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Can MWBD be used from inside a transport?

Trying to figure out if I need to Grand Illusion in certain leaders so they can buff turn one, or if I can just load them onto a ghost ark and place the units I want buffed in reach and then have them disembark and proceed to the turn as normal on move phase.

From 'Transports', pg. 183 of the 8th edition rulebook:

Embarked units cannot normally do anything or be affected in any way whilst they are embarked. Unless specifically stated, abilities that affect other units within a certain range have no effect whilst the unit that has the ability is embarked.

Yea dude, welcome to index 'every fun thing is too expensive to use practically'

 Klowny wrote:
Yea dude, welcome to index 'every fun thing is too expensive to use practically'

We are probably due for some points decreases in chapter approved, and if the new marine points cost are any indication we are in for a lot of them. However it's a long time between now and december, and there will be 7 more codexes before then, which is going to be brutal.

Omg I'm getting triggered in the Reinforcement Points thread. Its claimed in that thread that necrons RP is the most broken mechanic in the game and as a result we are the most OP faction currently.

To be fair, the first few games I played amongst five other friends, the necron player won every game apart from against the WAAC admech guy.

I was playing DG, and the RP rule was caning me. I just couldn't get the damage output to put units down. Heavy Destroyers coming back at full wounds is just stupid.

This was prior to the FAQ though, so the morale issue wasn't applying.

zerosignal wrote:
To be fair, the first few games I played amongst five other friends, the necron player won every game apart from against the WAAC admech guy.

I was playing DG, and the RP rule was caning me. I just couldn't get the damage output to put units down. Heavy Destroyers coming back at full wounds is just stupid.

This was prior to the FAQ though, so the morale issue wasn't applying.

That's way too anecdotal.

Saw the gloom prisms so started thinking about it and realized i'd never done a Deny the witch before.

Am I just rolling my 2d6 vs their 2d6 and im trying to get higher, or does the other side get some kind of other bonuses and thus im at a disadvantage for my Denial attempts?

So is the universal consensus that Praetorians are the go-to melee unit if we need melee units?

Praets or flayed ones, both put out 1 damage, just with more AP on the praets, but the FO put out a shedload of attacks, and reroll wounds. Can DS too.

 iGuy91 wrote:
So is the universal consensus that Praetorians are the go-to melee unit if we need melee units?

I think Praets are the go to atm. Flayed ones have imo a better statline but lack movement options to stay in combat and cost 3-5 too many ppm.

So there were no Necron players at Hammer of Wrath. In the TFG radio podcast they mention that and that the Necrons are in a bad place until chapter approved or the codex.

Nothing new, but it's good that it gets mentioned.

About Necrons best cc unit, I haven't tried out Lychguard or FO, but have used rod Praetorians in a couple of games. Wasn't particularly impressed by them since they only are S5 and Dam1. Perhaps if I would have met armies with elite infantry it would have been a different story.

Lychguard are too slow and have either too low damage (sword and board) or are too easy to kill (Scythe).
FO seems to be too expensive. If my opponents can wipe out 20 warriors the 20 FO shouldn't be a problem.

As long as you make the initial 9" charge off the deepstrike the FO squad shouldn't be out of combat unless the squad they were attacking died, and even then your pile in should ideally get them into cover and/or out of range of a charge or rapid fire.

The two units really serve a different purpose. I wouldn't throw a squad of 10 FO into anything with a 2+ save, but into a horde of conscripts or boyz? 40 attacks really add up quick. Anything with a 4+ save or worse goes down pretty fast under weight of fire (well weight of claws). Praets on the other hand are good for actually going up against armored characters and other CC units.

Flayed Ones NEED to go to 17 points minimum. I can't believe someone would make them over 20.

Flayed Ones's have actually been my answer to hordes (the bane of 8th ed.) as long as I can get off the charge.

Yeah I just don't like the 1 damage that praets do now, underwhelming overall. If you want elite killers, lychguard are your boys, if you want horde flayed ones do the job. If you want the small amount of units in between the two praets are the go

 Klowny wrote:
Yeah I just don't like the 1 damage that praets do now, underwhelming overall. If you want elite killers, lychguard are your boys, if you want horde flayed ones do the job. If you want the small amount of units in between the two praets are the go

Sure Lychguard have an extra damage on Praets if you take the scythes, but then you are looking at ~150 pts for a 5 man squad with warscythes, which really costs closer to 325 after you pay for the night scythe to bring them in, and that unit can't do anything till turn 2 at best, and the unit can't move after exiting the night scythe because invasion beam uses the rules for a deep strike not those for disembarking a transport, unless that has shown up in errata I haven't seen. so you are stuck putting the flyer in grenade range

Or you don't pay for the flyer, you hit most characters on a 4+ at best and get that 4++ save from the shield so you don't die on your march across the table, or you hit most stuff on 3s and get torn to pieces on the way up the field and don't make it into combat till turn 2 or 3 anyway since it only moves 5-11" per turn with the advance.

With the amount of AP weapons with range laying around in 8th ed, I just don't think a 3+ save keeps these guys around long enough to make their points back most of the time. Points better spent elsewhere.

Yeah, they're all underwhelming tbh, I dont like running any of them. The extra damage is really noticeable, and if you add in anrakyr the buffs really give lych the edge in combat. But then praets are faster. It depends on what your strategy is with them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
+1 A w/ MWBD is really good. I know he can give it to praets too, just keeping up with them he will have a hard time.

So the consensus is Lychguard and Praetorians are meh while the FO are ok.

I will try out the Praetorians a few more times because I've painted up 10 of them. Perhaps even in min sized squads.

The problem for me is that I pretty much always run a battalion so the army will have Warriors and or Immortals. Immortals kills just as good as Praetorians and then i get 2 units of 10 of them instead of 10 Praetorians.

Those 350 points are better spent on heavy support.

How about skipping the battalion?

Does anyone else find that due to the way RP works (only in your turn) that Necron CC units are very vulnerable in prolonged combat? Fighting elite units, this forces us to wipe out or cause heavy casualties the the unit on the charge.

Why can't units beamed out of a NS launch assaults that turn?

v0iddrgn wrote:
Why can't units beamed out of a NS launch assaults that turn?

The NS and Monolith both lack the Transport keyword so any units entering play act as though they DS. Which means no move. Which means unplayable.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Cmdr_Sune wrote:
So the consensus is Lychguard and Praetorians are meh while the FO are ok.

I would use FO in almost every army if they cost less points. Love the statline. Just too high of an opportunity cost.

Joeproton wrote:

v0iddrgn wrote:
Why can't units beamed out of a NS launch assaults that turn?

The NS and Monolith both lack the Transport keyword so any units entering play act as though they DS. Which means no move. Which means unplayable.

They can still try to assault though, it's just that the odds aren't in your favour.

torblind wrote:
How about skipping the battalion?

Yes, that's most likely the most competetive choice for Necrons since we have to foot slog our slow troops which makes them unwieldy and easy to pick off.

But concerning the Praetorians in another detachment i still believe that Immortals can reliably do more damage to the same targets. In a couple of games I will try out Praetorians in a Spearhead.

 Cmdr_Sune wrote:

torblind wrote:
How about skipping the battalion?

Yes, that's most likely the most competetive choice for Necrons since we have to foot slog our slow troops which makes them unwieldy and easy to pick off.

But concerning the Praetorians in another detachment i still believe that Immortals can reliably do more damage to the same targets. In a couple of games I will try out Praetorians in a Spearhead.

I will say that the main selling point of Praetorians, besides the new extra wound, is that they don't need a babysitter like everyone else. They're Fearless, already have an okay number of attacks, so they don't really need many bonuses from our HQ, and they have the natural mobility.

Played my doubles game...2000 points a side Necrons and Death Guard vs Sisters of Celestine and Adeptus Mechanicus.

It was a pretty brutal slugging match. I took Praetorians, Wraiths, Scarabs, a CCB, and some warriors so i could blitz the Admech running 4 triple phosphor blaster kastellans. (They are totally nuts and I struggled to kill them, the Praetorians were shot off the board, but the wraiths made it in and tied them up the rest of the game.

Ended up being a DG/Necron win, but my Crons took the brunt of the damage. Death Guard are probably tankier as a casual observation.

 vipoid wrote:

Joeproton wrote:

v0iddrgn wrote:
Why can't units beamed out of a NS launch assaults that turn?

The NS and Monolith both lack the Transport keyword so any units entering play act as though they DS. Which means no move. Which means unplayable.

They can still try to assault though, it's just that the odds aren't in your favour.

Actually, there's nothing wrong with pulling your Scythe up next to a juicy target, then beaming down Lychguard 1.01" away for guaranteed charge SAME turn.

v0iddrgn wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

Joeproton wrote:

v0iddrgn wrote:
Why can't units beamed out of a NS launch assaults that turn?

The NS and Monolith both lack the Transport keyword so any units entering play act as though they DS. Which means no move. Which means unplayable.

They can still try to assault though, it's just that the odds aren't in your favour.

Actually, there's nothing wrong with pulling your Scythe up next to a juicy target, then beaming down Lychguard 1.01" away for guaranteed charge SAME turn.

Well there is one problem. Your Scythe sitting there for a turn getting shot down while your CC unit is stuck on the tomb world doing nothing. That scythe gets shot down, which isn't that hard considering no Quantum Shielding and a 3+ save.

You can get grenades thrown at you! Rapid fire! The weight of shots will crush our Flyers if you sit them that close to enemy units. And if you only have 1 and the enemy can keep your deep strike units off the table, no way it stays alive.

No, Night Scythes are not a good method of delivery for CC units.