at when people people lost all ability to reason.

The GOP has degraded to a party of individuals with no integrity or regard for human decency that holds partisan politics as its only value and deceives its base into supporting them while taking action that harms them significantly.

They can't prove otherwise.

**BaronIveagh**

Xenomancers wrote:

Also - the same thing would happen to an american family here if they had a kid with them and couldn't prove that it belonged with them.

Wrong, please read actual laws regarding the state seizing children, next.

Xenomancers wrote:

Then - even if it was theirs - the state could still hold the kid if the parents were considered unfit (These are indisputable facts).

Or if they stood the parents up against a wall and shot them! (Further, these 'facts' are nothing like facts, and I do dispute them)

Xenomancers wrote:

For some reason - you want to give illegal immigrants a different standard? It makes no sense.

Xenophobomancer here once again ignores hard that this was not limited to illegal anything. But, hey, let's not let facts get in the way or anything!

Xenomancers wrote:

You'd also have to be incredibly Niave to think that this is the fault of Republicans. This is the result of going soft as gak on immigration for decades while our country was literally invaded by illegal aliens at will - encouraging the next eager batch. Due to the fact their are safe havens and people willing to employ these illegals. If it were up to me. employing an illegal alien would have much more serious consequences eventually - with no work - they would have stopped coming anyways.

Never minding that illegal entry into the US has been falling for years, or that Trump's activities have actually led to a 5% INCREASE in it, the fact that Xenopublicanhere thinks that the US is soft on immigration for decades leads one to suspect that he thinks that the previous, highly racist, immigration laws the US had were somehow a positive thing?

**feeder**

BaronIveagh wrote:
Xenophobomancer

Heh, clever.

Xenoscum

Oops. Enjoy your OT vacay

**Xenomancers**

feeder wrote:
Invasion is problematic because it implies there are a horde of illegals, when it is at worst a trickle.

Illegals are a net gain for your society, unless of course you are vying for that fruit picker or unskilled construction labourer job. Then they suck for you. Otherwise, you directly benefit from illegal labour.

And again, not everyone whose lives have been torn apart by this gakstorm implementation of a gakshow policy are illegal border jumpers. Read that sentence. Internalize it. Even if you subscribe to morally dubious theory that border jumpers "deserve it", not all victims of this policy fit that criteria.

The US has the lowest labor participation rate in it's entire history. It's only going to get worse with the coming rise of automation. We don't need more people for any reason. The only thing an unskilled labor force coming into this country ensures is - more people on wellfare / more unpaid medical bills / ect. Plus - that is eventually going to be the norm - because most people will be unemployable in 20 years.