Grey Knights get Prefered enemy against....

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**Bloodhorror**

Do they get it against

Eldar Avatar
Chaos Space Marines Lesser Daemons
Chaos Space Marines Greater Daemons
Chaoes Space Marines Daemon Prince
Chaos Space Marines Possesed Marines
Chaos Space Marines Defiler
Chaos Space Marines anything that has Daemonic Possesion
Chaos Space Marine Spawn
Dark Eldar Clawed Fiend
Dark Eldar Khymera
Dark Eldar Razorwing Flock

Also, do the Grey Knights new force weapons ignore instant death?
as it just says is removed as a casulty :O!

**juraigamer**

The avatar is actually a demon.

Everything else you listed doesn't have the demon rule in the CSM book.

Not sure about the DE stuff, I'm not too familliar with it.

If you need a reason why, look in the eldar book for the page with the avatar. It has a special rule stating it's a demon.

Nothing else does, so it's not a demon by the rules. Thus any rule that would be gained isn't gained by GK.

**Xca|iber**

Actually AFAIK, the term "Daemon" is no longer a defined term. Thus, it is up to you and your opponent to clarify what counts as a daemon.

I would probably count Possessed, Daemon princes, and Summoned daemons (and the avatar because of its specific rules) as daemons, in addition to all models in codex: chaos daemons.

Dark Eldar units I would discuss with your opponent.

GK NFWs have 2 ways to remove models instantly. First, they are force weapons and can therefore inflict Instant Death by passing a psychic test, against any model without Eternal Warrior. Second, they have the Daemonbane rule, which means that daemons (as determined by you and your opponent) and psykers must pass a leadership test or be removed if they suffer any unsaved wounds from NFWs (this bypasses Eternal Warrior).

**DeathReaper**

Grey Knights force weapons Do not ignore instant death, they are force weapons as described on P. 50 of the BRB

**nosferatu1001**

Force weapons inflict Instant Death as normal, Daemonbane removes as a casualty.

Only units with the "Daemon" rule are daemons.

**Xca|iber**

nosferatu1001 wrote:Only units with the "Daemon" rule are daemons.

Where is this defined?

**nosferatu1001**

In the daemon rule itself

A daemon prince is not a daemon, in the same way that an Assautl Cannon isnt assault.

**Xca|iber**

nosferatu1001 wrote:In the daemon rule itself

A daemon prince is not a daemon, in the same way that an Assautl Cannon isnt assault.

But daemons aren't defined in the GK codex itself. Why would you use the rules from another codex to define what a different codex refers to? Wasn't that the crux of the argument in the previous Daemonhunters codex with regard to daemons?

**nosferatu1001**

GK do not have a special definition of "Daemon", so you fall back on the ONLY DEFINITION OF DAEMON in 40k, which is the Daemon special rule.

**Xca|iber**

And yet... it seems monumentally stupid to consider a Greater Daemon to not be a daemon. Oh well, I guess the CSM codex needs all the help it can get nowadays.

**Exergy**

Bloodhorror wrote:Do they get it against

Dark Eldar Clawed Fiend
Dark Eldar Khymera
Dark Eldar Razorwing Flock

dark eldar beast swarms are not demons. I believe Khymera are still warp beasts, but they may or my not be daemonic, just animals that live in the warp. Clawed Fiend and Razorwings are just animals.

**nosferatu1001**

No, no it doesnt. Read your rulebook before posting...

EW protects against Instant Death, not just Instant Death caused by double strength

**Exergy**

nosferatu1001 wrote:No, no it doesnt. Read your rulebook before posting...

EW protects against Instant Death, not just Instant Death caused by double strength

I was going off of this

page 26
Instant Death:
If a model suffers an unsaved wound from an attack that has strength double its toughness value or greater, it is killed outright and removed as a casualty
page 74
Eternal Warrior
The model is immune to the effects of the Instant Death rule.

Didnt realize forceweapons inflicted Instant Death as opposed to auto slain. Some things in the game remove things from play or auto slay them and are not Instant Death.

but you are right, normal force weapons inflict Instant Death. Dont know about NFW but I imagine its the same.

**nosferatu1001**

NFW are FW with other bonuses

DH FW *used to* bypass EW.

**Grakmar**

Eldar Avatar: This is the most clearcut answer. Yes! He has a rule saying he's a Daemon.
CSM Lesser Daemon: Fluff, yes. Rules, maybe. Nos is right in that there's no rules definition for what a Daemon is. But, these seem to be a clear RAI to me.
CSM Greater Daemon: Same as lesser.
CSM Daemon Prince: Fluff, probably. Rules, unlikely. These guys are just regular CSM who have been elevated. They're not 100% Daemon.
CSM Possessed: Fluff, no. Rules, no. They're human.
CSM Defiler: Fluff, maybe. Rules, probably not. It's a vehicle that is possesed by a Daemon. But, is it itself a daemon?
CSM Daemonic Possesion: Fluff, no. Rules, no. It's just a vehicle that's been corrupted by a Daemon. In fact, I'd argue that it's not actually a daemon, but they just let the AI (aka the machine spirit) run the vehicle.
CSM Spawn: Good question here. I'll go with fluff, probably. Rules, unlikely.
DE All: These are a big no. They're not daemons.

Nos has the hardline RAW spot-on. Only the Eldar Avatar and things from Codex: Daemons are actually Daemons. But, I'd advocating adding any of the CSM summoned daemons as well, since they're pure daemons in the fluff.