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I'm moving on to making a squad of 5 scouts. Anyone have any thoughts as to which weapons are good for scouts? I've never played with scouts before so I'm on the fence.

Depends on what else you're running. A land speeder storm and give them a good ride to get into CC quick so BP/CCW with a powerfist sergeant can be useful. If you want range, snipers is alright although 5 of them and BS3 makes it a little tough to do much. Bolters are wasteful though

If you don't mind not doing anything spectacular, give them sniper rifles and stick them with your firebase, keeping objectives for you.

If doing 5 I like the ccw, pf sarge, speeder storm

With a speeder storm. Shotguns and Sgt with PF&Combiweapon.

If you are planning on sitting back, 4 Bolters and either HW. The Hvy Bolter does better vs troops but zero on tanks. The ML of course is the perfect JOT weapon.

There are 3 viable builds for Scouts in the Vanilla codex. First is the Telion delivery system give them sniper rifles and objective camp (as his stealth is transfered to the unit no need for camo cloaks). Give one a Missile launcher for telion to play with.

The 2nd is similar but does no damage. This is sniper rifles and camoloaks. They will rarely if ever kill anything but sitting on your objective and going to ground for a 2+ cover save is awesome sauce. They can win you the game doing that.

The 3rd is as an assaullt force. In a LSS with a powerfist and BP+CCW for the rest. Give the LSS a heavy flamer or Multimelta and match the Sargeants combi to that and they can be very potent. Getting turn 1 charges off can really cause problems for an unprepared opponent or force mistakes for a prepared one. My personal favourite load out is duel flamer. That way that humble 5 man Scvout squad is actually favourite in assault with 20 Ork Boyz (including a PK Nob)! Whilst for tank hunting 3 auto-hitting S8 attacks and 4 auto-hitting S6 attacks on the rtear will ruin pretty much any vehcile short of an LR.

Hmmm. I have the scouts that came with the SM battleforce. So it looks like my only weapon choices are boltgun, bolt pistol, shotgun, or combat blade. I don't have any other bits so I'm trying to make due with what I got. It seems like a waste though if they don't give you the weapons you need to make a decent squad. Are these even worth using? They don't even provide a PF. :(

PFs are easy to get or just make. Dump any SM PF on them and they will look fine.

I'd go BP + CCW with the standard scouts. Then invest in a PF and a LSS as soon as possible.

Thanks for the pointer. I don't have any other PFs. I put the only one the battle force came with on my assult squad sergeant. I'll just have to find one somewhere.

I did a little surgery on a Terminator Powerfist and put it on there.

Looks pretty good, if I do say so myself.

5 man scout squad, CCW and pistols and melta bomb sarg, outflank and kill tanks. nice and cheap to and can hole thier own in combat.

With the battleforce scouts, I'd agree that CC ones would be best. Otherwise I would easily recommend telion, 3 snipers and a ML. You have no idea how little people pay attention to it until it's the last unit left

tenclaw wrote:5 man scout squad, CCW and pistols and melta bomb sarg, outflank and kill tanks. nice and cheap to and can hole thier own in combat.

Thanks. Decisions decisions. I wanted to do bolters and 1 heavy bolter and a melta bomb on the sarg, but everyone says go CCW and pistols. :(

I personally like my bolter H/B squad. It is a cheap unit that acts as a good speed bump against Geqs who want to go into midfield. The 2+ poison blast is really quite good esp if you fire it at units fresh out of vehicles (from results or got out on their own) or didn't move much after a combat (low roll)

I agree with FlingitNow, except I'm not a big fan of spending the points for the Telion unit. His option 2 and option 3 are solid.

Variants:

You can throw a missile launcher in with the sniper/camo objective campers. It's not a lot of points, and it's not reliable, but every once in a while it'll pop a transport for you, and you'll be psyched.

You can give the assaulty scouts camo cloaks, and use them for assaulting in most games, but in Seize Ground deliberately put one objective way off to one side away from the main battle, and then Outflank these guys over there to grab it for you.

You can buff up the assault/outflanking scouts to 10 men, and they hit surprisingly hard. This unit combines remarkably well with Shrike, as with a scout move and Fleet, they can get first turn charges if you infiltrate them instead of outflanking.

I would go with four Snipers and one Heavy Bolter. That way they all have 36" range and Rending and Pinning shots.

I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though... I have opted to not use them at all.

a 5 man combat squad, which has +1 BS, WS, and Sv, is only 15 points more. Go to ground, and it is a 3 up save anyway. Much better at holding objectives.

Brother-Thunder wrote:I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though...

Pardon, but which ruling are you refering to?

I run two types of scout squads with my Salamanders.
1. 10 Sniper Scouts with Telion. I like Sniper Scouts despite the poor BS and adding Telion gives the whole unit Stealth thanks to the new FAQ and his bolter is awesome. I have picked out Powerfists/Meltaguns/ICs in numerous games with his bolter.
2. 2x 5 scouts with CCW/BP+Sarge with PF and Combimelta in a Land Speeder Storm with MM. If you get turn 1 the 2 Storms Scout up prior to turn 1 then move on turn one scouts get out pop a transport and assault the contents. 2 charges on turn 1! Or if you are going second keep them in reserve and outflank 2 MM touting Speeders full of Scouts. They are great for clearing an objective late in the game and holding it or flanking on a popping that pesky Land Raider you just can't seem to get into melta range with with your other units. The Storm can always deepstrike too but then the Scouts can't assault.

Sentai_Sage wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though...

Pardon, but which ruling are you refering to?

if my LSS turbo-boosts and eats it, my scouts die. I figured that the 165 points is better spent in regular speeders is all.

Brother-Thunder wrote:

Sentai_Sage wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though...

Pardon, but which ruling are you refering to?

if my LSS turbo-boosts and eats it, my scouts die. I figured that the 165 points is better spent in regular speeders is all.

I hate the rulebook FAQ so much because of this. This is going to be the new "I don't like basilisk because you can't shoot at stuff within 36 inches" or "Lumbering behemoth mistakes" rules blunder

It only applies in YOUR turn, so unless you decide to flat-out into terrain or ram something, the passengers won't die. Page 9 of the rulebook explaines what they mean by turn.

Illumini wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:

Sentai_Sage wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though...

Pardon, but which ruling are you refering to?

if my LSS turbo-boosts and eats it, my scouts die. I figured that the 165 points is better spent in regular speeders is all.

I hate the rulebook FAQ so much because of this. This is going to be the new "I don't like basilisk because you can't shoot at stuff within 36 inches" or "Lumbering behemoth mistakes" rules blunder

It only applies in YOUR turn, so unless you decide to flat-out into terrain or ram something, the passengers won't die. Page 9 of the rulebook explaines what they mean by turn.

A LSS can't ram so the only way is to flat out into terrain

I decided to go CCS and BP on the scouts and I put a BP and PS on the Sarge. I got the PS from leftover parts from the assult squad in the battleforce. Will a power sword be decent enough? Now I need to buy the LSS.

yeah, a power sword is usually a better buy than the fist. The things the fist is better at, it isn't enough better at to take in my opinion.

My thinking is this: a PF is meant to take out vehicles, MCs, Dreds, and ICs. A CC scout squad should not be assaulting MCs, Dreds, and good CC ICs, as the odds are low, and the risks are VERY high. You send the scouts in against small support squads and small groups of mooks (like small dev squads, IG platoons/HW teams, or non CC eldar) So the PS fulfills the mission they should be on better.

If they GET assaulted by the opponents bad stuff, it is after all your fault for having your scouts there (I prefer to think of them as bait so i don't feel bad when they die). Having a fist as "insurance" is not a good deal, 25 points for 2 attack PF is not good odds.

A fist is not taken as insurance in a scout squad it is taken because you want 3 Str 8 auto hits vs tanks. Paying 10 pts extra for that is a steal

tedurur wrote:A fist is not taken as insurance in a scout squad it is taken because you want 3 Str 8 auto hits vs tanks. Paying 10 pts extra for that is a steal

Scouts vs tanks is not a good use of scouts. Tanks usually move when near fists, and aren't on the board edge with flanking fists coming in (don't assume opponent is a moron or best case scenario). So 1.5 hits instead of auto hits. Rear armor is 10, so need a 3+ to pen. So 1 pen. Need a 5+ to destroy so .33 vehicles destroyed with the fist. Then the squad usually dies due to being out in the open with 4+ armor. If the tank moved more than 6, the numbers are even more dismal. Then there is the whole problem of scouts not having any other anti tank assault weapons... So you are sending an anti infantry unit at a armored unit? Paying a premium to make a squad bad at a role it is not even meant for is not points well spent.

If you could give your scouts melta weapons, then I would MAYBE see the point of a fist (wolf scouts can take melta, but they don't get sarges, and can't take fists). Or I would just point out the issue of paying for a fist when you could just use the free krak grenades the squad has. Against 95 percent of the vehicles that you face, Krak can pen the rear armor. Against the 5 percent that krak doesn't... a fist only glances. A melta bomb is better... but why assault a land raider with a scout squad?

Illumini wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:

Sentai_Sage wrote:

Brother-Thunder wrote:I used to run scouts, and I would always alpha strike them with a power fist in a LSS. Since the new transport ruling, though...

Pardon, but which ruling are you refering to?

if my LSS turbo-boosts and eats it, my scouts die. I figured that the 165 points is better spent in regular speeders is all.

I hate the rulebook FAQ so much because of this. This is going to be the new "I don't like basilisk because you can't shoot at stuff within 36 inches" or "Lumbering behemoth mistakes" rules blunder

It only applies in YOUR turn, so unless you decide to flat-out into terrain or ram something, the passengers won't die. Page 9 of the rulebook explaines what they mean by turn.

I thought it could be shot out of the sky, with the flat-out being a full turn over a player turn thing. Now I am confused again...

notabot187 wrote:

tedurur wrote:A fist is not taken as insurance in a scout squad it is taken because you want 3 Str 8 auto hits vs tanks. Paying 10 pts extra for that is a steal

Scouts vs tanks is not a good use of scouts.

This is possibly the most false thing I've ever heard on a 40k forum. Especially on the first turn, auto-hitting and glancing on 2s, penning on 3s in most cases with the fist. When a combi-melta is added to the mix it just gets better, especially if you're talking about Chimeras full of squishy guardsmen or similar.

Scouts vs tanks, in the right situation, is an excellent use of scouts. Two battle reports to illustrate my point:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/329682.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/311802.page

Scouts thrashing tanks is a pretty important part of both of these battles, as well as the report that I'm currently working on.

So since I went with the power sword on the sarg, will I be OK if I strap some meltabombs on him for anti-tank?

From another thread:

notabot187 wrote:Sure, BS 3 is a bit of as drag for people used to hitting with BS 4... But honestly it isn't that big a deal (uless you missile launch with krak, or shoot solid HB). It is just bolter fire (which you should never take a squad just for). The main purpose of a small shooting scout squad is the HB blast. The difference between BS 3 and 4 when you are talking about a small poisoned blast is not a big deal.

And WS 3 versus WS 4 is so much different?

You said thatsniper scouts can't move and shoot. True, but the question is "do they need to move and shoot because they have really long range shots and can sit on an objective?" Also another question would be "why are you taking a heavy bolter if you want to move and shoot?" and "Do I want to move and shoot while I'm sitting on an objective?" What's the purpose of moving and shooting if,as you say, the main purpose of the scouts is for the HB and you shouldn't take scouts for the bolter fire only?