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Sounds like at least the UK is getting hammered on availability - what about in the US?

I didn’t preorder, but I’m betting the two FLGS here in the vast gaming wasteland will at least have one copy that ends up lingering on the shelf for months.

Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing.

It would have been the first GW game I've bought since 1996.
But they priced me out of their market.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/08/14/14th-aug-adeptus-titanicus-the-titan-legionsgw-homepage-post-4fw-homepage-post-4/

Legio-specific rules & fluff

Edit:

 Ghool wrote:
Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing.

It would have been the first GW game I've bought since 1996.
But they priced me out of their market.

To be fair after 22 years "not being a customer" you're probably not in the target market for the game At least by GW's marketing team.

Also don't forget the new titans are vastly bigger than the old warlords and the plastic casting and quality are streets ahead. As a miniature product it is by far and away superior

I know it's supposed to be based on the horus heresy, but has there been any word beyond wishlisting on if they are planning to do any of the titans for other races, like Eldar?

 Overread wrote:

 Ghool wrote:
Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing.

It would have been the first GW game I've bought since 1996.
But they priced me out of their market.

To be fair after 22 years "not being a customer" you're probably not in the target market for the game At least by GW's marketing team.

If you're trying to regrow your customer base, lapsed customers are one of the richest veins you can mine. From a PR perspective, a lapsed customer effectively saying "I had my hand in my pocket but you screwed it up" should be regarded as somewhat disastrous.

Now in this case people seem to be reenacting a scene from World War Z to get GMEs, but that won't always be the case, and there'll only be so many chances those lapsed customers will give you. AT is objectively expensive, and subjectively too expensive for many, and that might hurt it in the long term.

It's all too easy to be lazy when you're making plenty of money, but GW have been here before, then the LOTR bubble burst and they nearly went bust.

 Necros wrote:
I know it's supposed to be based on the horus heresy, but has there been any word beyond wishlisting on if they are planning to do any of the titans for other races, like Eldar?

Basically the only mention is that if is sells well and proves to be viable and profitable then GW will continue to support it with new model releases and that they are not opposed to advancing the story line.

This means that if it keeps selling they will likely add more Imperial Knights and Titans; then branch out to Chaos warped stuff and then if that keeps doing well they will likely start adding in Eldar, Orks, Tyranid and the rest.

Overread wrote:o be fair after 22 years "not being a customer" you're probably not in the target market for the game At least by GW's marketing team.

They talk in their financial reports now about the importance of getting back lapsed customers, but I think you're right that this was not the game to necessarily accomplish that for anyone who lapsed because of price. This will definitely have gotten lapsed customers back who are former Epic customers though.

Also don't forget the new titans are vastly bigger than the old warlords and the plastic casting and quality are streets ahead. As a miniature product it is by far and away superior

I'll say that I was simply wrong that they priced this too high. Sure, it may have scuttled some local interest because of the sticker shock, but apparently there's enough UK based interest for the price to be not too high to sell out their stock at launch.

Another thing they've explicitly said in their financial reports is that all the way up to the board of directors they look at both sales numbers and targets for return on capital when deciding what to do in the future. So selling out on preorder in the UK pretty much assures that there will be more of this product line. Anyone hoping for this to get expanded and maybe even infantry and tanks added for some sort of Epic expansion is probably not going to be disappointed by anything other than the time it will take to bring it to market.

MongooseMatt wrote:

MaxT wrote:


You mean you took pre-orders on Saturday for stock that you didn't have until 20 mins ago??? That's misrepresentation and you'll be hearing from Rod Hull's lawyer

Haven't started taking pre-orders

Though, I have to admit, one copy has 'disappeared' already...

Was this mysterious disappearance accompanied by the sound of rapidly fading footsteps and an odd “gleeheeheeheeeeee!” type sound, by any chance?

I managed to snag my FLGS's only copy... The owner only ordered one, and presumably now there are no more to order even if he wanted to embiggen his order.

 frozenwastes wrote:
. Anyone hoping for this to get expanded and maybe even infantry and tanks added for some sort of Epic expansion is probably not going to be disappointed by anything other than the time it will take to bring it to market.

Personally I'm expecting it to be somewhere in the order of 5 years before we see Xeno factions appear*. I'd wager any shift to Epic will wait until Xenos. That is unless they splinter off a new game alongside (in fairness the rules for AT are clearly build around AT and not around the abundant use of smaller than knight style weapons - we might get a few, but not rank and file armies). If they decide to do another Epic style game then I'd wager at best two or three years before we'd see or hear anything.



*This is assuming steady growth and the expectation that the big first update will be adding full warpchaos models probably around the 2-3 year mark

Right, my 5mm magnets are here, now I just need my Titans…

 Overread wrote:

 Ghool wrote:
Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing.

It would have been the first GW game I've bought since 1996.
But they priced me out of their market.

To be fair after 22 years "not being a customer" you're probably not in the target market for the game At least by GW's marketing team.

Also don't forget the new titans are vastly bigger than the old warlords and the plastic casting and quality are streets ahead. As a miniature product it is by far and away superior

They could be the best models in the world. But charging $350CAD as a starting point for 2 players is the perfect way to stop me dead in my tracks.
The giant robots and monsters are the appeal for my son, and quite frankly, this is the only boxed set/game they have come out with that does so.

I've paused at Shadespire, checked out Bloodbowl and Necromunda, but none of those appealed to my son.
The giant robots do.

The thing is, they could very likely have a lifetime customer with my kid.
But when they price stuff to a point where I won't even consider it, they've lost a former customer, as well as a potential 'lifer'. No matter how you spin that, it's bad for business.

True but then again I doubt they could have given us models of this quality at the size they are and lowered the price significantly. That said Knights are £20 for a trio with some weapon options and I wager once Reavers hit the market you could make a more affordable start with them - plus Reavers and Warhounds always look great and the Reaver at least is a very good high variety titan suited for lots of roles from ranged gun battery to close combat.

On the one hand cheaper is always good; but on the other sometimes some products just cost what they do.


Also don't forget the boxed set is quite a big bit of content - two larger models; 6 smaller plus a lot of terrain and a complete rules setup with counters, tokens and such (much of which is in plastic instead of punch-card).

 Overread wrote:

 frozenwastes wrote:
. Anyone hoping for this to get expanded and maybe even infantry and tanks added for some sort of Epic expansion is probably not going to be disappointed by anything other than the time it will take to bring it to market.

Personally I'm expecting it to be somewhere in the order of 5 years before we see Xeno factions appear*. I'd wager any shift to Epic will wait until Xenos. That is unless they splinter off a new game alongside (in fairness the rules for AT are clearly build around AT and not around the abundant use of smaller than knight style weapons - we might get a few, but not rank and file armies). If they decide to do another Epic style game then I'd wager at best two or three years before we'd see or hear anything.



*This is assuming steady growth and the expectation that the big first update will be adding full warpchaos models probably around the 2-3 year mark

I don't actually think there will be Xenos stuff at all. I think it's going to stay in 30k and be Loyalist vs Traitor all the way.

 Overread wrote:
True but then again I doubt they could have given us models of this quality at the size they are and lowered the price significantly. That said Knights are £20 for a trio with some weapon options and I wager once Reavers hit the market you could make a more affordable start with them - plus Reavers and Warhounds always look great and the Reaver at least is a very good high variety titan suited for lots of roles from ranged gun battery to close combat.

On the one hand cheaper is always good; but on the other sometimes some products just cost what they do.


Also don't forget the boxed set is quite a big bit of content - two larger models; 6 smaller plus a lot of terrain and a complete rules setup with counters, tokens and such (much of which is in plastic instead of punch-card).

To think that there's a substantial link between what a model costs GW and what they charge is bordering on naive at this point. There are equally complex and comparably sized kits that cost less.

The pricing of AT is a combination of the ever increasing march upwards, "because we can," and the knowledge that some of the big stuff is going to be comparably low volume because of the numbers needed by an individual (über collector loons notwithstanding.)

Well yes pricing is way more than just material costs to produce a model of that size; its profit, considering volume of sale (not just per customer but how big the potential customer base might be), considering room within the price to allow for finances to provide for further investment potential in that range (this might even just be looking at the profits). Plus GW has distribution, stores, art, lore, marketing etc.. all to pay for too.

 frozenwastes wrote:


I'll say that I was simply wrong that they priced this too high. Sure, it may have scuttled some local interest because of the sticker shock, but apparently there's enough UK based interest for the price to be not too high to sell out their stock at launch.

Seeing as they seem to have sold thru their entire first run pretty much everywhere (I'm sure a few vendors will have a box or two after all of this) I have to say I too was wrong regarding the price. I didn't expect this to still sell out. I'm glad it did though and personally I'm looking at getting into it in a reasonable way as time moves on and my more preferred titans come out and the knights get more weapons.

They could be the best models in the world. But charging $350CAD as a starting point for 2 players is the perfect way to stop me dead in my tracks.
The giant robots and monsters are the appeal for my son, and quite frankly, this is the only boxed set/game they have come out with that does so.

I've paused at Shadespire, checked out Bloodbowl and Necromunda, but none of those appealed to my son.
The giant robots do.

The thing is, they could very likely have a lifetime customer with my kid.
But when they price stuff to a point where I won't even consider it, they've lost a former customer, as well as a potential 'lifer'. No matter how you spin that, it's bad for business.

True but then again I doubt they could have given us models of this quality at the size they are and lowered the price significantly. That said Knights are £20 for a trio with some weapon options and I wager once Reavers hit the market you could make a more affordable start with them - plus Reavers and Warhounds always look great and the Reaver at least is a very good high variety titan suited for lots of roles from ranged gun battery to close combat.

On the one hand cheaper is always good; but on the other sometimes some products just cost what they do.


Also don't forget the boxed set is quite a big bit of content - two larger models; 6 smaller plus a lot of terrain and a complete rules setup with counters, tokens and such (much of which is in plastic instead of punch-card).

GW Products are a luxury item. They charge a price point at which they calculate they will make the most money. They could sell them significantly cheaper, plastic is ridiculously cheap to make, even factoring in the mold making costs. This isn't a complaint, just the facts. I wish they were cheaper also, AT was priced too high for me to want it. But its their business to run, Individual customers mean nothing to them, profit means everything. They changed how they interacted with the community not to be nice guys, but because it would net them more sales, and it has. I'm not saying they are evil or bad. All businesses exist to make money.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Seeing as they seem to have sold thru their entire first run pretty much everywhere (I'm sure a few vendors will have a box or two after all of this) I have to say I too was wrong regarding the price. I didn't expect this to still sell out.

It really hasn't in the US. Most of the big online dealers have stock left.

 Ghool wrote:
Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing.

It would have been the first GW game I've bought since 1996.
But they priced me out of their market.

They got me back in with the 40K Knights


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Overread wrote:

Also don't forget the new titans are vastly bigger than the old warlords and the plastic casting and quality are streets ahead. As a miniature product it is by far and away superior

Compared to 1996? Obviously. But I can't imagine a vast improvement on 2017. Their artistic direction has lapsed frequently over the last 10 years but afaik the plastic and casting quality hasn't improved significantly over this time period. Not sure how it could really.

 Stormonu wrote:
Sounds like at least the UK is getting hammered on availability - what about in the US?

I didn’t preorder, but I’m betting the two FLGS here in the vast gaming wasteland will at least have one copy that ends up lingering on the shelf for months.

GW US has been out of stock for more than a day now on the GM box. Miniature Market is still taking preorders on everything; whether you'll get it, or one of those 'ain't gonna happen' letters after the fact, who knows. The closest local store did not take any pre orders at all. The best they would offer is show up Saturday at open, and maybe you'll snag one first come, first serve. This is the first GW product that has happened to in a while. I think the last where you had to preorder to get one at all was Shadow War:Armageddon. No such luck on Titanicus.

 Ghool wrote:
Available or not, that price is insane.
The fact that it sold out at that price is testament to GWs marketing..

I don't quite agree with that. If GW had made the Warlord smaller and cheaper, and therefore the set cheaper or at least maybe with more Titans then I think it all would sell even better.

This game wasn't developed from a void, lots of peeps remember the glory days of Epic and are excited to see GW going down this road. Also, its a change from the 28mm games that GW has done the last 10 years (well, besides Dreadfleet). GW is pumping out a ton of games that use miniatures in other games which is fine and I am sure a lot of people appreciate that, but to me, it's also getting boring. I think part of the excitement with AT is a new scale. I do hope we see a second box set introducing infantry and vehicles like in SM1.

Which btw, there seems to be this idea that the original AT game was meant to be titans only, and that isn't really true. There was always an intention to expand on it and articles for vehicles came out in White Dwarf soon after its release. It was the success of those articles that gave way to SM1.

Also, once AT/SM1 was revised to SM2, the success of SM2 brought on TL. I asked Jervis back in the day if there was a plan to follow up Epic 40k with another set and he said had Epic 40k been successful, they would have. I can only imagine what that set would have been (he didn't elaborate on it).

There just wasn't any plan to make an EpicA box set, as Fanatic didn't have the resources at the time, but I knew that would kill the interest for the game right out of the gate. You really need some kind of starter army for Epic, and not just force players to go out and buy everything. I do think the GME does create excitement for the game even if not everyone wants it. The shame is that it is not more affordable, and I blame the size of the models on that.

I just aren't sure how many players will build up large forces. Even a combination of 5 warlords, reavers, or warhounds seems stretching it. And how many games could you possibly play with those units before you get bored? That is why I have said that I hope the designers kept this in the back of their mind when creating this system, because the longer it goes on for, the more Titans will end up being sold. But if people are convinced this is it, then interest will drop off pretty rapidly as GW keeps listing new boxed games every couple of months.

I mean, imagine a GME set only based on Space Marine v1, with just Marines, Rhinos, and Land Raiders (maybe Whirlwinds), and buildings, with rules to play the game within itself, or alongside the AT version. Epic players will go nuts.

I haven't seen the models in the flesh yet.. the warlord price seems kinda high to me.. is it worth $110.. like compared to other GW minis of similar size/price? Seems high to me, but then, it's GW

 Necros wrote:
I haven't seen the models in the flesh yet.. the warlord price seems kinda high to me.. is it worth $110.. like compared to other GW minis of similar size/price? Seems high to me, but then, it's GW

It's slightly smaller than a knight. I think I'd have to see it in person to appreciate the size personally. Thus far it hasn't been something that my head really wraps itself around.

Personally though, my main issue is just that there's really nothing that makes it feel bigger to me than playing with my Knights. The terrain really has to sell the scale difference that aspect just isn't clicking for me.

 Overread wrote:
Well yes pricing is way more than just material costs to produce a model of that size; its profit, considering volume of sale (not just per customer but how big the potential customer base might be), considering room within the price to allow for finances to provide for further investment potential in that range (this might even just be looking at the profits). Plus GW has distribution, stores, art, lore, marketing etc.. all to pay for too.

Yeah, if you've even a passing familiarity with my posting history you'll realise that this isn't news to me.

As per their last report, their cost of sales is running a little over 25% (a figure that has been largely consistent by a few % for years now.) So, broadly speaking, that £65 Warlord cost them around £13 to make, including all the studio costs to design it, the machining of the die to cast it, and all associated costs getting it in the box (including printing that box.)

Irrespective of how well they're doing, I'm still convinced that their pricing is past the peak of the bell curve, and they could be doing even better. Of course, if one is experiencing a production bottleneck, and has a hardcore of credulous customers who seemingly aren't price elastic, then throwing product out at a premium and realising the most cash on the limited number of units you've got isnt bad business, but long term I think price is going to become an issue once again, as they still continue to raise their prices as they release new product.

 frozenwastes wrote:

 Overread wrote:

 frozenwastes wrote:
. Anyone hoping for this to get expanded and maybe even infantry and tanks added for some sort of Epic expansion is probably not going to be disappointed by anything other than the time it will take to bring it to market.

Personally I'm expecting it to be somewhere in the order of 5 years before we see Xeno factions appear*. I'd wager any shift to Epic will wait until Xenos. That is unless they splinter off a new game alongside (in fairness the rules for AT are clearly build around AT and not around the abundant use of smaller than knight style weapons - we might get a few, but not rank and file armies). If they decide to do another Epic style game then I'd wager at best two or three years before we'd see or hear anything.



*This is assuming steady growth and the expectation that the big first update will be adding full warpchaos models probably around the 2-3 year mark

I don't actually think there will be Xenos stuff at all. I think it's going to stay in 30k and be Loyalist vs Traitor all the way.

Xenos is coming. The only thing stopping it is poor sales. Tony Cottrell said they would do the other races. It is Epic that is a ? I think it will definitely come as they deliberately sized the scale so that you could tell the difference in mk armour on a space marine but Tony did say that they are not making the mistake they did last time and rushing into Epic. It will be a long long way off.

Don't kid yourself. By the time you think they should be releasing xenos, they'll have done a dozen new big box games and AT will be another forgotten project.

I've been looking at the knight sprues and I can't figure out whether they have slots for magnetizing. It looks like the arms should be swappable pretty easily.

Does anyone know? if they do, what size magnets would they take?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Don't kid yourself. By the time you think they should be releasing xenos, they'll have done a dozen new big box games and AT will be another forgotten project.

You say this but out of the "big box" items we've had so far obviously 40k & AoS are supported but so is Kill Team, Shadespire, Necromunda, and Bloodbowl are still being supported. The first 4 being produced by GW proper and not specialist games but the two specialist games are being supported. And unlike the previous 2 specialist games this is designed for Match Play which seems to be an indicator of seriousness of continuation. Additionally it may have been on the fence but I'm pretty sure their financials will bear out this was a good launch.

 Hulksmash wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Don't kid yourself. By the time you think they should be releasing xenos, they'll have done a dozen new big box games and AT will be another forgotten project.

You say this but out of the "big box" items we've had so far obviously 40k & AoS are supported but so is Kill Team, Shadespire, Necromunda, and Bloodbowl are still being supported. The first 4 being produced by GW proper and not specialist games but the two specialist games are being supported. And unlike the previous 2 specialist games this is designed for Match Play which seems to be an indicator of seriousness of continuation. Additionally it may have been on the fence but I'm pretty sure their financials will bear out this was a good launch.

Indeed. Lord blackfang’s scenario has happened with literally zero of the previous Specialist Games projects, so I have no idea where that came from. Even smaller GW boxed games like Renegade, Lost Patrol and Execution force have received post-release support in White Dwarf. Titanicus is not one of those games though, it’s a fully supported Specialist Games product just like all their other projects.