Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The proxying thread got me thinking.

Would you rather play against:

1) Completely unpanited GW army. All assembled, completely WYSIWYG.

2) Completely Painted Counts-as army. All non-GW figures, weapons vehicles and equipment but all figures are of similar types (i.e. Goblins are goblins, Sci-fi troopers are IG, etc) as what they represent and equipment proxy is consistent across the army (i.e. all sci-fi assault rifles are lasguns, all swords are swords, etc).

Obviously this is a rather extreme example, and threads about painted vs unpainted armies already exist but when push comes to shove, I'm interested to see how folks priortize the spectacle of painted armies vs having miniatures which -while unpainted- match the background of the game.

I really like the 40k asthetic, and fluff, but for me gaming is about the specatcle of painted miniatures. It helps that the 40k universe is so vast that almost anything can fit in somehow, but even if it wasn't I'd take the painted Counts-as army every time.

I'd rather play a painted army, and I really couldn't give a fig if that army uses 100% GW or 0% GW. As long as it's reasonably clear what everything is supposed to be (usually discussed prior to the game) then knock yourself out. I know I've proxied plenty of things in the past, though typically it was other GW models (like using Eldar in Blood Bowl because my High Elf team hadn't arrived in the mail yet)

Ye Gods, that is a serious toughy for me.

I'll admit I am a bit of a nazi when it comes to playing against painted armies and having official Gw models. Its a purely aesthetic thing though, no sense of "doing the right thing" BS. I just love having a nice battlefield with two well painted armies going at it.

However considering the truely bizarre possibilites of a non GW counts as army (someone in another thread mentioned jar jar binks as an Avatar or something lol ) I'd go for unpainted and suck it up.

Thanks for stewing my brain though.

I could care less about what models my opponent is using, as long as I know what they are supposed to be when I'm playing and they "fit in" and look close enough to what they are supposed to be.

I think just about anyone would want to play against a fully painted army over a non painted one...

I saw a guy use warmachine jacks to count as dreadnoughts, they had eagles on em, and a converted lascannon arm and it looked pretty cool.

I saw space marine army years ago that was all converted from different models of men that looked like they were in mini walking WWII tanks, he had fluff all worked out and the iconography & proper weapons were all there and the army just looked awesome. They looked like a cross between marines and really small titans.

Although I generally prefer GW models to be used, I'd take a painted army over the Great Grey Hordes any day of the week.

No brainer. Painted.

I'd rather see a non-GW army anyway. Let creativity that GW espouses as "the hobby" shine through without their overpriced schlock.

Yeah painted all the way.

I'm split with this one. I think WSIWYG can also be kind of creative and for that I don't mind playing an unpainted army. Painted non-GW is also an excellent practice of creativity.

Mattlov wrote:I'd rather see a non-GW army anyway. Let creativity that GW espouses as "the hobby" shine through without their overpriced schlock.

Non-GW miniatures don't bother me if they fit in the universe, but I'd better not see something stupid like Star Wars or identifiable modern-day military.

I'd rather play a painted army.

Who makes the figures is irrelevant as long as they are roughly in scale to each other and they are representative of what they are supposed to be.
If GW don't make something like what you want your army to look like (either because they stopped or they just don't) then you should be free to look elsewhere - like us RT players had to back in the 1st ed days,

Eilif wrote:... gaming is about the specatcle of painted miniatures.

Indeed.

Also why I play other games, like Flames of War etc.

I'm glad the results are trending the way they are. My Wargames Factory IG army might just see the light of day (someday)!

I'd be more interested in seeing what another gamer's imagination came up with rather than another grey horde!

Me personally, id rather face painted, but could care less if its GW, especially since my guardsmen are the Greatcoats from Wargames Factory. Of course, the tanks and vehicles, the heavy weapon teams and HQ models are GW, but the bulk infantry are on-gw models.

i think from a Visual point of view (as i am a bit of a nerd and like taking pics of alot of my battles with oponents permision of course) 2 fully painted and based armies on a nicly designed and set out board is great and looks and feels fantastic. But then on the other hand from the gaming point of view wysiwyg makes the game play a whole lot smother you no what you are up against at a glance and what weps you have to deal with etc and you do not spend half your time asking your opponent so what weps have they got what squad is that etc so best solution is to get a fully painted wysiwyg army then all are happy

Has to be painted other wise you may as well play chess or chequers, the visual is a core component of the hobby in my opinion.

Painted AND WYSIWYG all the way!

No one does better looking plastic zombies that Mantic and there are some really cool gaurdman types from the Wargames factory so not being G.W is not a issue.
I used to be a G.W nazi but over the last few years other companies are doing some great work. Or better yet a converted army is rather cool.I've seen some great ones like grot rebels and chaos guard or genestealer cults. As long as its pleasing to the eye and the other guy is fun to play with then thats fine by me.
Infact i really don't get why anyone would want to play with a unpainted or broken mini? Really is it fun to stand behind a line of grey plastic models?

I would much rather see a GW army then a full painted one. I don't care for models that aren't GW usually unless its like 2 or 3 models. I mean, GW has a style to models so if two fully painted armies of different companies clash, it still wouldn't look as good on the field.

Painted, because a part of the hobby, for me, is neat conversions.

Hi all.
I am biased as I play some historicals , and there is no preconcieved idea about 'proper brands' for models.
I like to play armies that are crafted with care , and painted with passion and played with thought and commitment.(In an ideal world.).

Having an army made up of expencive plastic and metal bits glued to gether, and NOT painted, is the same level as using cardboard markers IMO.

People use minatures in games to ADD to the asthetic.

If you are not going to make the most of the minatures, why bother using them?


TTFN

Interesting observations all around. I'm a pleasantly surprised there wasn't more folks preferring the unpainted GW figs, but that's mostly because of the massive amount of unpainted GW and PP figs that I see on tables at the FLGS where my friends and I play.

In general I won't field anything unless it's painted and when I make an exception it at least has a basecoat on it.

IMO, figures made by other companies are usually just crap in games made by GW. I might go as far to say that they're crap in general, but GW has a unique style, and I've just become accustomed to it, so I'm definitely biased. I've never seen a non-GW model I even remotely wanted.

I'd rather see a tide of grey than a tide of crappy PP models or those ugly greatcoats everyone seems to love as guardsmen.

How about missing option: "Meh? As long as it's the proper scale."

I am on the side with the painted bunch, if I really had to choose one over the other. While sure, Games Workshop does many nice things and has their own unique style and bla bla bla, I would much rather see a painted bunch of assorted sci-fi troopers as Guardsmen or Marines than just a bunch of glued models.

I cannot paint all that well; I admire people who can. Cutting people off sprues and using a little blob of glue is one I do posess, however.

daedalus wrote:How about missing option: "Meh? As long as it's the proper scale."

That's one of the main things that irks me about 'count as armies'. You've got this regular guy who's as tall as a chaos terminator and towers over your models in assault, yet he's counting as a guardsman

Samus_aran115 wrote:

daedalus wrote:How about missing option: "Meh? As long as it's the proper scale."

That's one of the main things that irks me about 'count as armies'. You've got this regular guy who's as tall as a chaos terminator and towers over your models in assault, yet he's counting as a guardsman

Exactly. One of our guys is a "playtester." You know the kind. The kind that is codex and rules first, army second, and painting comes in at a close 5th or 6th. "Hey, I just started thinking about this new unit in my codex. I'm going to use it tonight." And then tonight rolls around and he is using a cut up Tamiya plane he uses for his Eldar as a flier (no flight stand) as one of the new DE vehicles. I took a look at it and said, "Uh, you know, I'm never going to have LOS to that thing, right?"

We decided to play it as though I could always see it as if it was 6 inches higher. It's not a question of being WAAC, just that he doesn't think this stuff all the way through.

Sigh.

Samus_aran115 wrote:IMO, figures made by other companies are usually just crap in games made by GW. I might go as far to say that they're crap in general, but GW has a unique style, and I've just become accustomed to it, so I'm definitely biased. I've never seen a non-GW model I even remotely wanted.

I'd rather see a tide of grey than a tide of crappy PP models or those ugly greatcoats everyone seems to love as guardsmen.

You joking right? I mean yes some companies make some shobby stuff and G.W does make some very nice plastic models / kits but say to everything made by everyone other than G.W is crap is just making you sound like a jackass. Of course you can like and dislike what you want but I would suggest you check out some of the minitures on offer nowdays. Some are just jaw dropping.

Boomer wrote:

Samus_aran115 wrote:IMO, figures made by other companies are usually just crap in games made by GW. I might go as far to say that they're crap in general, but GW has a unique style, and I've just become accustomed to it, so I'm definitely biased. I've never seen a non-GW model I even remotely wanted.

I'd rather see a tide of grey than a tide of crappy PP models or those ugly greatcoats everyone seems to love as guardsmen.

You joking right? I mean yes some companies make some shobby stuff and G.W does make some very nice plastic models / kits but say to everything made by everyone other than G.W is crap is just making you sound like a jackass. Of course you can like and dislike what you want but I would suggest you check out some of the minitures on offer nowdays. Some are just jaw dropping.

I JUST SAID I WAS BIASED.

I've actually taken a look at some other companies. I can say for certain that GW makes the best miniatures in the world after looking though. GW is definitely the most consistent with their sizes. I've noticed a lot of companies throw random sizes around for the same unit of models.