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2017/02/21 18:51:29
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Chopxsticks wrote: I think you miss the point of a GM and story telling and that's ok, its not everyone's cup of tea.
The complexity of rules isn't what its about, and prefab is par for the course with pre-build campaigns, with a little time and a few beers you can create what ever you want, there is nothing stopping you but yourself.
This game could have very little substance, we dont know yet, but again that is the joy of GM, they can add more to the story to fill it out, it makes it more fluid and less robotic.
I see the GM as an asset, AI cards can only do so much and they do it the same every time...
*soft clapping*
2017/02/21 18:55:31
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Chopxsticks wrote: I think you miss the point of a GM and story telling and that's ok, its not everyone's cup of tea.
The complexity of rules isn't what its about, and prefab is par for the course with pre-build campaigns, with a little time and a few beers you can create what ever you want, there is nothing stopping you but yourself.
This game could have very little substance, we dont know yet, but again that is the joy of GM, they can add more to the story to fill it out, it makes it more fluid and less robotic.
I see the GM as an asset, AI cards can only do so much and they do it the same every time...
I like you, I agree with this comment!
2017/02/21 18:56:36
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Man, I've run like a half-dozen campaigns and probably played in twice that. I get how to GM. What I'm saying is, I don't think this is offering a substantive support for that.
I could hand you three rocks, a piece of binder paper, and a pencil and say "this is your fantasy campaign, improvisation is the joy of being a GM, and if you don't like this awesome campaign, you're just thinking too rigidly, gimme $10." And you could (assuming you're creative enough) make your own awesome campaign, but it wouldn't be because of my awesome structure.
This looks really good to me now, however I still want more info on what enemies are in the basic book.
They could always do white dwarf expansions however IMO that is not a proper expansion in any sense. Because the magazines are limited and produced for one month only. If they had the rules as a 2 dollar PDF I could download and print I would prefer that. I don't really do the digital stuff because I only have a small android phone. I always prefer to have physical rules and gaming elements instead of squinting at small text on a phone.
A small expansion with a new enemy type, one or two new tile sheets and a couple cards could go a long way. Printing stuff in WD looks half arsed to me. Then again...its better than nothing...
I could see myself playing as the GM in every round. My gaming group consists of friends who only do tabletop gaming because I hound them to play.
I do like how they took some of these rather generic sculpts, like the chaos sorcerer and at least tried to make them interesting characters. The implication that the gryph hound has to be found is cool..if it is done well. I will say I still don't care for how the Kairic Acolytes turned out, they look like a blue/bird version of the bloodreavers instead of the wiry and cunning look Blanche came up with. They could have had mutations, three arms..more wacky stuff. Could have had a guy with a claw arm that wounds heroes easily. Considering Tzeentch followers used to always be the most warped of all chaos followers I feel like the execution of the human troops GW did simply didn't work out. Tzeentch also had plenty of female followers, unlike Khorne and Nurgle. So there's another missed opportunity. Eldar have female warriors mixed into all of their units, I don't understand why there wouldn't be female acolytes in Tzeentch forces as well. Even Warhammer Online had them. I'm noticing nothing less than neglect or lack of creativity from GWs sculpting department regarding the acolytes.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/02/21 20:38:57
2017/02/21 19:24:40
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
spiralingcadaver wrote: I'm w/ Albino here, GM's in the worst possible place- it sounds like they don't have the resources to be a true adversary/competitive force, but don't have enough storytelling/flexiblity to be a GM since everything I've seen looks very structured.
Thank you. That is exactly what I was getting at, but you said it much better.
Then again, it seems like people still aren't getting it. It sounds like the games master isn't going to be in a competitive role in the same way as other 1 vs team games, and they also aren't going to be able to have the same storytelling role as a gm in a roleplaying game would have, since the enemies are so limited, as are the actions that can be taken by the heroes and enemies alike. It's the worst of both worlds.
And I think it's ridiculous to say "well, you can just change the game however you want then!" Okay, or I could just play a different game that's already good so I don't have to make up my own or fix this one. If you need a gamesmaster anyway, why not just play fantasy roleplay? Then your gamesmaster actually has something worthwhile to do.
2017/02/21 21:27:41
Subject: Re:New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Sop it sounds like I'll be playing this like I play most games with my kids. Explain the story, play along, guide the game, but still have to do all the book keeping.
Better than being a pure adversarial role I suppose.
Got a box of cheap acolytes to mutate just to keep things interesting for this.
Poorly lit photos of my ever- growing collection of completely unrelated models!
Major thematic feedback from BGG was that they didn't want this LSD stuff. They wanted the generic fantasy of old Warhammer Quest. So, instead of another Chaos God stronghold, I guess GW's going for a more accessible generic Chaos Army.
Recycled sculpts, of course, are okay for the boardgaming audience, who didn't buy AoS figures in the first place. I'm not sure of the lack of variety, though. BGG'ers may interpret it as an unsubtle starter set that requires you to buy more expansions, although, if you have Silver Tower, you *have* an expansion.
The semi-GM I don't know about. BGG's had a long distaste of "one vs. many" games, and prefers coops, although I'm sensing that newer coop games have better AI.
Lemme dig around the BGG WQ:ST forums and see what else is there...!
OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How un-GW of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
H.B.M.C. wrote: OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How AOS of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
FTFY.
Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
2017/02/21 23:48:52
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
H.B.M.C. wrote: OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How AOS of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
FTFY.
Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
Pretty much, I do honestly think they are setting up a slaanesh release.
2017/02/21 23:49:37
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Lord Kragan wrote: Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
What are you talking about?
What does "... as many slaaneshis featuring..." even mean?
H.B.M.C. wrote: OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How AOS of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
FTFY.
Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
Pretty much, I do honestly think they are setting up a slaanesh release.
Between this and the talk of a "snake bodied demon" (Fulgrim) leading Noise Marines in 40k, I would say it's safe money to assume we'll see a Slanneshi release this year. Hope they do something different from the 1k Sons and not just give them Slanngors.
2017/02/22 00:36:29
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
H.B.M.C. wrote: OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How AOS of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
FTFY.
Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
Pretty much, I do honestly think they are setting up a slaanesh release.
Between this and the talk of a "snake bodied demon" (Fulgrim) leading Noise Marines in 40k, I would say it's safe money to assume we'll see a Slanneshi release this year. Hope they do something different from the 1k Sons and not just give them Slanngors.
Well I recall on the grand alliance community there was a rumor that a cult of aelves will be joining up with slaanesh. IF the rumor is true I assume they would take the place of tzaangors for the tzeentch release.
2017/02/22 06:12:43
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
H.B.M.C. wrote: OMG! Acknowledging Slaanesh exists. How AOS of this game.
I still don't get why they're named, although it's nice to see all the extra stuff in the rulebook (like expanded rules for being Grievously Wounded, which makes sense for a longer-form game).
FTFY.
Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
Pretty much, I do honestly think they are setting up a slaanesh release.
Between this and the talk of a "snake bodied demon" (Fulgrim) leading Noise Marines in 40k, I would say it's safe money to assume we'll see a Slanneshi release this year. Hope they do something different from the 1k Sons and not just give them Slanngors.
Well I recall on the grand alliance community there was a rumor that a cult of aelves will be joining up with slaanesh. IF the rumor is true I assume they would take the place of tzaangors for the tzeentch release.
A nice homage to the cult of pleasure? I would approve. My only concern is a "need" for a 40k crossover unit. If they don't make any crossover units, I don't mind.
2017/02/22 06:56:12
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
I get that GW have for a long time wanted to make sure that they don't homogenise the Warhammer and 40K, in the same way they want each Marine Chapter to be different and not just a different paint job ('cept for Chaos, obviously! )... but when it comes to Chaos I think that they should do it as much as possible.
Think of how much better it'd be if Tzeentch 40K armies could get the other Tzaangor units? If Blight Knights were a thing Chaos Nurgle 40K could get as sort of 'super mutants'?
H.B.M.C. wrote: I get that GW have for a long time wanted to make sure that they don't homogenise the Warhammer and 40K, in the same way they want each Marine Chapter to be different and not just a different paint job ('cept for Chaos, obviously! )... but when it comes to Chaos I think that they should do it as much as possible.
Think of how much better it'd be if Tzeentch 40K armies could get the other Tzaangor units? If Blight Knights were a thing Chaos Nurgle 40K could get as sort of 'super mutants'?[/quote
]
This is exactly what I am doing now
Tzaangor Enlightened make great screamers/flamers
Blight kings make great beasts of nurgle
Etc....
2017/02/22 08:33:37
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Yeah, but I didn't mean as proxy/counts as miniatures. I mean as actually having rules in the game. It's nice that 1KSons can get Tzaangors, but why not Tzaangor Skyfyryz and Enlightened?
Major thematic feedback from BGG was that they didn't want this LSD stuff. They wanted the generic fantasy of old Warhammer Quest. So, instead of another Chaos God stronghold, I guess GW's going for a more accessible generic Chaos Army.
Recycled sculpts, of course, are okay for the boardgaming audience, who didn't buy AoS figures in the first place. I'm not sure of the lack of variety, though. BGG'ers may interpret it as an unsubtle starter set that requires you to buy more expansions, although, if you have Silver Tower, you *have* an expansion.
The semi-GM I don't know about. BGG's had a long distaste of "one vs. many" games, and prefers coops, although I'm sensing that newer coop games have better AI.
Lemme dig around the BGG WQ:ST forums and see what else is there...!
Maybe they were listening over on EnWorld and RPG.net as well!
Yeah I'm guessing is is a response to the community response and feedback to Silver Tower. They saw it was popular, realised they could put together another one pretty quickly if they bundled existing minis, and James Hewitt along with any other working on this project got the permission to go hogwild with the written material as long as they kept it reasonably accessible and thematic, while also sticking to what I'm guessing was a tight deadline. So they, as lovers of Mordheim and original WHQ just like us, saw the opportunity to set the game in one of the cities created for the summer campaign last year, flesh it out and give it that grimdark character people love, while also re-introducing much loved features from the old games like visits to shops and taverns, a more involved dungeon delving system. etc. Really looking forward to this.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/02/22 10:08:59
2017/02/22 10:19:02
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Lord Kragan wrote: Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
What are you talking about?
What does "... as many slaaneshis featuring..." even mean?
He means the stories and lore featuring them. There's alot of it.
I personally don't think we'll see Slaanesh for AoS until next year but who knows?
2017/02/22 10:26:08
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Lord Kragan wrote: Because I think we've got almost as many slaaneshis featuring in these 2 years in AoS than fantasy and 40k combined in the previous decade.
What are you talking about?
What does "... as many slaaneshis featuring..." even mean?
He means the stories and lore featuring them. There's alot of it.
I personally don't think we'll see Slaanesh for AoS until next year but who knows?
Nah I disagree I think slaanesh is going to be early to mid summer then late summer and after that I think it's highly likely GW is going to focus on 8th edition 40k. Now death? I think is late this year or the next.
2017/02/22 10:42:06
Subject: New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
All I need is a random map generator, and random enemy generator and I don't need a GM! Want nothing but co-op cause will be only 2 people playing. Having the behaviour charts is encouraging though.
For mother Soviet scotland oh and I like orcs
2017/02/22 12:49:49
Subject: Re:New Warhammer Quest - Shadows Over Hammerhal
Turns out I was right. The verbose and space-consuming AoS-style profiles just eat into available page space, leaving no room to include a proper bestiary, just a few extra things if you own them (and Wrathmongers of all things? Can't just put regular Chaos Warriors in?).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/02/22 13:03:49
H.B.M.C. wrote: (and Wrathmongers of all things? Can't just put regular Chaos Warriors in?).
Maybe the Chaos Warriors kit is on its way out the door? It's a fairly old kit.
"Sometimes the only victory possible is to keep your opponent from winning." - The Emperor, from The Outcast Dead.
"Tell your gods we are coming for them, and that their realms will burn as ours did." -Thostos Bladestorm
)... but when it comes to Chaos I think that they should do it as much as possible.
)
