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What planet do orks come from?
They must come from somewhere right?
I need an idea for my game board and was thinking of some kind of invasion of the orks.

Maximus Prime

Well, they sg=hare dna from fungi so it would probbably be a moist, dark forrest world and the old ones altered the dna of the fungi to create orks.

It is strongly believed that orks were created by the Old Ones, so their is probably on an Old One ship or research planet.

It is widely believed that modern Orks are descended from a race created by the Old Ones called the Krork, during their battle with the C'tan roughly sixty million years ago.

No-one knows what kind of planet the first orks came from or where it might be/have been in the galaxy. For that matter we don't even know what the krork were like or how advanced they were and how modern orks differ from the krork.

Before Codex Necrons came out that introduced the Krork the older background for the orks, largely re-used in the latest Codex Orks, the orks had been created as a slave warrior subspecies by what orks call the Brainboyz. Brainboyz were/are snotlings who, on the original ork homeworld consumed a fungus which dramatically increased their brain power allowing them to create advanced technologies as well as the orks and gretchin to act as their salves and servants.

However, the orks also ate the fungus and also became more intelligent and realised that they didn't have to take orders from the weedy Brainboyz and rebelled. They consumed all of the brain enhancing fungus which only grew on the orks home planet and to make sure their technological inventions did not die out completely the Brainboyz re-engineered the orks to have all of the Brainboyz technological knowledge encoded into their DNA. With no more fungus the Brainboyz were inable to mature fully and snotlings are all that remains of them.

As to more specific descriptions of the ork homeworld there are none.

This would contribute to the idea that orks came from a planet that easily sustained fingus. Brainboyz did'nt start of as snotlings, they gradually turned into them

Well not quite, the Brainboyz were snotlings (who have a predilection for eating fungus) and one of them turned out to be mind-enhancing but after it was gone they continued to be snotlings. It goes without saying that the planet sustained fungus but that really doesn't help describe it, for all we know it was a barren rock on the surface and the mushrooms grew deep underground in caves.

Yes but I'm sure they used to be larger than snots, they did invent the webway after all

moonshine wrote:Yes but I'm sure they used to be larger than snots, they did invent the webway after all

The brain boyz invented the webway? I didn't know that. I always thought that the Old Ones created it, and that the webway was later used and developped by the eldars.

The Brainboyz did not invent the webway. The Old Ones created the webway. The only thing we know about the Krork is that they were a 'hardy' and 'green-skinned' race; that could literally make them anything.

Ooops that what I meant

But the old ones fought the necronypt and created most life in the galaxy, I'm confident there physical appearance degenerated with time

For most of the background in Codex Necrons the Old Ones are said to have nurtured various warrior races but does say that the Krork and Jokaero were 'newer creations', intended to defend the last bastions of the Old Ones. It is unclear how many races the Old Ones created from scratch, how many were simply aided by them and how many were modified to become more psychic.

By the same token we don't know anything about the Krork's physical appearance or their abilities. For all we know they were dimunitive little creatures that swarmed over the enemy bringing them down by sheer weight of numbers. Afterall snotlings are mischievous creatures, perhaps it is a throwover from their ancient past. Of course sixty million years is a long time, and we have no idea how closely related the orks and more ancient Brainboyz were to the krork.

We don't know anything about the original old ones, but it is rumored they visited terra

It is?

Yes, according to lexicanicum the old ones made worlds habbitable including terra

Well if it's on Lexicanum it's bound to be true then. Do you have a link to that page where it mentions that the Old Ones made Terra habitable?

I don't have the necron codex on me but I remember in it a Eldar or just a random blub said after the Old ones died off evolution took over hence why we have humans and stuff. I also think they evidence for orks being the krork is in that book. First is the name thin but its two letters off. And the fact orks aren't afraid to die and the Night Bringer didn't get to imprint on one species. thirdly in the Ork codex they mention blood axes are natural generals and the current state of affairs is why they aren't leading. All of it isn't direct but it dose point to them being the Krork and I think its mention somewhere that the reason orks are all over the place is they started in alot.

Orkfantic wrote:in the Ork codex they mention blood axes are natural generals

There was a time when the Blood Axes dominated ork society but when the rest of Ork-kind could no-longer tolerate the friendly relationships the Blood Axes had with alien races especially humans (indicating that the Blood Axes dominated Ork society until quite recently) they rebelled, with the Blood Axe clan being almost wiped out in a war known as Da Big Party.

Wow, that's just.. well.....

...awesome!!

I can't remeber which page on lexicanicum i saw it on but i swear i saw it. if i see it i'll put a link up

moonshine wrote:I can't remeber which page on lexicanicum i saw it on but i swear i saw it. if i see it i'll put a link up

+ 1

I remember reading something like this too. I'm pretty sure the old ones shaped Terra and made it habitable.

Laodamia wrote:

moonshine wrote:I can't remeber which page on lexicanicum i saw it on but i swear i saw it. if i see it i'll put a link up

+ 1

I remember reading something like this too. I'm pretty sure the old ones shaped Terra and made it habitable.

Same, something about them seeding life throughout the galaxy.

The Brainboyz were what the orks called the Old Ones, and I don't think they devolved into snotlings. The Krork is described as being hardy with no fear of death, so the nightbringer has no effect on them. The term hardy could also refer to there adaptability, the can make anything from anything and it generally works, supoosedly a gift from the old ones. The Old Ones created them as a warrior race, they can reproduce very fast, whch can combat the necrons ability to regenerate and get back into the fight. None of that should be taken as Gospel though, as different sources vary.

It would make sence that the orks are krorks. the old ones made orks to fight necrons so they would naturally make it so the orks don't fear them, just like the krork do not fear them

winnertakesall wrote:The Brainboyz were what the orks called the Old Ones, and I don't think they devolved into snotlings. The Krork is described as being hardy with no fear of death, so the nightbringer has no effect on them. The term hardy could also refer to there adaptability, the can make anything from anything and it generally works, supoosedly a gift from the old ones. The Old Ones created them as a warrior race, they can reproduce very fast, whch can combat the necrons ability to regenerate and get back into the fight. None of that should be taken as Gospel though, as different sources vary.

moonshine wrote:It would make sence that the orks are krorks. the old ones made orks to fight necrons so they would naturally make it so the orks don't fear them, just like the krork do not fear them

The Orks did not call the Old Ones Brainboyz, the Brainboyz were intelligent snotlings as was and now they are just snotlings.

As already discussed we know that the Old Ones made the Krork. We know they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned' and we also know that they were the only young race to escape the Nightbringer's boon (if you can really call it that) and did not fear death. We do not know what if anything the Krork had in common with orks (other than being hardy, green skinned and with no fear of death) and we do not know if orks had anything to do with the Krork; the much more recent Codex Orks reiterates the older Brainboyz background, with the orks being created by the Brainboyz who degenerated back into snotlings so if anything the krork would have much more in common with snotlings than with orks or gretchin. OF course it is all specualtion as we know almost nothing about the Krork.

Gogsnik wrote:

winnertakesall wrote:The Brainboyz were what the orks called the Old Ones, and I don't think they devolved into snotlings. The Krork is described as being hardy with no fear of death, so the nightbringer has no effect on them. The term hardy could also refer to there adaptability, the can make anything from anything and it generally works, supoosedly a gift from the old ones. The Old Ones created them as a warrior race, they can reproduce very fast, whch can combat the necrons ability to regenerate and get back into the fight. None of that should be taken as Gospel though, as different sources vary.

moonshine wrote:It would make sence that the orks are krorks. the old ones made orks to fight necrons so they would naturally make it so the orks don't fear them, just like the krork do not fear them

The Orks did not call the Old Ones Brainboyz, the Brainboyz were intelligent snotlings as was and now they are just snotlings.

As already discussed we know that the Old Ones made the Krork. We know they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned' and we also know that they were the only young race to escape the Nightbringer's boon (if you can really call it that) and did not fear death. We do not know what if anything the Krork had in common with orks (other than being hardy, green skinned and with no fear of death) and we do not know if orks had anything to do with the Krork; the much more recent Codex Orks reiterates the older Brainboyz background, with the orks being created by the Brainboyz who degenerated back into snotlings so if anything the krork would have much more in common with snotlings than with orks or gretchin. OF course it is all specualtion as we know almost nothing about the Krork.

Lexicanum says:

'The Brainboyz created the other Orkoid species as a mean of protection, while at the same time directing Greenskin society. What happened next is unknown, some legends telling of the Brainboyz having died out during a great plague (giving the implication that the Brainboyz were really the Old Ones). Other legends dictate that the Brainboyz reverted into the Snotlings.'

Confilcting evidence from trustworthy sources, I have seen more sources saying that the brainboyz were the old ones, and the 'great plague' was when those strange physker jelly fish just to nom them. I personally think it is unlikely that a creature as intelligant an old one would degenerate into a snotling

winnertakesall wrote:

Lexicanum says:

'The Brainboyz created the other Orkoid species as a mean of protection, while at the same time directing Greenskin society. What happened next is unknown, some legends telling of the Brainboyz having died out during a great plague (giving the implication that the Brainboyz were really the Old Ones). Other legends dictate that the Brainboyz reverted into the Snotlings.'

Confilcting evidence from trustworthy sources, I have seen more sources saying that the brainboyz were the old ones, and the 'great plague' was when those strange physker jelly fish just to nom them. I personally think it is unlikely that a creature as intelligant an old one would degenerate into a snotling

I find it quite appropriately ironic that something as insignificant as a Snotling was once the potentially one of the mightiest beings in existance.

winnertakesall wrote:Lexicanum says:

There's the problem right there.

Ork background however, since Waaargh the Orks and right up to the latest Codex Orks, has held that the Brainboyz were snotlings that ate mind-enhancing fungi, became super intelligent, made the orks and gretchin as slaves, lost all their mind-enhancing fungi when the orks ate it and then reverted back to being snotlings. The plague could refer to the Ensalver Plague perhaps but it seems unlikely everything else considered although even so it doesn't make the Brainboyz the Old Ones.

Some of this fluff seems pretty old to me and is no longer official.

Personally given that the Orks where created by the Old Ones I do;ot the they came from just one planet. To me it seems like the Old Ones took what they wanted from differant races and made the orks in a lab then just mass produced and let the Orks do there thing (i.e spores spreading and growing into more orks) That's just my opinion though.

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:Some of this fluff seems pretty old to me and is no longer official.

Background is always offcial irregardless of its age unless it is overwritten, as it stands the Brainboyz background is far more current than the background written in Codex Necrons.

Personally given that the Orks where created by the Old Ones

The Krork were created by the Old Ones, not the orks and we do not know in what way orks are related to the Krork. Afterall the Eldar then, are the same as the Eldar now, that is decsribed in detail in the background but all we know about the Krork is that they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned' (and that Krork has ork in it obviously) but beyond that we do not know how closely related the orks are to the Krork. If the orks and gretchin are the creations of the Brainboyz then they would have no relation to the Krork at all, only the snotlings in a direct line from their ancient forebears.

Gogsnik wrote:

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:Some of this fluff seems pretty old to me and is no longer official.

Background is always offcial irregardless of its age unless it is overwritten, as it stands the Brainboyz background is far more current than the background written in Codex Necrons.

I'm aware of this, I was refering to codex Orks where the identity of the Brainboyz isn't confirmed and is intentionally left obscure. This automatically overrides the older fluff saying that the Brainboyz regressed into snotlings.

Personally given that the Orks where created by the Old Ones

The Krork were created by the Old Ones, not the orks and we do not know in what way orks are related to the Krork.

Given that about 90% of the current Ork fluff parallels what's known about the Old Ones and the Krork exactly it isn't a large leap that they are one and the same.

Afterall the Eldar then, are the same as the Eldar now

Saying that the Eldar of now are the same Eldar of then isn't a fair compareson since 2 differant races aren't going to have the same events throughout their history. And it's not even that true concidering the Eldar have lost alot of their technology and knowledge plus the time period we are talking about was before the Eldar Empire and not alot is known about the race from that time period. Just because a name changes (like how the Necrons where once the Necrontry) dosen't mean that they aren't one and the same ya know?

that is decsribed in detail in the background but all we know about the Krork is that they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned' (and that Krork has ork in it obviously) but beyond that we do not know how closely related the orks are to the Krork.

Again these parallels are to close to simply be coincidence especially when talking about something created by GW.

If the orks and gretchin are the creations of the Brainboyz then they would have no relation to the Krork at all, only the snotlings in a direct line from their ancient forebears.

I've already pointed out that the Snotlings are no longer conclusivly identified as the Brainboyz as may have been the case in older fluff which is why it's widely believed given recent Ork fluff and the overwhelmingly large amount of parallels that the Brainboyz where the Old Ones who created the Krork (now known as the Ork which probably came from the race themselves since they don't exactly remember things in detail) and the other greenskin races to protect themselves and their bastions.

In the Ork codex it specifically states that the Brainboyz do not exist in the modern 40k universe and gives 3 differant ideas as to what might have happened to the Brainboyz (2 of which have to do with them becoming Snots and 1 probably created because of Ork mentality that Orks woulden't be dominated not actual history) but all of these are based off of Ork legends and none of them are shown to be the actual result.

So Like I said I think that the Old Ones created the Orks in a lab of some sort where they combined the traits that they wanted and then probably allowed them to populate in the way they where created to on worlds created by the Old Ones ergo there is no Ork homeworld.

Warboss Imbad Ironskull wrote:I'm aware of this, I was refering to codex Orks where the identity of the Brainboyz isn't confirmed and is intentionally left obscure. This automatically overrides the older fluff saying that the Brainboyz regressed into snotlings.

How can something left obscure override somthing specific? The fact that it is left obscure lends more credence to the already established background, not less.

Given that about 90% of the current Ork fluff parallels what's known about the Old Ones and the Krork exactly it isn't a large leap that they are one and the same.

The Ork Codex doesn't mention the Old Ones at all so that's not really exact is it. As far as paralleling the Krork that isn't very hard to do seen as how all we know about the Krork is that they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned'. You can have green skinned Kroot and they're pretty hardy, maybe the Kroot are the Krork...

not alot is known about the race from that time period.

We know a fair bit about the Eldar of those times, physically they are exactly the same as modern Eldar, they haven't even evolved one little bit.

Just because a name changes (like how the Necrons where once the Necrontry) dosen't mean that they aren't one and the same ya know?

There's nothing to suggest that they are one and the same either, it seems a likely implication but it is far from certain, unlike with other species created and fostered by the Old Ones, like the Eldar, the K'nib and the Jokaero. The Necrontyr really aren't a great example of continuity since they aren't even a living species anymore.

that is decsribed in detail in the background but all we know about the Krork is that they were 'hardy' and 'green skinned' (and that Krork has ork in it obviously) but beyond that we do not know how closely related the orks are to the Krork.

Again these parallels are to close to simply be coincidence especially when talking about something created by GW.

overwhelmingly large amount of parallels

That the Old Ones made the Krork and that the Brainboyz made the Orks you mean? One similarity, hardly an 'overwhelmingly large amount'.

In the Ork codex it specifically states that the Brainboyz do not exist in the modern 40k universe... ...none of them are shown to be the actual result./quote]

And, what's your point?

My point is and always has been that we do not know how orks are related to the Krork so stating the connections as fact is ludicrous because we do not know. We do know certain things about the orks origins, and on their origins we can infer certain elemnts but as to how that ties them in with the Krork no-one can say because we know almost nothing about the krork or how they might be related to modern day orks.

In the original background the Brainboyz were part of ork legend and it was also confirmed that it was fact as well. The latest background reiterates those legends. It doesn't mention the Old Ones or the Krork. So to say that the ork legends are just legends and that the Brainboyz are long dead, just as they always have been, doesn't tell us anything.

So Like I said I think that the Old Ones created the Orks in a lab of some sort where they combined the traits that they wanted and then probably allowed them to populate in the way they where created to on worlds created by the Old Ones ergo there is no Ork homeworld.

That may well be your theory but it doesn't really add to the discussion does it when we have actual background to chew over.