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My store is having an escalation league this months point level is 750. I am still very new to 40k and I would love any and all feedback on this list on how to make it more effective. I simply want the most effective list. The reason I play the ion cannons is there is a large amount of MEQ in my area. After reading online it seems the ion cannon for the points is one of the best options for tau for taking out MEQ. Again any and all advice is greatly appricated.


HQ
shas’el plasma rifle missle pod HWMT targeting array 85 points

Troops

Devil Fish
Disruption Pods
6fw 145 pts

Devil Fish
Disruption Pods
6fw 145 pts.

Heavy Support

hammer head ion cannon burst cannon disruption pod 130 points
hammer head ion cannon burst cannon disruption pod 130 points
broadside team leader hwdc 2x shield drones A.S.S. 115 points

The list has plenty of high strength pain but I think you are too heavily invested in Heavy Support. Broadsides may be a bit overkill as many armies will struggle to effectively use AV14 in 750 points. That said there will always be that one guy that brings a Land Raider so a single Broadside could still be worthwhile.

Have you considered Deathrain (TL Missile Pod/Targeting Array) suits? They are super accurate and will almost always wound with their S7 shooting. If you want to save on points and spread fire then consider swapping the Targeting Array for Target Locks.

Your fireknife commander is solid but without other XV8s to attach him to he will be insta-killed very early by one of the many Missile Launchers you are sure to encounter. Either take another unit of Fireknives to run with him or consider changing his loadout and taking a similar loadout unit if you don't want to spend too many points on XV8s.

Thank you very much for your input. What wold you consider dropping? I was thinking about the hammer head and use the points for 2 additional suits in the death rain configuration.

jacetms87 wrote:Thank you very much for your input. What wold you consider dropping? I was thinking about the hammer head and use the points for 2 additional suits in the death rain configuration.

If you do that you are giving the Marines their 3+ save instead of a 4+ cover save but you are gaining an additional shot that can also bust vehicles.

If you do opt for Deathrains, I would recommend making your commander a Deathrain as well and attach him to the XV8 unit so that he doesn't get blown away by a missile. Otherwise you should be good. Tau really struggle at low point costs when using the standard FOC because of how overcosted our troops and transports are so expect tough times ahead.

So for tau at 750 what would be the optimal build?

2 Hammerheads and a broadside seems to be a bit of over kill. That and 6 man FW teams give you zero staying power.

I would say drop one of the HS options, add at least 3 FWs to each team and if you have the points a body guard for your HQ may be advised.

So if i drop one of the hammer heads it will give me 115 ill add 3 firewarriers each for 60 points i will have 55 points left, would you suggest an elite choice of a death-rain to join the HQ to?

jacetms87 wrote:So if i drop one of the hammer heads it will give me 115 ill add 3 firewarriers each for 60 points i will have 55 points left, would you suggest an elite choice of a death-rain to join the HQ to?

Go with an Elite XV8. The bodyguards are Shas'vre which is 35 points and gives you +1 WS and I as well as access to special issue tech. At 750 points, and considering how worthless most of the special issue tech is, you are better off going with the 25 point Elite Shas'ui XV8 and starting the game with the HQ joined to the unit. Also, if you have the points, I would recommend adding two Gun Drones to the XV8 unit. At 10 points each they serve as ablative wounds to keep your expensive XV8s alive longer.

I have to say, you need more Firewarriors. They're the backbone of Tau along with XV8's

Drop one HH and the Broadside, and try to add some XV8's with Plasma Rifles...their AP is low enough to not give MEQ's their armor saves

So only have one major source of anti armour?

You are off at the points of the comander he should be 97

Also it might be good to make the fishes warfishes but well I don't know I always use them :/

assassin wrote:Also it might be good to make the fishes warfishes but well I don't know I always use them :/

That is 80 more points just to get 8 more S5 shots. I personally think they aren't a good choice at any point limit but that is just preference. At 750 points though, surely they don't have a place as points are so sparse.

Hmm good point I think its just me being obsessed with them and so on

Still a comander with taht setup is 97 points

jacetms87 wrote:So only have one major source of anti armour?

How much armor do you fight in a 750 game against MEQ's? One or two Rhinos maybe...a FW Pulse Rifle can damage a Rhino - I actually immobilized and destroyed a storm bolter on a Rhino with 6 FW's the about a week ago.

At this point, you have a decent list, but the only way to learn is to play and re-read the codex and tune your list several times lol

After all the comments what about somthing like this?

HQ
Shas'El w/Plasam Rifle and Missile Pod, Hardwired Multi-tracker, Targetting Array, Hardwired Drone Controller w/2x Shield Drones and Stimulant Injector
137 pts total

Elite
3x Shas'ui all have plasma rifle, Missile Pod, Multi-trackers
Total 186 pts

Troop/Transport
2x Fire Warrior Squads (8 man each) w/ 2x Devilfish (each squad has one) and Disruption Pods for both Devilfishes
Total 330 pts

Heavy Support
1x Broadside w/ Advanced Stabilization systems
80 pts total

Total 733 pts


The suits can perform transport duty and I get to have the rail guns on via the broadside. Any idea on what to do with the remaining 17pts?

That's way better that before, but I would suggest this...and it's just a suggestion

Drop a shield drone from the HQ, drop the Disruption pods, and upgrade the two Shas'la to Shas'ui and take a marker drone per FW squad. That makes 748 if my math is correct

mega_bassist wrote:That's way better that before, but I would suggest this...and it's just a suggestion

Drop a shield drone from the HQ, drop the Disruption pods, and upgrade the two Shas'la to Shas'ui and take a marker drone per FW squad. That makes 748 if my math is correct

I think you meant markerlight instead of marker drone. Marker drones are 30 points while the Shas'ui markerlight carbine is 10 points. Marker drones and drone controllers would put you at 788 points, markerlights at 748. The markerlight you get replaces the Shas'ui weapon and is not networked meaning the unit of Fire Warriors can't use its ability.

If you want markerlights, here is a better way to get them in your list. Swap your Shas'el Shield Drones for Gun Drones and drop the stimulant injector to bring your point total down to 713. Remove one FW from each unit as well as one of the Devilfish to go down to 608. Add in a five-man unit of Pathfinders with their required Devilfish for +140 points bringing you to 748.

HQ
Shas'El w/Plasam Rifle and Missile Pod, Hardwired Multi-tracker, Targetting Array, Hardwired Drone Controller w/2x Gun Drones
117 pts total

Elite
3x Shas'ui all have plasma rifle, Missile Pod, Multi-trackers
Total 186 pts

Fast Attack
5x Pathfinders w/ Devilfish (no Disruption Pod)
Total 140 pts

Troop/Transport
2x Fire Warrior Squads (7 man each) w/ 1x Devilfish and Disruption Pod
Total 225 pts

Heavy Support
1x Broadside w/ Advanced Stabilization systems
80 pts total

Total 748 pts

You deploy the Pathfinders outside of their devilfish and have the transport somewhere out of line of sight and close to an objective. You then deploy one of the Fire Warrior units safely behind it so that they can embark on the first turn. If you can't find a place that is hidden, place your disruption pod devilfish in front of it, granting it a cover save as well. The HQ deploys attached to the XV8s and the Broadside deploys in a good position.

You weaken your troops by one model per unit, lose a disruption pod, lose FNP on the HQ but this is a non-issue because of the ablative wounds in the gun drones he has and the XV8s he has joined. In return you get 5 markerlights on the table and the capacity to accurately deep strike using the Pathfinder devilfish if you so choose.

If you really want markerlights in your list, and they are quite useful, then I would recommend going with pathfinders instead of upgrading the FW or taking marker drones. Both of the other choices end up being nearly the same points or even more for less markerlights.

I think you meant markerlight instead of marker drone. Marker drones are 30 points while the Shas'ui markerlight carbine is 10 points. Marker drones and drone controllers would put you at 788 points, markerlights at 748. The markerlight you get replaces the Shas'ui weapon and is not networked meaning the unit of Fire Warriors can't use its ability

Herp Derp, you're right...I wasn't paying attention

My only suggestion is to drop the ion cannon for the railgun. The railgun on the hammerhead has the option for submunition shot which is STR 6 AP 4 Large blast template, good for taking out a good portion of a squad.

Thank you for the suggestion I have never played with marker lights ( still very new to 40k) What is the consensus on them? I have read conflicting reports. The two main schools of thought being. Marker lights are invaluable for removing cover saves and for rail guns shots with improving BS. The other being that you should simply have more shots. In my very limited experience I have had better luck with more shots. With that in mind what about removing the injector ( just wanted to try it out) and using the gun drones and using the left over points for another suit?


Edited for spelling

jacetms87 wrote:Thank you for the suggestion I have never played with marker lights ( still very new to 40k) What is the consensus on them? I have read conflicting reports. The two main schools of thought being. Marker lights are invaluable for removing cover saves and for rail guns shots with improving BS. The other being that you should simply have more shots. In my very limited experience I have had better luck with more shots. With that in mind what about removing the injector ( just wanted to try it out) and using the gun drones and using the left over points for another suit?


Edited for spelling

Markerlights are good but expensive. Especially at such a low point level, they aren't going to be of much use. You are going to spend almost 200 points on a unit that is giving you zero offensive output. I would instead put in more suits. You could put in a full Fireknife team for about the same as a pathfinder team.

As far as suits, I would go with a team of 2 fireknives, and a team of 2 deathrains, and outfit your HQ to go with one or the other.

Plus, bring one hammerhead, and use the railgun. A large blast template at those point levels can be really useful.

My suggestion:

HQ
Shas'El 127
PR, MP, TA, BK, HW MT, HW DC
2x Shield Drone

Elite
1x Fireknife Crisis Suit 124
PR, MP, MT
1x Helios Crisis Suit
PR, FB, MT

2x Deathrain Crisis Suit 94
TL MP, Flamer

Troops
8x Fire Warrior 165
1x Devilfish
Gundrones, Burst Cannon, Disruption Pod

10x Kroot Carnivores 70

Heavy Support
Hammerhead Gunship 165
Railgun, Burst Cannons, Multitracker, Disruption Pod

Tactics:
Commander + the first Crisis team roll together. Since all three models are different + the commander's shield drones/BK, you should be able to conduct some serious wound allocation shenanigans, and this squad will become very hard to kill. Helios also can serve as an emergency armor popper, but mostly as a last resort.

Deathrains are on transport poppy detail. After that, they can support an anti-horde role with their flamers, or continue to pew pew 4+ save models.

Firewarriors and Kroot should probably be held in reserves/outflank, so that you can zip in in the second half of the game and contest/take objectives, instead of them getting shot up or even worse, assaulted early on in the game.

Hammerhead can pew pew TFG that brought a landraider @ 750, and support anti-horde with it's pie plate. Whats not to love. Common rule is "never bring one tank" but if they are shooting what limited anti-tank they probably posses at the Railhead, instead of at the suits, more power to them. Besides, you'll probably mostly see missile launchers, and I'll take str8 vs armor 13 /w cover save... thats about as safe as it's going to get (for tau).

Comes out to exactly 750.

Cottonjaw wrote:My suggestion:

HQ
Shas'El 127
PR, MP, TA, BK, HW MT, HW DC
2x Shield Drone

Elite
1x Fireknife Crisis Suit 124
PR, MP, MT
1x Helios Crisis Suit
PR, FB, MT

2x Deathrain Crisis Suit 94
TL MP, Flamer

Troops
8x Fire Warrior 165
1x Devilfish
Gundrones, Burst Cannon, Disruption Pod

10x Kroot Carnivores 70

Heavy Support
Hammerhead Gunship 165
Railgun, Burst Cannons, Multitracker, Disruption Pod

Tactics:
Commander + the first Crisis team roll together. Since all three models are different + the commander's shield drones/BK, you should be able to conduct some serious wound allocation shenanigans, and this squad will become very hard to kill. Helios also can serve as an emergency armor popper, but mostly as a last resort.

Deathrains are on transport poppy detail. After that, they can support an anti-horde role with their flamers, or continue to pew pew 4+ save models.

Firewarriors and Kroot should probably be held in reserves/outflank, so that you can zip in in the second half of the game and contest/take objectives, instead of them getting shot up or even worse, assaulted early on in the game.

Hammerhead can pew pew TFG that brought a landraider @ 750, and support anti-horde with it's pie plate. Whats not to love. Common rule is "never bring one tank" but if they are shooting what limited anti-tank they probably posses at the Railhead, instead of at the suits, more power to them. Besides, you'll probably mostly see missile launchers, and I'll take str8 vs armor 13 /w cover save... thats about as safe as it's going to get (for tau).

Comes out to exactly 750.

Don't do the helios thing. You can't "conduct some serious wound allocation shenanigans" with a 3 man unit. Well you can, but it isn't going to do much because their wound threshold is only 3. Diversified nobz are so good because you can take 10 wounds before loosing any (plus they have a 5++ and FNP but I digress).

Plus I think MP>FB. A missile pod has range 36, so you are going to be getting off a lot more shots, while the fusion blaster has range 12, and only gets stronger at 6". Because I doubt you are going to have anything that needs a melta in this points range, amount of shots is superior to quality.

This is the only problem with asking for help:

You'll get four different ideas/lists/stratigies to use! The best thing is trial and error

MP>FB is questionable when you're talking about AP4 vs AP1. The FB is going to kill more marines and deny FNP. I'm guessing he's going to see more power armor than transports, and between the Deathrains and the Hammerhead I think he should be able to handle it.

It's a matter of preference I suppose.

I would also say that "some" wounds allocation shenanigans is much better than none.